[Deck] GW/x Maverick

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I’m also interested in the 2 sideboard Blood Moon (!) of the Norwegian Team's Legacy deck. It seems powerful but really hard to manage with just 2 basics, I can see it as an improved Choke effect, devastating against 3+ colors deck, even if non-blue. Any feedback? When would you side them in?

Research & innovation are always welcome! Good luck :smile:

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Thanks, blood moon is really devastating, thats why decks like imperial painter are such a pain to play against, in my traditional mav list in where i ran 4 basics my win % against moon effect is just around 33%.., if you are decided to play blood moon i think you have to re-tweak your deck to maximize its potential.., and im guessing birds of paradise would be the mana dork of choice over noble , in the times i was running fire mav my mana dork config was 2 birds 2 noble then 3 birds 1 noble, in those config i was running 1 taiga 1 plateau and 4 burnwillows and 4 fires.

Maybe adding aether vial in the mix for the blood moon plan could work as you can still cast creatures and burn them with fires or maybe more red removals.

Nice to know that rebs are doing its job...

As for my new deck here is it comments and suggestions are welcome.

Lands [23]
4 wasteland
2 rishadan port
1 karakas
1 gaea's cradle
1 maze of ith
4 savannah
4 windswept heath
2 flooded strand
2 plains
1 forest
1 horizon canopy

Creatures [26]
3 mother of runes
3 noble hiearch
1 birds of paradise
3 qasali pridemage
3 stoneforge mystic
4 serra avenger
4 kotr
3 flickerwisp
2 gaddock teeg / terravore / mirran crusader

Spells [11]
4 aether vial
4 stp
1 sofi
1 solas
1 jitte

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Originally Posted by 264505

Punishing Fire Maverick is the Norwegian Team's Legacy deck in the finals of Worlds. Here's the list:

Sideboard
1 Batterskull
2 Blood Moon
3 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Mindbreak Trap
2 Purify the Grave
1 Pyroblast
2 Qasali Pridemage

It will end up going head to head with a Sneak and Show deck that the Japanese team is playing.

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264505, Thanks for sharing the Norwegian Team's List.

I'm not sure of the format of worlds, but if you know you are going head to head with Sneak and Show, why not a little more hate? Why did the Norwegian Team decide against an Enlightened Tutor sideboard? I play online and have faced Sneak and Show and I recommend Ensnaring Bridge. Your guys can get under it with exhalted and it stops their guys in their tracks. Other than a resolved Teeg, you have no answer to Sneak Attack. Pithing Needle also works against Sneak Attack.

Quick question- What are you bringing the Batterskull, Purify the Grave and Blood Moon in against?

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Originally Posted by Water_Wizard

264505, Thanks for sharing the Norwegian Team's List.

I'm not sure of the format of worlds, but if you know you are going head to head with Sneak and Show, why not a little more hate? Why did the Norwegian Team decide against an Enlightened Tutor sideboard? I play online and have faced Sneak and Show and I recommend Ensnaring Bridge. Your guys can get under it with exhalted and it stops their guys in their tracks. Other than a resolved Teeg, you have no answer to Sneak Attack. Pithing Needle also works against Sneak Attack.

Quick question- What are you bringing the Batterskull, Purify the Grave and Blood Moon in against?

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Well, they don't get to change their decklists, so that was what they played throughout the Team swiss rounds as well.

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Originally Posted by Water_Wizard

Quick question- What are you bringing the Batterskull, Purify the Grave and Blood Moon in against?

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I'm not sure with Batterskull but Purify the Grave is mostly vs reanimator. It also gets boarded in against dredge, but is not as strong there.

Blood Moon is good against 3 colored decks. BUG, RUG and other decks run with a very low number of basic lands. I would not board them in versus decks that run Noble Hierarch though.

Hey guys, I haven't played any mtg in the last 2 months and I'm preparing for a tourney that's in a few weeks. I have a few questions about the current state of Maverick:

Which singletons are necessary now? Terravore? Teeg still? Thrun still? Is 2 Qasali the right number now? How about 2 Ooze?

Also, anything major i'm missing from this board:
2 K.Gripp
2 E.Tutor
2 Path to Exile
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Wheel of Sun and Moon
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Choke
1 Stony Silence
1 Dueling Grounds
1 Bojuka Bog

Sorry for all the questions and thanks for any help.

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Originally Posted by TossUsToLions

Hey guys, I haven't played any mtg in the last 2 months and I'm preparing for a tourney that's in a few weeks. I have a few questions about the current state of Maverick:

Which singletons are necessary now? Terravore? Teeg still? Thrun still? Is 2 Qasali the right number now? How about 2 Ooze?

Also, anything major i'm missing from this board:
2 K.Gripp
2 E.Tutor
2 Path to Exile
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Wheel of Sun and Moon
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Choke
1 Stony Silence
1 Dueling Grounds
1 Bojuka Bog

Sorry for all the questions and thanks for any help.

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Personally, I moved Bog to the main because I was facing so many KotR's. If you anticipate a lot of mirror matches, I would move Bog to the main, because it allows your KotRs to wreck their KotRs. Bog in main also help improves the 1st game against Reanimator/Dredge and can surprise Snapcaster/Goyf/Nimble Mongoose. I run 1 Teeg Main and Thrun in the board.

Here's a link to a list ruckus ran 2 weeks ago: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...ural-Wasteland It's a very well-tweaked list and I would run something similar with perhaps a few small changes for your meta.

Really depends on what you want to do. Some people also like Scryb Ranger as a 1-of also.

Your sideboard looks fine. If you want a little more combo hate, you can also throw in a Thorn of Amethyst as well.

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Originally Posted by Esper3k

Well, they don't get to change their decklists, so that was what they played throughout the Team swiss rounds as well.

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Esper - thanks - like I said, I wasn't sure of the format, but this makes sense. Thanks for the clarification! Personally, I've had Batterskull in the main to the board to now completely out. I was facing a lot of Burn and losing, so I put Batterskull in the main, but found it was oftentimes dead or just sitting in my hand when I drew it without SFM or SFM was killed, and then I put it in the board, but found my deck was too equipment heavy (I only run 2 SFM and had 2 equipment main and 2 board), so now I removed it all together and am relying on Ooze, Jitte and STPing my own creatures to survive against burn. Ooze is my favorite, as he removes Hellspark and prevents Grim from activating, if they play Grim.

Seems like the proper equipment and when to side the equipment package out is something that is being tweaked. SoFaF, SoFaI, SoLaS, Jitte, Batterskull are all getting play and are boarded out against different decks. It seems many players remove the equipment package against UW Stoneblade, but I think STPs should come out and equipment should stay in, if anything so you can legend-rule their jitte. If they get active Jitte, our deck is just about over. I run punishing mav, so I still have some removal after the STPs come out.

Currently, I'm running 2 SFM, 1 Jitte, 1 SoFaF. I'm intrigued by ruckus' running of SoLaS and thinking about working 1 into my board. It takes care of the STP/PTE hate and recurring Pridemage/Dryad Arbor is good. It also has life gain to help out against the Burn decks I mentioned above. However, since I already have Prop Black from SoFaF, it seems redundant. I thought about putting SoFaI in the main, like Ruckus did, but there are strong synergies between SoFaF and Punishing Grove. With the untap all land trigger on the stack, you can use Punishing Fire a few times. This usually occurs in games in which you are already ahead, so maybe it is overkill. I like SoFaI for the card advantage, burn, protection from Jace and protection from Grim Lavamancer and Lightning Bolt, so maybe I'll play this, but I wonder if I need the extra removal since I already have 4 STP, 3 PF, 1 Jitte and 2 creatures with Prop Blue (Rangers).

What's everyone's thoughts on when to use SoFaI and when to use SoFaF? SoFaF in punishing mav and SoFaI in 'traditional' (u/g) mav? SoFaF if you expect a lot of ANT/TES (or is it too slow?) and BUG? SoFaI if you expect URG Tempo? What does everyone think about the Prop Black swords against Batterskull? SoLaS against U/W Snapcaster to combat STP/PTE and Batterskull?

I currently also have cut Batterskull from my 75 completely. I could see running it in maybe the PFires builds though since you have less creatures.

My equipment package is currently 1 Jitte, 1 SoFI, 1 SoFF, 3 SFM all main.

I generally get SoFI if I either need cards or need removal (and have already gotten my Jitte out).

SoLS is good defensively, but that white ability is so meh...

I'm also playing Rukcus' Gaea's Cradle, so that makes SoFF even more nuts. The other day, I got some sick use out of SoFF + Maze of Ith to give 2 of my guys vigilance!

Oh yeah, I forgot to add - in our deck SoFI also adds quite a bit of defensive ability since we have a lot of X/1 guys and a regular sword won't protect them from Lightning Bolts. I've found this particularly useful against Canadian Thresh.

In my build, I could have run with SoLS instead of Batterskull and probably still end up fine. Terravore and Batterskull play out in the same role - breaking through the stalemates. The Sword of X/Y issue is something that needs to gel with the pilot however. I prefer SoFI and SoLS because they provide the relevant protections in a neat package with useful abilities.

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Originally Posted by Water_Wizard

SoLaS against U/W Snapcaster to combat STP/PTE and Batterskull?

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Nail on the head.

Since I don't play PFires, I have no need for SoFF; moreover pro:green isn't necessary in Maverick. This leaves only Pro:Black as the relevant protection. Same with SoBM, pro:green is wasted and the triggered abilities are actually useless. That leaves only 3 remaining swords, and the SoWP is just all around terrible.

For equipment packages, we could play:

1. Umezawa's Jitte
2. Sword of Fire and Ice
3. Sword of X/Y or Batterskull [optional if playing the 3rd equipment]

The Vegas list was anticipating a lot of CanThresh, Merfolk, and Burn (Arizona players...). SoLS in the sideboard for pro:white/black mainly against Junk/Deadguy lists, and recursion 2ndly. I could see playing SoFF in a metagame that has a lot of Junk and BUG lists as well - but from any indication the BUG lists are moving more towards a creature base that is Goyf + :u: creatures, rather than Tombstalker.

The only change I would make right now to my Vegas list is to cut 1 Sylvan Library and 1 Eternal Witness for a 2nd Scryb Ranger/Quirion Ranger and possibly 1 Tarmogoyf. I think that the Scryb Ranger is vastly more important than Quirion Ranger specifically for Flying and Pro:Blue.

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Originally Posted by TossUsToLions

Which singletons are necessary now? Terravore? Teeg still? Thrun still? Is 2 Qasali the right number now? How about 2 Ooze?

Also, anything major i'm missing from this board:
-snip-

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Terravore to help break apart the mirror/stalemate.
Teeg is awesome against UW control and Combo.
Thrun is awesome against anything mid-range, but terrible against combo/reanimator.
The two Oozes are definitely recommended against the majority of the field, and especially if you anticipate any form of G/Y deck.

I saw a list up-thread that put in 2 Tarmogoyfs in anticipation of Tempo and aggro. I think this is the right call for the right metagame.

The SB looks complete, and I would consider finding room for Thorn of Amethyst. The Dueling Grounds looks a little suspect, which matchups are you concerned about that this card would be relevant? I can't imagine you would also board into the Enlightened Tutors to find it against the creature feature.

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Originally Posted by rukcus

Teeg is awesome against UW control and Combo.

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How actively do you seek Teeg against UW control? Against combo, I'm dropping Teeg or Canonist as quickly as possible, but against UW control, a lot of times I have been boarding Teeg out.
Here is my reasoning: Pre-board, the average UW deck has 7-8 spells Teeg will stop (4 FOW, 3/4 Jace and maybe Elspeth or Repeal (and I guess a hardcast Batterskull)). Post-board, they are likely to bring in 1-2 WOG, perhaps an Elspeth and maybe an extra Batterskull (plus 4 PTE) and they are taking out 4 FOW, maybe a Counterspell or two, and a Clique. So, post-board, they are going to have 4 Jace, 2 WOG, 1 Elspeth and 2 Batterskull. Teeg shuts down 4 of our cards (GSZ). I like Teeg shutting down WOG. I also like that he stops Jace, but I run 2 REB, so I have some answers to Jace.
ruckus, my question to you is: how actively do you bring out Teeg against U/W combo? What is your strategy as far as protecting him? I guess with SoLaS in your sb, it is easier to protect Teeg from STP/PTE.
Presently, I've been playing my creatures out conservatively against U/W Snapcaster. As Punishing Mav, I have the backup plan of pinging for 1 point a turn. I'm finding if I just drop 1 or 2 creatures at a time, I can can attack for 2-3 a turn and whittle them down.
I'm just now realizing, I don't have much of a plan against U/W, other than not playing out too much and getting a MoR to stick.
Teeg is good, but he's vulnerable to Snapcaster on the attack (if you don't have any exhalted triggers). What I'm trying to ask is: "What is your plan against U/W?" and "Do you put all your eggs in one basket with Teeg?" I realize it depends on board state, your hand, etc., but in general, what would you like to do?
I'm about 500 vs. U/W, probably slightly over. I feel like they win when they draw well or I draw too much land (I guess this could be said about any match-up), but that the Mav v. U/W match should be about 60/40 or 55/45 in Mav's favor - we have more threats than they have answers, we have some nice tricks with LftL and Sylvan Library, and we should be able to out tempo them (mid-range vs. control)

Hi;

Reading the primer, and most of the thread (including the last few pages), I have to ask- are dark confidant variations still viable?

Thanks!

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Originally Posted by Syaoran

Hi;

Reading the primer, and most of the thread (including the last few pages), I have to ask- are dark confidant variations still viable?

Thanks!

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Confidant is weak against Tempo Thr€shold which is seeing a lot play everywhere.

My decklist, as long promised... You will see, this is very similar to Morte's list, with some small tweaks for my meta. I play purely MTG Online. I'll discuss my reason for my picks, which cards are near misses and which cards I'm considering cutting. First, the deck:


4 Windswept Heath
2 Wooded Foothills
1 Arid Mesa
2 Savannah
1 Taiga
1 Plateau
1 Horizon Canopy
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
2 Wasteland
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Karakas
1 Forest
1 Plains
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Mother of Runes
2 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Aven Mindcensor
4 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Sylvan Library
4 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Noble Hierarch
2 Scryb Ranger
2 Scavenging Ooze
1 Birds of Paradise
3 Punishing Fire
1 Life from the Loam
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice

Sideboard:
2 Enlightened Tutor
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Stony Silence
1 Serenity
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Wheel of Sun and Moon
1 Choke
1 Path to Exile
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Red Elemental Blast
1 Pyroblast


Comments on the decklist:
Why do I play 2 Qasali Pridemage main? I found I was putting him in every game, so I just decided to leave him in. Even on the draw, he's a 3/3 beater. I also ran into situations where I would play out an early Pridgemage and it would die (I have no recursion Eternal Witness or Sword of Light and Shadow main), so the 2nd Pridgemage is nice as a GSZ target.
Why no Maze of Ith in my 75? This is one of the cards that is 'on the cusp'. I like that it can give my guys vigilance, stop an opposing Batterskull, or deny a Etched Champion equipped with Cranial Plating when they have Metalcraft. However, it's rarely a card I like to draw (good as a KotR tutor effect, but tough in your opening 7 or off the top), it is susceptible to Wasteland (which seems to be on the rise), and it seems a highly reactive card- I view Maze of Ith as a card that will prevent you from losing the game, but it won't win you a game.

Some deck decisions: Currently, I'm only running 5 red land sources and 1 BoP. Lots of the decks are running an extra Taiga or switching Noble Hierarch(s) for Birds of Paradise. I have played very few games with this set-up (only 5). Under the previous set-up (with the extra Taiga, I only ran into problems against URG Tempo). Their combinations of Wasteland and Stifle keep red lands off the board and prevent us from fetching more. Life from the Loam helps bring these red sources and Stifled Fetchlands back.

(Selected) comments on the sideboard:
Ethersworn Canonist I'm only running 1 because I haven't had that much of a problem with Storm and I can tutor for her.

Serenity I keep the one in the board for Enchantress, Stax and Affinity. These are decks I occasionally play against Online and this 1-of makes otherwise though match-ups easy. My only other removal to enchantments and artifacts are 2 Qasali Pridemage, so the Serenity helps a lot, in the limited cases I've used it.

Ensnaring Bridge is for Sneak and Show and Reanimator. Reanimator has answers in the forms of Angel of Despair and/or Terastodon, but Ensnaring Bridge will usually buy you some time or they might even board out their threats. Likewise, Sneak and Show is unlikely to bring in artifact hate against Maverick. I also considered Pithing Needle against Sneak and Show for Sneak Attack. I was in a situation, where an opponent dropped a Sneak Attack, but was tapped out. I have an Enlightened Tutor in hand and 3 land on board (2 tapped with a W open) and no land in hand. He has 2 Mountains, so I couldn't Waste his Red sources. Also, Karakas and Phyrexian Metamorph won't work, because if I bounce with Karakas, he'll just replay and I can't play Metamorph at instant speed. So, after this game, I decide to run Ensnaring Bridge in the board. It is yet to be tested, but I think it's our best option.

Tormod's Crypt Wheel of Sun and Moon. I rarely bring these in because I rarely play dredge or other graveyard based decks. Since I stepped up to 2 Scavenging Ooze in the main, I may drop to 1 piece of gy hate in the board. However, without Gaea's Cradle, if they have a good dredge, I could face the possibility of not having enough G mana to remove all of their threats with Ooze.

Choke I'm only running 1. I've run 2 in the past. I bring it in against URG Tempo and U/W Snapcaster. It's better against Snapcaster. Against Snapcaster, I usually board out 4 Swords to Plowshares and a Karakas. In comes 1 Choke, 1 Red Elemental Blast, 1 Pyroblast, 1 Thrun, the Last Troll and 1 Sword of Light and Shadow. So, the 1 Choke is because I don't make the room for 2. I'm also hesitant to take out the whole equipment package against U/W Snapcaster (this would make more room), as I prefer to fight equipment with equipment and they usually don't have many answers other than to keep our creatures off the board. Against URG Tempo, I'm going to take out Gaddock Teeg, Sylvan Library, Qasali Pridemage and 2 Aven Mindcensor for a Choke, Sword of Light and Shadow, Thurn, the Last Troll and Red Elemental Blast and Pyroblast. I also switch a Swords to Plowshares for a Path to Exile, since URG Tempo doesn't run any basic lands. I keep 1 Pridgemage in for Mind Harness.

Path to Exile for the mirror - it's nice to have the extra removal spell.
Thrun, the Last Troll - I really like Thrun against U/W Snapcaster and Black Control.
Red Elemental Blast and Pyroblast I think 2 is the right number for the 'blasts. For a while, I ran 3, but I found they were clogging up my hand.

Cards I may remove (on the cusp):

Karakas
is good against Reanimator and a Show and Telled Emrakul, The Aeons Torn. I haven't faced either of these decks in a long time and there are other and better options out of the sideboard. The best use I've received from Karakas was Legend-ruling my opponent's Karakas against Death and Taxes. I'm considering replacing this with a Maze of Ith, Gaea's Cradle or a 6th red-land source.

Cards that missed the cut:

Maze of Ith
Phyrexian Metamorph
Batterskull
Sword of Feast and Famine
Quirion Ranger
3rd Aven Mindcensor
Tarmogoyf
Terravore
2nd Sylvan Library
Gaea's Cradle

Maze and Metamorph - see above. Batterskull is a meta decision - plus with only 2 Stoneforge Mystics it is harder to cheat it into play. Scavenging Ooze, Umezawa's Jitte, and Sword of Light and Shadow provide life gain versus burn decks (I still face a lot of burn online).
Quirion Ranger I like this card as it is a 1 casting cost and is an earlier drop than Scryb Ranger and combines better with Green Sun's Zenith. However, as ruckus mentions above, Scryb Ranger has Protection from Blue, flying and flash. If you've missed a land drop, Quirion Ranger can become a 'free drop' and both Rangers combo well with Mother of Runes, Dryad Arbor, Knight of the Reliquary, Birds of Paradise and Noble Hierarch plus they protect your forests from Wasteland. One issue with both of the Rangers is that out of the 22 land I run, only 5 are forests, so I've run into problems where I didn't have a Forest in play to activate Rangers or not two to activate Rangers on my turn and my opponent's turn.
Aven Mindcensor. I really like this card - it stops:
Natural Order
Green Sun's Zenith
Pattern of Rebirth
Infernal Tutor
Stoneforge Mystic
Knight of the Reliquary
Intuition
Grim Tutor
and Fetchlands. It also has flash and flying (evasion). Until recently, I was running 3, but I really don't like to draw a second once I have one on board. That being said, I definitely want 1, as this card is one of this deck's only answers to Natural Order. I recently cut the 3rd copy for a 2nd Scryb Ranger, as I really like that card's untap ability (I often find myself wanting to draw Scryb more often).
The reason for not including a 2nd Sylvan Library is the same for not including a 3rd Aven Mindcensor above. 1 is really nice, but 2 is overkill.
Tarmogoyf and Maze of Ith would be the two cards I would add as 76 and 77, perhaps removing a Karakas or Ensnaring Bridge from the board for a Maze of Ith or the 2nd Scryb Ranger from the main for a Tarmogoyf. 'Goyf is great against Burn, Zoo, URG Tempo or for creating a clock against a combo deck. He's usually our biggest beater at the GSZ=2 slot. He's also very good at opposing other 'Goyfs and giving our deck some time to develop.

Comments/Feedback/Questions welcome. As Mav players, after we answer the 'Traditional' WG Mav vs. Punishing Mav question, our decklists are all very similar (I would say 95% of the cards are the same), with small tweaks for the expected metagame. Likewise, the sideboards all have similar themes, with the usual debate being Enlightened Tutor sideboard vs. non-Enlightened Tutor sideboard. After this question is answered, the objectives of most sideboards is similar, with small tweaks for the expected metagame and card preference.

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Originally Posted by rukcus

Maze of Ith (should not be Maindeck)

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ruckus, is this because it is a dead draw/undesirable against so many decks? From your Vegas tournament report, it looks like you were bringing it in against the mirror, Bant, etc. What other decks do you bring the Maze in against?

To my list above, I'm replacing Karakas with Maze of Ith and the 2nd Scryb Ranger with a Tarmogoyf. Both are mainly meta decisions. Maze is a nice blocking cantrip with Knight of the Reliquary, gives your guys vigilance and saves them from unexpected blocking situations. While it is dead against some decks and susceptible to Wasteland, I still think it's more valuable than Karakas in my meta (I haven't played a Reanimator deck in forever).

Second, I've never been unhappy to draw Tarmogoyf, he is our only decent GSZ=2 threat/blocker and he's good at slowing down Burn, Zoo, URG Tempo's opposing Tarmogoyf and creating a clock against Combo.

I'm very happy with the 2 Scavenging Ooze as it provides a valuable utility, life gain and easily turns into a beater in mid game.

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Originally Posted by Water_Wizard

ruckus, is this because it is a dead draw/undesirable against so many decks? From your Vegas tournament report, it looks like you were bringing it in against the mirror, Bant, etc. What other decks do you bring the Maze in against?

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In Game 1 against unknown opponents, you want to be the aggressive deck. It's a dead draw against most control and combo decks, and the maindeck is perfectly able to play aggresive against other mid range decks.

In games 2/3 is were you shift to more of a control deck that answers their general strategy, and having additional outs to opposing KotR/Goyf/Delver is important since the density of the deck is marginalized by the additional SB cards. Against reanimator specifically, it buys you some time and negates one of their attackers if they chose the wrong threat.

I never found that I wanted to use the Maze of Ith tricks with Knight - I would rather just find Wastelands or grow knight with fetchlands then start attacking when he's about 1/2 their life total.

Never put out Karakas if you running Teeg MD. Unless you like to be locked down by own creature.

What does Karakas have to do with Teeg? You could bounce your Teeg to GSZ, then cast it again if need be.

-Matt

I think he's talking about getting your Karakas Wastelanded before you drop Teeg. Still, when in need for the mana, I'd definitely run out that Karakas.