[Deck] T.E.S - The EPIC Storm

1.) Molten Psyche or whateverthecardthatsterribleiscalled, is bad. Don't play cards that are only good after Ad Nauseam, ever. You've already won.

2.) Read the opening post people. Cards and topics are in there, it's organized and will stop repetitive questions.

3.) Xantid vs. Chant, they both get the job done.

4.) I don't post because I'm too busy in my last semester, It'll pick up after graduation. Slightly too because I've argued against dumb ideas for too long. If people want to stray away from my winning list, let 'em.

5.) Stop ruining my thread people.

How was everyone's Spring Break?

Mine involved the following: Legalizing myself to smoke weed. Waking up in an unknown part of town. Staying up till 4am with women. Smoking weed.

Also, I think everyone is aware that cards that are only good after Ad Nauseam are bad (well, most of the world...).

Bryant, do you still play? I haven't been seeing you in any Top 8s, I personally always enjoy your reports, so get back to winning. Also, put my report for SCG LA n the opening post. Maybe even my primer.

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Originally Posted by lorddotm

Bryant, do you still play? I haven't been seeing you in any Top 8s, I personally always enjoy your reports, so get back to winning. Also, put my report for SCG LA n the opening post. Maybe even my primer.

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Not really when school is in session. I've played in three events since last summer, two top 16's and a scrub.

Your stuff was already in the opening post. READ THE OPENING POST!

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Originally Posted by Bryant Cook

Not really when school is in session. I've played in three events since last summer, two top 16's and a scrub.

Your stuff was already in the opening post. READ THE OPENING POST!

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Are you going to Providence?

And I failed. My bad.

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Originally Posted by Dia_Bot

I'm actually convinced that at this point there is very little left to talk about.
Everything that should be discussed has already been discussed and thoroughly tested and all the info is already available.
This thread has really helped me out when I started playing TES a long time ago and I can only advice newer players to:
1) read this thread instead of just asking everything over and over and over again...
2) (and pay attention because this one is crucial) Actually playtest to figure things out for yourself!

/end rant

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Truth, this is actually a pretty good thread for the first 50 pages or so (until it ended up in Decks to Beat, from what I gather). Tons of info; reading it all + playtesting = you will actually know the reason behind card choices and won't make horrible suggestions! There really isn't much left to say at this point though... list is very tight with some meta flex in the sideboard.

People have been helpful in answering my situation specific questions at least :)

I'm bringing TES to a GPT on Sunday - in for disaster. I'll make sure to take notes so I can ask good questions and have it pointed out where I went wrong. Maybe I'll get to play against Zoo all day!


PS: late nights and weed = a good spring break

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Originally Posted by Bryant Cook

4.) I don't post because I'm too busy in my last semester, It'll pick up after graduation. Slightly too because I've argued against dumb ideas for too long. If people want to stray away from my winning list, let 'em.

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Eh, not finding the pyroblasts as necessary these days. Swarms are back in vogue.

Best tourney ever.

I stepped in a pile of dog shit walking to the site - pretty much an omen for the rest of the day. Only 8 people showed up = cut to top 8. I lost round 1. Fun times.

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Originally Posted by TUMBLES

I'm bringing TES to a GPT on Sunday - in for disaster. I'll make sure to take notes so I can ask good questions and have it pointed out where I went wrong.

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Originally Posted by TUMBLES

Best tourney ever.

I stepped in a pile of dog shit walking to the site - pretty much an omen for the rest of the day. Only 8 people showed up = cut to top 8. I lost round 1. Fun times.

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Good notes :/

Don't hate bro :-/



In seriousness, was a lot harder to take notes than I thought. Got distracted with playing and stayed up all night before to finish a paper, was all I could do to focus on the game.

Pretty much looked like:

Game 1: Duress ---> take relevant counter magic since I plan to go off next turn ---> he drew a Force and appropriately counters my mana, I don't recover before I die.

Game 2: Swarm on board, Ad Naus from 20 + land drop in hand, in response to attack trigger he Cliques ---> grabs my Ad Nauseam (Was not Rit/Rit, so I couldn't cast it with the bugger on the stack) ---> I draw dead until I die to Clique beatdown.

Hey guys,

I went to a 23-man GP Trial yesterday and decided to play this deck last second when I saw that the metagame was awful for my Lands deck. It was 5 rounds with a cut to top 8. I didn't drop a single game, and I now have 3 byes! My only difference between this and the stock list is that I run 4 Xantid Swarm instead of 4 Pyroblast in the SB. I really feel like this tilts the Fish matchup to being relatively favorable while sacrificing a lot vs. Countertop, which I feel is on a significant decline in competitive tournaments.

Some of the good plays I noticed myself making were:
-Not being afraid to mulligan and not being afraid to use Diminishing Returns when needed. I went off easily on a critical turn 2 on a mull to 5 against combo Elves.
-Adding mana for no reason off of Gemstone Mines so I could bust them in response to a timely Price of Progress. I had 10 gobbos in play already against Burn, and it was a good play considering the situation.
-Not boarding out Empty the Warrens against Cephalid Breakfast even though he was convinced I should have. He named Ad Nauseum with a turn 2 Meddling Mage (which I thought should have been Infernal Tutor), and I simply destroyed him with Goblins while using Chants proactively to keep him from possibly laying down his combo dudes (no Vial in play obv.). I thought it was strange that he thought I should have boarded it out, as he essentially tries to play as the control player post-SB, and 12+ Goblins early is essentially game.

I'm sure I made some questionable decisions as well, but it is not easy to notice what they were when I wasn't punished for them.

I have never played this deck before in a tournament, but I playtest it a lot. I have a couple questions for experienced players, so please only answer if you are quite certain in your response.

The situations:
When going for Ad Nauseum off of Infernal, let's say I have one additional mana of my choice for Ad Nauseum. Let's also assume that I have already made a land drop.

1) I have not seen Burning Wish, Dark Ritual, or Rite of Flame.
2) I have not seen Burning Wish, Rite of Flame, but I have seen a Dark Ritual.
3) I have not seen Burning Wish, Dark Ritual, but I have seen a Rite of Flame.
4) I have not seen Dark Ritual, Rite of Flame, but I have seen a Burning Wish.

To simplify, here is what is left in my deck when I am planning to Ad Nauseum:

1) 3 Infernals, 4 Wishes, 4 Dark Rits, 4 Rite of Flames
2) 3 Infernals, 4 Wishes, 3 Dark Rits, 4 Rite of Flames
3) 3 Infernals, 4 Wishes, 4 Dark Rits, 3 Rite of Flames
4) 3 Infernals, 3 Wishes, 4 Dark Rits, 4 Rite of Flames

Obviously the numbers will often be skewed even more than here, but this is a good place to start. Would you float a black or a red mana in these situations? Would the number of Lotus Petals or Lion's Eye Diamonds affect your decision? Would the deck you are playing against (and hence the effectiveness of Empty the Warrens as a possible win) affect your decision?

There are so many things to consider here. The fact that there are more black sources in the deck for Chrome Mox is even something to consider. These are very basic situations that I really need to make confident plans for before I bring this to the next tournament.

Thanks in advance. If anyone could answer this with a level of confidence and reasoning behind it, I would be grateful.

@patrunkenphat : Good report with cool plays, thanks for posting. I don't have enough experience with the deck to answer your questions (you could possibly use the float % for Diminishing Returns in the OP as guideline though) but have some of my own.

For people playing Xantid Swarm in the SB, I have noticed some run a Tropical Island and some don't.. If you don't run it, would you side it in for a Volcanic Island or a Chrome Mox (or else?) if you had it, but prefer to have more space in the SB? Or do you not run it as you don't think it is useful? Does it depend on the number of decks you intend to side in Swarm against? Would you side it in against anything with Force of Will, or Force+Daze, Force+Spell Pierce, etc? For reference, the usual lists have 10 ways to make G in the maindeck (4 gemstone, 4 petal, 2 city), and with a Trop it goes up to 15. I'm not counting LED for GGG and Chrome Mox imprinting Swarm or Krosan Grip here...

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Originally Posted by Patrunkenphat7

Obviously the numbers will often be skewed even more than here, but this is a good place to start. Would you float a black or a red mana in these situations? Would the number of Lotus Petals or Lion's Eye Diamonds affect your decision? Would the deck you are playing against (and hence the effectiveness of Empty the Warrens as a possible win) affect your decision?

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I prefer to keep red mana floating for burning wish, especially if you have seen 2 LED's already. The point is that Infernal Tutor requires hellbent, which after Ad Nauseam usually means that you need to also find a LED.
When you keep red mana floating, you only need to find one initial mana source to generate a lot of black mana of your dark rituals.

It's situational off course, but I would certainly take the number of LED's you've seen into the equation.

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Originally Posted by bennotsi

I prefer to keep red mana floating for burning wish, especially if you have seen 2 LED's already. The point is that Infernal Tutor requires hellbent, which after Ad Nauseam usually means that you need to also find a LED.
When you keep red mana floating, you only need to find one initial mana source to generate a lot of black mana of your dark rituals.

It's situational off course, but I would certainly take the number of LED's you've seen into the equation.

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It is true that you will likely be casting Burning Wish if you have seen a couple LED's, however you would only need one initial red mana source as well for the Burning Wish, and you still need 2 black for the Tendrils, leading me to believe that the number of Rituals and Rites would be important at that point. If you assuming that you are not going to find LED, the next step is deciding what accel is more likely to pop up based off what you have already seen. The only real benefit to floating red over black in that situation would be the possibility of imprinting Duress onto Chrome Mox, which I suppose is legitimate; however, you must also take into account the possibility of flipping a Tendrils. Also depending on the number of Rites you have seen, future Rites have the possibility of producing less, more, or equal many than Ritual.

This is very complicated, and I am trying to find a concrete method for determining what mana should be floating. People might have a 'feeling', just like me, but I am wondering if anyone knows for certain which is better.

It depends on whether you have made a land drop prior to casting ad nauseam, along with how many chrome mox and petal's are left in the deck. I find that after I resolve ad nauseam at a safe life total which is 14 or more typically I find everything I need to combo off because this deck is so well equipped to win after resolving AdN at a safe life total. If I had to choose between a black or red mana floating though it's situational depending on how many LED's are left and how many infernal tutors and burning wishes are left to be revealed. If I only have 2 LEDs left in deck I would float red for burning wish since it doesn't rely on you being hellbent. This is especially true if only 1 LED if left in deck. If 0 are left in deck, I think you should straight win probably lol.

Not that TES needs more ways to win, but does Phyrexian Unlife (or whatever that card will be called in English) deserve a spot?

It essentially reads, play Ad Nauseam and draw your whole deck without consequence, for 2 extra mana (as the two life initial investment will be inconsequential).

That said, it also works against Tendrils, requiring a Tendrils for 20 and a Grapeshot kicker (sorry UB ANT).

This should also get around 3-sphere as the phyrexian mana should count for CMC.

Additionally, it will buy you 8 extra life (-2 initial life +10 poison) against aggro decks that can't deal with it. This could be beneficial against something like Pyrostatic Pillar.

Just a thought...

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Originally Posted by Andy_V

This should also get around 3-sphere as the phyrexian mana should count for CMC.
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I don't believe Phyrexian Unlife uses Phyrexian Mana in its casting cost.

However, even if it did, you would still have to pay 3 total mana for it under a Trinisphere. Trinisphere only cares about how much mana was paid to cast a spell, not the spell's cmc (thus, FoW still costs minimally 3 mana even if you use its alternate cost).

Oh, sorry for that... got too excited for a minute. It doesn't use phyrexian mana (at least based on the JP pictures), so now is a much less interesting choice. Lame.

There will likely not be anything for TES then out of NPH... Guess we'll just have to keep winning the "old-fashioned" way.

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Originally Posted by Zamussels

For people playing Xantid Swarm in the SB, I have noticed some run a Tropical Island and some don't.. If you don't run it, would you side it in for a Volcanic Island or a Chrome Mox (or else?) if you had it, but prefer to have more space in the SB? Or do you not run it as you don't think it is useful?

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I actually tried a singleton Tropical Island strategy and boarded it in against decks like Merfolk, where I wanted both the extra land to help fight against Wasteland and the green mana to cast Xantid Swarm. Unfortunately, I was seeing the Trop in opening hands without Xantid Swarm or I was seeing Xantid Swarms in hands full of rainbow mana (so the Trop was still unnecessary). It wasn't that it was bad most of the time; it was that it just wasn't needed. So I cut it for a relevant sideboard card but am still running Xantid Swarms. With Lotus Petals and rainbow lands, I haven't had an issue casting it when I need to.

What do you players think about the new Mental Misstep card in TES/ against TES? We essentially get to use Duress but see it countered for 2 life now and let them have Spell Peirce mana open on a on the draw situation. This card is busted nuts against most of our answers though. Is it wise to use a card that cost us 2 life when we run Ad Nauseam? Only City of Brass does this and it is a 2-of in Kobe Bryant's list. Aside from our fetches anyway.

I think this card is good and deserves discussion on how it will effect TES's line of plays.

Counterspell + Lion's Eye Diamond = no.

As for fighting it, I think the correct plan is just don't give a fuck and play some disruption, just like how you fight Force of Will.

I haven't seen any discussion of Gitaxian Probe.

Gitaxian Probe
[U/p] Sorcery
Look at target player's hand.
Draw a card.
([U/p] may be payed with U or 2 life)

It's pretty similar to Street Wraith (not that you would ever play Street Wraith with Ad Nauseum in the deck)... it shows your opponent's hand and generates additional storm, but it makes Ad Nauseum slightly worse by costing 2 life, and it makes mulligan decisions worse.

Off the bat, it doesn't seem like it does enough, but I suppose you could at least justify testing it.

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Originally Posted by Lego

I haven't seen any discussion of Gitaxian Probe.

Gitaxian Probe
[U/p] Sorcery
Look at target player's hand.
Draw a card.
([U/p] may be payed with U or 2 life)

It's pretty similar to Street Wraith (not that you would ever play Street Wraith with Ad Nauseum in the deck)... it shows your opponent's hand and generates additional storm, but it makes Ad Nauseum slightly worse by costing 2 life, and it makes mulligan decisions worse.

Off the bat, it doesn't seem like it does enough, but I suppose you could at least justify testing it.

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I think we do not have any room to test it. What will you cut to pack one in? I mean I really don't care to often what my opponents hand is. You have to either stop him from countering (silence, chant and duress are in the deck for that purpose) or you have to play some bait for their counters (pretty much any spell that is broken). The information does not really do anything and drawing a card for 2life is not the best plan.

I do admit though. Adding storm for zero mana is strong, I just doubt it's strong enough to make it in TES. I also feel Mental Misstep and Surgial Extraction do more for basically the same mana cost. Drawing a card CAN make a big difference, but that's pretty much gambling and having at least some protection from duress, toughtseize, spell snare, spell pierce OR removing keycards from you opponents Hand/GY/Lib is less of a luck-factor.

Edit:
I think with mystical tutor still unbanned the card would be pretty cool! For ANT...^^

How does tutor chaining work?

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Originally Posted by Kyle Hyde

How does tutor chaining work?

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If you have lots of mana, you can cast Infernal into Infernal, etc to get more storm before you grab Tendrils of Agony.

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Originally Posted by lorddotm

If you have lots of mana, you can cast Infernal into Infernal, etc to get more storm before you grab Tendrils of Agony.

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Ok. I thought that was what it was. I was hoping there was a trick I wasn't seeing.

Hey everyone, just started playing TES. This is undoubtedly the cockiest thread I have ever seen in my life. I think I'll love it here...

Anyways, I would also like to hear what people think about Mental Misstep? How will it affect us, and is there any merit to testing it against cards like Sensei's Divining Top, Stifle, Spell Pierce, etc.

Honestly, I don't see it being game-breaking against us. It only hits our protection spells, cantrips, and rituals, but none of our bombs. But I think only time will tell how this card fits into legacy.

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Originally Posted by AriLax

Counterspell + Lion's Eye Diamond = no.

As for fighting it, I think the correct plan is just don't give a fuck and play some disruption, just like how you fight Force of Will.

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Originally Posted by TossUsToLions

Hey everyone, just started playing TES. This is undoubtedly the cockiest thread I have ever seen in my life. I think I'll love it here...

Anyways, I would also like to hear what people think about Mental Misstep? How will it affect us, and is there any merit to testing it against cards like Sensei's Divining Top, Stifle, Spell Pierce, etc.

Honestly, I don't see it being game-breaking against us. It only hits our protection spells, cantrips, and rituals, but none of our bombs. But I think only time will tell how this card fits into legacy.

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Humbly, fuck mental misstep. This deck powers through Merfolk if and when played correctly, which packs quite the heavy counter suite. You've got chants / silences, plus what are you going to cut?

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Originally Posted by ryl417

Humbly, fuck mental misstep. This deck powers through Merfolk if and when played correctly, which packs quite the heavy counter suite. You've got chants / silences, plus what are you going to cut?

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Well said... frankly, i'd prefer them to cut Spell Snare for MM and stop leaving mana untapped trying to bait me to forget about MM. It's just another fuckin counterspell (dazing a petal could be bad for us). Either they cut other/better counters for it (wash) or or they cut pressure (++). Storm tends to have inevitability, if not locked out (chalice/crucible+waste/3sphere) and few decks can really lock you out.

Yes, it's good against storm if the storm player doesn't put you on it and doesn't try to play around it, but paying phyrexian for it means I have to get to 9, not 10.

If I played folk and had to win against goblins, i'd play it, but I don't have to worry about either deck, because I play TES.

I agree. The Merfolk matchup might become sligthly harder since you can't just go for Xantid Swarm and win anymore if they pack Mental Misstep, but if people are cutting Spell Snare from their decks for this. Well, thanks. Also, I'm pretty sure most people won't use Mental Misstep to counter the right spells anyway. I'm not afraid of it at all, at least not when playing TES.

MM will affect us way less than other Decks. (DD and ANT for instance) since we basically rely on different cards(edit: what I am trying to say is that we play less cantrips and more tutors). Decks that Pack MM in addition to their usual counters are less likely to put us on a fast clock. That means we have time to find a way to beat them to pieces regardless what they counter. In case they switch their counterpack and exchange I predict our chances of winning are even higher. Spell Snare hits all of our tutors I'd love them to not play it.
Merfolk can pack MM to fight Xantid, but I doubt that it's going to be more played than Daze. And for those worried about them countering silence/chant/duress -> we often play some counterbait. so what exactly is the difference? They make the storm +1 and in most cases even lower it by 1 for paying two life(theoretically) ...

Personally I am not convinced the card will be such a beast, but time will tell ;)

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Originally Posted by TossUsToLions

Hey everyone, just started playing TES. This is undoubtedly the cockiest thread I have ever seen in my life. I think I'll love it here...

Anyways, I would also like to hear what people think about Mental Misstep? How will it affect us, and is there any merit to testing it against cards like Sensei's Divining Top, Stifle, Spell Pierce, etc.

Honestly, I don't see it being game-breaking against us. It only hits our protection spells, cantrips, and rituals, but none of our bombs. But I think only time will tell how this card fits into legacy.

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There are ways to win around mental misstep, It also depends on the way they evaluate their hand, almost the same way they evaluate their hand based on force, most of the decks our team has been testing with misstep have been advocating cutting Daze, so that means we only have to worry about force and misstep.

Like I was saying, we can win through misstep with hands like LED, LED, Land, Mox, Card to inprint, Tutor.

This is what I wrote in the MM thread :

A curious thing about MM is that one of the archetype it will affect the less is actully combo. Control deck that will play MM will either remove daze, spell pierce of spell snare for it, so the disruption density remain the same and that disruption density is the main thing you worry about when playing combo.

For non-blue deck non black deck, if the play 4 MM, fine, thats really thin protection against combo, if they run nothing else against it (Teg, etc...) it wont matter

For black deck, chance are that black deck that will run MM will cut some kind of hand disruption for it, so once again, the disruption density remain the same. If they do run the fulll suit of hand disruption and MM, then the rest of the deck will be real thin, so a slow clock, unless they get that Tombstalker real fast!

So I dont beleive we need to worry about this card

I almost want to switch decks from DDFT to TES, not for any rational reason, but just because this is the only combo thread on the source that isn't preaching doom and gloom since the spoiling of MM.

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Originally Posted by leegoo

I almost want to switch decks from DDFT to TES, not for any rational reason, but just because this is the only combo thread on the source that isn't preaching doom and gloom since the spoiling of MM.

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At least part of that is the nature of the deck. Most of the other storm decks (and I've only played Rev314, but I think this is applicable to other versions as well) run more cantrips (Brainstorm+Ponder+Sensei's Top+Preordain) and fewer actual tutors, so they have to dig harder. Since we run both infernal tutor and burning wish, we're less vulnerable to that sort of disruption (although it does affect us to some extent).

I'm pretty sure it will make things (at least a little) uglier. If, say, a zoo player (if zoo decides to run it), plays a first turn Wild Nactl followed by a misstep on our ponder it will be irksome as hell. I'm also anticipating the merfolk matchup getting worse because they have a (free) answer to our protection spells, Silence, Chant and Duress. Ugh. However, realize that doing that (while not costing them mana) does cost them a card. This is super relevent in the zoo matchup, as they rely on being pretty balls to the walls with the burn spells and the hate bears to get to us before we combo off. Even one fewer burn spell could be the difference between victory and defeat for them, and they have to cut something to fit in the missteps. . .

Still, the deck is pretty silly, and we've all seen the deck fight through hate before, or we wouldn't be here. Is anyone excited about comboing off for 9 storm and doing 18 damage, looking at their faces when they realize their misstep killed them? Because I am.

Mental Misstep won't do much to this deck.

First off, what does it counter?

Ponder? I have 3 other Ponders and 4 Brainstorms.
Duress? I have 3 other Duress and 4 Chants.
Dark Ritual? I have 3 other Dark Ritual, 4 Rite of Flames, 4 Lotus Petal, 4 LED, and 4 Chrome Mox.

What doesn't it counter?

Infernal Tutor. Burning Wish. Ad Nauseam.

Basically, everything Misstep counters is a redundant spell. The reason this card completely rapes High Tide is because it counters the actual card High Tide, and there is no other card in that deck that does what High Tide does. However, anything MM can counter in TES is in the deck in at least 8 copies.

The biggest impact MM will have is post-board, when Xantid Swarm is brought in. Control decks now have 8 cards that can counter a turn 1 Xantid Swarm when they are on the draw. That's huge. And that is the only real negative impact MM will have on this deck.

Second, what cards are being cut for MM? Most decks are cutting Daze, Spell Pierce, or Spell Snare. They aren't adding 4 MM to their deck while keeping their disruption/counters consistent, so opposing decks will still have roughly the same number of interactive cards. Here's the upside, though: Spell Pierce and Spell Snare are both better than MM vs TES. Spell Pierce can hit everything MM can (minus Swarm), in addition to the non-replaceable cards like Ad Nauseam and Burning Wish. Dropping Spell Snare is a HUGE upside. Spell Snare counters the most important cards in the deck (IT and BW) for 1 mana. Furthermore, a Spell Snare countering a Burning Wish or Infernal Tutor is generally going to be more harmful because you're more "all-in" at the point you cast those spells. Rituals are generally cast at that point, not to mention LEDs being cracked in response, so countering your spell at that point is going to be more impactfull than countering the Dark Ritual at the start of the turn.

Third, people are talking about adding MM to every deck. Literally, every deck. Zoo, Goblins, Dredge, everything. That's awful. If you're playing an aggro deck and the only way you feel you can compete is to play MM to counter their MM, you should probably be looking for a new deck. If those decks do add MM to their decks, or even the sideboard, I feel they will cut anti-Storm cards to fit them. I feel like they would replace Mindbreak Traps and Thorn of Amethyst with MM, under the impression that MM will fight Storm just as well. And well, that's a huge, huge bonus for TES.

On Gataxian Probe: it's trash. Don't play it in this deck. It isn't free, as the 2 life you pay means 2 less cards you can draw off Ad Nauseam. The info you gain is awesome, but if you really want another card to look at their hand, add Thoughtseize before Probe. Now you get to look at their hand AND take that Force of Will.

On Surgical Extraction: Why is this even being mentioned? If this deck doesn't even want Extirpate, why would you consider adding a worse Extirpate to the deck?

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Originally Posted by x8eikdls

Mental Misstep won't do much to this deck.

First off, what does it counter?

Ponder? I have 3 other Ponders and 4 Brainstorms.
Duress? I have 3 other Duress and 4 Chants.
Dark Ritual? I have 3 other Dark Ritual, 4 Rite of Flames, 4 Lotus Petal, 4 LED, and 4 Chrome Mox.

What doesn't it counter?

Infernal Tutor. Burning Wish. Ad Nauseam.

Basically, everything Misstep counters is a redundant spell. The reason this card completely rapes High Tide is because it counters the actual card High Tide, and there is no other card in that deck that does what High Tide does. However, anything MM can counter in TES is in the deck in at least 8 copies.

The biggest impact MM will have is post-board, when Xantid Swarm is brought in. Control decks now have 8 cards that can counter a turn 1 Xantid Swarm when they are on the draw. That's huge. And that is the only real negative impact MM will have on this deck.

Second, what cards are being cut for MM? Most decks are cutting Daze, Spell Pierce, or Spell Snare. They aren't adding 4 MM to their deck while keeping their disruption/counters consistent, so opposing decks will still have roughly the same number of interactive cards. Here's the upside, though: Spell Pierce and Spell Snare are both better than MM vs TES. Spell Pierce can hit everything MM can (minus Swarm), in addition to the non-replaceable cards like Ad Nauseam and Burning Wish. Dropping Spell Snare is a HUGE upside. Spell Snare counters the most important cards in the deck (IT and BW) for 1 mana. Furthermore, a Spell Snare countering a Burning Wish or Infernal Tutor is generally going to be more harmful because you're more "all-in" at the point you cast those spells. Rituals are generally cast at that point, not to mention LEDs being cracked in response, so countering your spell at that point is going to be more impactfull than countering the Dark Ritual at the start of the turn.

Third, people are talking about adding MM to every deck. Literally, every deck. Zoo, Goblins, Dredge, everything. That's awful. If you're playing an aggro deck and the only way you feel you can compete is to play MM to counter their MM, you should probably be looking for a new deck. If those decks do add MM to their decks, or even the sideboard, I feel they will cut anti-Storm cards to fit them. I feel like they would replace Mindbreak Traps and Thorn of Amethyst with MM, under the impression that MM will fight Storm just as well. And well, that's a huge, huge bonus for TES.

On Gataxian Probe: it's trash. Don't play it in this deck. It isn't free, as the 2 life you pay means 2 less cards you can draw off Ad Nauseam. The info you gain is awesome, but if you really want another card to look at their hand, add Thoughtseize before Probe. Now you get to look at their hand AND take that Force of Will.

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Well said sir.

What do you guys think of Last Chance? It is probably terrible, but part of me wants to try it. Then again, I am not really in a mental state to be evaluating cards.

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Originally Posted by lorddotm

What do you guys think of Last Chance? It is probably terrible, but part of me wants to try it. Then again, I am not really in a mental state to be evaluating cards.

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Honestly, I think it's terrible. :confused:

RR is not allways easily castable and it gives us:
- 1 extra draw (brainstorm and ponder both do this much better)
- untap (not really relevant, unless it allows us to drop another land)
- random etw race wins. (etw shouldn't be played when opponent has a reasonable chance of racing it + etw usually requires LED, so your hoping that one of your next 2 draws is a burning wish -> last chance + mana to cast it)

Though I don't really care about the lose the game part (when you go for your big turn, you win now or lose now most of the time), I don't believe this card merits a spot in an already really tight wishboard.

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Originally Posted by Diprivan

Honestly, I think it's terrible. :confused:

RR is not allways easily castable and it gives us:
- 1 extra draw (brainstorm and ponder both do this much better)
- untap (not really relevant, unless it allows us to drop another land)
- random etw race wins. (etw shouldn't be played when opponent has a reasonable chance of racing it + etw usually requires LED, so your hoping that one of your next 2 draws is a burning wish -> last chance + mana to cast it)

Though I don't really care about the lose the game part (when you go for your big turn, you win now or lose now most of the time), I don't believe this card merits a spot in an already really tight wishboard.

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Your Wishboard is tight? I have a flexslot right now occupied by Hurkyl's Recall, and there have definitely been time where I think an extra turn would be exactly what I need, that being said, RR is a harsh cost to pay.

Once again, a disclaimer, I don't have class tomorrow, so I am not in a position to be seriously making any sort of suggestions.