Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
hi guys. you perhaps know me from the eldrazi deck. i have now switched to miracles. if you got some advice on this list. i whould love to hear it:
3 Monastery Mentor
1 Vendilion Clique
2 Counterspell
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Entreat the Angels
2 Council's Judgment
4 Terminus
2 Back to Basics
4 Counterbalance
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Sensei's Divining Top
1 windswepth heath
1 Tundra
2 Polluted Delta
2 Scalding Tarn
4 Flooded Strand
4 Plains
8 Island
side:
2 stoneforge mystic
1 batterskull
1 pithing needle
1 grafdiggers cage
2 containment priest
2 Rest in Peace
2 Disenchant
1 spell snare
2 Flusterstorm
1 Karakas
notice the grave hate. there are a lot of reanimate and sneaky show players in my local tournaments.
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Noloam_
hi guys. you perhaps know me from the eldrazi deck. i have now switched to miracles. if you got some advice on this list. i whould love to hear it:
3 Monastery Mentor
1 Vendilion Clique
2 Counterspell
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Entreat the Angels
2 Council's Judgment
4 Terminus
2 Back to Basics
4 Counterbalance
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Sensei's Divining Top
1 windswepth heath
1 Tundra
2 Polluted Delta
2 Scalding Tarn
4 Flooded Strand
4 Plains
8 Island
side:
2 stoneforge mystic
1 batterskull
1 pithing needle
1 grafdiggers cage
2 containment priest
2 Rest in Peace
2 Disenchant
1 spell snare
2 Flusterstorm
1 Karakas
notice the grave hate. there are a lot of reanimate and sneaky show players in my local tournaments.
Hey NoLoam, we've played each other on MTGO a lot =P what made you switch over to our side?
Secondly, what things do you want to improve regarding your list? It's kind of all over the place at the moment it would seem, and would also likely get demolished by anyone playing the mirror.
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Noloam_
hi guys. you perhaps know me from the eldrazi deck. i have now switched to miracles. if you got some advice on this list. i whould love to hear it:
3 Monastery Mentor
1 Entreat the Angels
2 Council's Judgment
4 Terminus
2 Back to Basics
notice the grave hate. there are a lot of reanimate and sneaky show players in my local tournaments.
This list doesn't make much sense. You have 3 spells that require WW, and Back to Basics interferes with White Mana production. To utilize Back to Basic better, either you commit to single W via Mentor, or you need to commit to Legend build, using Venser to bounce your own Back to Basic when needed. Just start with a main-stream build, MD Back to Basics requires specific list and a different planning during game-play, maybe something that requires Mystic Gate if you insist on double W spells.
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
I'll be headed to SCG Worcester (I have to defend my title) and I'll be playing this list:
2 Arid Mesa
4 Flooded Strand
4 Island
1 Plains
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Tundra
2 Volcanic Island
4 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Counterbalance
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
2 Predict
2 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Monastery Mentor
3 Snapcaster Mage
1 Engineered Explosives
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Terminus
Sideboard:
2 Flusterstorm
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Monastery Mentor
1 Mountain
4 Pyroblast
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Vendilion Clique
2 Wear // Tear
I ran that 75 at a local 1k last weekend, and went 5-0-1 beating BURg Delver, Bant blade, Junk Nic fit, Eldrazi and D. I then lost in the top 8 to MzFroste's list after mulling to hand of 5 with 2 white cards in game 1 and then getting too aggressive in game 3.
After lots of testing (mostly on cockatrice) the list has performing very well for me and even the eldrazi matchup does not feel bad. Grixis and shardless BUG feel favored. Entreat and moon have not been missed and EE has overperformed. If you are still playing council's judgment, stop doing that.
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
twndomn
This list doesn't make much sense. You have 3 spells that require WW, and Back to Basics interferes with White Mana production. To utilize Back to Basic better, either you commit to single W via Mentor, or you need to commit to Legend build, using Venser to bounce your own Back to Basic when needed. Just start with a main-stream build, MD Back to Basics requires specific list and a different planning during game-play, maybe something that requires Mystic Gate if you insist on double W spells.
He has 4 basic Plains. How is Back to Basics going to interfere with his white mana production?
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
lutz
He has 4 basic Plains. How is Back to Basics going to interfere with his white mana production?
Yes, you're correct in that I did not make myself clear. Say you want to play B2B mid game without any drawbacks, either you float it or you have it in your hand, hence you start the game with Island Island because you want to land a turn 2 CB. Now, you are a bit far from casting CJ, yes SDT, cantrips, and fetch would fix that, but depending on MU, this could become a problem.
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Minniehajj, could you talk about the third counterspell and the fourth snapcaster mage in the board. I'm assuming the fourth snapcaster mage is when you want additional removal against agressive decks, and the counterspell is for the control/combo matchups?
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Hello everyone I'm new to legacy, and my favorite deck is miracles. I like the legend version very much, so I want to ask about its advantages as well as disadvantages. Joe said that "you may take a risk to use it cause it is very slow". So is it the best version so far? Thanks for helping. (I'm a Chinese, so my English is not so native, just ignore my mistakes XD
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NiCHolAs
Hello everyone I'm new to legacy, and my favorite deck is miracles. I like the legend version very much, so I want to ask about its advantages as well as disadvantages. Joe said that "you may take a risk to use it cause it is very slow". So is it the best version so far? Thanks for helping. (I'm a Chinese, so my English is not so native, just ignore my mistakes XD
In general legends is better against combo, because you have more disruption in the form of Vendilion Clique and Venser, Shaper Savant. Cavern of Souls + Venser, Shaper Savant + Karakas also helps out in the mirror as well. However, because of the fewer cantrips and higher curve the deck is a little more inconsistent than the ponder/predict variants. This causes your fair matchups like delver to be worse.
TLDR; Legends better against combo/mirror, but less consistent.
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
How many versions does miracles have so far? What are they? And there difference is what (style?)
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
skyout
In general legends is better against combo, because you have more disruption in the form of
Vendilion Clique and
Venser, Shaper Savant.
Cavern of Souls +
Venser, Shaper Savant +
Karakas also helps out in the mirror as well. However, because of the fewer cantrips and higher curve the deck is a little more inconsistent than the
ponder/
predict variants. This causes your fair matchups like delver to be worse.
TLDR; Legends better against combo/mirror, but less consistent.
Thanks for replying. So which version is the most stable and the most consistent?
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NiCHolAs
Thanks for replying. So which version is the most stable and the most consistent?
The ponder/predict variant is definitely the most stable and most consistent because of all of the cantrips and lower curve. Something like this: http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=12671&d=273452&f=LE
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
skyout
Can someone explain me why Nicolas Tholance's version has a split in 3 CS / 3 CB, why not 4 CB as usually?
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mainactivenet
Can someone explain me why Nicolas Tholance's version has a split in 3 CS / 3 CB, why not 4 CB as usually?
Tholance is a testing buddy of ours and gathered inspiration from our theories. I'll refer to this post of my own from before the GP:
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...l=1#post948961
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Yep Min :). I was writing this before seeing your post :
I'm often asked why there is a 3cs/3cb split in the list. I'll answer it here once and for all :) :
It's first and foremost a metagame call : People will be prepared against chalice and cb, be it thanks to abrupt decay (Shardless), Out of Curve Threats (Show & Tell) or Cavern of Souls (Eldrazi). CS is a better card in all these MUs.
It also has to do with the relative draw go aspect that predict brings to the deck. Even if we have maindeck Mentor (that are there because Miracle needs to pressure the opponent nowadays - Eldrazi mainly), they are played quite late in most Match ups. Before that, it s desirable to keep open mana for predict, cspell, Snapcaster and counterspell better fits that plan.
With a 4th Snapcaster in the board, the 3rd Counterspell is also nice to have.
Towards the gp list. After some thoughts, I would switch the containment priest for a meddling mage in the sb and keep the mountain. This way, you can
1. switch gear postboard and go tap out like some 3-4 mentor miracle list do in some Mus
2. Better dodge Boseiju +Omniscience, and generally have a better clock vs combo.
In a general sense, MM would be like the 4th MD CB.
I don't have a reliable internet connection right now so I won t be able to answer further inquieries.
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Joe is the only 9-0 after Day 1. Damn, he is a god of Legends Miracles.
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CutthroatCasual
Joe is the only 9-0 after Day 1. Damn, he is a god of Legends Miracles.
So the most difficult part of this version is how to survive in the early games?(not the tournament)
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NiCHolAs
So the most difficult part of this version is how to survive in the early games?(not the tournament)
Essentially yes.
Won a 76 person IQ today with a variation of Wilson's list from GP Columbus and Mackan (Truckis) on MTGO won the Magic Online Legacy Challenge today as well, with an evolution of his Predictable Miracles list (I finally got him to play Monastery Mentor!)
Will do a formal write up tomorrow!
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Meanwhile, Das, or AnziD was featured on camera round 1 vs Duke's elves.
https://www.twitch.tv/scglive/v/77109593?t=0h16m0s
Re: [DTB] Miracle Control
Quote:
Originally Posted by
twndomn
I am pretty surprised that anziD didn't make day 2 :frown:
