Printable View
I was going to rant on this, but to allow a thread to be conducive for testing I will start a new and developing thread and if they eventually merge then so be it. I appreciate the feedback, but it doesn't feel very constructive at this point in time.
-Rob
Some guy got 5th place in the last SCG open , with an interesting list :
2 Exquisite Firecraft
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
3 Searing Blaze
1 Scalding Tarn
2 Arid Mesa
4 Goblin Guide
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Wooded Foothills
3 Grim Lavamancer
9 Mountain
4 Price of Progress
4 Fireblast
4 Chain Lightning
4 Lightning Bolt
Sideboard
2 Exquisite Firecraft
1 Searing Blaze
3 Smash to Smithereens
2 Sulfuric Vortex
4 Pyrostatic Pillar
3 Ensnaring Bridge
Discuss
Weaker to Miracles than someone running Swiftspear, but Firecraft is the right call right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Basara
No out to Reanimator seems to be a concession.
I feel like 3x lavamancer can be too much.
I also run 2x Firecraft main, and I love it. I still run Swiftspears, the Firecrafts replaced 2x Vortex.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMana
I don't see 3x Ensnaring Bridge to be a concession to Reanimator. Their GY doesn't matter if they can't attack you, and they won't be digging for answers to it with Griselbrand, even if they didn't take the life hit from Reanimate.
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...l=1#post966577
lost handily to jund (0-2) and burn (0-2), then some really close games lost to miracles (1-2), and dredge (1-2). beat esperblade (2-0), BR reanimator (2-0), infect (2-0), storm (2-0), and painter (2-0). (all not necessarily in that order)
full report on other thread.
-rob
I've been considering getting burn built again, after I finish UG Infect. Do you think this is a good plan for right now? Will the increased prevalence (at least, temporarily,) of D&T make it a bad choice? I mainly want it as something to shake up with after casting berserks and invigorates.
D&T probably helps us. They're a fair deck that has pretty good matchups against our bad matches. At the same time though, we tend to have a pretty good matchup against D&T. The games are a little slow but they definitely favor us because we have instants to play, Port, Wasteland doesn't lock us out, and blowing up artifacts is amazing for us. The only thing I would worry about is the new 2/2 Chalice creature. That has the potential to cause us a lot of problems.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. No Face
I've also cut Sulfuric Vortex for Exquisite Firecraft and I think it might be a good idea. Considering Miracles is playing Wear // Tear and Monastery Mentor, Exquisite Firecraft seems like a better option right now. Furthermore, I've been playing four copies of Smash to Smithereens in the sideboard for Chalice of the Void and equipment, and since most other life gain is through equipment, it may be safe to cut Sulfuric Vortex entirely.Quote:
Originally Posted by dudedusty
Concerning graveyard decks, I think if you have to choose between graveyard hate and Ensnaring Bridge, I'd choose the utility of Ensnaring Bridge. It's strong against Sneak & Show, Reanimator, and RUG Delver.
Here's what I've been testing:
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Chain Lightning
4 Goblin Guide
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
9 Mountain
3 Arid Mesa
2 Scalding Tarn
3 Bloodstained Mire
3 Wooded Foothills
4 Fireblast
4 Price of Progress
1 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Exquisite Firecraft
3 Searing Blaze
SB: 4 Smash to Smithereens
SB: 1 Searing Blaze
SB: 4 Ensnaring Bridge
SB: 3 Pyrostatic Pillar
SB: 3 Searing Blood
I typically play Grim Lavamancer but I thought I'd try and play more searing effects and minimize the permanents in the deck. I'm not sure how many fetch lands to run though. I've gone between 11 and 12 with Grim Lavamancer, but fetching also helps with Searing Blaze and Sensei's Divining Top.
Yeah, I think Vortex is pretty much useless at this point in time. I'd rather have the 4 damage immediately, and we have more efficient ways of negating lifegain. I don't like giving up on graveyard hate though. I generally run some number of Grafdigger's Cage, Faerie Macabre, and Surgical Extraction.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle Hopkins
I am adding 2x Bedlam Reveler to my list, just to try it out.
Decklist:
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Destructive Revelry
3 Price of Progress
4 Fireblast
3 Lava Spike
4 Chain Lightning
3 Rift Bolt
2 Exquisite Firecraft
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Goblin Guide
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
2 Grim Lavamancer
2 Bedlam Reveler
2 Bloodstained Mire
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Arid Mesa
2 Taiga
6 Mountain
1 Barbarian Ring
Sideboard:
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Sulfuric Vortex
2 Pyrostatic Pillar
2 Krosan Grip
2 Exquisite Firecraft
3 Sulfur Elemental
Taiga and Revelry is to stop game 1 Chalice of the Void and just in case someone is running a problematic enchantment. I have seen people run maindeck Leyline of Sanctity ... confuses the hell out of me. Krosan Grip comes in when they expect Revelry, so that they can't stack Wear//Tear for Counterbalance.
There are far more decks NOT playing Chalice than decks playing Chalice, so most of the times Destructive Revelry is a total blank that you cannot Brainstorm away.Quote:
Originally Posted by AceOfJacks
Is Ghirapur Orrery playable in the board for the really grindy matches? I realize it's four mana, but if we can get it down against miracles it lets us really overtax a countertop, or dig for our uncounterable stuff. Might be a bit out there. Thoughts?
Vexing Shusher seems better than Orerry, or its ilk. Resolving the good spells is far better than trying to overpower cards theough expensive cards.
It's just not going to happen against Miracles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kozilek
Burn, in general, is not in the market for this type of effect. Burn cares more about card consistency, or resolving their spells.
How did you find Blood Moon? Does it deserve its slot?Quote:
Originally Posted by mistercakes
I'm not a big fan of Bridge against Reanimator. Iona kills everything we do and we have no out and they can bounce Bridge as Reanimator still runs some number of a bounce spell. Burn doesn't want to be in the long game and all you really need is for them to hiccup once and the game could be yours. Faerie Macabre, Crypt, Extraction are my choices for grave hate.Quote:
Originally Posted by dudedusty
I'm trying out Top, so with Top allowing myself to manipulate my draws, I cut a land for it. I think this might be a bad play as it is a little bit of a mana sink since I can see having two lands in play, draw Top cast it and find nothing, but two mana spells and lethal on board. I dunno, we will see. I like being able to cast spells and not be screwed.
I am also trying out Swiftspear for the very first time. I've always preferred Lavamancer, but I see that Swiftspear hedges the Miracles match up. Speaking of the Miracles match up, I am thinking of cutting a PoP for Barbarian Ring. That's something I am more than willing to do, because it gives me my twentieth land and for sure damage against counter decks. Also, Lavamancer is no longer an edge against Death and Taxes because I have been Revoked on it so many feel bad times.
I am running Sudden Shock for Infect and Infect alone. I know that there are multiple Infect decks in the meta I'm going into as well as some Aluren decks. It's one of the few removal damage spells that actually affects both decks and a great trump card on them.
I really like Lyle Hopkins point about Smash against equipment decks and Chalices. I'm down to just four creature Searing effects and up to four equipment Searing effects.
My deck I plan on running if I actually play this Sunday. I decided to put Shardless away and play with my true love<3
4 Goblin Guide
3 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Lava Spike
1 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Searing Blaze
4 Price of Progress
4 Rift Bolt
2 Exquisite Firecraft
3 Fireblast
11 red Fetches
8 Mountain
Sideboard
2 Tormod's Crypt (might become Faerie Macabre)
2 Grim Lavamancer (might become Pyrostatic Pillar)
2 Pithing Needle
1 Surgical Extraction
4 Smash to Smithereens
2 Sudden Shock
2 Exquisite Firecraft
I am on the fence about Pyrostatic Pillar. Storm decks seem to be on the decline a lot and I can't remember what else it is good against. Delver, sure, but I only like Pillar effects on the play and not on the draw and even then, I'm not a fan of hurting myself in certain Delver positions. What else is pillar good against?
Went X-3 at the CFB Legacy today playing a different list than I posted. Missed pay out by placing twentieth. Fun tournament and I'm still a decent pilot for the deck and I think this deck is well positioned in my area to really wreak havoc. Bad tournament report when I make it home later today!
List:
4 Goblin Guide
3 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
1 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Chain Lightning
3 Searing Blaze
4 Price of Progress
4 Rift Bolt
2 Exquisite Firecraft
3 Fireblast
4 Windswept Heath
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Scalding Tarn
1 Arid Mesa
1 Barbarian Ring
8 Mountain
Sideboard
1 Tormod's Crypt
2 Pithing Needle
2 Pyrostatic Pillar
1 Searing Blaze
4 Smash to Smithereens
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Exquisite Firecraft
1 Mindbreak Trap
Grixis Delver - Win 2-1
Sideboard: I put in two Firecrafts and the extra Blaze, I removed three Goblin Guides.
Only note to take from this was that he decided to counter my Top in game three. I didn't play a land when I cast it, making him believe I needed land. Played a land after and proceeded to beat with spells. Two Firecraft, a Barbarian Ring, and Fireblast destroyed him. He was a solid player though. If he suspected the Barbarian Ring, I'm sure he would have played a little differently. In game one he had all the counterspells and ran with Gurmag Angler. I can't really remember game two, but I suspect I just ran him over with nothing to note.
Shardless BUG - Loss 2-1
Sideboard: I side boarded just like the previous match in our game one, but in game three I put in two Smash and two Pithing Needle and removed the three Swiftspear and the last Guide
Regarding my sideboard, I usually put in some number of Smash against this deck, but I have been sideboarding incorrectly for this match up, which explains why I keep losing to this deck. I'll get into this further at a later match up from today
Game one he ran with Deathrite Shaman and had three Forces for all of my kill spells. Game two I ran him over fairly easily with creature beats and some Firecrafts. Game three I mulled down to five and kept a single land hand. He ran away with the game with Goyf, Lili, and Agent. Really wish I wasn't mana screwed here. I know my first hand was no land, second hand too much land. That's probably something I should have kept because I faintly remember Eidolon hanging out there. I just didn't want to chance it with drawing duds in the form of more lands. I also sideboarded incorrectly. I didn't know what he was after game one and suspected he was Grixis Delver. After finding out what he was, I re-boarded.
Grixis Delver - Win 2-0
Sideboard: Same as match one.
Nothing special here, move along. I don't even remember this match in its entirety, but apparently it happened according to my match notes.
Lands - Win 2-1
Sideboard: I put in Pithing Needle and two Firecraft. I thought about using some grave hate, but quickly dismissed it. There's such a small chance that it will matter since the problem will be on the table already. I took out Blaze and a Mountain.
Nothing special to note here. I put Needle here to combat a possible Zuran Orb and stop the combo. Neither mattered and nothing really noted here, other than my stupidity that I waited for him to tap out of green for fear of Crop Rotation, but he had a Chalice out on one. I face palmed myself pretty readily after I decided to go for it when he tapped out green. I asked why did he tap out for green when he didn't need it. Pointed to the Chalice. Boy, this is what happens when you don't play Magic in awhile.
Shardless BUG - Win 2-1
Sideboard: In two Firecraft and the singleton Blaze, and removed three Guides. I decided to go this route for once because I felt like I kept having artifact hate in hand and dying. I hesitated taking out Guides and bringing in Firecraft. Reason being is Hymn kills my hand sometimes before I get Firecraft. I am thinking maybe I take out Fireblast for the extra Firecraft and keep the Guides? I know I want to race, but I know Guide isn't a great top deck. Neither is Swiftspear, but I considered removing Guide because Brainstorming a land onto the top of the deck in reponse to the Guide trigger and I can grow Swiftspear above an Agent and keep the beats the following turn.
Nothing to note about this game, other than I roll him over in games two and three after a Deathrite and Goyf beat in game one. The deck felt more streamlined in this form and the greed was gone from wanting to two for one the opponent.
Miracles - Loss 2-1
Sideboard: I took out Prices and two Blaze, for two Needle, two Smash, and two Firecraft.
He was paired up and a very good pilot because he was paired up all day as told by him. He looks tired and I know what he's on and saw how well he played the round before. I'm hoping he makes mistakes and he doesn't. Shit. I hate this match up and I've only beaten it once in my life. Game one I beat in with Swiftspear a couple of times off of countered spells, and get there with four Rift Bolts that were never countered and finished him with Firecraft. Game two he has early Counter-Top lock and I have a slow death from Clique beats. Game three I have single land for two turns and I open up with Needle and Smash in hand. I keep playing this cat and mouse game with this two card combo and this is the final time I play it. Just going to bring in Needle and Firecraft next time. I feel like this deck needs more higher costing spells that Miracles can't really answer in the Counter-Top lock.
Eldrazi - Loss 2-1
Sideboard: I took out Guide and Eidolon for four Smash, two Firecraft, and two Needle.
I've never played against this deck a day in my life, but he has a nut draw with that 5/5 trample haste, and Jitte. GG one. Game two I kill on turn three with a pair of Swiftspears, Lava Spike, and Smash. Game three he drops a Basilisk Collar and I have Needle in hand. I keep thinking I'll have time to drop Needle to surprise him, but that bites me in the ass as I didn't realize how explosive Eldrazi is. Also, I kept a one land hand with a variety of spell costs. Probably going to be the last time I keep a sketch hand like that as well. He beats my face in, needless to say.
What to take away from this tournament? I don't like Top in this deck. At the very least, it doesn't fit my playstyle for the deck in the slightest. Everytime I had it, I was disappointed by it. There's probably a learning curve to playing it in the deck, but I'm not going to take the time to find it while I have other iterations to play with and test, plus I don't play nearly enough to care about it. Swiftspear is a lot better than I thought and I take back alot of the bad stuff I've said about it. Would I replace Guide with it? Hell no! This deck needs hasty aggressive beaters, but I do think in different circumstances the deck can survive with one or the other. I don't think Grim is a card for the deck right now. Maybe if Elves comes back, but Delver and D&T probably just don't care for it. I didn't miss him all day. I do like Ring. Didn't hamper me at all. Plenty of other lands I played while sandbagging it in hand. I don't believe I would go beyond a singleton though. I don't like my chances of having two and the bad that can come along with it.
Once again, my worry about Storm variants goes checked. Didn't see it and many people I've talked to about it say that very few play it if they even show up to tournaments. I can think of maybe three players total I've seen play it over my course of two and a half years of playing locally. Of course, I always come across the same Storm player whenever he's attending the same tournament as me. Never fails, plus he hasn't failed to combo out on me at most turn two every time we play against each other. I think if I don't see these players, I will gladly forego the Storm hate out of my side for other spells I could use. Cards I never sided in all tournament: Crypt, Macabre, Pillar, and Trap, though there were at least two Dredge players there. Dredge always seems to wade at the tournaments, so I see you Dredgers.
There, I'm done editing that last post of mine.
Played a small, nine man tournament yesterday placing third with a bye. Not much to report about it, but I ended up with a question regarding the Merfolk match up; which was my loss. How is this match up approached? With their counters and Aether Vial, I imagine this race is in their favor. Besides artifact hate and Pithing Needle, what do you do against them? I ended up bringing in two Firecraft, Searing Blaze, four Smash. I probably should have brought in Pithing Needle, but I figured it was a race. I probably had a couple of mistakes as well, one of them being trying to Smash his untapped Vial on one and one Cursecatcher in play already.
My list for this tournament. I haven't been here in awhile, but I knew of two Miracles players, some BUG colored gents, and the rest was generally unknown to me.
4 Goblin Guide
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Lava Spike
3 Searing Blaze
4 Price of Progress
4 Rift Bolt
2 Exquisite Firecraft
3 Fireblast
11 Fetches
8 Mountain
1 Barbarian Ring
Sideboard
1 Tormod's Crypt
2 Pithing Needle
1 Shattering Spree
2 Vexing Shusher
1 Searing Blaze
4 Smash to Smithereens
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Exquisite Firecraft
Merfolk is a matchup where you need to burn some creatures. Because they're all lords, their board presence grows exponentially. Killing the first lord will save you a full turn on the race but you still need some quality.