[Deck] bUrg Tempo

just finished first in a 4-round weekly tournament in berlin.

Deck: German ******** by Kai thiele (july 2014)

Creatures:13
3 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Nimble Mongoose
2 Vendilion Clique

Spells:28
4 Brainstorm
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Ponder
3 Spell Pierce
1 Spell Snare
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Bitterblossom
4 Daze
1 Sylvan Library
4 Force of Will

Lands:19
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Taiga
2 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland

Sideboard:15
2 Flusterstorm
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Grim Lavamancer
3 Pyroblast
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Dismember
1 Fire Covenant
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
3 Submerge


nimble mongoose should be goyf i guess to appy more pressure in the early turns.
maybe also a 1-off scavenging ooze but i'm not sure yet.

Looks like a slight variant on the bUrg theme took 5th out of 148 at the Prague Eternal 2014 Legacy main event earlier this month.

// NAME: BUGr
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Tarmogoyf
1 Snapcaster Mage
1 Vendilion Clique
4 Ponder
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Spell Pierce
2 Gitaxian Probe
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
1 Volcanic Island
1 Taiga
4 Wasteland
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Polluted Delta

// Sideboard
1 Life from the Loam
1 Ancient Grudge
2 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Flusterstorm
1 Spell Pierce
1 Pyroblast
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Forked Bolt
2 Grim Lavamancer
1 Submerge
1 Golgari Charm

I think it looks pretty reasonable, though I'd personally replace the Gitaxian Probes with something else. I like the one-of Snapcaster, though, for the occasional surprise.

yep this is Thomas Mar's Deck, i played against him in the top 8 @ prague eternal.

the list looks pretty solid,there were also a lot of other burg decks with different creatures in that event.
(i played against 4 different burg decks,one with dark confidant another with pyromancer ,sometimes with stifle ,the popularity of this deck is huge.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sawatarix

just finished first in a 4-round weekly tournament in berlin.

Deck: German ******** by Kai thiele (july 2014)

Creatures:13
3 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Nimble Mongoose
2 Vendilion Clique

Spells:28
4 Brainstorm
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Ponder
3 Spell Pierce
1 Spell Snare
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Bitterblossom
4 Daze
1 Sylvan Library
4 Force of Will

Lands:19
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Taiga
2 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland

Sideboard:15
2 Flusterstorm
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Grim Lavamancer
3 Pyroblast
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Dismember
1 Fire Covenant
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
3 Submerge


nimble mongoose should be goyf i guess to appy more pressure in the early turns.
maybe also a 1-off scavenging ooze but i'm not sure yet.

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Would you rather play 2x TNN instead of Cliques in a combo-light meta?
If so, do you think it would be good to shave some spell pierces for more snares?

Thanks!

exactly !

imho the creature suite is the hardest choice you have, atm i'm playin:

3 DRS
4 Mungo
4 Delver
2 TNN

TNN sucks against Combo obv. and it hurts to draw them in game 1, but combo is good anyways, play more Snares. They are simply the better Counterspell against ANT and the midrange MUs and Miracles.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by blablub

imho the creature suite is the hardest choice you have, atm i'm playin:

3 DRS
4 Mungo
4 Delver
2 TNN

TNN sucks against Combo obv. and it hurts to draw them in game 1, but combo is good anyways, play more Snares. They are simply the better Counterspell against ANT and the midrange MUs and Miracles.

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I agree. However, I used to play a build very similar to the one sawatarix posted above and I liked the V.Cliques a lot. They usually came down at the end of the opponents turn to replace the freshly removed flying Insect :-)
Problem was; I used to play Snares in that deck and lacked a way to protect my threats. So I would definitely suggest Pierces in this list.

Also, I don't think cutting Stifles is wise, unless you are sure everyone in the room thinks you are running them. It is hard to survive vs a Wasteland deck w/o them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crush

I agree. However, I used to play a build very similar to the one sawatarix posted above and I liked the V.Cliques a lot. They usually came down at the end of the opponents turn to replace the freshly removed flying Insect :-)
Problem was; I used to play Snares in that deck and lacked a way to protect my threats. So I would definitely suggest Pierces in this list.

Also, I don't think cutting Stifles is wise, unless you are sure everyone in the room thinks you are running them. It is hard to survive vs a Wasteland deck w/o them.

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jeah, i will never cut Stifles.
i Don't want to protect my threads, just Kill/counter everything relevant, then kill em with mungos, its enoughm especially if you play with TNN :P

playing nimble mongoose is fine.
but most of the time this deck has trouble to fight opposing tarmogoyfs.
that could be a reason to increase our own tarmogoyf count,2 decays and 2 tnn are not enough to deal with the lhurgoyf...jund,shardless bug and even canadian ******** are still one the worst matchups in my experience.

a solid way to beat those decks can be the following:

to turn the deck a little bit midrang-ish.

+ 19th land
+ 4 tarmogoyf
+ 3 Spell Pierce (to protect our threads)

- 4 nimble mongoose (we can't play both goose and goyf)
-4 stifle or spell snare

Not to mention that we have the option to play grim lavamancer (which is an underplayed card in legacy for years) if we switch to 4 goyfs instead of mongeese.
it's like playing team america without all these clunky spells like hymn to tourach and 4 abrupt decays and especially liliana (which isn't a tempo card at all) but with reach (burn) and better sideboard cards.

I always wanted to try out a black splash in a NLT RUG list :)

I believe the 4th color would make a bigger difference in the long run (ie. a midrange build), since you would have more time to "sculpt the perfect (reactive) hand" (to use a combo phrase).

On the other hand, I doubt such a deck would be powerful enough to compete with the existing midrange decks.

after sideboarding the deck looks a little bit like next level ******** but still remains a tempo deck.


Yesterday I went to a local legacy tournament in berlin with 4 rounds and finished 1st.
went 4:0:0 and 8:1:0 in games.
here the list:

4 Delver of Secrets
3 Deeathrite Shaman
3 Tarmogoyf
1 Bitterblossom (could be the 4th Tarmogoyf but is insane against miracle control)
2 Vendillion CLique

4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Abrupt Decay
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Spell Pierce
2 Spell Snare

4 Wasteland
2 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
2 Volcanic Island
1 Taiga
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn

Sb:
2 Jace the Mind Sculptor
1 Ancient Grudge
2 Golgari Charm
2 Grim Lavamancer
1 Tarfire
3 Pyroblast
2 Flusterstorm
2 Submerge



Round 1: Canadian ******** 2:0
Both games went into the long grindy ones where tarmogoyf+shaman were superiour to nimble mongoose+ friends.

Round 2: UWr Miracle 2:1
G1 was kinda unfortunate: i had polluted delta in my hand but no second land nor cantrip for 7 turns in total, i got countertoplocked in the midgame after a terminus and i got crushed by elspeth and jace, happens.
G2 i started with Deathrite Shaman followed by Vendillion Clique and Jace on turn 3. at this point i was so far ahead and won via tarmogoyf-beats while sculpting a perfect hand with double force of will backup.
G3 = G2, Jace is a good card to fight Control Decks in general because you need a Cardadvantage machine if your board gets sweeped away.

Round 3: ant 2:0
well this deck is supposed to kill combo decks and it did the job very well.
keycards were vendillion clique and spell snares in particular, there is no way ant can play around spell snare.
just keep always mana open to counter their cantrips (that is pretty important and most of the times the key to victory, believe me or not.i know the matchup very well from both sides)

round 4: burn 2:0
burn is also very similar to a combo deck - keep counterspells alive and try to kill grim lavamancer and eidolon as soon as possible.
tarmogoy and deathrite shaman are pretty good in this matchup, delver dies pretty soon and bitterblossom...well this card realy sucks in this matchup.
don't be agressive with shamans, if you have the option to drain/ gain life: always gain life to prevent instant kills via 2 price of progress or multiple fireblasts and so on.don't make any unnessesary land drops and keep dazes in your hand to minimize pops.
job done.

the list was fine, bitterblossom could be a sideboard card to make room for the 4th goyf in the main, otherwise the list looks great i think.
if you have any questions or
Furthermore i can also imagine to add Stifle in the deck to get more free wins via manadenial.
- 2 spell snare
- 1 abrupt decay
- 1 vendillion clique
+ 4 Stifle

would be my guess.

what do you think?

high 5

Great report and performance. But i really dont like that you cut Stifle. It is one of the reasons why we can play 4 colours to begin with.
That is why i dont think the above deck should be playing red at all. You have 7 cmc2 and 2 cmc3 cards in the deck which pretty much ensures that you cant use Stifle effectivly. So the cut of Stifle for THIS list seems right. But if we just move to a more tappout tempo deck then Team America should do that better and will have less mana problems.

I can agree on 4 Goyfs main in a heavy green meta. But i see no reason to play Bitterblossom and 3! Abrupt Decay preboard. At least some of those cards should be boarded in rather then getting cutted after G1(assuming you wanna play Stifle). I think i need to remember you that Dismember is a pretty good card in this deck.

Also i hate the Jaces in the board. They dont solve any problems we have against control(namely Miracles and Nic Fit). If a situation occurs in which you can resolve a 4 mana socery and still have a favourable position after you untap, then about every threat that doesnt die to creature removel(Nimble Mongoose, Sylvan Library, Bitterblossom, TNN, ...) should have done the same thing without being unable to cast most of the time. I mean Jace itself doesnt even produce pressure and cant stabilize you in a bad board position.

I think the idea of going big with threats is good right now. But playing those cards main seems wrong to me.

To be honest, Jace was just a fun-slot in the sideboard and we all know how hard it is to cast such expensive threads in a deck with just 19 lands (or 15 if you ignore wasteland).
But it's always fun if you get to resolve Jace on your side on the table and start to control decks out like miracle.
Bitterblossom or Sylvan Library do the same job for 2cmc by the way but Jace is...you know,Jace :D

The biggest question in the deck are the creatures.
i'm still not sure about the amount of copies of Tarmogoyf, Nimble Mongoose, Scavenging Ooze, Dark Confidant,Vendillion Clique and maybe True-Name Nemesis.
Maybe we should simply play 4 deathrite Shaman 4 Delver of Secrets and 4 Tarmogoyf - end of Story.
For now adding 1-2 Vendillion Cliques might be great to combat Stoneforge Mystic Decks as well as show and tell decks.
Another thing i like a lot is to play clique in respond to a miracle-trigger - put the miracle card on the bottom and 'hard counter'
Many People have suggested True-Name-Nemesis but honestly i'm not a big fan of the Shroud Merfolk in a deck which doesn't have access to equipments like UWR Delver.
Team America also stopped playing Nemesis for the same reason, we can't get full advantage out of it.

The 3rd Decay was there to fight our bad matchups - the fair ones like maverick, death and taxes and shardless bug.

The time i can play magic (which is not a lot at the moment) I test this list right now:

3 Tarmogoyf
3 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Grim Lavamancer
1 Sylvan Library

4 Stifle
4 Daze
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Dismember
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Spell Snare
2 Spell Pierce

2 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland
4 Misty Rainforest
1 Taiga
3 Scalding Tarn

SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
SB: 1 Abrupt Decay
SB: 2 Golgari Charm
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Pyroblast
SB: 1 Envelop
SB: 2 Spell Snare
SB: 1 Grim Lavamancer
SB: 1 Sylvan Library
SB: 1 Flusterstorm
SB: 1 Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
SB: 1 Dismember

It hurts me a lot to play no gooses but for the next time people will play that Judgement crap(not saying it is good but people play it) and i want to try some new stuff as well. You could give it a try.

Hey all,

I've recently been exploring various Delver archetypes, and I put this together this weekend for a small local event, and went 3-1, 2-0ing Burn, Sneak, and TA, and losing to Elfball (no combo, just Elf Lords...it was embarrassing).

I haven't had so much fun playing a deck in a long time. I beat BUG on a mull to 4 off of a 3-for-1 with Fire Covenant. I cast 3 Stifles on 3 fetches all in the same turn. I decayed my own dude for a Deathrite activation to keep myself alive against Burn. I actually cast a Compost in Legacy. Thanks for putting so much effort into tuning the deck this last year, and I hope everyone keeps doing well with it! I definitely plan on sticking with the deck for quite awhile.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by crush

I always wanted to try out a black splash in a NLT RUG list :)

I believe the 4th color would make a bigger difference in the long run (ie. a midrange build), since you would have more time to "sculpt the perfect (reactive) hand" (to use a combo phrase).

On the other hand, I doubt such a deck would be powerful enough to compete with the existing midrange decks.

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Hey Crush ! You're completely right. I think that Burg is very well suited to play a NLT Strategy. The power of Stifle and DRS in one deck is a lot more efficient when you also play Jace. Black doesn't exactly fit the normal tempo strategy, but it allows the NLT player to have answers to TNN (diabolic edict), Goyfs (decay) and this miraculous sb card : Bitterblossom. I've been playing a NLT Burg Deck for quite some time now (2 months). The worst matchup is Elves (and Omnishow for my list) - no more delvers -, the best is Miracle (never lost once). It's maybe not the best place to discuss this : there is a NLT Thread.

It would the great if you can share your lists, especially your creature config ;)

Sure, I would be glad to get some feedbacks :).

First, here is my list (4c-NLT):

4 Wasteland
2 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Polluted Delta
2 Volcanic Island
1 Taiga


4 Stifle
4 Brainstorm
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Spell Snare
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Force of Will
1 Counterspell
3 Vendilion Clique
1 Snapcaster Mage
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Ponder
1 Sylvan Library
1 Force Spike

SB: 1 Spell Pierce
SB: 1 Flusterstorm
SB: 2 Bitterblossom
SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
SB: 1 Forked Bolt
SB: 1 Pyroblast
SB: 2 Diabolic Edict
SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
SB: 1 Red Elemental Blast
SB: 1 Izzet Staticaster

With 2 free Sb slots depending on the meta. Fire Covenant/Electrickery/Spell Pierce/Envelop/Engineered plague...



Some remarks :

.The creature configuration is quite usual regarding the NLT strategy. I just added Drs that fits perfectly. Maybe a few words : Mongoose doesn't have enough late game to be played here, and doesn't close games fast enough. Vendilion Clique is just better than TNN in NLT. Playing both MD is too heavy for this 20 land deck and I couldn't find room in the sb (tnn doesn't exactly help vs bad match ups).
.Because of 3cmc drops, i prefer force spike to a third spell snare, but pierce can be used instead. Daze is very bad : you need your land drops. Force spike is also there to afraid the opponent (he will also be afraid of Daze btw).
.I used to play Life MD, then sb, and then I completely dropped it, because I need my slots for match ups like elves/painter/show and tell.
.I consider Sylvan library as a fifth Tarmogoyf and as a third Jace.
.It's an old debate : should NLT play 21 Lands and 2 Ponder or 20 Lands and 3 Ponder ? With Drs now in the pack, I chose the second option.

I used to play the usual Burg Tempo deck, then I switched to the delverless list by Carsten Linden, and I finally got this list, that fits my playstyle. Getting Jace to filter lands out of my opponent's draws is just exhilarating.

So, I've been playing 4-Color Delver for a while now:
LANDS [18]:
3 Volcanic Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
4 Wasteland
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand

CREATURES [14]:
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Young Pyromancer
2 True-Name Nemesis

INSTANTS [21]:
1 Fire // Ice
4 Brainstorm
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Daze
4 Stifle
4 Force of Will

SORCERIES [7]:
4 Ponder
3 Gitaxian Probe

SIDEBOARD [15]:
2 Grim Lavamancer
2 Pyroblast
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Golgari Charm
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Spell Pierce
1 Life from the Loam
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Sylvan Library
2 Submerge

----------------------------------

While I really love this deck, I do feel it's weak to Golgari Charm and the likes. All the creatures besides flipped Delvers and Deathrites die to it and it shuts down your ability to run them succesfully as well.
This deck also has some issues with early Goyfs and the Young Pyromancers need a while to set up. If you're shit out luck and have no cantrips to chain/whatever, it just makes it a weak 2/1. However, when it works, it works out amazingly and I do like YP better in the combo match-ups because with a DRS you can slam it down on turn 2, leave mana open for Stifle or a cantrip and during the game, the pressure just keeps building while you dig for permission.

Anyways, I've been interested in BURG Delver for a while now, because it looks like a mix between RUG and BUG Delver; slightly more clunky than RUG, but less so than BUG. The mainboard Abrupt Decay and DRS are something that seem interesting to me. I've already made up my mind that I'd prefer to play a DRS-Delver list, so this does fit perfectly to my tastes. It's why I play 4-Color D. right now.

Anyways, this is the list I've been thinking about for BURG Delver:
LANDS [18]:
2 Volcanic Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
1 Taiga
4 Wasteland
4 Misty Rainforest
3 Scalding Tarn

CREATURES [13]:
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Deathrite Shaman
3 Nimble Mongoose
2 Tarmogoyf
1 True-Name Nemesis

INSTANTS [25]:
4 Brainstorm
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Daze
4 Stifle
4 Force of Will
2 Spell Snare
1 Spell Pierce

SORCERIES [4]:
4 Ponder

SIDEBOARD [15]:
1 Grim Lavamancer
2 Pyroblast
1 Golgari Charm
1 Fire Covenant (not sure about this slot)
1 Bitterblossom / 1 Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver (not sure about this slot, at all)
1 Spell Pierce
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Life from the Loam
1 Sylvan Library
1 Ancient Grudge
2 Submerge
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Grafdigger's Cage

I'd need to do some testing to see what I would prefer. Our meta is very combo-light at the moment. It's like it has died out. Most of it is either Miracles, mid-range decks like BUG or tempo decks like various Delver lists and Merfolk/etc. I'm not sure if that one maindeck TNN should be another DRS or another Goyf, perhaps. It seems random, but the TNN has done work for me in 4-Color Delver, even just as a 2-of.

I'm also not sure about Fire Covenant - is this still used in these lists? Or have we moved towards Golgari Charm and/-or Toxic Deluge?