I'm interested in building this deck. Anyway, my question is why Volrath's Stronghold isn't used so much. Seems good when you can tutor for it with Knight of the Reliquary.
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I'm interested in building this deck. Anyway, my question is why Volrath's Stronghold isn't used so much. Seems good when you can tutor for it with Knight of the Reliquary.
It's very slow is the main problem, and you have no way to get it back if it dies (since it will be used in the long-game, it'll probably get Wastelanded).
-Matt
I choose not to play deed because I honestly felt I didn't need it for the vestal meta. Sure its a blow out against affinity, but that was really the only matchup I was finding it all that needed against. I felt my merfolk matchup was already stupid good, and the two jitte's I played in place of it improved the matchup just as much and was still quite good against affinity (the only creature it doesn't kill is Enforcer, etherium, and ravager).
Can't Jitte be an issue with so few things to stick it on? If a Goyf or Knight is swinging you're probably already winning, and a Bob swinging with it is likely dying in the process.
I was concerned about the same thing but didn't really find it to be a problem. So often you lose to merfolk and goblins because your single knight/goyf isn't enough to race their entire team, and your stuck having to sit on defense. A goyf equipped with a jitte suddenly becomes very hard for fish and goblins to race.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sintheros
I also found Jitte to be extremely useful vs the faster versions of zoo. The deck loses so much life so quickly it can be hard to deal with that matchup. Jitte makes short work of steppe lynxs and provides critical life gain in the late game.
Has anyone thought about dropping the mox diamond for birds? Seams like a extra dude could be good. I understand birds won't swing for the win here, but it has to be better late game over the mox
It's times like that where Deed would come in handy.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonBarber
Has anyone tried a more Suicide version of the rock with Dark Rituals and Sinkholes? I tested it abit yesterday and it was pretty good. Similar to Team America, it tries to screw your opponent's manabase and quickly win. Unlike Team America, we can run the ultimate Landscrewer/ Win con in Knight and We have + 8 Screw spells (4 Vindicate, 4 Sinkholes). I was redirected back here from the eva-green thread. Here's the list I've been testing:
4 Goyf
4 Bob
4 KOTR
4 Dark Ritual
4 Hymm
4 Thoughtseize
2 Inquisition
4 Sinkhole
4 Vindicate
4 STP
4 Bayou
4 Scrubland
10 Black Fetch
4 Wasteland
Been testing well for me. Bob and Knight have been brilliant in the Sui plan. Anyone else tried the Dark Ritual + Sinkhole path?
The problem is that you're running 16 cards that don't use Dark Ritual. I think inconsistency issues will lose you more games than Dark Ritual + Thoughtseize + Sinkhole will win you.
On the contrary, Dark Ritual is mostly cast on T2 and not T1. The only thing I can't cast of a T2 Dark Ritual is KOTR and STP. With so many 2 mana bombs in the deck, my Turn 2 plays are usually double 2 cc spells. Can be a combination of Hymm, Bob, Sinkhole, Goyf. It can also be ThoughtSeize/Inquisition + Vindicate. I do admit there are inconsistencies in any Sui deck, but its nice to have a change of direction at times. This list tries to by pass the midgame slugfest by heavy screwing early.
I don't think the suicide plan should be dismissed completely. Probably not very good in an open random meta, but it could be very strong in a combo-controllish meta where your screw can get you there more effectively than playing traditional rock lists.
Junk
A Legacy Magic deck, by Sang Jung
7th place at a StarCityGames.com Legacy Open tournament in Fort Worth, Texas, United States on 2011-03-20
As reported at http://www.starcitygames.com/open_series
Click here to see a summary of all decks from StarCityGames.com Invitational
Maindeck:
Artifacts
4 Sensei's Divining Top
Creatures
4 Dark Confidant
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Tarmogoyf
Enchantments
2 Pernicious Deed
Instants
4 Swords to Plowshares
Legendary Artifacts
1 Umezawa's Jitte
Sorceries
4 Hymn to Tourach
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Thoughtseize
4 Vindicate
Basic Lands
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Swamp
Lands
3 Bayou
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Horizon Canopy
4 Marsh Flats
2 Scrubland
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland
Legendary Lands
1 Karakas
Sideboard:
4 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Pernicious Deed
3 Diabolic Edict
4 Extirpate
1 Duress
2 Perish
one is good in the board if you are really scared of landstill.Quote:
Originally Posted by trivial_matters
Landstill usually runs basically 6-8 Swords, though.
-Matt
I'd rather have more chokes. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by RexFTW
How much do we need the wastelands for this deck? It's really the only thing from holding me back from playing it. it seams like adding more basic lands can't be bad. Maybe even the 4th mox?
You could easily run 8 basics and another Mox in this deck. It'd run a little bit more out of whack but you'd gain infinite stability against Wasteland decks. If you can't afford the Wastes, I'd say that sounds like a decent plan (Tec edge doesn't cut it) if you're a little strapped for Wastes. In that case, I'd run a Pulse for 1 Vindicate, since your land-denial plan is a little less effective without Wasteland. Maybe not, though.
The price of duals has me crying. Damn you StarCity!
-MAtt
The Moxen are more optional than the wastelands. The way I see it, it goes kinda like:
4 Bob
4 Goyf
4 Knight
4 Swords
4 Seize
4 Hymn
3 Top
4 Vindicate
are the required 'shell' of the deck that really everyone goes by (assuming you aren't doing GSZ shenanigans or Stoneforge/Pridemage/Mom stuff)
Which leaves you 5 to 6 slots with which to play around. Some stuff you can put in there include...
-The 4th top
-1 to 2 IoK's
-1 to 3 Moxen
-1 to 2 Deeds
-1 to 2 Elspeths
-an EE
-1 to 2 PtE's
-a Jitte
And so on.
i think i will move to a moxless build, ... the inconsistency of the moxen was a bit disturbing, and if i had mox it rarely mattered, and since i am allready running 2 deeds main it is quite antisynergistic, it even happened to me that i manascrewed myself because i was forced to blow up a deed, when i had a mox in play
i think i know now very well the upsides and the downsides of the moxbuilds, so i will try swithing to a non-mox build for more synergy, and more business-spells
another thing that i have been thinking of lately.... does anyone still use bojuka bog?, it does not feel like its worth anymore, and did anyone try to use tidehollow skuller (in the gerrards verdict slot)?
I'm not going to run Bojuka Bog in my build. Like you said, I don't think it's worth it.Quote:
Originally Posted by AggroSteve
My friend runs Tidehollow Sculler in his deck and loves him. I really don't like him. I guess you could add him in the flex spots.
I run a 1-of Bog in the board now, and have replaced it's spot in the main with a basic Swamp, so I'm running 2 Swamp, 1 Forest, 1 Plains. It's been stellar.
-Matt