Printable View
4 Avoid fate is not necessary. Removal is brutal against that deck, but in a meta full of combo there is not that much removal floating around. It is true that berserk stompy is more consistent, but also a good 2 turns slower. With infect stompy you can afford to slow roll them, because you only need to deal 10 poison counters. However the huge negative I find about infect stompy is that I basically scoop to an active jitte....Quote:
Originally Posted by NihilObstat
hey, i've recently picked up Berserk Stompy, and its been lots of fun to play :D
refreshing after counter wars and endless top-spinning x_X
i am running this list:
17 Forest
4 Scryb Sprites
3 Skarrgan Pit-Skulk
4 Slippery Bogle
4 Kavu Predator
4 Silhana Ledgewalker
4 Rancor
4 Berserk
4 Invigorate
4 Might of Old Krosa
4 Vines of Vastwood
4 Keen Sense
i think the Keen Senses are really good, you always find a Critter that can make use of it.one just really have to be careful about trading 2 to one..
but if they stick a few rounds, card advantage will normally win the game.
well, it works good for me but as i said i just picked up the deck so i am not very expierienced.. maybe long time players come to another conclusion.
because the deck is rly gr8, i will take it to my local legacy tourney.
therefore, could you give me a rough analysis of the matchups? i dont know how up to date the matchups in the primer are...
i mostly need merfolk, goblin, dredge, dreadstill, bant aggro, G/W Sur.
well mostly merfolk, last top8 was 4 fishies .. urghs. hate that smell.
also i guess my mainboard looks kinda solid?! any tips for sideboarding?
would be glad if you could help me a little^^
also, first post.. hello evrybody :D
For sideboarding I would look at the previous page
Sideboard:
4 Tormod's Crypt - Deals with graveyard decks like Dredge
4 Mindbreak Trap - Stops Combo decks
4 Vexing Shusher - Helps against control decks, and gives you an extra creature
3 Gleeful Sabotage - Kills Challice, Counterbalance, Stax and other problem cards like moat, Jitte
As for your deck I would drop one Senses to get the fourth Pit-Skulk in there. 19 Creatures seems too few.
ok ty, ill do -1 sense +1 skulk.
Perhaps ill try to fit the 4th Sense in another slot as it often comes in handy drawing force of wills. what do you think about that?
thanks for help, and gr8 thread =) very useful
I suggested that to him, because we played first round in a tourney together and he was really positive about winning the tournament with it, and I said, sure it's a fast and unexpected deck, but you'll see how you die to removal, not against me, but 70% of the rest of the players (which is a big number).Quote:
Originally Posted by Tru3z3rox
After the tournament he said: You were right, I lost 3 games to spot removal (although he had 4x VoV). So, what should I do? and I suggested Avoid Fate and Autumn's veil, ok, maybe not as maindeck options, but definitely 4x Avoid Fate in sideboard.
To WILSON: I'm happy that someone else thinks good of Keen Sense, let us know about your testing ;)
About matchup analysis, I believe that Merfolk are really doable, and winnable. I usually never have a problem with them, specially when Vexing hits the board, just remember to side in some anti artifacts (Gleeful preferably) against the annoying Jitte, but I believe it's a good pairing. Just remember to play around Daze, in the first game. You can slow yourself down a little in the first game, and think about Cursecatcher, I sometimes end up forgetting about him and he counters something... annoying ^^
Goblins are easy as most aggro decks. Seeing that you run Scryb they should be even easier, make sure she doesn't die to Incinerator. Try to chump block with non-flier and win with your fliers ;)
Dredge as with most decks is winnable if you draw graveyard hate. I recommend mixed against them so 2 Tormods 2 Ravenous Trap, 2 Traps 2 Farie Macabre, 2 Tormods 2 Relic of Progenitus, or even 1 of each. If Dredge is big in your meta, try fitting 5 or 6 slots against them, although we can outrun them sometimes if they don't get good hands.
Dreadstill, I would say sideboard, maybe running 1x Viridian Zealot maindeck or 1 Gleeful sabotage.
And I haven't played against Suvi yet so no idea. Enchantment destroy and aim for the Fittest ^^ Fauna Shaman will be a problem though.
Good Luck, let us know how things are going ;)
i dont know nihilo but for me, with this set up, keen is not a good addition.
your berserk stumpy's designed has river boa, selkie or other mid range wincon, then maybe
adding keen to it would be a nice idea.
i have tried using keen seen in a gw mid range berserk stumpy before (just before noble came out)
wherein my creatures were, riverboa, mireboa at the non basic dryad 2/1...
so with wilson's design, i'd rather see a +/+ spell rather than keens.
:)
btw, we just had our philcoa yr ending legacy last night and i used
etennie's (magic-style) current list. so strong that it doesnt need
3 - 4 pump spells to win. :)
exalted abilities were awasome! and after i dealt the damage, just before leaving the combat phase,
i'll fling the big fella to his face. hahaha i'd done that a couple of times.
also, i've done two 2nd turn kills. wow! 1st via wild nactl then inv then 2 berserks and
the other one, via 1st turn kavu then 2nd turn noble dropped a land then
invi invi then zerk on my attacking kavu.
priceless
:)
I'm still scratching my head on the Snow-Covered Forests...???
As far as Keen Sense goes, you would have to cut pump spells in order to squeeze it in. I wouldn't use more than 1-2, it's functionally just a different alternative to Sylvan Library.
4x Slipper Bogle
4x Nettle Sentinel
4x Skarrgan Pit-SKulk
4x Silhana Ledgewalker
4x Kavu Predator
4x Rancor
4x Invigorate
4x Might of Old Krosa
4x Berserk
4x Vines of Vastwood
2x Seal of Strength
2x Keen Sense
16x Forest
That might work, you have 16L - 20C - 22P - 2 utility. STILL, I would be really skeptical about using only 16 lands without Noble Hierarch or Elvish Spirit Guide. There's a reason my tagname is Mr. Safety, I play it safe when it comes to mana source count.
I've been thinking about Troll Ascetic, and I think if you're going to spend 3 mana on a creature, maybe Eternal Witness may be playable. It would get your creature count a little higher and you could drop the utility draw altogether with Keen Sense/Sylvan Lybrary. How awesome would it be to get an Invigorate back and play it for free the same turn?
oh man...
since I posted that I play Troll Ascetics, you all are thinking about other creatures... I don't think, any other cc3 creatures will improve the deck... Troll is ONLY there because of Regenerate AND Trollshroud.
I'd like to see Keen Sense in a Scryb Sprites / Ledgewalker / Trollshroud build but the space is miising =/
Snow-covered Forests are super-secret-ninja-jedi-tech to confuse opponents, and every 10th person is asking: "why snow?" =P=P=P
Well you might confuse an opponent into thinking that you have something in your deck that you do not...Quote:
Originally Posted by NecroYawgmoth
Keen Senses seems to be a win more card. You do not get any extra cards to use in the attack phase the turn you cast it since you will not be drawing until damage is dealt. It would be great on Ledgewalker, but I think a bit weak elsewhere. Library seems better to me since it lets you dig.
I think Scryb is probably better than Nettle right now. And with Keen Sense, Scryb is definetly better.
I'm not saying it is the greatest addition or that we should all play it. I just wanted to hear results, that's all, since I don't have much time to test lately :(Quote:
Originally Posted by paeng4983
To MR.SAFETY:
You can always run Scrying sheets or Mouth of Ronom. To either draw extra or deal better damage than with Hornet Sting in mono-green, hehe, just kidding ;)
Boy, I'm glad you said you were just kidding. Holy moly, all of those cards are just BAD, haha. The only reason would be the fake-out factor, which would only work for 1 game and then they'd clue in. Still, I don't think it's really anything that will work on anyone but a scrub/bad player.Quote:
Originally Posted by NihilObstat
The one deck I saw Keen Sense work in was a G/B/u deck that used Silhana Ledgewalker and Troll Ascetic (along with man-lands) as it's offense, and the traditional Force of Will + Daze + Brainstorm package. It was essentially Tempo Thresh...but without the threshold and Keen Sense was the draw engine instead of Bob + Tops. It worked ok (well, I lost to it twice, lol, this was on MWS, so it doesn't really count anyways)
Hey, I wouldn't say they are that bad. It Scrying sheets used to be very used in it's T2 and extended, although certainly not legacy, but it's one of the only possible ways to draw in mono-green and specially in mono-white.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Safety
But yeah, it's ninja tech and hey, snow-lands are pretty. Specially the old ones ^^
Also, the idea you posted about Eternal Witness doesn't sound that crazy to me, she is card advantage in this deck which is awesome, cause we don't have, and she can recycle Mook, a countered Rancor, Vov, Zerk, well anything!!! So she is card advantage who hits for 2, and picks what advantage to get. Maybe playing 1 or 2next to 1 or 2 Troll in a 18 lands version could be great. I hate not being able to test. MWS doesn't work of Machintosh, and I don't have time to test irl.
Hmmm...I'll get back to you about the Mac-problem with MWS. A good friend of mine overcame that obstacle, I'll ask him how he did it.
Yeah, Witness in an 18 land version sounds good. I also really like the Troll Ascetic idea in a 'bigger' version of this deck. It would be what Big Zoo is to zoo, only this would be 'Big Stompy'.
Just throwing out a list:
22 Creatures
4x Ledgewalker
4x Predator
4x Bogle
4x Pit-Skulk
2x Troll Ascetic
2x Eternal Witness
2x Noble Hierarch/Elvish Spirit Guide
20 Pump Spells
4x VoV
4x MooK
4x Rancor
4x Invigorate
4x Berserk
18 Forest
You wouldn't need Sylvan Library because of your Witness bringing back stuff from the graveyard. Both are susceptable to countermagic, but Witness has the added bonus of having a 2/1 body as well as bringing back a cheap/free pump spell to hand, usable immediately. I would use/playtest this list if I was going to see a CounterTop or control heavy environment, as the added 3 mana spells can dodge CounterTop as well as being able to play the mid-range beatdown game vs. aggro decks that rely on removal to get their dudes through. The Witness/mana dork/Troll ratio could be endlessly played around with, I just popped in 2x of each for a starting point.
I believe Eternal Witness to be a bad card for us, and I'll tell why: Her 3 mana cast cost is an advantage only when someone got countertop/chalice online and we are lucky that he can't counter her AND has no tarmogoyf to ruin her, since countertop/chalice decks already can foil our Berserk plan easily.
A 2/1 vanilla that returns a card to hand has nothing the deck currently demands: It is not a midgame creature, it won't help you combo by either having evasion -or- protection, and isn't even granted to be a pump, since you'd need to use the pump, then cast her to return and, only then, be able to recast.
I can understand Troll. Troll has power 3, which is not great, but OK. Troll won't be point-removed, and can protect itself from Firespout-like mass removals, and is a midgame creature that can stall Tarmogoyfs and Knight of the Reliquary's.
Eternal Witness will only turn the deck into something it isn't supposed to be doing in first place.
If you want a 3cc creature, and I believe troll should be it if that's the case, even Cradle Guard is better than E.W., in my opinion.
LMK if I'm wrong, but my guess is that she's going to stall you more than get otherwise unreachable wins.
I'm making a good amount of argumentation on that simply for the way the idea started. There are countless amount of green 3cc creatures out there, and our deck is know to get any 2/1 vanilla to the 20+/x tier, but that doesn't mean any creature is usable here. Before you start testing the most recent Grizzly Bear around, think about some situations in which they would be better than what we got, which will usually involve being Big for cheap, having evasion and/or protections.
Any idea on how a Berserk Stompy can defeat a Storm deck with Tendrils as the finisher? Krosan Grip perhaps?
You can use either Mindbreak Trap, or Chalice of the Void @0. There's also Guttural Response, which is useful against cantrips, enters against counterspells, and is way better against High Tide, and there are lots of stuff if you splash. If you are playing against Ad Nauseam, then you should rush their lifepoints as soon as you figure that out. If you know they run Ill-Gotten Gains, you can use Tormod's Crypt. The most reliable is to side-out 2cc creatures against them, and try to pump and attack with a creature at least once.Quote:
Originally Posted by Khell
Usually you're fast enough to race them. The Ad Nauseum version is easiest as you can just do a maximum amount of damage to them before they go off to ensure that damage isn't lethal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Khell
The doomsday version you just need to kill as fast as possible.
The deck I would really be worried about is anything containing Iona/Blazing Archon. If that is in your meta you should run slaughter pact.
@Gui: yeah, you make great points. If you're looking for mid-range, make it count. Troll Ascetic is the only good option. Drove of Elves has the potential to be bigger, but does NOT have the built in regeneration, and it's conditional. I'm letting you know, YOU'RE NOT WRONG, haha.
Let me open up some sideboard options, seeing as how the maindeck is really just 'splitting hairs' over minor changes.
Autumn's Veil
Guttural Response
Mindbreak Trap
Baloth Cage Trap
Summoning Trap
I like the idea of Summoning Trap against Counterbalance and control decks. Although I could just seeing it getting hard countered. I think Baloth Trap has the problem of you being in a situation where you have two mana and the opponent has played an artefact. Without acceleration I am not sure the timing of this will work except against a very narrow range of decks. Do either give a benefit over [card]Gleeful Sabotage[/card]?
Mindbreak Trap I think is going to be needed just to have a chance of stopping combo decks for a turn or two.