[Deck] Team America (BUG Delver)

I think that if you looks at the disruption suite you need synergy and redundancy. I like 4/4/4 Daze/FoW/Hymn. That's a pretty solid 12. If you go under 12 you start to soften up to combo decks like storm or snt, and it's also challenging to really lean on Lilli as disruption as she is a little slow for the tier one combo decks in Legacy. You can also mix in Stifle which is both more conditional and at times more back breaking. I'd say pick a 12 and get some rounds in and see what you like. I love Hymn for example and just want to cast it. You can also look at cards like Clique as kind of a soft increase to both the disruption and threat density in the deck. You have lots of tools to choose from, play around with them.
cheers
defector

I play 4 FoW, 4 Daze, 3 Thoughtseize, 2 Hymn, 2 Liliana in a list with 2 Confidants. Maybe I want to swap 1 seize for a 3th Hymn or a piece of removal. I don't like the lifeloss from thoughtseize because of Confidant right now, but still prefer trageted discard over Hymn =(.. In a lot of matchups it doesn't matter much, but still..

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Originally Posted by H

List looks good to me, but why the second Trop over the fourth Sea? Black seems critical in this list, considering Hymn, Lili, even the Confidants too.

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I want four green and five blue sources, especially postboard where I'm bringing in several additional green cards. I'm actually considering cutting a Bayou for the fourth sea if I go down a green source because I hate mulliganing otherwise solid 1-landers because Bayou is the one land.

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Originally Posted by Lans89

I play 4 FoW, 4 Daze, 3 Thoughtseize, 2 Hymn, 2 Liliana in a list with 2 Confidants. Maybe I want to swap 1 seize for a 3th Hymn or a piece of removal. I don't like the lifeloss from thoughtseize because of Confidant right now, but still prefer trageted discard over Hymn =(.. In a lot of matchups it doesn't matter much, but still..

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I think it's a matter of prederence. My oddball disruption suite works for me. If anything I'd go to just four pieces of discard on top of your Lilianas, but that's just me.

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Originally Posted by wcm8

Picking your battles is indeed the conundrum. You only have 15 slots to work with, and those will also be based largely on what your main 60 looks like.

Lately I've dropped Hymn and am playing a 3/3 split of Spell Pierce and Stifle + 3 Dark Confidant + 1 TNN due to changes in my local metagame (plenty of Control and Combo decks, but also a fair amount of opposing tempo decks). I also dropped Liliana entirely (since she's too slow right now) and am running 3/2 Decay/Disfigure for my removal right now. My current sideboard:

1 Flusterstorm
1 Force of Will (only 3 in MD)
1 Vendilion Clique
2 Thoughtseize
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Marsh Casualties (over Golgari Charm since I'm running Bob + TNN)
1 Dread of Night
1 Life from the Loam
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Life from the Loam
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Maelstrom Pulse

DoN is arguably the most narrow card there, but it's what I consider to be a necessary evil due to the prevalence of White creature decks in my metagame and also at large. It's really up to people to decide if DnT is prevalent enough to justify running it, but DoN is just *soooo* good at beating those strategies. It's the perfect sideboard card because it's relevant no matter when you get to cast it, and can really help out against a bad board state. (Some SB cards need to be proactively deployed or only serve as temporary measures).

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You have Loam listed twice in your board. Are you running 2 Loam or is there another card you left out?

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Originally Posted by TLK

You have Loam listed twice in your board. Are you running 2 Loam or is there another card you left out?

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typo, the missing card was probably another removal spell like Diabolic edict or similar.

My list was just put together for that weekend. Build your own SB based on your main deck and local expectations. I'm not even so sure if I'm entirely sold on running Stifle, and will likely go back to Hymn if I'm playing TA. Also I think it's a toss-up between Dark Confidant and Sylvan Library; they both shine in different scenarios.

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Originally Posted by wcm8

typo, the missing card was probably another removal spell like Diabolic edict or similar.

My list was just put together for that weekend. Build your own SB based on your main deck and local expectations. I'm not even so sure if I'm entirely sold on running Stifle, and will likely go back to Hymn if I'm playing TA. Also I think it's a toss-up between Dark Confidant and Sylvan Library; they both shine in different scenarios.

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Yea i don't like the stifle build. I rather just jam and jam and jam.

Waiting isn't my game.

Took first place at a local event ("Win a playset of Noble Hierarch") with a slightly experimental list. Tournament report here - http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...626#post874626


Highlights - Tasigur beating up Tarmogoyfs; Tasigur beating up Tombstalkers; topping the swiss; not dropping a game in the top8; Surgical-ing all my opponent's lands away; building a really wonky sideboard and not getting punished for it

Got 3rd in a small 10-man Legacy tournament last night.

Round 1 vs. Imperial Painter:

He wins game 1 on the back of a timely Blood Moon. I had the mana to float for an Abrupt Decay, but unfortunately he had a Spellskite on board. Close, but he took it. Game 2 I was able to counter/disrupt him enough for a large Goyf to take care of business. Game 3 he has a turn 1 Magus of the Moon on the play. GG. :/

0-1, 1-2

Round 2 vs. Mono Black Control:

It's a weird build with Waste Not, tons of discard, Smallpox, etc. His finishers are Abyssal Persecutor and Desecration Demon. The large fliers were hard to deal with once in play, and I succumb to 6/6 monsters game 1. Game 2, my timely Thoughtseize took a Demon and I was able to ride double Goyf to victory. Game 3 is similar to game 2.

1-1, 2-1

Round 3 vs. Burn:

Game 1 he gets a close game with a Price of Progress. Games 2 and 3 I'm able to counter most of his big spells as well as gain tons of life/deal tons of damage with Deathrite Shaman. He was the all star in this matchup. Large Goyfs acted as roadblocks for opposing Guides and Swiftspears. Disfigures and Decays helped with Lavamancer and Eidolon.

2-1, 2-1

Deck felt pretty good overall. The T1 Magus was just unfortunate luck. I think I need to revise my sideboard a bit.

Pff the 3 Confi, 3 Pierce, 3 stifle builds are doing very well... I can't rly decide on which one is better. Discard gives so much information, something I miss when trying out that 'new' list. I keep switching between the

I also love to play with 2 Confi in a discard build, but the Thoughtseize lifeloss is still an issue. 2 confi, 2 hymn, 2 Seize, 2 liliana, 2 disfigure, 3 decay, 19 lands + the usual is what I'm thinking off now.

I think both the Hymn and Stifle builds are perfectly fine in the current meta. If you are having trouble deciding which to choose, I would just ask which of those two cards you would prefer to cast. I prefer Hymn cause of the sad faces I see from my opponents when it resolves.

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Originally Posted by o_boogie

I think both the Hymn and Stifle builds are perfectly fine in the current meta. If you are having trouble deciding which to choose, I would just ask which of those two cards you would prefer to cast. I prefer Hymn cause of the sad faces I see from my opponents when it resolves.

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Haha yeah, Hymn is fun to play! But I would most likely only play 2 copies =). And as others stated, jamming is more fun than waiting! I guess I know what I want to play hmm, but the stifle results are still tunning!

In general, being aggressive is *always* better than being reactive. Threats are always potential game-winners, whereas reactive cards need to be both A) timely and B) appropriate for the given scenario. Neither of those is always guaranteed; conversely, a flipped Delver *demands* an answer. The thing about RUG is that is can use its reactive portion to shield its threats, whereas BUG is more about running the opponent out of answers and then winning via topdeck (speaking in general, obviously this isn't always the case). Either approach can work, asHymn isn't *always* powerful (but then, neither is Spell Pierce or Stifle).

This doesn't apply directly to BUG, but I played a Grixis list this past weekend in a local 24-man tournament, piloting it to top 4. Previously I was testing a version that ran a lot of reactive spells, minimal threats, and no Dazes, but found that this list was too slow and it was difficult to always capitalize on opportunities due to not having a creature onboard. So I instead ran a version that had more threats, including Delvers and Monastery Swiftspear and 4 Daze. The list ran much, much smoother as I generally always had a threat onboard.

I think that aggro-control is the right approach to the metagame at large, and the sideboard can be built to answer the strategies' weaknesses. It becomes a matter of taste to decide on running BUG, RUG, Grixis, UR, and even UG Infect is essentially a tempo deck that utilizes a similar approach to closing out games. Each has their strengths and weaknesses, and unless more broken cards are printed that make one color combination undeniably 'the best', there's no definitive answer. And even then, Legacy has plenty of strong sideboard cards to answer just about anything.

When do you play Disfigure (1-2x) in the mainboard?

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Originally Posted by Deckerator

When do you play Disfigure (1-2x) in the mainboard?

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When the meta is full of delver decks, stoneblade decks, or creature decks.

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Originally Posted by Deckerator

When do you play Disfigure (1-2x) in the mainboard?

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At the moment? Always. The prevalence of x/2s is significant enough that it's useful in more games than it isn't, and it also lets you win in combat in situations like Goyf vs Batterskull. You should probably be looking at either 4/1 or 3/2 for your Abrupt Decay/Disfigure split in the main, with a total of 4/2 or 4/3 in the 75.

It really is x/2s, as well - unfortunately Darkblast really isn't the card it used to be :frown:

Yeah, unless Miracles is big in your area. They are just plain bad against Miracles.

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

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Originally Posted by ANRoebuck

At the moment? Always. The prevalence of x/2s is significant enough that it's useful in more games than it isn't, and it also lets you win in combat in situations like Goyf vs Batterskull. You should probably be looking at either 4/1 or 3/2 for your Abrupt Decay/Disfigure split in the main, with a total of 4/2 or 4/3 in the 75.

It really is x/2s, as well - unfortunately Darkblast really isn't the card it used to be :frown:

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To be fair, Goyf vs. Batterskull is usually a win for Goyf anyway.

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Originally Posted by Secretly.A.Bee

Yeah, unless Miracles is big in your area. They are just plain bad against Miracles.

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

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This (and other non-creature matchups) is why I don't like non-Decay, non-Liliana removal maindeck. I was up to 2 MD Dimir Charm when Cruise was legal and that worked very well. I think that some number of MD Disfigures are fine (and even correct) if you have a bunch of creature decks to slog through. In my meta (or in a large unknown meta), I'd rather have the Charm if you were absolutely committed to an additional maindeck removal spell. I know that it doesn't kill flipped Delvers and doesn't break Goyf/Tasigur standoffs, but it does everything else that you want Disfigure for without being dead in a third or more of your matchups. Especially in the case of Miracles, where drawing a hard counter versus drawing a brick is often the difference between winning and losing.

Here is my list. Played
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Tombstalker

4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Daze
4 Force of Will

4 Thoughtseize
2 Hymn to Tourach

1 Sylvan library

4 Polluted Delta
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Wasteland
3 Underground Sea
3 Tropical Island
2 Bayou

This is the list i play at the moment.
After Disfigure I have got some questions about some other options in the deck.
The ideas are.
--> 2 Tasigur instead of Tombstalker. I have tested Tombstalker and he is a good option because he is 5/5 flying and not legendary. The downside is the double B
--> 4 Hymn and 0 Thoughtseize instead of 2 Hymn and 4 Thoughtseize. Im not really convinced of so many BB spells.
+ 2 Liliana of the Veil.

For me, i really like Liliana but cmc 3 is much in this deck and she is not really a win con.

Any ideas?

Gurmag Angler is a viable option instead of the 2nd Tasigur. It costs 1 delve more but power is greater and most important thing, it's not legendary (see Karakas); you won't activate most of the time Tasigur's ability.

I either don't like Liliana. It's not a wincon and I'm still searchin' for a decent substitute.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk.


Edit:

For reference, this is the list I'm approaching to:

4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
1 Tasigur
1 Gurmag Angler
1 Tombstalker
2 TNN

4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
2 Disfigure
1 Dimir Charm
4 Hymn to Tourach

1 Sylvan Library

4 Waste
3 Usea
1 Bayou
2 Tropical Island
9 Fetches

SB
1 Flusterstorm
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Pithing Needle
1 Spell Pierce
1 Surgical Extraction
2 Dread of Night
1 Null Rod
2 Marsh Casualties
1 Engineered Plague
1 Krosan Grip
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Vendilion Clique

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Originally Posted by meffeo

4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
1 Tasigur
1 Gurmag Angler
1 Tombstalker
2 TNN

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No Goyf? This must be an April Fool, yes?! ;-)

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Originally Posted by I_Hate_Counterspells

No Goyf? This must be an April Fool, yes?! ;-)

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Yes, it's a goyfless build. I'd like to play creatures that are undecayables and not *excessively* weak to gy hate.

The Golden Fang could easily enter at turn 3 or 4 and still remains a 4/5 after a RiP et similia (apply the same concept for the Angler). Obviously Tombstalker is a different story.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk.

Recently "joined the dark side" with the recent decision to purchase a set of Goyfs to complete my Legacy collection.

I've ran the following list to cash at both Legacy events at GP Cleveland (Top 4 split Saturday, 8th on Sunday, picked up a free Volcanic Island for my troubles), and also have won the last two weeks at my LGS.

3 Underground Sea
3 Tropical Island
4 Polluted Delta
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Wasteland

4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Delver of Secrets
2 Tasigur, the Golden Fang

4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Spell Pierce
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Stifle
2 Disfigure

Sideboard:

1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Pithing Needle
1 Null Rod
1 Sylvan Library
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Murderous Cut
2 Divert
2 Flusterstorm
3 Thoughtseize


The only changes have been to the sideboard, where I've cut the Golgari Charm and Umezawa's Jitte for Toxic Deluge and Null Rod (metagame choices).

I've been a huge fan of Tasigur in the deck, despite not being very popular with some players. I feel that this inclusion walks the same line as the Discard vs Stifle debate. It's all about your play style and how you want to attack your individual matches.

Either way, thought I'd share.

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Originally Posted by Unassigned

Recently "joined the dark side" with the recent decision to purchase a set of Goyfs to complete my Legacy collection.

I've ran the following list to cash at both Legacy events at GP Cleveland (Top 4 split Saturday, 8th on Sunday, picked up a free Volcanic Island for my troubles), and also have won the last two weeks at my LGS.

3 Underground Sea
3 Tropical Island
4 Polluted Delta
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Wasteland

4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Delver of Secrets
2 Tasigur, the Golden Fang

4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Spell Pierce
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Stifle
2 Disfigure

Sideboard:

1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Pithing Needle
1 Null Rod
1 Sylvan Library
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Murderous Cut
2 Divert
2 Flusterstorm
3 Thoughtseize


The only changes have been to the sideboard, where I've cut the Golgari Charm and Umezawa's Jitte for Toxic Deluge and Null Rod (metagame choices).

I've been a huge fan of Tasigur in the deck, despite not being very popular with some players. I feel that this inclusion walks the same line as the Discard vs Stifle debate. It's all about your play style and how you want to attack your individual matches.

Either way, thought I'd share.

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If I were going to play Stifle, this is very close to the list I'd play. Tasigur definitely gives you the lategame that Liliana does in the discard version, and I suspect that you can very easily get rid of all the bad earlygame cards like Daze when he comes down. How has Murderous Cut been at dealing with things outside of Decay range? Is it markedly better than something like Go for the Throat, Victim of Night, or Ultimate Price?

Also, glad the Dark Side is treating you well.

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Originally Posted by btm10

If I were going to play Stifle, this is very close to the list I'd play. Tasigur definitely gives you the lategame that Liliana does in the discard version, and I suspect that you can very easily get rid of all the bad earlygame cards like Daze when he comes down. How has Murderous Cut been at dealing with things outside of Decay range? Is it markedly better than something like Go for the Throat, Victim of Night, or Ultimate Price?

Also, glad the Dark Side is treating you well.

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Thanks Brendan (This is Adam btw ;) )

Yes, Wiley is pretty dead set against Tasigur, but I've been so in love with the card in Standard/Modern/Legacy that I added him without a second thought and haven't regretted it. There are certainly situations where he's bad, but he's been such a house that I can't justify changing him out aside for a few matches like Death & Taxes.

Murderous Cut has been very beneficial. In addition to controlling my graveyard, hitting opposing Tasigurs and beefier bodies outside of Decay range has been very helpful. I wouldn't change him out for ay of the cards you've mentioned, namely because I'm trying to stay as cheap as possible and it's nice that cut does not have the limitations on targets that others do.

Alright. After a long and tireless search for the right "blue" deck, I've come to this secluded alley and stumbled upon this community to study under your tutelage of the dark arts.

In all seriousness, I cannot find the right "blue" deck for myself. I currently have D&T, Elves, and plan on building burn (maybe goblins instead) as well as building MUD. My problem with blue is, I want to use as many of the best blue spells in Legacy as I can and not get bored using them (for reference: brainstorm, ponder, force of will, and daze). I have an OmniTell deck with the four show and tell required, but the spells search for combo pieces, not threats so it bores me (I also don't get to play daze). I tried Merfolk but they have no use for brainstorm or ponder which kind of turns me off a little. I also tried Sneak & Show, but they are similar to OmniTell.

So I have come to this community to ask if this deck is more fun then the blue decks that I mentioned? (So is it more fun than an Islandwalking army or dropping Show and Tell?) If it is a fun deck to invest in, I am missing the goyfs and blue duals. Anyway I can build it without sacrificing much of it's power while collecting other pieces?

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Originally Posted by Brentane

Alright. After a long and tireless search for the right "blue" deck, I've come to this secluded alley and stumbled upon this community to study under your tutelage of the dark arts.

In all seriousness, I cannot find the right "blue" deck for myself. I currently have D&T, Elves, and plan on building burn (maybe goblins instead) as well as building MUD. My problem with blue is, I want to use as many of the best blue spells in Legacy as I can and not get bored using them (for reference: brainstorm, ponder, force of will, and daze). I have an OmniTell deck with the four show and tell required, but the spells search for combo pieces, not threats so it bores me (I also don't get to play daze). I tried Merfolk but they have no use for brainstorm or ponder which kind of turns me off a little. I also tried Sneak & Show, but they are similar to OmniTell.

So I have come to this community to ask if this deck is more fun then the blue decks that I mentioned? (So is it more fun than an Islandwalking army or dropping Show and Tell?) If it is a fun deck to invest in, I am missing the goyfs and blue duals. Anyway I can build it without sacrificing much of it's power while collecting other pieces?

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I think it is just personal preference, which deck is fun and which is not. With this deck you have many cards to interact with the oppenent.

You NEED definitly 3-4 Gofys and 3 U-Seas (4 are better when you are on the blacker Build with Hmyne / Lily). In genereal: Hymne Build standard Manabase 4 U-Seas, 2 Bayou, 1 Trop, Stifle Build often has 3 U-Seas and 3 Trops.

You don't want to play any Basics in there.

I hope this may help you. :smile:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Brentane

Alright. After a long and tireless search for the right "blue" deck, I've come to this secluded alley and stumbled upon this community to study under your tutelage of the dark arts.

In all seriousness, I cannot find the right "blue" deck for myself. I currently have D&T, Elves, and plan on building burn (maybe goblins instead) as well as building MUD. My problem with blue is, I want to use as many of the best blue spells in Legacy as I can and not get bored using them (for reference: brainstorm, ponder, force of will, and daze). I have an OmniTell deck with the four show and tell required, but the spells search for combo pieces, not threats so it bores me (I also don't get to play daze). I tried Merfolk but they have no use for brainstorm or ponder which kind of turns me off a little. I also tried Sneak & Show, but they are similar to OmniTell.

So I have come to this community to ask if this deck is more fun then the blue decks that I mentioned? (So is it more fun than an Islandwalking army or dropping Show and Tell?) If it is a fun deck to invest in, I am missing the goyfs and blue duals. Anyway I can build it without sacrificing much of it's power while collecting other pieces?

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This deck is one of the most interactive blue decks you can play. Yes, it is great fun.
You still get some blow outs with Hymn to Tourach, but almost every game is a battle.
I would definitely recommend this as a blue deck to get into.

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Originally Posted by Zodiac_Dragon

I think it is just personal preference, which deck is fun and which is not. With this deck you have many cards to interact with the oppenent.

You NEED definitly 3-4 Gofys and 3 U-Seas (4 are better when you are on the blacker Build with Hmyne / Lily). In genereal: Hymne Build standard Manabase 4 U-Seas, 2 Bayou, 1 Trop, Stifle Build often has 3 U-Seas and 3 Trops.

You don't want to play any Basics in there.

I hope this may help you. :smile:

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I had a question about this as well. I'm building TES which requires 2 Underground Seas. If I want to play that AND lend Team America to someone, could it function on just 2 Seas, 3 Trops, and a Bayou? could stifle work with that list?

BUG Tempo does have the problem that Disfigure and Dismember are the 1cc creature removal available to it and they both have significant drawbacks. Abrupt Decay is a great all purpose removal tool for the meta right now but it often doesn't happen fast enough on the draw. That's the primary thing holding BUG back from being the best blue shell list right now. Lightning Bolt and Swords to Plowshares are just objectively better at removing early creatures than anything BUG Tempo has available.

It's a good trade-off though. If BUG had a removal spell with the overall value of bolts nobody would play anything else.

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Originally Posted by FoolofaTook

BUG Tempo does have the problem that Disfigure and Dismember are the 1cc creature removal available to it and they both have significant drawbacks. Abrupt Decay is a great all purpose removal tool for the meta right now but it often doesn't happen fast enough on the draw. That's the primary thing holding BUG back from being the best blue shell list right now. Lightning Bolt and Swords to Plowshares are just objectively better at removing early creatures than anything BUG Tempo has available.

It's a good trade-off though. If BUG had a removal spell with the overall value of bolts nobody would play anything else.

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I think everyone would jump to DNT or elves...having BUG as 50% of the meta will be hell

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Originally Posted by KobeBryan

I think everyone would jump to DNT or elves...having BUG as 50% of the meta will be hell

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BUG can adapt to that kind of meta shift better than most lists. That it doesn't really like the D&T or Elves matchups is primarily because there are so many other things that have to be taken into account. If you can play three Dread of Night in your sideboard D&T becomes almost trivially easy. You can't do that in most metas. You'd also see more mainlist Golgari Charm in that type of meta.

The thing that keeps BUG from dominating at this point is the heavy reliance on two colors that are not blue and the utility/casting cost of the early removal. If either of those things were less aggravating than they currently are the list would be the best blue list.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FoolofaTook

BUG Tempo does have the problem that Disfigure and Dismember are the 1cc creature removal available to it and they both have significant drawbacks. Abrupt Decay is a great all purpose removal tool for the meta right now but it often doesn't happen fast enough on the draw. That's the primary thing holding BUG back from being the best blue shell list right now. Lightning Bolt and Swords to Plowshares are just objectively better at removing early creatures than anything BUG Tempo has available.

It's a good trade-off though. If BUG had a removal spell with the overall value of bolts nobody would play anything else.

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Your post contains absolutely no response to mine. Please remove the quoted bit.
EDIT: Thanks. :smile:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Star|Scream

I had a question about this as well. I'm building TES which requires 2 Underground Seas. If I want to play that AND lend Team America to someone, could it function on just 2 Seas, 3 Trops, and a Bayou? could stifle work with that list?

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I'd probably run another fetch or a Watery Grave before I added Bayou if you're going to be on the Stifle plan. Bayou is a necessary evil if you're on Hymn/Liliana/Tombstalker, but it's really bad when you want your first two lands to make UUBG.

Hi. After a record of 6-1, i decided to ID last round of the MKM Rome legacy main event and finished 9th :(

Feel sad about the result but happy with the good performance of the deck.

I won to UW control, Deathblade, goblin stompy, dredge, miracles, UWR pyro and lost to elves.
My friend with the same 60 and only 4 changes to the sideboard made top 8.

Hymn to tourach was the MVP. I only played 1 copy the day before on the trial, and decided to change.


Maindeck
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Tasigur, the Golden Fang

2 Bayou
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Polluted Delta
1 Tropical Island
4 Underground Sea
1 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland

4 Abrupt Decay
4 Brainstorm
4 Daze
4 Force of Will
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Ponder
2 Liliana of the Veil

Sideboard
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 pithing needle
3 Golgari Charm
2 Disfigure
2 Vendilion Clique
1 Dismember
1 Sylvan Library
3 Spell Pierce

Quote:

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Originally Posted by apon

Hi. After a record of 6-1, i decided to ID last round of the MKM Rome legacy main event and finished 9th :(

Feel sad about the result but happy with the good performance of the deck.

I won to UW control, Deathblade, goblin stompy, dredge, miracles, UWR pyro and lost to elves.
My friend with the same 60 and only 4 changes to the sideboard made top 8.

Hymn to tourach was the MVP. I only played 1 copy the day before on the trial, and decided to change.


Maindeck
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Tasigur, the Golden Fang

2 Bayou
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Polluted Delta
1 Tropical Island
4 Underground Sea
1 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland

4 Abrupt Decay
4 Brainstorm
4 Daze
4 Force of Will
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Ponder
2 Liliana of the Veil

Sideboard
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 pithing needle
3 Golgari Charm
2 Disfigure
2 Vendilion Clique
1 Dismember
1 Sylvan Library
3 Spell Pierce

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No love for Tombstalker instead of Tasigur? The rest is really standard classic TA which I also prefer. Congrats

I must admit that this looks like a really interesting deck to play. I've been wanting to play a delver deck in Legacy for quite some time now, but I've always been looking at UWR Delver since I own a playset of Stoneforges. Though lately I've been contemplating about selling those, mainly because I find the UWR Delver manabase quite expensive. Of course, this deck's manabase is also expensive, except for the fact that I'd still need 2 more U. Sea's and 1 more Bayou if I'd not go on the Stifle plan (from what I've been reading).

So let me ask, which version is better? Stifle or more discard focussed?

Still contemplating a bit, since a playset of Tarmogoyf isn't exactly cheap either.

Also, since I haven't been playing on a non-basic list yet (only played reanimator [and UW Stoneblade without duals and wastes] before in Legacy), how do you cope with blood moon? I just don't like to insta-lose to it. Running basics is a no-go?

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Originally Posted by redesign1991

I must admit that this looks like a really interesting deck to play. I've been wanting to play a delver deck in Legacy for quite some time now, but I've always been looking at UWR Delver since I own a playset of Stoneforges. Though lately I've been contemplating about selling those, mainly because I find the UWR Delver manabase quite expensive. Of course, this deck's manabase is also expensive, except for the fact that I'd still need 2 more U. Sea's and 1 more Bayou if I'd not go on the Stifle plan (from what I've been reading).

1.) So let me ask, which version is better? Stifle or more discard focussed?

2.) Still contemplating a bit, since a playset of Tarmogoyf isn't exactly cheap either.

3.) Also, since I haven't been playing on a non-basic list yet (only played reanimator [and UW Stoneblade without duals and wastes] before in Legacy), how do you cope with blood moon? I just don't like to insta-lose to it. Running basics is a no-go?

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1. There is no directly better or worse...It depends on personal playstyle and preference. The stifle version is more a classic delver tempo strategy & the Hymb version is more a tap out sorcery speed version of the deck. Both have they´re pro´s & con`s.

2. Tarmogoyf is needed in both variants. So that point doesnt really matter...

3. Yes, playing basics in this deck is a no-go. We cant support basics with that low land count and cards like Daze or Hymn, Lili, Stalker etc....

Greetings

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Originally Posted by Manipulato

No love for Tombstalker instead of Tasigur? The rest is really standard classic TA which I also prefer. Congrats

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For me the possibilities for 1/2 solts in addition to delver, tarmo and deathrite are:
Taisgur is 4/5 for B5 : can be cast easily in turn 3. Disadvantage legendary and power. His ability is rarely used.
Hooting Mandrills is a 4/5 trample for G5 : could be better than tasigur
Gurmag Angler is 5/5 for B6 : costs 1 more than tasigur, and has no legendaty problem and no ability.
Tombstalker is a 5/5 flying for BB6. Once in play is the best creature, but is the slowest of them

BUG delver is still a tempo deck, that means, the soonest you put your beast, the more preasure your opponent will have.

I'm going to test Mandrils and Gurmag. Stalker seems to slow.

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Originally Posted by Brentane

Alright. After a long and tireless search for the right "blue" deck, I've come to this secluded alley and stumbled upon this community to study under your tutelage of the dark arts.

In all seriousness, I cannot find the right "blue" deck for myself. I currently have D&T, Elves, and plan on building burn (maybe goblins instead) as well as building MUD. My problem with blue is, I want to use as many of the best blue spells in Legacy as I can and not get bored using them (for reference: brainstorm, ponder, force of will, and daze). I have an OmniTell deck with the four show and tell required, but the spells search for combo pieces, not threats so it bores me (I also don't get to play daze). I tried Merfolk but they have no use for brainstorm or ponder which kind of turns me off a little. I also tried Sneak & Show, but they are similar to OmniTell.

So I have come to this community to ask if this deck is more fun then the blue decks that I mentioned? (So is it more fun than an Islandwalking army or dropping Show and Tell?) If it is a fun deck to invest in, I am missing the goyfs and blue duals. Anyway I can build it without sacrificing much of it's power while collecting other pieces?

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Good luck on your search. I was on the same pursuit for years and after years of trial and error decided that no blue deck in Legacy fit the bill for what I'm looking for so I switched my FoWs to my Vintage deck and sleeved up Dark Rituals for my Legacy deck. My experience with Team America has been, that this is an aggro deck at the end of the day and despite the counterspells you are playing you don't really feel like a 'blue mage'. Plus I don't like losing to decks like Elves and D&T when I'm the one casting Brainstorms so... UWx decks feel more like blue decks to me but they always have a hard time against BUG colors, midrange and random stuff like 12-post, goblins, MUD etc. so there is really no perfect blue deck (disclaimer: This is my humble opinion.). I think you just have to play the deck and see if you enjoy how it plays against the format.

Stifle is insane in the mirror and against any other Delver decks. Stifle obviously compliments Wasteland really well too

I like Stifle build more because it feels tighter and faster... I don't like needing/wanting BB on turn 2 for for Hymn and then trying to cast Decays and TNN/Clique... I just really like the 3sea/3trop/8fetch/4waste manabase. Plus if you draw Bayou as your only land in your opening hand... That can be pretty bad, horrible even without a DRS to go with it.

The Hymn/Lili build has stronger late game, but is that where we really wanna be anyway?