[OLD] UGr Threshold

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Originally Posted by aTn

Good job !

How was Shackles for you ? Can you give play situations where it was good/bad ? Thanks in advance...

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I personally have had play experience with Shackles. And if you ask me (the proud owner of 50+ of them) I think it should be in every deck ever made, but I brought it in against Salvagers. It ended up stalling the game out long enough for me to draw enough counters or stifles to stop him and win (happened in both game 2 as well as 3). And considering it went down to 4 cards game 2... I was quite happy with the out come. Um as for being bad... Pithing needle? As well as artifact destruction more common then enchantment.

hello, im building ugr thresh and i really like this deck,

i've tested for a while nog with this deck and now i have this build:

4#Force of Will
4#Daze
4#Brainstorm
4#Lightning Bolt
3#Predict
2#Spell Snare

4#Ponder

4#Wooded Foothills
4#Flooded Strand
3#Volcanic Island
2#Island
1#Forest
3#Tropical Island

4#Nimble Mongoose
4#Tarmogoyf
4#Terravore

3#Counterbalance
3#Sensei’s Divining Top


i really like teravore in this build because i play much fetch(and probably my opponents too) hes a 3c creature so hes good with counterbalance and he has trample wich is really good i think.

there are a few things i want to ask:

3xpredict? should i change it to 3xportent/serum visions because there sorceries, and im aonly playing 4 sorceries?

2xspell snare? should i change it to something else because i already play 8 free counters and 3xcounterbalance.

removal? sould i add more removal, liek fire/ice or chain lightning or something?



greets, electrolyze

Just browsing through some Top 8 lists, and noticed this build. Granted the build does not splash Red, but contains an interesting inclusion in the main.

Mind Harness
(1), Enchantment - Aura
Enchant red or green creature.
Cumulative Upkeep - {1}.
You control enchanted creature.

It makes sense for a U/G to run this card, since they have next to no removable and considering today's meta, but does it warrant a try in the Red version? Is it better than Threads or Control Magic? Once it gets around to attacking, you have invested 2 mana. Second attack, you now equal to Threads. But then you have invested less mana per turn, which still allows you to cantrip and cast cheap counter magic.

How about the Red side of it; what Red creatures would you take? If we are talking Goblins; Warchief, Kiki or I guess could be any targetable Goblin?

Strategic Planning is also strange.. Kind of a better but more expensive Mental Note.
I don't think Mind Harness is better than Control Magic or Shackles. You can't keep the stolen creature around for long. Maybe that's all it will take but if you get into a stalemate, you need a permanent solution. Shackles is even better in that situation.

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Originally Posted by PhanTom_lt

Strategic Planning is also strange.. Kind of a better but more expensive Mental Note.
I don't think Mind Harness is better than Control Magic or Shackles. You can't keep the stolen creature around for long. Maybe that's all it will take but if you get into a stalemate, you need a permanent solution. Shackles is even better in that situation.

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Strategic Planning just acts at sorcery speed an costs 2 Mana, that's why it sucks and was never really played in Thresh. The rest is agreed.

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Originally Posted by Adan

Strategic Planning just acts at sorcery speed an costs 2 Mana, that's why it sucks and was never really played in Thresh. The rest is agreed.

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Not that i'm advocating using it, but Strategic Planning gives you the option of what card you want to keep, unlike Mental Note.

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Originally Posted by PhanTom_lt

I don't think Mind Harness is better than Control Magic or Shackles. You can't keep the stolen creature around for long. Maybe that's all it will take but if you get into a stalemate, you need a permanent solution. Shackles is even better in that situation.

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Just FYI...

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Originally Posted by Sigar

Mind Harness was awesome all day. Stole so many Goyf, it's crazy.

Shackles is sooo slow in this deck, and you rarely have more than 3 lands anyway.

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This comment is regarding the UG Threshold version 4/4/4 with Waste + Stifle

This build won Serbia - Montenegro Legacy Championship. The think I don't like is the lack of Ponder and inclusive of MN, since there is only 4 threshold creature. Other than that, good to see some BTS.


lands
4 Polluted Delta
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Tropical Island
4 Volcanic Island
1 Mountain
1 Forest
2 Island

creatures
4x Tarmogoyf
4x Nimble Mongoose
2x Burning Three Shaman

spells
4x Brainstorm
3x Serum Vision
3x Mental Note
3x Daze
3x Spell Snare
3x Stifle
4x Force of Will
3x Fire / Ice
4x Lightning Bolt
2x Magma Jet

sideboard
4x Tormod's Crypt
2x Engineered Explosives
1x Red Elemental Blast
2x Chill
1x Pyroblast
2x Pithing Needle
3x Pyroclasm

I think that it's usually a toss up between Ponder and SV for most lists, although it's not uncommon to see them run side by side to ensure a sorcery in the yard. They're very similar I think.

I think that Predict used alongside Ponder works best. Shrinks the number of cards you don't want to see for a relatively low cost. Or Ray of Erasure :P

Uhh... I think it is generally accepted that Ponder is better than SV because they are the same or Ponder is better in all but 1 situation, where the top card of your library is a bomb (aka good) and the 2nd and 3rd cards are bricks (aka bad). I don't remember in what thread this was evaluated but one of the more respected posters on this site did a pretty in depth analysis of all the possible variations of the top three cards of your library and it showed the Ponder is the superior card in general.

Kronicler

I fell in love with CB/ Top Combo last night at a local turny. It was incredible and every game just CB hit the table, even some games without top, I won. The only thing that I question in my build is the Spell Snares. I know its a meta choice, I indeed to like them over Counterspell. I am also I big believer in Stifle in the main. It just makes the Combo match up much essayer (TES and Iggy mostly) and Stifling a fetch land in the mirror or against Fish can be detrimental to their game.

Oh, and I'd like to say this because it's true. Ichorid is a mentally challenged deck. It should die and burn in the place where the devil lives. :eek:

Thank you very much Tool for deleting that deck list from this post. Instead of deleting a new Large post why don't you just delete some of you stupid rules posts. Posting deck lists helps in its own ways, as where posting stupid gay rules in turn DOES ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!!!

People seem to be forgetting some of the basic rules for posting on this site, especially in the LMF.

1. Don't quote large posts or decklists.
2. Don't spam the thread with decklists.
3. Add real content to your posts. Enough of this single sentence question nonsense.
4. Spelling and grammar are important.

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Originally Posted by kabal

11/28 @ SuperGames Inc.
Alpharreta, GA

13 people, 4 rounds, top 4

Top 2 Split
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NQGr BTS.FTW (me)

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// Lands
1 Forest
2 Island
2 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
3 Tropical Island
4 Volcanic Island
3 Wooded Foothills

// Creatures
2 Burning-Tree Shaman
4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Tarmogoyf

// Spells
4 Brainstorm
3 Counterspell
4 Daze
3 Fire/Ice
4 Force of Will
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Stifle
4 Ponder
3 Serum Visions

// Artifacts
2 Pithing Needle

// Sideboard
SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
SB: 2 Control Magic
SB: 2 Krosan Grip
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
SB: 4 Pyroclasm
SB: 3 Spell Snare
SB: 1 Stifle
SB: 1 Threads of Disloyalty

BTS was the MVP considering I got matched up against Ghoul Cephalid Breakfast twice.

I've decided to move the counterbalance/top to the maindeck. In the board I ran 4 c/b and 3 tops...what is the consensus on the numbers for applications in the maindeck.

Just browsing through the 4-1 decks from Worlds, and came across this one.
First off, they are running 14 lands. To supplement the low land count, this individual is running 4 Aether Vial.

What do you think about this build? It has been mentioned in the past that since Threshold can run 4 Wasteland as part of their 18 lands, that maybe 14 can suffice.

Threshold by Nicolas Kohan

2 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
4 Tropical Island
4 Volcanic Island
2 Wooded Foothills

4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Werebear

4 Aether Vial
4 Brainstorm
4 Daze
1 Fire / Ice
4 Force of Will
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Mental Note
3 Ponder
4 Spell Snare
3 Stifle

Sideboard
3 Counterbalance
2 Krosan Grip
1 Pyroblast
2 Pyroclasm
1 Red Elemental Blast
3 Sensei's Divining Top
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Umezawa's Jitte

Damn, that Build somehow sucks. 4 Mental Notes... Ah, wait, Werebears. Ok, hen it's justified.

But Aether Vials??? 11 creatures are not enough to justify Aether Vial. They may bring you creatures through Counterbalances against Mirrormatches and so on, but in the end I think they are 4 dead slots.

That single Fire/Ice also sucks, I prefer 4 of them (Damage Race and Cardadvantage so on...).
That build really look weird. But that's how Threshold is, if you get early Mungo-beatz you will win anyways, no matter how the remaining 52 Cards look like :cool:

edit: I'm not sure if I corrected it all, but it's half past 7 in the morning so my orthography may suck...

Actually the 4 Vials might not be as wasted as they seem. Since the build is only playing 14 lands having the 4 Vials give you a sure fire way to drop creatures (being immune to Counter-Top and other means of counter is just an additional plus) but Vial allows you to keep you mana open for counters It also gives you an answer to Dragon Stompy and it's Chalice for 1 & 2, Trinispheres, and Moon x7-8.

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Originally Posted by JanValentine00

Actually the 4 Vials might not be as wasted as they seem. Since the build is only playing 14 lands having the 4 Vials give you a sure fire way to drop creatures (being immune to Counter-Top and other means of counter is just an additional plus) .

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As was said before, 4 Vial for only 11 creatures doesn't seem that good; they'll often be dead cards.

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but Vial allows you to keep you mana open for counters

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Threshold plays undercosted creatures and is able to play cantrips and countermagic efficiently because of that. The deck has worked well for years without Aether Vial, I think it's overkill in that aspect.

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It also gives you an answer to Dragon Stompy and it's Chalice for 1 & 2, Trinispheres, and Moon x7-8

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You play countermagic to take care of that (post-board you still have your countermagic and Ancient Grudge, Krosan Grip). You also have Control Magic post-board for their fatties. It's not that bad a match-up for the 'standard' builds of UGR-Threshold, I don't see again why Aether Vial is necessary in that aspect.

[QUOTE=kabal;187505]J

2 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
4 Tropical Island
4 Volcanic Island
2 Wooded Foothills

4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Werebear

4 Aether Vial
4 Brainstorm
4 Daze
1 Fire / Ice
4 Force of Will
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Mental Note
3 Ponder
4 Spell Snare
3 Stifle
/QUOTE]


I don't agree on the Aether Vials in a traditional build of Threshold, but I can understand why he did in fact put them in. Most of us would agree that its probably not a smart play to include these cards, but let me point out a few things which is a reason why I don't have a problem with them.

This decklist is from Worlds, the last swiss rounds of the tournament which were Legacy. A lot of Pros went with Aggro/Control decks to play since they didn't know the format that well. This is why I believe Vials were included in the decklist. If your expecting most of the field to play control strategies, then having a card if it resolves lets you play your creatures without the worry of counter spells and at instant speed is a very good plan.

I don't see why you guys are bashing the inclusion of Aether Vial, which seemed like a very good call given all the circumstances that were present for these 5 rounds of swiss to end Worlds.

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nickrit2000: I don't see why you guys are bashing the inclusion of Aether Vial, which seemed like a very good call given all the circumstances that were present for these 5 rounds of swiss to end Worlds.

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1. No one is bashing, we are questioning and discussing the choice, that is all.

2. We aren't discussing the Worlds metagame or card choices for Worlds, etc. We are discussing the relevance of playing Aether Vial in UGR-Threshold and the relevance of the Kohan build outside of Worlds (since Worlds is now over).

Aether Vial wasn't needed before Worlds when the meta was filled with Threshold and I don't see why it would have been needed for Worlds.

Pros are well... pros, so saying they weren't familiar with the format doesn't seem like a good argument to justify a card choice, all they had to do was playtest... it's their job. Yes there were lots of formats to cover for Worlds, but they had a lot of time to prepare.

Again, playing 4 Vials when you play only 11 creatures really seems bad. Your Vials will very often be dead cards and you'd be better off replacing them with a better metagame call... like playing CB-Top maindeck if you fear a field of Threshold (EDIT: And why not splash W instead of R in that case ? - in the case of Worlds I understand the fear of Gobs and thus the R-splash)..

I'm not saying all this is the absolute truth, but it's my point of view.