[Deck] Next Level Threshold

Not really, before the last tourney, I had only played NLT in a small local tourney, going 3-1 losing to the local burn player. For about 3 months (sep to dec I think) I played survival since it was literally the best deck. Before survival dominance though, the times either me or my friend freakish777 played the deck, we'd either top 8 or top 16 a large event. For me, I got 10th at a 130 person tourney in June, split top 4 in a 67 person GPT before colombus, while my friend got top 64 with the deck in colombus, then got top 4 in a September tourney. Point being when eiher of is had played the deck, it's been pretty fucking spectacular. Sure it might be a somewhat small sample size, but I have never run bad with the deck. The worst I've ever done is losing in the last round playing for top 16 in an 80 person event. The only thing I recommend is to play this deck in a well developed metagame, playing the deck at some 4 round local tourney probably won't give you the results you want. As for future tourneys I'll be playing the deck at, there a lotus tourney at Jupiter games in Binghamton that I'll be running the NLT. So don't be surprised if I came back after this weekend one lotus richer.

^ I agree. Stifle becomes really savage when your opponent just walks into it because he doesn't know your deck, which is why I also think NLT is a really good deck for larger tournaments. It's probably not the best choice for small locals, though, because there isn't the same "surprise, buttsecks"-factor . If your meta has a lot of Goblins, Merfolk, combo and control, then I still think it's a very good choice, because you can beat those decks pretty easily, and you're 50/50 against most other stuff. I'm surprised NLT hasn't seen play in the SCG series. It seems like it would crush that metagame, especially if the new MUD deck becomes popular.

It's probably not the best choice for my local meta anymore, but I was too lazy to sleeve something up, so I played NLT again

BW Deadguy 2-0
Burn (optimized) 2-0
GerryT's CB 2-1
PT Junk 0-2

Some whine ---> g1: Mull to 5 before I see a single land. g2: his hand is nigh unbeatable for any blue deck. T1 Thoughtseize, T2 Hymn, T3 KotR (gets bolted). My turn 4: Play 2x Goyf and go hellbent. His T4: play Choke + StP Goyf. His T5: play new KotR.



Between weekly events and the 1 small tournament that I won, I'm now 17-6 overall in matches with the deck after picking it up again. I guess that's ok, but not insane

i just played chinEsE girl's decklist yesterday.. exept sidebord was alittle diffrens

for a 6 rounds standings..
i vent 4-1-1

Maindeck

4 Tarmogoyf
3 Vendillion Clique

4 Brainstorm
3 Ponder
4 Stifle
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Spell Snare
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Firespout
3 Jace the Mind Sculptor

3 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
3 Wasteland
3 Mishra's Factory
3 Island
2 Flooded Strand
1 Polluted Delta
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Scalding Tarn

Sideboard

1 Hurkyl's Recall
2 EE
3 Spell Pierce
2 Krosan Grip
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Pyroblast
2 Red Elemental Blast

match 1.
2-1 vs Mono G Elvs

mach 2.
2-0 vs UB Show and Tell

mach 3.
0-2 vs Junk and Taxes

mach 4.
2-1 vs GW cookie with Green Sun's Zenith.deck

mach 5.
2-0 vs WB Quest.deck

mach 6.
1-1 tie vs UB Faeries

sorry for the shoort post :)

I would really like to fit 2 grim lavamancers and a control magic effect to that maindeck.
Suggestions on what to cut?
-1 Jace?
-1 Clique?
-1 ?

I'd also have to use the old Fire // Ice in place of firespouts. But hey, reach is fun.
Suggestions?

I think two Jace is the right number.

Replacing 1 jace by a control magic seems fine.
For fire/ice in place of firespout.... depends of your meta :wink: with tribal deck and zoo firespout is da best.

And for the grim... don't if it fit in the deck, probably yes... just read the primer :cool:

So here's my opinion on lavamancer. He's a pretty sweet creature, and certainly is a bating against apt of different things. Only problem is, the deck is already sick against the things lavamancer helps beat. All the tribal decks we already have good matchups against, and I guess he helps give us reach against control decks when he can resolve and not get swords, but overall I haven't really had games where I missed having him. He can certainly be awesome, but personally I'd be much more concerned about dealing with knight of the reliquary. I swear if I could figure out a way to deal with a knight in play that didn't cost a ton of mana, this deck would be favored/even against every deck in the format.

Bottom line, grim lavamancer is a good card that can be put into some of the flex spots in the decklists, though I personally think he's just a win more instead of helping the deck shore up it's weaknesses.

Well, another tournament, another top 8. Only problem is I lost in the quarters to not drawing a cantrip or red source against merfolk when my hand crushes if I draw a red source. It was actually the first time I've ever lost against merfolk. Ever. Guess I had ran out of luck after going x-0 in the Swiss. Tomorrow when I'm not so tired I'll give a quick tourney report on what decks I played against.

Rough beats. I've been playing with 4 Volcs and 2 Islands for some time now, basically just to minimize the risk of losing that way

Alright, so more tourney report time.

Once again played NLT at Jupiter Games in Binghamton, since it's the stones in the metagame, so long as you don't run into infinite Knight of the Reliquary. Considering that NLT can beat Zoo handily, plus have good game versus junk and new horizons with proper deck construction, I sleeved up the same cards as last months, with only a few changes. Here's the list I ran this time.

NLT aka Next Level Thresh aka Next Level Tempo aka Next Level Tech aka "The Mother Fucking Stones"

3 Volc
3 Trop
3 Wasteland
3 Factories
2 Island
7 Blue Fetches

4 Goyf
3 Clique

4 Stifle
4 Force
3 Daze
3 Spell Snare
4 Bolt
3 Firespout
4 Brainstorm
3 Ponder
2 Jace
1 Crucilbe
1 Control Magic

Sideboard

1 Firespout
3 REB
3 Spell Pierce
2 Grip
2 Relic
2 Mind Harness
1 Gilded Drake
1 Null Rod

For those taking notes, the only changes from last time is replacing a basic with a fetch in the maindeck, along with taking the crypt out of the board for a gilded drake. These changes came after my friend james (jimirynk on the source) noticed we only needed the two basics to cast out stuff, plus the extra fetch makes our brainstorms and jaces better. Basically, it's a pretty obvious change. The other switch was the gilded drake tech for deal with giant green dudes, basically KotR and Goyf. They're the biggest threat against this deck, so they need to be dealt with accordingly. The crypt on the other hand rarely got used, since decks like lands and dredge are rarely played. So after casually telling everyone I met that top 8ing would be a cinch since I was running the stones, I hunkered down to back up my claim.

Round 1 vs Merfolk

Ah, a matchup I just love to see. It's too bad I know my opponent, since if it was some unknown they would assume an easy match since I'm playing blue, then they just stare in disbelief after they get crushed by NLT. Anyways game one I get there with a resolved Goyf while dealing with all of his lords. Game 2 is all about my three firespouts. The first two get countered, and the third wrecks his shit.

1-0

Round 2 vs Gw Fauna Shaman

Basically he was playing the Gw survival deck that was insane two months ago, but now lacks the namesake card. Game 1 he sticks fauna shaman after I run out of removal, and then turns his extra dudes into vengevines, which own me. Game two he surprises me with sword of fire/ice, which would have destroyed me if he ever got to equip it. Somehow I keep him off of creatures with firespout, bolts, and stifles. He makes a small mistake where he could have killed a goyf of mine, but forgets to use a quiron ranger to make the mana, so he can't swords my guy with only the basic forests he has left over after firespout. Eventually I kill all of his creatures, get him to 2 with clique, and then manage to topdeck the bolt to kill him. Game 3 he keeps a sketch hand with only a single land, and after he lays down three dudes I firespout plus wasteland to blow out his mana. I just play a goyf and clique to take him out before he can play anything in his hand.

2-0

Round 3 vs Ugbr Countertop

He was playing black instead of white, but otherwise is pretty much stock 4c countertop. Game 1 I get him with daze when he taps out for jace, and then drop my own jace, which takes the game from there. It certainly helped that he wasn't expecting the daze at all. Game two I get to use all my sweet one mana counters while he is stuck on very few lands. Eventually I resolve a win con (I think it was a goyf) and it goes the distance.

3-0

Round 4 vs Dragon Stompy

I saw the pairing for this round and I was doing mental fistpumps. For those who don't know, this is one of the very best matchups for this deck. They run a bunch of moon effects, but we really don't care so long as you're not stupid and fetch for some basics first. Add in countermagic for their few threats, and the fact that all our removal kills all of their dudes, and everything adds up to the best matchup this side of belcher. So game one my hand isn't great, but I have the few removal spells I need to keep him down, and he can't deal with vendillion clique at all. Game 2 my hand is great, and once again clique just dominates his shit. Actually, you know what, just keep hands with removal/countermagic, and one clique, and you'll probably win very easily.

4-0

Round 5 vs Rb Goblins

Time to lock up my spot in the top 8. Game 1 is all about me getting a goyf down to block his lackey, and then using firespout to crush his dudes. Game two I mull to five, but stay in it when I rip bolt like a champ to deal with his turn 1 lackey. Then I fuck up royally, using force on a pointless relic of progenitus, and it costs me when he uses warren weirding to get rid of my goyf that was holding his dudes back. Game three though I get him good. My early goyf keeps his piledriver back, then goes on the aggro while I have countermagic to deal with his threats. I even have the stifle to deal with ringleader, then find firespout with brainstorm to clear his team and attack for lethal.

5-0

Round 6 & 7 vs the ID

I got to draw these rounds, and then promptly get stomped by good EDH decks while I play my awesome sauce allies deck that isn't actually good in 1v1 EDH.

Top 8 vs Merfolk

Against the same guy who I played in the swiss, who ended up going 5-0-1 after I beat him in the swiss. Game one I get him with goyf like usual. Unfortunately I get my bad luck in games 2 and 3, which really sucks when it happens in the top 8 of all places. Game 2 he draws all 4 wastelands, which keeps me from casting the 2 goyfs in my hand that would otherwise dominate his shit. Game 3 I open with fetch -> basic island so that wasteland doesn't crush me, and then proceed to not draw a cantrip or a fetch or a volc or goyf for the next 15 turns. Basically I drew a lot of my red cards and counters, but couldn't really use them/cast them. Eventually I tap low for a control magic, then he casts back to basics while I still can't draw a red source. The game ends when I can't cast spells for the last 5 turns.

So yeah once again I top 8 without too much hassle, but I lose in the quarters for the 4th fucking legacy tournament in a row. And I'm not playing bad either, just need to get past the bad beats and have the deck not shit on me in the top 8. I'd much rather lose in the swiss then sweep the top 8, but I guess my one loss has to come at the wrong fucking time. But yeah the frustration shows, show the results don't lie. I still feel like this deck is the nuts right now, and it helps that a bunch of people don't even know what kind of cards the deck plays. So many times people have asked me "oh, you're playing countertop right?" and then get wrecked by stifle. The one thing I will say though, I will put down a guarantee, right here right now, that I will top 8 either the washington SCG legacy 5k or the edison SCG legacy 5k. I'm calling my shot right now so that this deck can get some serious consideration. I'll post again after I top 8 an SCG 5k.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chinEsE girl

The one thing I will say though, I will put down a guarantee, right here right now, that I will top 8 either the washington SCG legacy 5k or the edison SCG legacy 5k. I'm calling my shot right now so that this deck can get some serious consideration. I'll post again after I top 8 an SCG 5k.

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Quoted. And see you there, promise.

@chinEsE girl
I played the deck also when it first made its debut at GP Madrid,and only played it twice but t8'ed both.
I'm not so sure if I like the Control Magic though,seems like the Jace would be just better anyway.Yes knight,rhox's are annoying but I think ur better of putting pressure and bouncing/countering them with Jace,and deal with them post side(Mind harness does this really good since they wont bring in K-grip or something,and a big KotR/goyf,.. finish things fast).
I dont like the fact that CM can be kinda dead where a Jace is always usefull.
Love this deck,and the maindeck crucible was also mvp for me. The suprise effect is indeed very good,but its a solid deck that can wreck opponents who dont pay attention to their fetches,duals,..

I predict a huge showing of the MUD deck at your scg's chinese girl. i would play more null rod. It seems like Juicy sweet tech! Wurmcoil Engine? Control magic! EAT IT!

In a heavy BGW Rock/Junk metagame, I was considering Divert as a 2-of in the sideboard. May be pretty sweet to Divert a Hymn back at them. Thoughts?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chinEsE girl

The other switch was the gilded drake tech for deal with giant green dudes, basically KotR and Goyf. They're the biggest threat against this deck, so they need to be dealt with accordingly.

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How would Submerge fare in the board as a 2 or 3-of?

I played chinEsE girl 's list with the following changes today :

-1 Crucible of Worlds
-1 Control Magic
+2 Engineered Explosives

I expected to see more vial aggro and combo than 4c Counterbalance/blue based aggro-control, and wanted a compact catch-all answer to both an early Vial and an resolved Knight/Tarmogoyf. The little extra "oopmf' in the Merfolk, Affinity, Zoo, and Green and Taxes matchups was also welcome as a metagame call. They were terrific in every match where I drew them. My sideboard was similar, I ran another Relic because people here like dredge, and took out a control magic effect since blue-based aggro-control wasn't there.

Went 4-0-1 , drawing in turns with Landstill (would have killed him, had goyf w/ force backup w/ him having no answers), and beating mono-U merfolk, mono-R Goblins, Rb Goblins, and T.E.S. . What this deck does to tribal aggro is just plain dirty. I wouldn't hesitate to run it at the SCG DC event if I could make it (sadly I don't travel for Legacy). Awesome deck.

Hi, i have a huge tournament (around 200 people) this weekend and this is my option nº1 to play it.
I think the metagame will be full of aggro, specially goblins and Zoo (Big-Zoo specially).What are your opinion against Big Zoo?
The other option is CounterTop-Progenitus, but im like a bye to goblins, so ive rejected that option (i made 4-2 losing both vs goblins).
I played yesterday with ChinEse girl's list and it was like i spected: Tribal = too easy, traditional Zoo = 60-40, Big Zoo = 40-60, CounterTop = 40-60, all of them pre-side.
I have a feeling about Daze playing only 3: They come always later, but i dont know what to remove to add the 4th, maybe one land...
About the SB: 2 Slots anti-graveyard are few, we need 3 at least, so i think ill swap 1x firespout 2x Relic - 3 Tormod's. Seriously, in this deck, relic is the worst anti-graveyard card. We need to use it and race, and with Relic our goyfs became 0/1...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Plague Sliver

How would Submerge fare in the board as a 2 or 3-of?

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How about Hibernation? Not as fast, but also provides an answer to Progenitus. Has additional utiity versus elves and enchantress.

Also, I love Gilded Drake. It combos very nicely with Jace since bouncing it returns it to your hand and you still keep the trade.

I'd like to fit another null rod in the sideboard too. It's useful in multiple matchups, not just affinity and mud.

I've been playing this deck for a while using a stock list and it feels like it has an identity crisis, choosing between control and threshold.

While I'm having lots of fun with the deck, it only seems to be viable by being carried on the backs of Firespout and Force of Will.

Hibernation has the same problem as Relic, is a card that helps you race your opponent.
And both work bad with your Goyf.
On the other side, i see Null Rod as a very good card on the counterterbalance matchup, since it stop Sensei and Relics (post SB).

Im thinking about the next cards Sylvan Library, Engineered Explosives and Greens sun's Zenith.

Taking the chinEsE girl main deck

1º
-2 ponder +2 Sylvan library, sylvan library is an autowin againts control.

2º -1 Crucible -1 Control Magic +2 Engineered Explosives or +2 Greens sun's Zenith? I like the idea of playing with 6 tarmogoyf.

What do you think about this changes ?