Printable View
@viscosity: I don't think you need 3 decrees to succesfully cast a standstill facing down a threat. I run 2 decrees and I throw standstill out all the time. I definitely feel 2 decrees is the lowest number a landstill deck should go. I'm really sure where I was going with this but I'm at work ill finish the thought at half time.
Edit: I guess is no landstill player should be afraid to ever drop a standstill in the face of a fairly small threat.
I leave Standstills in against Vial Goblins, Affinity and Merfolk.Quote:
Originally Posted by FredMaster
I think it might have been konsultant that said in an earlier post: there is no need to neuter yourself in those match ups (that fred mentioned) . Just meaning you still need to draw cards to win those games and they won't always have t1 vial.
EE also makes AEther Vial look weak. If you board in BEB, the games are even more one-sided. The only card you should ever worry about is Price of Progress, but Goblin players havent picked up on that yet, which is good.Quote:
Originally Posted by rockout
I've noticed a large number of the posts with lists have started using 2 Elspeths, I just recently stopped using two and cut back to one. I seldom want to see her in an opening hand, and never want to see two. What are your experiences with two Elspeths?
Thank god people haven't started running PoP. That card is a one sided savage beating on crack.Quote:
Originally Posted by Citrus-God
If you draw two, you play one, they somehow deal with it, which almost never happens, you play the second one and win the game. It's pretty simple.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Shake
In the mirror its also very difficult to beat an opposing elspeth let alone 2.Quote:
Originally Posted by rockout
Indestructible soldier tokens is pretty raw.Quote:
Originally Posted by mossivo1986
How exactly were you planning on having 2 planeswalkers out with the same subtype?Quote:
Originally Posted by mossivo1986
He was talking about them getting rid of one and then having to get rid of another.
I obviously cheat :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by freakish777
I'd like to shift the discussion towards match ups that we are not too happy to see sitting across from us. Every deck has their nemesis and deck that just gives you a lot of trouble. I guess I'll start by saying: merfolk i heard islandwalk + swarming + counters are good, dragon stompy for the random I win button in the form of t1 magus (sometimes), goblins just for being goblins, aggro loam game 1, survival for it's insane engine, burn for being homosexual.
As I've progressed as a player, I don't really fear too many match ups (there's a reason wizards gave us a 15 card sb), but you playtest the good and the bad. You have the strats down on how to beat a particular match up and sometimes it just does not get there. It happens to the best. O well.
Share your heart to heart with each other. I want to see tears! Blood sweat and Tears!
I'd love some tips for handling goblins both game one and post-board. I play straight UW so e. plague isn't an option. I really don't know what to do against them. Regardless of whether or not I can keep vial off the table, they just run me over, wrath of god or not.
BEB + STP to keep Goblin Lackey from hitting you turn 2 is imperative. After you stop that little shitter from dropping a friend or two into play, you should be ok. I've never really had trouble dealing with the deck after you survive the first few turns. Their only relevant spells after that are Goblin Ringleader, Seige Gang, and thats about it. Vial needs to get an EE dropped on it before they can use it to power in their above mentioned spells.
I have always had trouble with that piece of shit Burn deck. This is more of a rant on it than asking for tips on beating it, because I already know SBing in like 2 COP Red is more than enough to completely dispatch the deck, but I really don't want to waste the SB slots because it is so stupidly specific for a single awful deck.
The list I saw of yours:Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiiMagic
Looking at your landbase 21 lands is not enough. I personally run 22 and thats the bare I would EVER run in landstill, plus im running ponder as well as brainstorm.Quote:
// Lands
4 [u] Tundra
3 [TE] Wasteland
2 [IA] Plains (1)
2 [IA] Island (2)
4 [ON] Flooded Strand
2 [ON] Polluted Delta
3 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (4)
1 [TSP] Academy Ruins
// Creatures
2 [ALA] Elspeth, Knight-Errant
2 [SC] Eternal Dragon
// Spells
3 [FD] Engineered Explosives
2 [8E] Wrath of God
4 [OV] Swords to Plowshares
2 [SC] Decree of Justice
4 [DIS] Spell Snare
4 [IA] Counterspell
4 [OD] Standstill
4 [CST] Brainstorm
2 [FNM] Fact or Fiction
4 [AL] Force of Will
2 [10E] Crucible of Worlds
// Sideboard
SB: 4 [PS] Meddling Mage
SB: 4 [ALA] Relic of Progenitus
SB: 3 [SHM] Runed Halo
SB: 2 [LRW] Ajani Goldmane
SB: 2 [LRW] Jace Beleren
If I were you I'd smooth your base down to something like this:
4x Flooded Strand
4x tundra
4x Plains
4x Island
3x wasteland
3x mishra
1x ruins
This gives you major consistency, and also makes it easy for you to trick it out if you want to.
-One key thing to remember is that you want 3 wrath unless your running vindicate or a 2-1 split with humility "wish version."
-You deffinately do not need 4x spell snare. You want to either go with a standard approach when it comes to the extra 2 slots "you should run 2-3 spell snare, deffinately not four." Or you can do some cute stuff with the extra slots given. I prefer to go more absolute in approach and maximize draw "ponder/ enlightened tutor" but basicly its whatever approach you really want.
-I would personally recommend cutting one of your crucibles as they are virtually dead top decks unless your already winning the game in most matches. Work more on maximizing your reach or creating unfavorable situations in some other way.
This is a very generalized approach to landstill, but it will help you understand the basic economics of the deck better.
23
4x Flooded Strand
4x tundra
4x Plains
4x Island
3x wasteland
3x mishra
1x ruins
4
// Creatures
2 [ALA] Elspeth, Knight-Errant
2 [SC] Eternal Dragon
33
// Spells
3 [FD] Engineered Explosives
3 [8E] Wrath of God
4 [OV] Swords to Plowshares
2 [SC] Decree of Justice
2 [DIS] Spell Snare
4 [IA] Counterspell
4 [OD] Standstill
4 [CST] Brainstorm
2 [FNM] Fact or Fiction
4 [AL] Force of Will
1[10E] Crucible of Worlds
// Sideboard
SB: 4 Meddling Mage
SB: 4 Relic of Progenitus
SB: 2 Ajani Goldmane
SB: 3 Blue Elemental Blast
SB: 2 Runed Halo
This Should help your Goblins matchup quite a bit, though the true deffinition of playing a deck and winning a deck comes in how the pilot plays, but by general ruling you should handle goblins rather nicely with this build.
Remember that the only cards your REALLY afraid of are ringleader, Lackey. Stop those and you basicly win. Other then that good luck :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiiMagic
Get to four mana counter anything that starts with pri and ends with ogress and you should be straight. Cast ajani= win game. With the freed up mana don't be foolish and if you do tap out make sure you have force in hand and a comfotable life. The key is staying out of 8 life range. Thats dangerous territory.
I got wrecked by Goyf Sligh twice today but did not have Ajani out of the side. In 4 games I "stabilized" at <10 life every time which was easily within burn range. Other than 2x Ajani and 4x BEB I'm not sure what else I can do than take my lumps against it.
On a more positive note, those were my only losses all day (same deck both times) and I came in 2nd at a local tournament.
Ok, so I haven't tried him out at all, but do you guys board Ajani in matchups other than burn? Like my entire issue is that I do not want to waste SB slots on a single matchup, rather than a strategy. I still run the board that was on Starcity, because that is the SB that has performed the best for me in the largest tournaments.
4 REB
4 BEB
4 Meddling Mage
1 Nevinyrral's Disk
2 Tormod's Crypt
REB literally comes in against any deck playing blue. BEB comes in against Goblins, random zoo, Dragon Stompy, and Burn. Meddling Mage comes in against so many strategies besides the obvious matches of combo. Disk rapes Threshold, Dragon Stompy, Enchantress, Stax, and anything I can't get EE with. Tormod's Crypts dominate the mirror, Dredge, and all the Loam decks.
I like to have my bases covered, so I have been floating the idea of using Ajani, but only if he has more uses than the burn match.
It depends on your build. Most builds I play with run 3 EE at least. On the play, I tend to play EE as an opener and try to keep Vial off the table. Just answer their opening threats like Lackey and/or Vial and then try and chain draw when convenient.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smog
Running maindeck Wastelands is good here. You should aggressively use them to destroy Rishadan Ports or throw them at random lands if you feel that they're tight on mana.
Running Humility and Cunning Wish helps too. Cunning Wish fetches ETutor => Humility to win the pre-board game.
Another way to end the game is to stall until you hit 8 mana. From there, you hardcast DoJs and try and take the game down aggressively. I've been in the practice of aggressive use of DoJ pre-board and post-board.
Cards to consider boarding in are BEB, Circle of Protection: Red, Enlighten Tutor if you run Cunning Wish, Ajani Goldmane and Crucible of Worlds.
You should post your build so I have some material to work with so that you can have a good game against Vial Goblins with a minimal amount of slots being filled to fight Vial Goblins. Also, list the other decks in you metagame and what decks you're concerned with against that metagame.
I know that the general concensus is that Path to Exhile is just bad Swords to Plowshares, but has anyone considered running both? Maybe not 4 of each, but possibly 4 StP, 2PtE? I find that, though wrath is amazing, alot of times some early game pressure (and an eventual game loss) could have been prevented by a singleton removal turn one or two.
I'm not endorsing the idea in anyway, just throwing it out there.
It's a good Cunning Wish target.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smog