[Deck] The Servant's Stone

Even though I think this combo is kind of casual, and I don't really think it will have a great impact, I think it is a very fun combo. The servant has such a tremendous effect on the game and for only 2 mana!

The pros of this combo - and the reason why I have made myself a list, and have gotten myself the servants - are of course that it is a 2-card combo, that requires only 6 mana! It is actually kind of insane if you think of it that way. Problem being of course that it is quite easy to disrupt. Therefore I have made a list with a lot of disruption in it. It is lots of fun to play, but as I started out saying: I don't think it will go and warp the whole format...

Anyways, my list:

4 painter's servant
4 grindstone

4 brainstorm
3 ponder
4 lim-duls vault
4 dark confidant

4 force of will
4 daze
3 pact of negation
4 duress

4 lotus petal
4 chrome mox
4 underground sea
4 ancient tomb
4 polluted delta
2 island

Sideboard would consist of something along the lines of 3 rushing river/wipe away, 4 tormod's crypt, thoughtseize and another win-condition, maybe tombstalker...

I don't know wether I want the dark confidants or not - one could remove them, and put in som plunge into darkness, spoils of the vault or meditate/thirst for knowledge or something else...

Anyway, I really like the deck, and it is a ton of fun to play...

- meanee

Don't know if some one offered this up yet, but how about Transmute Artifact?

Play some blue version of STAX and then whip out transmute artifact and boom...

based on the Flame Vault Stasis Stax deck on SCG

- da Vinci Stax

Combo
4 Transmute Artifact
3 Painter's Servant
3 Grindstone

Artifacts
4 Crucible Of Worlds
4 Mox Diamond
4 Smokestack
4 Trinisphere

Enchantments
4 Propaganda
4 Stasis

Basic Lands
3 Island
2 Mountain

Lands
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Bloodstained Mire
4 City Of Traitors
2 Crystal Vein
2 Flooded Strand
2 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland
1 Seat of Synod

Stasis? It must be good!

What do we need mountains for? Cuz baby there ain't no mountain high enough, ain't no island wide enough...

FVSS was good because Time Vault was good in Stax. That it could win on turn 2 by dealing infinite damage was more than a threat than actuality. Sure, it could do that, but it could just as easily set up Smokestack + Time Vault (sometimes mixed with a Stasis, Propaganda, or Trinisphere) and refuse to play magic until you decked. Painter/Grindstone has no similar synergies. Even Flame Fusillade was a formidable removal spell in a deck composed of 54 permanents that thrived on playing out its permanents.

emidln i see your point on FVSS and of course i trust your opinion on anything with Stax in the name, but i think you should also see the potential of abuse of the painter combo in stax. Is an entirely artifact colored combo, and thus can be fitted into decks that power out artifacts (stax)

for example here are the SCG vintage forums: http://www.starcitygames.com/phpBB2/...09309&start=50

some of the lists that they have been developing are lists that include Pyroblast and REB, which are good on there own since they can protect the combo (countering FOW). Also there lists have been including old Stax elements like welder (also as one user pointed out this cool trick "Activate Grindstone, in response weld Grindstone for Painter to win"), Sphere of Resistance and Thorn of Amethyst. And with so many artifacts in the deck that cost 2 Mana Transmute artifact is Painter & grindstone 5-8 literally. I just think that out of any existing archetypes Stax would be the best fit for the deck since IMO any pure combo approach, no matter how much counters you'll put in would be inferior to Fetchland Tendrils.

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Originally Posted by Cire

I just think that out of any existing archetypes Stax would be the best fit for the deck since IMO any pure combo approach, no matter how much counters you'll put in would be inferior to Fetchland Tendrils.

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I tried it in 'geddon stax, see my list a page or 2 back, it was OK. The problem is that grindstone sucks on it's own and painter sucks on it's own. Other than that, the stax part of the deck was awsome.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cire

Don't know if some one offered this up yet, but how about Transmute Artifact?

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Transmutate Artifact seems strong. But I would still run 4 Enlightened Tutor.

I don't think Stax is the best idea because theese cards don't help the stax strategy and Stax needs every card it plays to be a bomb to work.

Here is my latest musing...

UW Control

//Combo
4 Enlightened Tutor
4 Transmutate Artifact
4 Painter's Servant
3 Grindstone

//Control
4 Force of Will
4 Powder Keg/Chalice of the Void
3 Back to Basics/Propaganda
2 Veldalken Shackles

//Draw
4 Brainstorm/Ancestral Visions
4 Spell Snare/Impulse/Counterspell

//Mana
4 Island/Chrome Mox
20 Land

What do you think?

It runs all the very best cards that make MUC good. Yet, it doesn't need to lock down the game like MUC does, just slow it down long enough that you can combo off.

I think the trick with this combo will be to run as little of the grindstone and painter as possible and still be consistent. Bare with my terrible math for a minute. Lets count Enlightened tutor and transmute artifact as painters & stones. Lets say our goal is to be able to combo off turn 3 consistently and also to assume that the deck will run 4 BStorms and at least some Ponders: that means well see around 12 cards from the deck so that means we need to run around 10 of the combo pieces, obviously were not going to run singleton of the win condition, so i propose

4 Brainstorm
4 Transmute Artifact
4 Enlightened Tutor
2 Ponder
2 Painter's Servant
2 Grindstone
- 18

as the combo search and draw base...

now we need to include some artifacts of 2cc and above for the Transmute artifact and other control elements:

Artifacts at first glance

4 Sphere of Resistance
4 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Veldalken Shackles
-10

Control at first glance

4 Force of will
2 Counterspell
2 Back to Basics
2 Propaganda
1 Impulse
-11

so so far i propose all the above with 21 lands as a potential starting point... of course i want to up the land count but i couldn't think of anything to cut at the moment. additionally i still believe the route of Pyro's and REB's and 4 painters with welders is another perfectly good valid direction for to go.

Mana Maze would be one way to protect the servant and it would make instants become orim's chants....woah im up too late...

Cire, I agree with you for the most part except for a few things...

We need to base this off of MUC. MUC runs stuff like Powder Keg, Propaganda, B2B and countermagic and such to lock the game down completely.

While we can't and should try for that. If those cards are strong enough to lock the game down, they should be good enough to delay your opponent long enough for you to combo out.

So I say, let base the build around a standard build of MUC, but with 4 Enlightened Tutor (good for fetching MUC's control elements as well), 4 Transmute Artifact (ditto), and 4 total combo pieces, 2 of each like you suggested.

So here is what we can learn from MUC. MUC lists run 24-25 land. Since we play brainstorm and ponder, we can go below that number, but not too far below it. (Our win condition is mana intensive after all).

22 is absolute minimum IMO.

Why the random 1 of Impulse? Random 1 ofs don't work well. We should either cut if for the extra land. Or we should replace Ponder with it, and cut ponder for the extra land.

Sphere of Resistence is a really really crap card in this deck. I see absolutely no reason to run it. We don't play stax cards, we don't attack their mana, we are a combo deck for gods sake, we need to be able to play out our cards fast.

I think the strongest candidate to replace it is Powder Keg, but I'm open to suggestions.

I don't think Thorn of Ametyst works well either. It should be some other controlish artifact. At the very worst, we could cut it to run 2 Spell Snare, and 2 Phyrexian Warbeast or Phyrexian Ironfoot for early defense against aggro rushes.

So basically, here is my suggested decklist...

4 Enlightened Tutor
4 Transmute Artifact
2 Painter's Servant
2 Grindstone

4 Brainstorm
2 Ponder/Impulse

4 Powder Keg
2 Veldalken Shackles
2 Phyrexian Ironfoot

4 Force of will
2 Spell Snare
2 Counterspell
2 Back to Basics
2 Propaganda

22 Land (Including Snow Lands)

Im starting to agree with you in the department of stax artifacts, theyre not that good without the other stax parts, but in order to abuse transmute artifact to its fullest we need at least 10 2 mana artifacts or above. Why 10? first of all we need 5 to reliably get one every game after seeing 5 cards (and 10 to see 2), but the trouble is were forgetting that in all probability the opponent's will destroy, duress or grip one of our artifacts. so in my opinion the deck should have a base of

4 Enlightened Tutor
4 Transmute Artifact
2 Painter's Servant
2 Grindstone

4 Brainstorm
2 Ponder/Impulse

10 2cc+ artifacts
4 Force of will
6 Other Control Stuff
22 lands

so basically the same as your build so far the only thing left is to figure out what are the best artifacts and control elements for this deck.

I still don't get why you want to use Transmute Artifact over, say, Fabricate or Intuition. Transmute isn't really cheaper, since you need to cast the other artifact before it, and like you said, it is useless without drawing another artifact. You might argue that the other artifacts support the game plan of the deck anyway and are not dead, but this is a) not true for the artifacts in your list (the Spheres actually slow you down pretty bad), and b) if you have a card in play that disrupts your opponent, wouldn't you rather keep it on the board then sac it ? Seriously, Transmute would be decent if you used that 2 mana sunburst artifact that makes mana, or transmuted artifact lands into LED, but the plan of playing otherwise not so useful artifacts to play a bad card over a better one is strange.

I can see it now, the sideboard tech will be Barrin's Unmaking and Sygg, River Guide.lmao

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Originally Posted by georgjorge

I still don't get why you want to use Transmute Artifact over, say, Fabricate or Intuition.

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I think you're missing the bigger picture with the Transmute idea. Transmute Artifact is a game-breaking card, which, paired with other artifact acceleration and disruption can be devastating. Like Transmuting Su-Chi into a Sundering Titan is actually pretty good. It's ultra-lateral depending on what other cards you're playing. In that particular instance, you'd have to play around with an artifact-based build, which isn't that difficult to achieve.

And I'm not referring to Mono U(/w) Stax.

He makes a good point though.

Intuition might be a better fit in a controllish build of the deck (which I think will prove to be the strongest approach), esp if you pair it with Accumilated Knowledge.

This way you don't have to devote so many cards to artifacts, and could play a full more blue to better support FoW, and play 4 Propaganda or a full 4 Back 2 Basics or 4 Thirst For Knowledge and such.

The fact is, all these cards have a casting cost 2U, which means such a build could support the 8 dual lands too which let you combo out for cheaper!

Something like this perhaps...

12 Land
4 Chrome Mox
4 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb

//Combo
3 Painter's Servant
3 Grindstone

//Draw & Tutor
4 Enlightened Tutor
4 Accumilated Knowledge
4 Intuition
4 Thirst for Knowledge

//Control
4 Force of Will
4 Propaganda
2 Back to Basics
2 Engineered Explosives
2 Powder Keg

You get the picture...

The build would be faster. And it feels like you are only devoting six cards truly to the combo, as opposed to 8-12.

Hell you could throw in Sea Drake/Serendib Efreet in place of Thirst For Knowledge and Back to Basics for beats/defense if you want.

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Originally Posted by Clark Kant

He makes a good point though.

Intuition might be a better fit in a controllish build of the deck (which I think will prove to be the strongest approach), esp if you pair it with Accumilated Knowledge.

This way you don't have to devote so many cards to artifacts, and could play a full 4 Propaganda and a full 4 Back 2 Basics and 4 Fact or Fiction (though I think the Intuition/AK combo should take the place of FoF) and such.

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True, but you also have to take into consideration that your putting yourself at risk by losing the other two cards you went to search with. Remember, this deck isn't like Aluren; You're not going to just drop these cards and win. You need to:

1.) Find them.
2.) Protect them.
3.) Resolve them.
4.) Protect them again (potentially).
5.) Activate one.

In order to do that, you need to create a surrounding cast of cards that will not only supplement the combo by searching and protecting it, you're going to need offense - or in essence an alternate win condition. Intuition could be good.

Well, the idea of the build was to use Intuiton for this only when you are absolutely desperate.

Most of the time between E. Tutor and your pieces and all the draw, you will get your combo in place eventually. You just focus on maintaining control of the board till then.

Thus Intuition should 9 times out of 10 be used to grab Accumilated Knowledge and get you massive card advantage.

You should usually play your first Servant imo since it lets you pitch your artifacts to feed FoW or Chrome Mox, and it works as early defense or offense in a pinch. It might also draw away removal from Sea Drake/Efreet when you are going for an aggro route.

Then the second Servant, or extra Grindstones, you can pitch to either FoW, Chrome Mox or Thirst. So your combo piece are only rarely dead weight.

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Originally Posted by Clark Kant

You should usually play your first Servant imo since it lets you pitch your artifacts to feed FoW or Chrome Mox, ...

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Mox says "nonartifact, nonland" - you can't pitch those cards to a Mox, even with a Painter in play.

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Originally Posted by Barook

Mox says "nonartifact, nonland" - you can't pitch those cards to a Mox, even with a Painter in play.

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Amusingly, the Painter's Servant can make a Mox that is already in play produce additional colors.

I think the shock value would be worth it to pitch a land/artifact to FOw though:smile: