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Do not board Leyline of Sanctity against Tormod's Crypt and Nihil Spellbomb. It isn't worth it.
The only time I'd bring in Leyline as anti-hate is against a deck that has Bogs and Traps and no artifacts or Leyline. Even then it might not be worth the slots.
I never sideboard the card at all. I was just trying to suggest a card he could use for combo which could have other applications as well. My sideboard is 4 Nature's Claim, 4 Firestorm, 4 Chain of Vapor and 3 Ancient Grudge. It's been really good for me. Nature's Claim is the nuts.
Perhaps he did just have the nuts, but your experience is different than mine. They have a fast combo with Lim-Dul's Vault finding the pieces on turn 2, Cloud of Faeries to untap the shelldock for the T3 win, and countermagic for therapies and fast dread returns when I try to race. Emrakul ended games 1 & 3; he mulled to 4 and Therapy got him in game 2. In addition, his sideboard was particularly atrocious for me, as it had the ability to transform into Helm/Leyline combo as well as the primary; he landed T0 Leyline G3 and combo'd me turn 4. I just can't agree that this is a good matchup for us assuming that the other player knows what he' s doing with the deck, outside of multiple Therapy games getting them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hitman82
I don't play against many Show and Tell-esque decks, but I win more than I lose against them. You have to hit them with a Therapy or bury them with a draw spell on two, but that's not that hard to do. I've beaten Emrakul multiple times, too.
Anusien: Usually against Natural Order decks I recur Ichorids, let them die until I have a bunch of Zombies, then swarm them three to five turns later. If they get out Progenitus, you have to find your Ancestor's Chosen. DDD lines aren't as good.
I've always felt unnaturally pressured by the existence of Natural Order because it kills Bridges and if I don't have a Troll first, I can't race.
Then again, I've had them NOT cast Natural Order more than they do.
If my opponent casts NO that's of course bad, for obvious reasons. Thing is, I usually manage to prevent them from casting it. If the NO deck is non-blue I didn't have too many problems, because I'm just too fast for a 4 cmc spell. If the NO plan has counter backup it's harder but still... resolving a big Troll or therapying away the NO usually gets there.
As of the Shelldrazi matchup. I don't have much expierience against that specific archetype but I've battled several Show and Tell decks as well as DDFT (which is pretty similar to Shelldrazi iirc). It's of course a straight race, but I think I won more than I lost. They rarely win on turn 2, so if I had the nuts (Gold Land, Dredger, Discarder, Draw spell) I always won. They can't really win through 2-3 Therapies by turn 2.
And even if I didn't have the nuts, well timed and well aimed early therapies often slowed him down enough.
in my combo mu's ive been siding -2 tribe, -2 ichorid; +2 (discard), +1 therapy, +1 chosen/razer. however, im finding it extremely hard/rare for me to get to 3 dudes before they restabilize. ideas?
also, with spring/spiral tide a legitimate deck again, i believe the primus/terastodon/despair slot should definately go to Realm Razer, as its the best vs more of the decks where we would side the card in. aka lands, enchantress, etc
Guys, I went to a small tournament and got beaten by sneak show deck. He SB 3 tormod's against me. I went the DDD way and it was just not working. He was simply fast eanough to drop emrakul on turn 3/4.
Any good sideboard for this particular MU? I was thinking of 2 unmasks.
That's correct...do you play leds??Quote:
Originally Posted by sadakiyo
3 Unmask and well used cabalt therapies should slow down your opo until you go off.
I wouldn't take Unmasks, for the simple reason that I consider that card incredibly bad and don't understand why anyone would want to play it at all. I don't see what it would do for you if you can discard your foe's combo piece or hate, but lose your own most important 'combo' pieces in the process.Quote:
Originally Posted by sadakiyo
I wouldn't DDD against a combo deck tbh. That will mostly result in a very quick loss. You should try to be as fast as possible while therapying away their combo pieces. You could board Grudges to fight their Crypts, but if 3 Crypts is everything they have to disrupt your game plan, it could be better to rely on the probability that they never find one.
And if they hit your own Discard outlet or draw spell with a counter, that's bad luck. But I still think that playing as fast as possible is better than DDDing against combo decks.
And on a sidenote: If you're afraid of their countermagic, Unmask isn't a solution either. If they simply Force the Unmask you'll be slowed down much more than if they hit your discard outlet with it most of the time.
Pardon my ignorance, but what does DDD refer to?
Draw Discard Dredge ;).Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyle Hyde
so, against combo deck like emrakul, just sideboard the grudge (in case he find a crypt or relic) and nothing else? I would try that strategy. Unmasks isn't completely bad IMO, it can target you on the first turn and then go off with breakthrough. I wouldn't try that though, unless I am very sure that my opponent doesn't have counter.
Another question is : How do you play against counter top deck who drops relic turn 1?
I cant go DDD for sure once I see that, right? Do I just punch through their counters and try resolving a discard outlet??
Thanks for the kind comments guys
Just t16ed the SCG open with the following list:
Maindeck:
Creatures
4 Golgari Grave-Troll
2 Golgari Thug
4 Ichorid
4 Narcomoeba
4 Putrid Imp
4 Stinkweed Imp
4 Tireless Tribe
1 Woodfall Primus
Enchantments
4 Bridge from Below
Legendary Creatures
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
Sorceries
4 Breakthrough
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Careful Study
3 Dread Return
Lands
4 Cephalid Coliseum
4 City of Brass
4 Gemstone Mine
2 Tarnished Citadel
Sideboard:
1 Ancestor's Chosen
3 Ancient Grudge
4 Chain of Vapor
1 Darkblast
3 Firestorm
2 Nature's Claim
1 Ray of Revelation
So exhausted-going to bed.
@ Ozymondias: I'd love to hear a report of the tournament. I'm interested in why you chose the list you did, and how side boarding went. I assume woodfall primus is because it is a recurring sac target with a good sized body, yes?
Full report tonight!
Hi all!
I noticed that many players put both Chain of Vapor and Nature's Claim in their SB (not to mention Ancient Grudge). When you use one instead of another?
Well, I wanted my DR targets to help me beat random shit, so Primus and Iona are the best choices since they stop so much of what can beat you. I chose primus over angel of despair since it can nail 2 things with therapy. My sb is similarly geared to help versus tribal decks, though I was too paranoid about leylines.
I will type up a more detailed report, maybe, but I beat ANT, High Tide/Time Spiral, Merfolk, Show and Tell/Sneak Attack, Dredge, and green and taxes splash black. I lose to Elf Combo and Goblins, both due to my deck just dying on me. Versus Elves, I went turn 1 tribe, turn 2 discard Imp, dredge, cast study, dredge 5 blanks, whiff game away. Game 2 I mull to 4 and he opens on double crypt+natural order turn 3. Versus Goblins I mulled to oblivion twice. I never ended up DRing Woodfall primus, though Iona singlehandedly won the mirror for me, and Darkblast performed heroically versus merfolk, the mirror, and green and taxes. Leyline was basically nowhere, and I will probably cut down my board hate. I might move a Darkblast to the main for Primus, and try and squeeze a 15th land with some utility in.
Congratz for the finish.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias
And the changes you mentioned sound very reasonable. Seems like your deck performed very well, except that it mulled into oblivion a few times. There the 15 land as well as the 4th Study and/or the 11th Dredger could help.