Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
It'll see some play, maybe a lot of play... but it's not the end of the world. WotC does a lot of shit I don't like, but despite all of the general bitching about WotC, I'm actually pretty happy with where Legacy is right now. Like someone said, Etched Champion is hardly breaking the format. Sure, it's a lot better than Champion since you don't have to run it in a shitty mono-artifacts deck, but it's still not game breaking by itself.
It isn't really comparable with Jace or Clique. The one draws you cards (plus a million other things) and the other attacks their hand. Nemesis dude just swings. He swings well, but he still just swings. Just like Champion, he's not terribly threatening without Equipment or some other form of pumps to accompany him. On principle I definitely don't like his non-interactiveness, but really it's doubtful that it'll cause more of a shake up than Delver has.
Golgari Charm is already run by most GBx decks, UW decks already run Supreme Verdict (and/or Terminus), Delver decks will Daze 3 drops all day long, and Combo literally wishes that you'd run this over Clique. Liliana, Engineered Plague, Pernicious Deed, Massacre, and Zealous Persecution are also highly played cards.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dzra
Golgari Charm is already run by most GBx decks, UW decks already run Supreme Verdict (and/or Terminus), Delver decks will Daze 3 drops all day long, and Combo literally wishes that you'd run this over Clique. Liliana, Engineered Plague, Pernicious Deed, Massacre, and Zealous Persecution are also highly played cards.
Golgari Charm, Zealous Persecution and Engineered Plague are pretty bad against Merfolk, though, because of all the lords, and counterspells become next to useless if they have a Vial. Against Delver-type tempo, the -1/-1 effects are better, but still they don't kill Shamans, flipped Delvers, Goyfs, Tombstalkers, Mongoose with threshold. That's not ideal either.
In summary, I don't like the idea of bringing in -1/-1 effects against the decks that will play this guy.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
DLifshitz
Golgari Charm, Zealous Persecution and Engineered Plague are pretty bad against Merfolk, though, because of all the lords, and counterspells become next to useless if they have a Vial. Against Delver-type tempo, the -1/-1 effects are better, but still they don't kill Shamans, flipped Delvers, Goyfs, Tombstalkers, Mongoose with threshold. That's not ideal either.
In summary, I don't like the idea of bringing in -1/-1 effects against the decks that will play this guy.
Not to mention those are all sideboard cards. I you are playing a fair deck (other than Miracles) how do you stop him g1? Surely you don't want to run MD Charms of Plagues?
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
The same way fair decks deal with a Progenitus in play: Ignore it and kill the opponent.
Delver, Deathrite, Pyromancer, Lavamancer, Clique, Tombstalker, Piledriver, Sword of Fire and ICE.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dzra
It'll see some play, maybe a lot of play... but it's not the end of the world. WotC does a lot of shit I don't like, but despite all of the general bitching about WotC, I'm actually pretty happy with where Legacy is right now. Like someone said, Etched Champion is hardly breaking the format. Sure, it's a lot better than Champion since you don't have to run it in a shitty mono-artifacts deck, but it's still not game breaking by itself.
It isn't really comparable with Jace or Clique. The one draws you cards (plus a million other things) and the other attacks their hand. Nemesis dude just swings. He swings well, but he still just swings. Just like Champion, he's not terribly threatening without Equipment or some other form of pumps to accompany him. On principle I definitely don't like his non-interactiveness, but really it's doubtful that it'll cause more of a shake up than Delver has.
Golgari Charm is already run by most GBx decks, UW decks already run Supreme Verdict (and/or Terminus), Delver decks will Daze 3 drops all day long, and Combo literally wishes that you'd run this over Clique. Liliana, Engineered Plague, Pernicious Deed, Massacre, and Zealous Persecution are also highly played cards.
Yeah I think if there's one lesson to be learned from SCG Milwaukee it's not to sleep on combo.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
crow_mw
Not to mention those are all sideboard cards. I you are playing a fair deck (other than Miracles) how do you stop him g1? Surely you don't want to run MD Charms of Plagues?
What about the new Toxic Deluge? Not only does kill Nemesis, it also kills their entire board for a few points of life.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dzra
It'll see some play, maybe a lot of play... but it's not the end of the world. WotC does a lot of shit I don't like, but despite all of the general bitching about WotC, I'm actually pretty happy with where Legacy is right now. Like someone said, Etched Champion is hardly breaking the format. Sure, it's a lot better than Champion since you don't have to run it in a shitty mono-artifacts deck, but it's still not game breaking by itself.
It isn't really comparable with Jace or Clique. The one draws you cards (plus a million other things) and the other attacks their hand. Nemesis dude just swings. He swings well, but he still just swings. Just like Champion, he's not terribly threatening without Equipment or some other form of pumps to accompany him. On principle I definitely don't like his non-interactiveness, but really it's doubtful that it'll cause more of a shake up than Delver has.
Golgari Charm is already run by most GBx decks, UW decks already run Supreme Verdict (and/or Terminus), Delver decks will Daze 3 drops all day long, and Combo literally wishes that you'd run this over Clique. Liliana, Engineered Plague, Pernicious Deed, Massacre, and Zealous Persecution are also highly played cards.
Obviously it's not the end of the world. Obviously it's surely seeing some play and maybe a lot of play. And it's obviously going to cost a lot of money.
The point is not that there are answers for it in the format. It's that the best cards in the format don't interact with it. Just look at Delver, it dies to EVERYTHING! And it's still a major force in Legacy. Now when you tell it's ok because it dies to Golgari Charm and Supreme Veridict I just have to laugh at that. Let's all play a bunch of "bad" cards in our decks just to kill this one guy that is not warping the format at all.
And I don't even mind all that. I just hate that they are creating another staple that is going to be release in a somwhat fringe set and is going to cost a lot. Legacy doesn't need anymore expensive staples.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Tempo is Blue, Control is Blue, Combo is Blue and Midrange is now Blue too! *rhyme*
The card's crap in tempo ... The only real home is in decks with DRS and/or SFM
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Lemnear
Tempo is Blue, Control is Blue, Combo is Blue and Midrange is now Blue too! *rhyme*
The card's crap in tempo ... The only real home is in decks with DRS and/or SFM
I don't know if it is bad in Tempo. It doesn't fit their classic game plan but on the other hand it is a game plan of its own. It is good in the Tempo mirror, against Midrange and against Control and it gives you nice reach.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Identity Nemesis is Mental Misstep all over again. It will probably be banned on the next banned list update.
Stupid design. Noninteractive sucks! It's way too powerful and locks out any deck without access to sweepers.
I wonder if they print such cards just to get people out of Legacy and into Modern.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
With the card's official name being spoiled as "True-Name Nemesis" should the topic title be changed?
You know, though, I think the card would have been better worded as:
"As True-Name Nemesis enters the battlefield, choose an opponent.
As long as you have more than one opponent, True-Name Nemesis has protection from that opponent."
Wham! Suddenly all the potential abuse and noninteractivity in a 2-player game is gone, while it still keeps the actually interesting part of it, the way it's invulnerable to one of your opponents but not the others in a multi-player game. Because I really did like its ability in multiplayer, but in a 2-player game it's just an even less interactive Invisible Stalker (and we all remember how much players loved that card, right?)
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
joven
Identity Nemesis is Mental Misstep all over again. It will probably be banned on the next banned list update.
Stupid design. Noninteractive sucks! It's way too powerful and locks out any deck without access to sweepers.
I wonder if they print such cards just to get people out of Legacy and into Modern.
That little sucker isn't going anywhere anytime soon. It has the Tarmogoyf-Syndrom - stupid good, but nothing ban-worthy.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
If I can just figure out a way to kill this guy Supreme Blue will be back in action.
Current strategies:
1) Just counter it. If he gets through, Detention Sphere my own.
2) go UB and Liliana him.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tao
I don't know if it is bad in Tempo. It doesn't fit their classic game plan but on the other hand it is a game plan of its own. It is good in the Tempo mirror, against Midrange and against Control and it gives you nice reach.
Three mana for a 3/1 that doesn't have flash and does nothing else when it comes into play isn't exactly hot in tempo decks. It's worth noting that RUG decks don't run Vendillion Clique or Snapcaster Mage anymore, and both of those offered timing flexibility and added value. He also gets raced pretty well by Delver, which is easy to flip right away and will start beating down sooner.
He might be sideboard material in tempo, though. Delver, Goose, Nemesis seems like a pretty sweet lineup against control.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
In regards to this card being compared to Etched Champion, and not really seeing it's significance.
Imagine that you're running an aggro based deck of some sort. And you have a card that says the following:
Stupidly Overpowered. 3 mana
creature
Stupidly Overpowered gives +1/+1 to all of your creatures
Stupidly Overpowered's power and toughness is equal to the number of cards you have in play.
*/*
That's a good card right? But is it good enough?
So imagine they print a card that says
Ridiculous Lord. 2 mana
creature
tap Ridiculous Lord - All of your creatures get +1/+1 tokens. (so all creatures get an additional +1/+1 per turn)
1/1
Do you think Merfolk would play those lords? Do you think goblins would play those lords?
Finally, Imagine the card that is preferred over both of those cards....
Remove his only vulnerability of requiring 3 artifacts to have protection.
And Now, imagine he's blue.
Blue is the police, they keep unfair decks in check.
Everyone else is Rodney King.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
I'm not exactly one for predictions but somebody on the source is floating around with one of mine that is correct or incorrect depending on the season, so here goes:
True-Name Nemesis will be so good in Legacy that it warps the format, and at least a subset of players will call for it to be banned.
Also that XWW card will see some play.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Aggro_zombies
Three mana for a 3/1 that doesn't have flash and does nothing else when it comes into play isn't exactly hot in tempo decks. It's worth noting that RUG decks don't run Vendillion Clique or Snapcaster Mage anymore, and both of those offered timing flexibility and added value. He also gets raced pretty well by Delver, which is easy to flip right away and will start beating down sooner.
He might be sideboard material in tempo, though. Delver, Goose, Nemesis seems like a pretty sweet lineup against control.
I know what you are pointing at and I am not sure if he is the right card for RUG. But on the other hand, 3/1 that doesn't have flash and does nothing else when it comes into play isn't exactly hot in ANY deck.
My reasoning for playing 2-4 of him in RUG would be: Most decks are control against RUG. So for example against Jund and Shardless he sounds really great. They kill your Goyfs and Delvers and trump your Mongeese and that's how these games often go. This guy just lets you kill them from 7-9 life, no matter if they have Punishing Fire going or draw 748 cards with Agent / Ancestral Vision.
In the mirror I'd also rather be on the side that plays him. 3 mana is a ton in the mirror but when he lands, he dominates the ground.
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
R.I.P. Troll Ascetic he was a good GREEN Creature... :cry:
Re: [SCD] Identity Nemesis
This guy is unblockable when you're ahead and nearly invulnerable when you need him to block.
Its worth mentioning that this guy does some serious work against stuff like Jace, though Liliana not so much. Its not quite so good against BUG control which packs stuff like Deed, Innocent Blood, and Liliana. But against RUG, they can only remove this guy with Rough/Tumble post-board. He'll be awesome in combat races against RUG, but I think RUG will have difficulty playing him at 3cc.. though I expect to see some variations that play this guy for the RUG mirror.
I see this guy producing a shift toward BUG and away from RUG. I think this has been WotC's trend anyway though since Deathrite Shaman and Abrupt Decay have caused so much metashifting.
A few people have mentioned that you can counter it yes, but its 3cc and Aether Vial is still a thing. Clique is also conveniently at 3cc. I anticipate UW Tempo decks will have a field day with this guy as its literally perfect for holding equipment and that means SFM completes that equation. Also, the deck has had powerful new additions like Delver make me think that color combination in Tempo-style is going to catch on.
