[Deck] Dragon Stompy

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Originally Posted by Tacosnape

It's game-state dependent. I don't usually go out of my way (IE, Hold back) to flip an Akroma unless it's guaranteed to win me the game when/if I flip it and I'm going to struggle to win the game otherwise. Generally you don't go out of your way to flip her, but if the opportunity presents itself and it's a good idea, you do it.

Most often if she ends up on the board face-up it's because of one of four things:

1. I Morphed her turn one with either a Song in hand or a Song topdecked, allowing me a turn two flip.
2. I caught her midgame where I had enough mana.
3. I built up and hardcasted her against a deck like MUC or Landstill.
4. Someone in the mirror match ran Boldwyr Heavyweights. This happened once. They dropped it turn one and I quickly showed them Akroma wins races. Theoretically this could also happen if someone casts Patriarch's Bidding or something similarly bizarre.

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I've been finding that scenario 1 is the most common. I've always struggled between holding back an explosive Song in order to flip Akroma a turn or two down the road, or exploding with Song, but find myself gassed out, but with 1-2 more creatures swinging. I think Elemental is the best creature for that interchangeable slot too.

Taco, this will most undoubtedly get laughed at, but have you tested Bogardan Firefiend at that slot?

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Originally Posted by Arsenal

Taco, this will most undoubtedly get laughed at, but have you tested Bogardan Firefiend at that slot?

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Eh. It doesn't seem like it's all that good. If I'm going to run something that's fragile as a threat in this deck, I want it to fix problems. I run SSG because it fixes mana problems, and I run Magus of the Moon because it beats Legacy.

For slot #6, if I want a problem-fixer rather than a beatstick, I'd rather run Scalding Salamander or Fire Ants and fix my Empty the Warrens problems. Or I'd rather run Sulfur Elemental and fix my Cephalid Breakfast / Harmonic Sliver problems.

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Originally Posted by Tacosnape

Eh. It doesn't seem like it's all that good. If I'm going to run something that's fragile as a threat in this deck, I want it to fix problems. I run SSG because it fixes mana problems, and I run Magus of the Moon because it beats Legacy.

For slot #6, if I want a problem-fixer rather than a beatstick, I'd rather run Scalding Salamander or Fire Ants and fix my Empty the Warrens problems. Or I'd rather run Sulfur Elemental and fix my Cephalid Breakfast / Harmonic Sliver problems.

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I was looking at Firefiend as a 2R beater that can double as conditional spot removal. Sorta like the baby brother of FTK, but with a slightly different impact (Firefiend's combat math versus FTK's main phase assasination).

Yeah, it was just an idea I was kicking around. Elemental still gets the nod, but I think I'll test Firefiend for a bit just to be sure.

Why not fire imp than ?

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Originally Posted by savemysoul

Why not fire imp than ?

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Same reasons as not Flametongue Kavu:

1. Having to choose between killing your own shit and not getting Hellbent when they don't have a target for it is bad. Although, actually, Fire Imp at least can hit your own Dragon/Raiders to get himself in play in a pinch, so this would be less of an issue.

2. A shot for 2 isn't all that great. Arc-Slogger does rapid-fire for 2, and Pyrokinesis eats 2-vulnerable guys for breakfast. FTK can't make it in on a shot for 4, even.

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Originally Posted by Tacosnape

@Direct Damage: You do run Direct Damage. It's called Arc-Slogger. As for maindeck burn-style direct damage (assuming you're excluding things that don't hit players), it isn't worth it. You can't get enough of it to improve your board position effectively, and drawing it early is complete shit. If you have threats on the board, it's not hard to outrace your opponent with Dragon's insane pumping and evasion and Slogger's reach. And if you don't have threats on the board, you need more threats, not burn spells. If you do run them, however, Demonfire's your best bet, mainly because it's easy to get out of your hand in a pinch, and if you get a slow start you can do it for 1 to pick off a fast Lackey/Confidant/whatever.

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Yes, but Slogger's direct damage is rather limited by your red mana sources (unless you have a Moon effect) and the cards on your deck.

I guess I will test Demonfire (maybe 2 of them). I think it is worth it because of the amounts of mana the deck is able to get, and because of the Hellbent.

It will rarely be a dead card in your hand so it will rarely cut my Hellbent. And I guess it will be a card you will always be happy to topdeck. If it comes with a Seething Song it can be as good as RPD (it will deal less damage, but it will surely hit the opponent).

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Originally Posted by Tacosnape

@Powder Keg: Actually, it just gets rid of very little that I don't have a better answer to (The notable exception being ETW Tokens.) It can't touch an Enchantment, and most of the cards that really hurt me are enchantments. Tarmogoyf can be outraced if not killed outright, and most other low-cost creatures capitulate to Pyrokinesis. Manlands are better dealt with through Blood Moon, and most Artifacts I would want to get rid of can be dealt with faster and cheaper via Pithing Needle.

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OMG!! I forgot Powder Keg didn't target enchantments!! :cry: (And when I was thinking of it, it was mainly because of enchantments such as Survival or CoP).
The only thing that could deal with enchantments would be Nervinyrral Disk, but it would also destroy my Moxes and Chalices, so maybe it wouldn't be a good idea.
Anyway, this may change depending on the metagame. If decks using enchantments such as Worship or Solitary Confinement were more played, maybe Disk should be added to the Sb...

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Originally Posted by Tacosnape

@Trinisphere: It shines in some matchups. No question. It also makes you die in games where it's subpar due to it not giving you choices as to what to imprint on your Mox. Or by being topdecked on turn 3, where it starts to suck against a lot of decks. However, it's still really solid against Threshold and Storm Combo. My current list is experimenting with another card in its place that improves Threshold/Landstill/MUC matches, but leaves my Storm Combo match sort of iffy. I'll post results/explanations if I decide it's worth it.

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Can you give us an advance of what card you are talking about? :tongue:

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Originally Posted by Tacosnape

@Threats: I advise skipping Akroma. Sulfur Elemental and Taurean Mauler are better choices.

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I will think about it. I still agree with those who say Taurean Mauler is an horrible topdeck.
Akroma would be one of the bigger creatures played in Legacy, unaffected by half of Legacy removal (StP) and almost impossible to kill with Pernitous Deed (of course, if you morph it).
Maybe I didn't find Sulfur Elemental as good because I didn't use its potential as a removal card (using its flash ability in the combat phase) and because I ran only 1 of them in the maindeck.

Maybe next time I will try with 2 Akroma/Sulfur Elemental and 2 Demonfire instead of 3 Trinisphere and 1 Sulfur Elemental.

But now here comes another question: when I get the 4th mox, what should I replace it for? Maybe for one of the moons (what about 6 Moon effects?), as people seem to disagree with carrying less than 4 Sloggers...

Yeah, that's a good question...

Are 6 Moon-Effects enough for the Mainboard (if you play 4 Trinis main)?
(the other 2 are in the SB)

I don't like the Mauler, he is good in the early game, but bad in the lategame... Trini does the same, and I like it more then the Mauler...

For what reason you need FTK???, You have 4 Pyrokinesis in the board...
You don't need Fire Imp for the same reasons + you have 4 Sloggers...

YawG

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Originally Posted by Suguru

OMG!! I forgot Powder Keg didn't target enchantments!! :cry: (And when I was thinking of it, it was mainly because of enchantments such as Survival or CoP).
The only thing that could deal with enchantments would be Nervinyrral Disk, but it would also destroy my Moxes and Chalices, so maybe it wouldn't be a good idea.
Anyway, this may change depending on the metagame. If decks using enchantments such as Worship or Solitary Confinement were more played, maybe Disk should be added to the Sb...

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Theoretically there's already an answer to most enchantments you'll run across. For all the ones there isn't a great answer for, Anarchy solves it if you think it's worth having a solution to:

Survival of the Fittest
Needle it, or get down a fast Chal-2. Crypt can hurt them slightly also, and Moon can mess up their manabase.

Circle of Protection: Red
Needle it, or kill your opponent with face-down guys. Hellbent Pit Dragons take 2 mana to stop, interestingly enough. If too many white enchantments show up in your metagame, Anarchy can help.

Counterbalance
Ignore it. You're pretty strong against Counterbalance anyway due to your curve. Don't misunderstand, though, it can hurt you if it comes down fast enough and your opponent happens to have the right configuration. Chalice for 2 stops it, but it's better to aim for an early Chalice for 1 to keep SDT/Brainstorm from making Counterbalance dangerous. Needle on Sensei's Divining Top works too, in the odd case people leave in Counterbalance against you.

Pernicious Deed
Needle it (Starting to see why I run 4x Needle in board?), or take away their ability to cast it via Moons. Deed can hurt with a slow start.

Moat
Annoying as all hell. Chalice for 1 so STP can't kill your Dragon, then Dragon over it. Alternately, Slogger has reach. Again, investigate Anarchy if this is prevalent, though I've never seen a metagame where more than one person runs Moat due to cost/availability.

Humility
Also annoying as all hell, and also solved by Anarchy. Take away their manland blockers (Assuming it's Landstill) with Blood Moon and try to barrel through. Your best bet is to get control of this sort of match quickly. Against UW Landstill, this is the one place where Demonfire shines above all else. Against Rifter, you're just flat out in trouble, as Rifter eats Dragon Stompy if they can Swords their way out of your opening onslaught.

Worship
Does anything run this? Slogger their creatures away. Jitte away the pro-red ones. Try to deck them if you see Nimble Mongoose. (Hit with Jitte/Move it to a Blocker every turn and drop Lock-pieces galore) Anarchy's an option if this is for some reason prevalent in your metagame.

Ghostly Prison/Propaganda
Only a huge problem in multiples. Most decks that run these tend to lack a lot of spot removal, meaning it's not hard to keep a single giant threat on the table. Against Stax, focus on a Slogger if you have a choice, as Hellbent is hard to achieve and mana is in short demand (Plus, Slogger can eat Magus of the Tabernacle's face.) Against most other decks that run these, Rakdos Pit Dragon's your best option for singlehandedly going the distance. Anarchy solves Prisons, but not Propaganda.

Solitary Confinement
Tormod's Crypt answers this if it's in a Confinement/Squee lock shell, or a Confinement/Loam engine. If it's Enchantress, you probably weren't going to win anyway (This is seriously the worst matchup Dragon Stompy has), but Anarchy might occasionally lets you sneak the last point of damage through and Needle on Sterling Grove might buy you enough time to prevent severe problems. Rolling Earthquake/Pyroclasm are good against Enchantress, too, as keeping them off Draw Engines = Keeping them off Confinement lock.

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Can you give us an advance of what card you are talking about? :tongue:

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I'll give you a hint. It's green.

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I still agree with those who say Taurean Mauler is an horrible topdeck.

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It is a horrible topdeck. No argument. But it's no worse of a topdeck than Akroma if you don't have flip mana. And it's still a better topdeck than a Trinisphere or something that doesn't kill your opponent. It's just not as good of a topdeck as Sulfur Elemental.

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But now here comes another question: when I get the 4th mox, what should I replace it for? Maybe for one of the moons (what about 6 Moon effects?), as people seem to disagree with carrying less than 4 Sloggers...

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Depends on your list.

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Originally Posted by Yawgmoth'sWill

Yeah, that's a good question...

Are 6 Moon-Effects enough for the Mainboard (if you play 4 Trinis main)?
(the other 2 are in the SB)

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If you're running quad Trinisphere, which is way too many, then yeah, 6 Moon effects will have to be enough.

@ Humility: Don't forget that equipment owns Humility in the face.

@ green card: Leyline???

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Originally Posted by Phantom

@ Humility: Don't forget that equipment owns Humility in the face.

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SOFI, which I don't run, owns Humility in the face. Jitte just lightly slaps it in the face, then runs to hide behind a tree. (Although if you get it going, the extra 4 a turn makes a big difference.) The hard part is making the justification to keep equipment in against a control deck. Though for the most part, decks packing Humility are packing that much less actual removal (And they tend to like Decree of Justice), which would probably make keeping Jitte in a good idea.

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@green card: Leyline???

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The Tacosnape campaign has no comment at this time.

Tarmogoyf? :tongue:

My list is the following:

10 Mountain
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
4 Chrome Mox
4 Seething Song

4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Magus of the Moon
4 Gathan Raiders
4 Rakdos Pit Dragon
4 Arc-Slogger
2 Akroma, Angel of Fury

4 Chalice of the Void
4 Trinisphere
2 Blood Moon
2 Umezawa's Jitte

SB:
4 Pyrokinesis
4 Pithing Needle
4 Tormod's Crypt
2 Blood Moon
1 Umezawa's Jitte

@Tacosnape: Why are 4 Trinis too much, you want to have them on the opening hand...

I was just wondering if anyone runs Anger in this deck? Is it any good or is it just a "win more" card. I am looking to play Dragon Stompy and I am looking for some innovation to add to the current builds...

There's no easy way for Dragon Stompy to get it in the graveyard. The only discard outlet is Raiders. It's just a 2/2 for four with a mostly irrelevant ability.

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Originally Posted by Sacearuse

I was just wondering if anyone runs Anger in this deck? Is it any good or is it just a "win more" card. I am looking to play Dragon Stompy and I am looking for some innovation to add to the current builds...

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That is like saying you want to innovate breasts, you just don't change something that is already really really good.

Anger looks janky at best, you would really only have 4 ways to dump it into the grave yard (Raiders) unless I am missing something. Even then like you said it looks like win more.

If you want to "innovate" Dragon Stompy, find something utterly amazing for that 3 CC slot that currently resides as either Mauler or Sulfur Elemental.

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Originally Posted by Yawgmoth'sWill

@Tacosnape: Why are 4 Trinis too much, you want to have them on the opening hand...

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You don`t want to have 2 in hand ...

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Originally Posted by Ertai's Familiar

That is like saying you want to innovate breasts, you just don't change something that is already really really good.

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I completely agree. Boob doctors need to be hanged.

I wrote a tournament report about today's tournament because I felt like it. If someone wants to waste some time here's the link and all:
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...428#post217428

Sorry for an "empty" post but all relevant I have to say atm are in the report.

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Originally Posted by deviant

I wrote a tournament report about today's tournament because I felt like it. If someone wants to waste some time here's the link and all:
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...428#post217428

Sorry for an "empty" post but all relevant I have to say atm are in the report.

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Sweet job. Your list is a whopping 1 card off from mine when I run Sulfurs (I have 4 Kinesis and 2 Trinisphere in the sideboard.), and it does definitely seem like you had no use for the Trinispheres in that rundown.

Shame you couldn't get the Leylines for your metagame. Looks like they might have helped in your 3rd and 4th rounds, given that you had Maguses forced.

EDIT: After reading your reports, it looks like Sulfur did better than Taurean would have done for that series of matchups, given that you faced neither Goblins nor Threshold (Mauler's time to shine) but did face Cephalid Breakfast (Sulfur Elemental's specialty.) So good choice and I'll add this to my Sulfur-versus-Mauler thoughts.

Congrats. That list looks super solid.

I've been screwing around on MWS with an equipment-less list with no Trinis main. More thoughts on this later.