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Originally Posted by danyul

There are some perfectly reasonable arguments for and against price jumps in the Rav Duals. I guess I'll just wait and see once the cards are released. Until then I have plenty of other regrets to keep me occupied. Also, I apologize for basically asking the same Rav Dual question twice. I didn't want to turn this thread into some pricing thread.

Buuuuuut Pax is this weekend and we are supposed to see a bunch of new reveals over the next few days.

For example:

On today's card of the day
Grim Roustabout
1B
Creature- Skeleton Warrior (C)
Unleash (You may have this creature enter the battlefield with a +1/+1 counter on it. It can't block as long as it has a +1/+1 counter on it.)
1B: Regenerate Grim Rousabout.
1/1

Nothing super crazy going on there. I believe this is a Rakdos card. And just a common at that. I dunno how this mechanic will scale into rare and mythic rare territory. It will be interesting to see what Wotc comes up with.

Also those new art Brainstorms are available for preorder on StarCity for 2 bucks a pop. 1.50 on TrollandToad.

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This is like exhibit A in why they should just stop trying to come up with new keyword mechanics for every set.

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Originally Posted by Aggro_zombies

I imagine the mechanic is more interesting at a single +1/+1 counter. ...

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Critters could also have abilities like Triskelion where the +1/+1 counter is used for something.

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This is like exhibit A in why they should just stop trying to come up with new keyword mechanics for every set.

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Still better than banding.

Unleash does look pretty shitty. However, it could have been good if they put a number on it... like Unleash 1 for the card that got spoiled vs. Unleash 4 on something else.

Also, that card would have actually been alright if it were costed at a single black instead of 1B.

It looks like a mechanic that wouldn't even be good in draft. Then again, perhaps they'll make it better with creatures that have extra abilities if they've been unleashed. ie.

(example card) B
Creature - Demon
Unleash
As long as ~ is Unleashed, whenever it deals combat damage to a player, that player discards a card at random.
1/1

(example card) G
Creature - Druid
Unleash
As long as ~ is Unleashed, whenever it deals combat damage to a player, you may search your library for a land and put that card into your hand.
1/1

(example card) U
Creature - Illusion
Flying, Unleash
As long as ~ is Unleashed, whenever it deals combat damage to a player, you may Scry 1.

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Originally Posted by Vacrix

Unleash does look pretty shitty. However, it could have been good if they put a number on it... like Unleash 1 for the card that got spoiled vs. Unleash 4 on something else.

Also, that card would have actually been alright if it were costed at a single black instead of 1B.

It looks like a mechanic that wouldn't even be good in draft. Then again, perhaps they'll make it better with creatures that have extra abilities if they've been unleashed. ie.

(example card) B
Creature - Demon
Unleash
As long as ~ is Unleashed, whenever it deals combat damage to a player, that player discards a card at random.
1/1

(example card) G
Creature - Druid
Unleash
As long as ~ is Unleashed, whenever it deals combat damage to a player, you may search your library for a land and put that card into your hand.
1/1

(example card) U
Creature - Illusion
Flying, Unleash
As long as ~ is Unleashed, whenever it deals combat damage to a player, you may Scry 1.

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Since it's the Rakdos mechanic, it will likely only occur on B/R creatures. Also, were the cards you're suggesting all 1-drops or is that just an indicator of their color-identity?

Well, keep in mind that it's also on a Rakdos card so you shouldn't have to see too much of it outside of B and R sealed picks.

edit - posted at the same time as torpidninja

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Originally Posted by Vacrix

Unleash does look pretty shitty. However, it could have been good if they put a number on it... like Unleash 1 for the card that got spoiled vs. Unleash 4 on something else.

Also, that card would have actually been alright if it were costed at a single black instead of 1B.

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Something like Unleash 4 is going to have problems. If it's costed appropriately for the bigger end of the card, the non-unleashed end will seem shitty; if it's costed appropriately for the non-unleashed end, the correct decision 90% of the time will be to unleash it, which isn't interesting at all. I understand that larger numbers of counters on Unleash would make the cards Constructed-playable, but as it is I feel like they can already do that with the right combination of secondary abilities:

Unleash + Intimidate / Flying = formidable offensive creature
Unleash + Haste = suicidal fast attacker
Unleash + "Remove a counter" = attacker that can activate an ability and then chump when outclassed

Too many cheap Unleash creatures in the environment would make for a pretty brutal fast aggro deck if the Unleash numbers start to get too large. As it stands, they can make fine Constructed cards if they did something like, say a red one-drop 1/1 with Unleash and haste.

The current wording makes the cards actually interesting for Limited rather than stupidly overpowered. There's an actual decision to be made about whether a single counter is good enough to justify limiting your blockers.

While Unleash by itself is a pretty shitty mechanic, we'll have to wait and see how the actual cards turn out. Bonus effects with +1/+1 counters are basically a must. E.g. something basic:

Rakdos Goblin :r:
Creature - Goblin
Unleash
As long as Rakdos Goblin has a +1/+1 counter on it, Rakdos Goblin has haste.
1/1

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Originally Posted by Barook

While Unleash by itself is a pretty shitty mechanic, we'll have to wait and see how the actual cards turn out. Bonus effects with +1/+1 counters are basically a must. E.g. something basic:

Rakdos Goblin :r:
Creature - Goblin
Unleash
As long as Rakdos Goblin has a +1/+1 counter on it, Rakdos Goblin has haste.
1/1

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Right, but this speaks to Aggro_zombies point: there's no tension in the creature. Who doesn't want a Goblin Guide without a drawback? On the other hand, if it only had haste without the counter, then the card's more interesting.

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Originally Posted by TorpidNinja

Right, but this speaks to Aggro_zombies point: there's no tension in the creature. Who doesn't want a Goblin Guide without a drawback? On the other hand, if it only had haste without the counter, then the card's more interesting.

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I agree. For aggressive, cheap cards, unleashing will probably always be the right choice unless with another drawback on top of the can't block. On high-end creature, keeping the ability to block is probably more important. I see unleash at its best on 2 and 3 cmc creature. Something like:

Ominous Presence BB
Creature - Spirit
Deathtouch
Unleash
2/2

Deathtouch (especially with first strike) feel like the best mechanic to go with Unleash. If you don't Unleash, the card can work as removal, else it work only as an attacker that will trade on block.

http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphot...28659785_n.jpg

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Originally Posted by Snap_Keep

<huge image>

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It's about time they started printing Walkers with reasonable ultimatums and powerful second abilities. Also, I really want to resolve this before my opponent plays his third land.

A very interesting and powerful card, but it requires a heavy commitment to blue and 4 mana. I'm not sure if this will be playable in Legacy, probably not, but at least it's worth trying in some decks.

I call fake. Too wordy and that art is from the Ith in Time Spiral block.

That card feel like the impersonification of evil and annoying effects. Tap and selected card discard + counter everything zzz

That thing is going to be great in Modern and Standard. As long as Terminus is around it should see a lot of play together.

I hope it's real.

Just so I can RP with it and Maze of Ith.

I am gullible as hell, and even I didn't fall for this shit.

The card's abilities have no characteristic similarity to Ith or his signature land, Maze of Ith. Hmm, that art looks familiar...

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers...4903&type=card

Also, the +1 ability is too powerful if you're targeting lands. That means your opponent has to pay 2 to untap their frozen land. Or else... you just freeze another of their lands. Yay, that sounds exactly like what Standard needs right now (and I hate that stupid format).

It's fake.

There are two walkers in RtR - yet another Jace (seriously, he's becoming Magic's Megaman) and a new, female one.

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Originally Posted by Barook

It's fake.

There are two walkers in RtR - yet another Jace (seriously, he's becoming Magic's Megaman) and a new, female one.

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The new character is also rumored to be a blue planeswalker (Kiora) possibly Simic aligned.

There is some facebook app/game thingy that the MTG Salvation people have been poking around on. It lets you unlock art as you get points or something. Anyway some dude uploaded all the art unlocked so far. This set is gonna be pretty.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/6066501/facebookart.html

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showt...443455&page=14

Unleash could be an interesting combat trick if they have some way to move +1/+1 counters around.

I'm kind of surprised that this is Rakdos though, because I thought they said that the new abilities would work well with the old abilities, unless I'm missing something, I don't see how this works with hellbent at all.