I don't keep them in at all against Merfolk, but against Goblins, if I'm on the play I'll leave 1-2 in.Quote:
Originally Posted by FoolofaTook
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I don't keep them in at all against Merfolk, but against Goblins, if I'm on the play I'll leave 1-2 in.Quote:
Originally Posted by FoolofaTook
I always board out Standstill against decks with Vial, but I'll try and keep 1-2 when on the play to see how it goes.
Btw has anyone ever tried a planeswalker in the deck?
I've tested Jace a few times, he's excellent sometimes but I found that when he's good he is also a bit of a win more...
is there any sort of consensus as to whether Ur or UGr is the better build??
Ugr has more raw power and also more vulnerabilities. Ur is steadier and more controllish. It really depends on how you like to play I think. Both builds have done well and either one could easily top 8 a major tourney without getting particularly good matchups along the way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibsonmac
What about discussing sideboarding strategies against different decks instead of just Boarding standstill discussion?
I tested the UGr build and it is very fine..5 champs/3 top8 :wink: and almost every MU i could feel that if i had played better or make the right decisions i could have won the game :cry: .I particulary play slow so i it lead me to many draws when i could have easily win the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibsonmac
Now I'm going to test the Ur build and see the diferences between them and which one i like the most.In the end all is resumed by your style , if you play your style you have better results.
The main list seem very solid so i agree with pippo we should discuss more about sideboarding card AND strategy.
So what is the typical solid Ur list now? Roodmistah?
Verbal warning for spam. See our Site Rules. Next time, send a Private Message. - Bardo
I'am not roodmistah, but the UR list i'am running at the moment feels very solid:Quote:
Originally Posted by OurSerratedDust
4 Dreadnought
2 Trinket Mage
3 Divining Top
3 Counterbalance
4 Standstill
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
3 Spell Snare
4 Daze
4 Stifle
1 Rushing River
1 Engineered explosives
1 Trickbind
1 Crucible of Worlds
3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
4 Mishras Factory
3 Wasteland
3 Volcanic Island
5 Island
Sideboard:
3 Firespout
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Pyroblast
2 Blood Moon
3 Submerge
1 Rushing River
-> As i missed the Tournament yesterday, i can't say how good telepathy will work at all :tongue: so i changed into the current list, which i really like. As i allready said i don't run any graveyard hate at all cause i only would need it for the dreadge matchup but i dont count on those wins anymore.
Rodney's current maindeck is:
-1 Sensei's Divining Top
-1 Rushing River
-1 Volcanic Island
-1 Crucible of Worlds
+1 Trinket Mage
+1 Trickbind
+1 Island
+1 Engineered Explosives
He plays the same MD from ages, great for him!Quote:
Originally Posted by J.V.
Honestly, he is too lazy to test new things. :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by pippo84
I actually played the same list before, but i like rushing river more than the second explosives as the river trades everything and is a bit faster imo. The third trinket is cut for the third top on my list as i don't played the mage that often on my testgames as i already draw into dreadnoughts everytime and just needed to search top or explosives so the third top seems to be a bit more vunerable to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by J.V.
For the Trickbind i just had no empty space as i dont want to cut any more. The 5/6 islands have never been a problem to me so i feld like playing a third vulcanic as my sideboard is nearly complete red and prepared for opponents wastelands or other land removal i didn't want to play only 2 volcanics.
Anyways, on the topic of Ur Dreadstill, this is what I sleeve up when I play it:
// Lands
4 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (3)
3 [TE] Wasteland
2 [ZEN] Misty Rainforest
2 [ZEN] Scalding Tarn
1 [ON] Polluted Delta
1 [ON] Flooded Strand
3 [B] Volcanic Island
1 [A] Tropical Island
4 [RAV] Island (4)
// Creatures
4 [MI] Phyrexian Dreadnought
3 [FD] Trinket Mage
// Spells
4 [IA] Brainstorm
4 [SC] Stifle
4 [AL] Force of Will
4 [CS] Counterbalance
3 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
2 [TSP] Trickbind
2 [FD] Engineered Explosives
3 [NE] Daze
3 [DIS] Spell Snare
3 [OD] Standstill
// Sideboard
SB: 3 [SHM] Firespout
SB: 2 [LRW] Sower of Temptation
SB: 3 [A] Red Elemental Blast
SB: 3 [M10] Lightning Bolt
SB: 2 [DK] Blood Moon
SB: 1 [ALA] Relic of Progenitus
SB: 1 [DK] Tormod's Crypt
That's what i'm playing now, but i'm considering about:Quote:
Originally Posted by J.V.
-1 Trinket Mage or Daze
+1 Crucible of Worlds or Rushing River
SB:
3-Firespout
3-REB
4-Bolt
2-Blood moon
2-Relic
1-Tormod
I'm playing 3 Grave hates because there is always some TempoTrash , Loam and Ichorid in my meta.
JV, so you think that another counterbalance and top are better than 4 standstills?
I just can't stop thinking about Spell Pierce.Did anyone tested it? or at least thought about it in Dreadstill?
Since nought is bigger than everything( expect progenitous), a good protection like Spell Pierce could be usefull for us?Or the NON-CREATURE cause is so awful to play it?
I think that it is better in current environment, Standstill can be a liability in matches such as Merfolk and Goblins, and I basically never don't want to have Counterbalance on the board. It may just be a play style thing though, I know for a fact Rodney swears by the other direction on this...Quote:
Originally Posted by OurSerratedDust
...
If you were really heart set on playing 4 Standstill I would go down to 3 Phyrexian Dreadnoughts before reducing Counterbalance.
I think Spell Pierce is too situation, what is it better than? Also not hitting Tarmogoyf is relevant.
I'm now working on a solid Urw version that doesn't focus at Dreadnought as only wincon, i'd opted for two blue creatures I think they are too much underrated: Vendillion Clique and Wake Thrasher.
That is the list:
3 Phyrexian Dreadnought
2 Trinket Mage
2 Vendillion Clique
2 Wake Thrasher
4 Stifle
4 Force of Will
3 Standstill
4 Sensei Divining Top
4 Counterbalance
4 Brainstorm
2 Firespout
1 Relic of Progenitus
4 Daze
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Flooded Strand
4 Island
1 Mountain
2 Volcanic Island
2 Tundra
Sideboard:
2 Disenchant
4 Meddling Mage
2 Pyroclasm
2 Relic of Progenitus
4 Pyroblast
1 Pithing Needle
White is basically for Meddling Mages naming Krosan, while we are able to play disenchants. Also we can name Goyf, Swords, Vials and much other very played cards we don't use
Red is against swarm (firespout and pyroclasm), also help against blue based or merfolks (they can be a pain).
Maybe i'd need an answer for goyfs, but i think one maindeck relic is enough . we will have to wait for dreadnogh and swing ftw.
Haven't had time to test the deck, but what's your opinion?
Why play white if you dont play swords to plowshares? even on dreadstill they are great as a dreadnought will counter the gaining life effekt. I also dont understand why u picked up vendillion and trasher, they are nearly useless, i also like the random cliuque on different decklists but not on dreadstill. I guess if you change like this it could workQuote:
Originally Posted by johanessen
- 2 Clique
- 2 Trasher
- 2 Firespout (main)
+ 1 Enlightened tutor
+4 swords to plowshares
+ 1 trickbind
For the Sideboard i would change the disenchants to something with the same effect for CC3 just to get it through if you're also faced to a counterbalance, i personally would like oblivion ring here as you will be able to find it with enlightened tutor (i really would play it 1-2 on every w dreadnought list) and it could handle even things like planeswalker or creatures.
I know someone already pointed out Spell Pierce, but there hasen't been a real discussion for it.
Ok, it doesn't hit Goyf, but I think it could be really strong. Situational? Sure, but even Spell Snare and Daze are situational.
I think it could turn out to be really strong..
Thoughts?
I pointed out Spell Pierce but I really didn't get some time to test it.What i think is: Is it better in UGr or Ur build?Cutting spell snares and go for 4CB and 3 Spell Pierce could work?Spell Pierce is better for protecting and rushing nought but without a threat Spell Snare is better.Is the fact that Spell Pierce loses power in the late game so relevant(people can really aford to pay :2: is late game)?Quote:
Originally Posted by pippo84
If someone tested Spell Pierce please share the results without fear.
I like Spell pierce, but as you said spell snare counters goofy also CC2 Spells on the mid-lategame and as i got no slots free i dont know what to cut for it.
So, after Zendikar's release no changes for us?
I don't think so, except for the fetches, even though I won't play a Forest because I need Green just for Goyfs and Krosan Grips..
Yes its sad as not many changes are going around these days but i think the deck is more or less outsourced :> I actually only wait for the next tournament to try out which either i like more, UR or URG so there will only be Questions like 1 pithing needle or 1 relic of progenitus for the sideboard or just a 4th Lightning Bolt as i only got 1 slot left.Quote:
Originally Posted by pippo84
Agreed. Probably we have optimized our mainboard (I don't want to change a single slot!) and the only discussions left are sideboard (even here I don't want to change a card!), sideboarding and Mu strategies..
So what is your side now?Quote:
Originally Posted by pippo84
I listed my current list 1-2 pages before (its UR) the Sideboard is:
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Pyroblast
3 Firespout
1 x
3 Submerge
2 Blood Moon
My UGR side:
3 Krosan Grip
3 Reb
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Firespout
1 Pithing Needle
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Relic of Progenitus
I nearly played a same Shell, but did you try out 1 trygon predator+2 grip? i really feld pretty good with it. I think you also could try submerge instead of a relic/crypt and a needle as graveyard hate isn't usefull at all for most situations.Quote:
Originally Posted by pippo84
I never tried ! trygon Predator + 2 Krosan Grip, I'll give it a try.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tangle.Wire
I never liked submerge a lot and for Graveyard Hate, I just run 2 slots. If I see dredge I want to win and GY Hate is also useful against pox, survival etc.
Yeah true, but Submerge really is a Blast against random Goofies which are seen much more often than dredge at my opinion but i also found out hibernation is a brilliant way to handle ThreshThreshThreshThreshThresh,elves,stompy(rogue), random goofy again and also survival, garruk and when it really comes to paper logics its good against enchantress :tongue: but thats more brainstorming, i really played it against treash/countertop with greenparts, survival and elves all matches got bombed by hibernation all in all survival had problems resolving it.Quote:
Originally Posted by pippo84
For Trygon i really liked it as it stalles the game to our side as it stays in play but as every baseruption/countertop random deck can protect it we will be play kinda same. Trygon is also possible to hit multiple targets as krosan grip is always a last chance issue as we won't play it to handle annoying threats. I think everyone had situations where krosan grip was just to good to waste it. Also i always liked the predator 2x as it is so good on many ways i also had lucky games as it was just a 2/3 flyer :rolleyes:
I'd never want to go below 2 Crypt, since they're very nice to fetch with Trinket Mage versus Ichorid or Loam.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tangle.Wire
I do agree that 3 Grip might be overkill. I suggest testing out Ancient Grudge as well as Predator.
In my meta there is always an Ichorid or Loam and also TempoTrashTrash , so I use 3 graveyard slots which are 1 Tormod's and 2 Relic.
I think i'd play 2 crypt 1 relic as crypt is faster ^^ For Ancient grudge i think there are to many Enchantments on the play so i dont want to have only artifact destruction with it. Also the predator has some stronger "abilities" than the flashback of the grudge as it is a 2/3 swinger and could be pitched to force, also its a CC3 Spell so we can use it against Balance lock most times.
Although I do agree that enchantment hate is necessary, Ancient grudge is the nuts, it IS worth testing if you expect to see any Dragon Stompy, Geddon Stax, Affinity, etc. P.S. It also rocks in the mirror.
Edit:That took me like 6 minutes to type, wow I'm baked.
For artifact hate I just play 3 krosan Grip. Never had problems with it.
Btw if you expect a lot of Ichorid I would play 1 Crypt, 1 Relic and 1 of the new black trap because it's istant.
I really like the Blood Moon in the board, it gives you the edge against those 4color decks.
I'm building this deck now, and wondering if its possible to just go mono-blue (pre and post board) and use goodies like Back to basics and veldalken shackles in the sb instead of blood moon and firespout.
something like :
2 Explosives
2 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Phyrexian Dreadnought
3 Trinket Mage
Enchantments
3 Counterbalance
4 Standstill
Instants
4 Brainstorm
4 Daze
4 Force Of Will
3 Spell Snare
4 Stifle
2 Trickbind
Basic Lands
7 Island
Lands
2 Flooded Strand
4 Mishra's Factory
2 Polluted Delta
2 Misty Rainforest
4 Wasteland
Legendary Lands
1 Academy Ruins
Sideboard:
2 Relic Of Progenitus
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Threads Of Disloyalty
3 Back to Basics
1 Gaea's Blessing
3 Veldalken Shackles
Cheers.
Explosives can only get to one... seems bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by slylie