[Deck] GW/x Maverick

@Tempo topic
Yes you can say that it depends on there hand and if they are on the draw or play. Yes on the play you can somehow have the upper hand assuming you get a good mana ramp start.

But, its not all about tempo or stopping mav's mana production, a good rug player can easily see through if your lacking on mana or just go for the straight up kill and bash your face with there creatures.

Again i will point out that only KOTR is the only creature mav has that can decently race rug. Mav is very much dependent on stf or equips, like what i've posted earlier mav's creature list needs more muscle for me. Im still testing a different route eventhough i have a good game against rug now 70/30 in my favor, im still iffy about the deck due to its consistency. I've only been testing against rug, bug and bant.

But if i would revert back to gsz build, i would definitely put in 2 terravore and maybe add 1 behemoth sledge in the equip list and maybe cut solas for it.

If you're going to start cutting GSZ from the deck and add guys that are only beef like Tarmogoyf, you're really getting away from the Maverick utility creature / flexibility approach.

Zoo takes the pure Aggro + removal approach and just smashes the tempo decks.

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Originally Posted by Esper3k

If you're going to start cutting GSZ from the deck and add guys that are only beef like Tarmogoyf, you're really getting away from the Maverick utility creature / flexibility approach.

Zoo takes the pure Aggro + removal approach and just smashes the tempo decks.

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I've posted my build several pages, ive replaced
4 gsz
1 arbor
2 ooze
1 ranger
1 thrun

For
4 vials
4 serra avengers
2 spellskite
3 rishandan port

Still, i see no reason at all to cut one of the strongest cards of the deck. Keep in GSZ and play it alongside vial. Fabian Moyschewitz, one of the higher rated german eternal players just used a decent list in Nuremberg click.

That's about the lis twe have been playing before the printing of GSZ as a green splashed DnT before MAverick was actually taken up to top Tier via Green Suns Zenith and that deck became significantly better with the GSZ, even though you miss the vials from time to time.

I fully understand your approach but i don't see how Avenger helps against RUG.

Did you look at the date of the tournament? That is the list we played in germany in april.
But it had too many different directions. For gsz you need a good manabase, for vial you need critter. And once you draw vial, noble and lands you can not put enough pressure on the table.

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Originally Posted by BlackStarDeceiver

Still, i see no reason at all to cut one of the strongest cards of the deck. Keep in GSZ and play it alongside vial. Fabian Moyschewitz, one of the higher rated german eternal players just used a decent list in Nuremberg click.

That's about the lis twe have been playing before the printing of GSZ as a green splashed DnT before MAverick was actually taken up to top Tier via Green Suns Zenith and that deck became significantly better with the GSZ, even though you miss the vials from time to time.

I fully understand your approach but i don't see how Avenger helps against RUG.

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Hello,
I know that GSZ is really a strong card, no doubt about it and gives you flexibility on your creature list. I've used it for a long time before deciding to put them a the sidelines.

Like what i've explained above, gsz will never be a dead card as compared to vial, and fetches you creatures you need like (ooze, kotr, ranger or pridemage) they are the most common targets next maybe mana dorks.

Im still undecided in which path im going to take but like what i've said if im going to go back to gsz, i will try behemoth sledge replacing solas and add terravores in the mix to my build.

Thanks for the list, as much as i like mangara i feel his too slow especially without the taxing effects of DT, for me it makes your deck slower, mav is slow as it is, adding him for me is not my cup of tea. Maybe i would rather add fiend hunter over mangara

Now, how do serra avenger win against rug ?
- It gives you a good evasion creature especially when you have an equipment online.
- Blocks delvers thus stalling them
- Kotr, ooze with equip, without lifelink and trample is just painful see being block by random creatures and flying delvers go for the kill, then a double bolt via snapcaster then its GG

No matter how i see it, mav is just too equipment dependent, without equips, your creatures are somewhat mediocre. Yes you have mother of runes so your fat kotr can attack but not all the time you can let your mother go online.

Serra Avenger paired with exalted gives you a decent clock just like what vendilion clique does to bant.., making your 2-3 noble more effective as compared to land creatures.

In my initial list i used 3 gsz 4 vials but something was not right as i only had few targets. Thus i removed it.

I hope fellow mav players just give the build a few spin then ask yourselves was the changes worth it as compared to the traditional mav list.

If your MU against tempo rug does not improve or against any blue based decks, ask yourself would GSZ be alot better than vial ?? If you answered yes, then maybe there is something wrong with what im seeing in my playtest. Like what ive said im still iffy on the build bec of consistency issues as compared to the traditional mav which just plays the same every game.

My updated list

Lands [23]
4 wasteland
3 rishadan port
1 karakas
1 gaes cradle
1 maze of ith
4 savannah
4 windswept heath
2 flooded strand
2 plains
1 forest

Spells [11]
4 aether vial
4 swords to plowshares
1 sofi
1 solas
1 jitte

Creatures [26]
4 mother of runes
3 noble hiearch
1 birds of paradise
3 qasali pridemage
4 serra avenger
3 stoneforge mystic
4 knight of the reliquary
2 mirran crusader
2 spellskite

I don't see your problems with RUGs just side in more removal, without creatures they can't kill you enough fast.. additional PtE on sb and problem resolve. The key is to playing good around stifle and kill early attacker nothing more.

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Originally Posted by schniggaz

Did you look at the date of the tournament? That is the list we played in germany in april.
But it had too many different directions. For gsz you need a good manabase, for vial you need critter. And once you draw vial, noble and lands you can not put enough pressure on the table.

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Thanks for pointing that out, maybe i was a bit tired :D Missed the date somehow. Anyways i dont see the point against RUG at all. When playing Canadian theres one deck i don't want to face, and thats Maverick ( well besides MonoB :D).

Serra trades with delver on defense and eats bolts like a champ. Maybe you should take a look at the DnT thread because thats what you are creating there, Green and Taxes.

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Originally Posted by _erbs_

I've posted my build several pages, ive replaced
4 gsz
1 arbor
2 ooze
1 ranger
1 thrun

For
4 vials
4 serra avengers
2 spellskite
3 rishandan port

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As much as I love Serra Avenger, I don't think it's very good right now in a meta full of lightning bolts.

Against Canadian Thresh, I find a lot of the cards you took out very powerful. Thrun blocks Tarmogoyfs all day and with 1 Exalted creature or equipment, will punch through your average 'Goyf. Scryb Ranger blocks Delvers and makes life hell for them if you have an active Mother. Ooze both shrinks their Goyfs / neuters Snapcasters while gaining you life at the same time to keep you out of burn / delver range. We've already spoken of the benefits of a T1 GSZ against that deck as well.

===========================

Oh, my tournament report for the Beta Savannah tournament (34 players) I played in last weekend is up in the tournament reports section now.

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Originally Posted by _erbs_

No matter how i see it, mav is just too equipment dependent, without equips, your creatures are somewhat mediocre.

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The solution to this is to cut the 4x GSZ that gives one virtually 4 more cards to draw that are Knight of the Reliquary/Terravore/Ooze? I can't see how drawing into dead midgame Aether Vials is helpful compared to Green Sun's Zenithing into w/e creature would most effect board state.

I like Serra Avenger, but outside it's synergy with Aether Vial it's pretty vanilla. A 3-4 drop 3/3 that trades with a bunch of 1cc creatures/removal - Delver, Nimble, Nacatl, Bolt effects, etc. I've played the card in Death and Taxes and a couple of them can go the distance for sure, or if you get a Sword or Jitte on it, than it will own the red zone, but I think when you have Green at your disposal there's better options available.

For instance, I'd rather have another Scryb Ranger. It can hold off Delver, gives any of our creatures vigilance, has phenomenal synergy with Mother of Runes and Knight, and protects Savannas.

I think your proposed cuts take away too much of Maverick's threat density. Even just considering the 4 Vials and 3 Ports over 4 GSZ, an Arbor and 2 utility guys - that's 6/60ths of the deck that you can draw into that's superfluous mana production. The Avengers can be good with Vial, but I think the GSZ package offers more.

I feel like with Vial instead of GSZ, this deck becomes a "Green and Taxes" deck. The threat denstity and 8 one-mana ramp cards is what makes Maverick unique, and GSZ is the central engine for this.

With regards to Vial decks, I think that :w::b: decks have more to offer than :g::w: versions. Basically, with Vial you need to design the deck for a specific CMC (typically 2). Green doesn't have much to offer in that department aside from hate-bears. Black gives better (but not the best) tools, and a combination of B/W is probably the best.

For anyone going into the Invitational, I think maindeck Ethersworn Canonist is the way to go. If you can protect it (with SoLS or with Mom) that shuts out both UW and RUG tempo from utilizing Snapcaster effectively. It's also just tits maindeck against any unknown Combo deck.

SUCK IT Taigo!

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Originally Posted by rukcus

For anyone going into the Invitational, I think maindeck Ethersworn Canonist is the way to go. If you can protect it (with SoLS or with Mom) that shuts out both UW and RUG tempo from utilizing Snapcaster effectively. It's also just tits maindeck against any unknown Combo deck.

SUCK IT Taigo!

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I'm currently inclined to try out some maindeck Ethersworn Canoninsts. But has anyone had problem with its lack of synergy with Punishing Fires (for those who do run it)? Or do the scenarios where these two cards are useful not really overlap, so that the dissynergy is tolerable?

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Originally Posted by lordofthepit

I'm currently inclined to try out some maindeck Ethersworn Canoninsts. But has anyone had problem with its lack of synergy with Punishing Fires (for those who do run it)? Or do the scenarios where these two cards are useful not really overlap, so that the dissynergy is tolerable?

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The two strategies don't converge. Punishing Fire is generally better against aggressive decks, and Canonist is better against combo and Snapcasters. You could make it work (especially with SoFF to provide nearly limitless mana).

Canonist is better for stock GW lists rather than GWr lists running Fires.

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Originally Posted by rukcus

maindeck Ethersworn Canonist

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Given your list, if you put Canonist into the maindeck what would you take out?

It would be a good idea to MD canonist, but wouldn't it be hard to fetch it unless we board in E-Tutor or possibly Wordly tutor? So if we go 2 Canonist and 2 E-tutor/wordly tutor, what 4 cards from Mav would be take out for them in the MD?

I've tried out maindeck Canonists and the problem I've had is that protecting them is fairly tough against Canadian Thresh due to the amount of removal they have. If you can't get an active Mother to protect it, it generally just get Lightning Bolted then they use their Snapcaster.

Also, just from my experience, when it gets Spell Snared, you get really sad because their Goyf just got Instant, Creature, and Artifact into the yard.

I really wanted it to work out, but it wasn't as good as I was hoping it to be.

I'm too lazy to look Rukcus list up right now, but for testing purposes I would cut the Mindcensors.

Also, running E. Tutor MD to fetch Canonist seems horrible since Spell Snare is everywhere.

Right now I feel that 2 Ooze MD are necessary, they do a wonderful job against Snapcasters. :smile:

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Originally Posted by Philipp2293

I'm too lazy to look Rukcus list up right now, but for testing purposes I would cut the Mindcensors.

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Rukcus isn't running Mindcensors in his list. Also his list is in his signature, one click away on this very page.

I've cut the Mindcensors to make room for 2nd Ooze about a month ago. I've since cut Eternal Witness for a 2nd Scryb Ranger, and most recently, cut 1 (of 2) Sylvan Library for a Tarmogoyf.

More threats means less impact from Spell Snare.

EDIT: And yes, Ooze is fucking awesome! It finds so much utility in Maverick (or GSZ based deck really).