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I don't like Spriggan either, but dislike Hystrodon more.Quote:
Originally Posted by puppektion
1. The morph ability will cost you 2 turns against a removal, the exact reason we see no Echo creatures in the list.
2. The card draw is very unreliable, on a 3/4 body which only begins to function on turn 4 (unmorph cost and Briarhorn cannot be played on the same turn).
3. I just noticed your list did not include Garruk which provides more card advantage in a mana economical way.
Well, to be fair, my list is unconventional in a lot of ways by this thread's standards... However, I have been noticing that my particular build does incredibly well in the mirror match, as well as against any other chalice stommpy (i believe pre-board, my Dragon Stompy matchup is 70% in my favor).
I run neither briarhorn nor Garruk, originally because I didn't have access to the cards (This is my deck in real life). But as I continue to see it in workstation, I feel like Briarhorn and Garruk are there to assist Spawnwrithe getting the damage through, which I don't like. If I wanted to bank on one creature dealing damage to the face, I'd be plaing goblins ;)
But seriously, I love Garruk, and I feel as though he could be good, but currently with my build, he's not. Hystrodon was originally added in the days that I was running Ravenous Baloth, but through testing, I ended up removing the baloth and Hystrodon made the cut. I'm honestly not sure what else to say at the moment...
It seems like Tinder Wall is likely to be better in many ways since it can give you a bigger boost and act on the same turn it's played.Quote:
Originally Posted by puppektion
Garruk and Briarhorn are quite popular with the other lists. I think I'd rather play something like Chameleon Colossus or Canker Abomination which is a direct threat.Quote:
4 Hystrodon
It seems like you'd be better of with something that acts directly on play like Thorn of Amethyst, another beater like Argothian Worm, a utility spell like Primal Command, or even Stunted Growth.Quote:
2 Plow Under
Tinder wall is anti-synergistic with Chalice of the Void, which is too good to cut.
I avoid Chameleon Colossus because it is quite mana-intensive... As for Canker Abomination, its just not all that great.
I honestly don't know how to respond to your suggestions of Thorn and Wurm in a way that wouldn't get me a nice big warning from the moderators. I had considered Stunted growth, but it seems by the time it would be cast, it would be less than all that great. Late game, almost all decks are going to have at least 2 lands in play, but not all decks are going to have cards in hand (i know a lot of decks that go to topdeck mode...) Primal command is a thought, but I'm not sold on it.
About 95% of the time I see a plow under, I win the game.
Ok here's my list.
Lands
4 [TE] Ancient Tomb
10 [B] Forest (2)
4 [EX] City of Traitors
Creatures
3 [FUT] Tarmogoyf
4 [MOR] Chameleon Colossus
4 [LRW] Garruk Wildspeaker
4 [SHM] Spawnwrithe
4 [AL] Elvish Spirit Guide
2 [EVE] Canker Abomination
Spells
4 [NE] Tangle Wire
3 [DS] Trinisphere
4 [MR] Chrome Mox
4 [MR] Chalice of the Void
3 [OD] Call of the Herd
3 [LRW] Primal Command
Sideboard
3 [TSP] Krosan Grip
3 [TE] Choke
3 [SOK] Pithing Needle
3 [DK] Tormod's Crypt
3 [MM] Rushwood Legate
Let me explane some of my choice:
The basic Prison structure stays cause it fit the deck perfectly.
Garruk Wildspeaker is a must I think as I use it for mana accel, tokens and the overrun effect.
Canker Abomination is good but you must play it in the first couple turns if you want it to perform. I've put only 2 in here for that reason.
Primal Command come in as a tool spell for games that start to drag a little.
I'll bring this deck to a tourny soon. I'll let you know what happened!
Tangle Wire seems like a very odd choice for a deck like this. Is there a particular reason that motivated it?
Tangled Wire is very useful to tap everything (or almost) your opponent control. This done, it's very easy to bring your big creatures up your opponent nose.
When you play Tangled Wire at first, it got 4 fading counters so your opponent got no choice but to tap 4 permanents. On your turn, you remove 1 fading counter and tap 3 of your permanents. (Tap Tangled Wire + 2 other things)
In my testing, the wires were very good most of the time. They can be sideboarded for something else if they don't work.
*EDIT*
I'm going to try instead a list with: -1 Garruk, -2 Canker and +3 Fyndhorn Elder.
The Fyndhorn Elder should help me fixing some mana problems and help with Chameleon Colossus +X/+X ability.
Just screwing around on MWS, I came up with this list:
4 Spawnwrithe
4 Manaplasm
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Briarhorn
3 Rushwood Legate
3 Garruk Wildspeaker
3 Harmonize
4 Chalice
4 Call of the Herd
2 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Chrome Mox
4 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
8 Forest
Basically, I decided to forgo disruption in favor of more explosiveness. Manaplasm can be silly early, especially alongside Briarhorn and Rushwood Legate, and Garruk for mana acceleration. Legate might seem a little strange, but the chances of her not being free are pretty small... and even if she isn't free, the deck can easily hardcast her (although it doesn't really want to). No board yet, but Chokes will definitely be in there somewhere, alongside probably Grips. I'm not sure yet.
I don't know if this is necessarily better than lists with Trinisphere or Plow Under, but it can have some pretty silly starts.
My most recent went 4-2-0 and took 12th place out of 60-some people. I'll give my list first, then go through the matchups that I had to endure.
// Mana
10 Forest
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Chrome Mox
3 Wall of Roots
// Threats
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Spawnwrithe
4 Call of the Herd
4 Hystrodon
2 Iwamori of the Open Fist
// Everything Else
4 Trinisphere
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Plow Under
// Sideboard
4 City of Solitude
3 Choke
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Plow Under
3 Krosan Grip
2 Pithing Needle
Round 1: Cephalid Breakfast
Game 1, I was on the draw. He opened up with Tropical Island => go. The first thing I thought was thresh. I proceded to drop a turn 1 spawnwrithe. After hitting him once in the face with it, he drops his nomads and illusionist on turn 3 and wins that turn (Kiki-Jiki - Karmic Guide - Sky Hussar).
My sideboard was out: 2 Plow Under, 1 Iwamori. In: 1 Jitte, 2 Pithing Needle.
Unfortunately, things didn't go too well there, despite the fact that I dropped a turn 1 trinisphere game 2. He got up to 3 mana, dropped a K-Grip at the end of my turn, and proceded to kick my teeth in the next.
Record: 0-1
Points: 0
Round 2: Cephalid Breakfast.
Game followed suit as the first one did. This guy (I'm assuming based on actions and the like) came in with the guy from round 1, and gave up extra counters for AEther vial. Game 1, he turn 1-ed me. Game 2, I was able to drop an early Chalice at 1 and trinisphere, and beat him down with Spawnwrithe and a morph. Game 3 was longer, and involved him dropping an AEther vial nice and early, and me trying to get through his Illusionist with my goyfs. He ended up pulling through, however.
Record: 0-2
Points: 0
Round 3: Rw Goblins
There's nothing like dropping a turn 1 trinisphere against goblins. Plow Under bought me some more time, leading to a threat, followed by a jitte.
S.B. Out: 1 Plow Under. In: 1 Jitte.
Game 2 my opening hand was miserable. Also, white was for more than just STP main deck; He sided in Disenchant. I was wrong to assume that I'd be able to ride a turn 1 trinisphere to victory again, and was vastly overwhelmed due to the few threats that I kept in my opening hand. I scooped that game before I became too frusterated.
Game 3, I opened up with a chalice at 1, followed by a turn 2 Trinisphere and a turn 3 threat. The game was won by the two Goyfs and the Hystrodon that I landed.
Record: 2-1
Points: 3
Round 4: UB Faeries
I felt really bad about this matchup. It was over in about 10 minutes (I'm not even kidding). I opened up the first game, turn 1 chalice at 1, turn 2 chalice at 2, and then he scooped to a spawnwrithe.
SB, Out: 2 Iwamori, 2 Plow Under. In: 3 Choke, 1 Jitte
Game 2 was similar, only it involved less chalice and more Jitte.
Record: 2-2
Points 6
Round 5: Mono-B Reanimator
Going into this matchup, I was shitting bricks. The threats that he had were more scary than anything in my deck, and come out pretty quickly. Luckily, my fears were fairly unfounded. Game 1, he was on the play. He started off with a turn 1 dark rit. => Buried Alive followed up by a turn 2 animate dead. I scooped there.
Game 2, I opened up with a trinisphere, and proceded to kick his teeth in with a spawnwrithe. Dark rit. is basically worthless with 3sphere in play :D
Game 3, he played a Putrid Imp on turn 1. The details of the remainder of this game are a little hazy, but I do recall an Iwamori beating face for the win.
Record: 3-2
Points: 9
Round 6: Mono-R Burn
I saw this matchup and couldn't stop smiling. Between Chalice of the Void, Trinisphere, and Umezawa's Jitte, this matchup was a breeze.
SB: Out: 1 Plow Under In: 1 Jitte
From there, it was cut to top 8 (unfortunately, I just missed that. Fucking Breakfast)
I'm looking for suggestions to improve my Sideboard. I would like to include some form of graveyard hate, and it seems like my weakest SB slot is the City of Solitude. Any help?
Sounds great! However, it seems that you've been siding out Plow Under alot. Not sure if it's worth the MD slot anymore. Would it be better if it were MD as something else? From my experience, running Winter Orbs and Tangle Wires are good in Stompy.dec (I'm experimenting them right now), and it improves the MU against combo and Landstill.
Not sure if Plow Under is good, it seems great on paper, but it doesn't justify its slot so far.
Hi,first of all sorry for replying a post that seems like it were dead but Iīm new in this forum and iīm testing a deck like the one is been argued here so iīm going to tell some thoughts i have about it. If moderators think this reply is not necessary, please feel free to delete it.
In my list iīm not playing any equipment. Why? Because our deck is green. This color has lot of pumpers that can be played here. Iīm playing with Moldervine cloak. This aura makes your critters the bigger monsters of the entire table. But the reason because this aura is good in this deck is because you can recover it (dredging 2 cards), feeding the tarmogoyf in the way and replaying it. Its cost is perfect 2G and can be imprinted on a mox. Because of that i prefer the auras to jittes or SOFI.HAve anyone tried it too?
Another card iīm playing is overgrowth. I think is better than elves and replace them in a sweet way. It comboes with Garruk and provides the green mana you are afraid of (and can be pitched to a mox too).
Iīve read the matchup against landstill is horrible, but any of you have used "bind" to improve this matchup. It counters EE, pernicius, fecth, vedalken and lot of crap any player can play agaisnt you, and itīs cantrip too.
About creatures iīm playing Spawnwrithe (superb), chameleon, briarhorn, elder and call of the herd and tarmogoyfs. I donīt like tarmogoyf because itīs boring (everybody plays them) but you know itīs good.
What do you all think?
Welcome to The Source, zabuza!
The deck is not dead, it just has not drawn much attention in recent months. Elephant Stompy is a decent Tier2 decks. The inclusion of 4 MD Trinispheres has much bettered its matchups against Combo, Aggro and AggroControl. It is as explosive as and more consistent than other Stompy variants, whereas it has no access to evasive creatures and suffers much from Engineered Explosives and Pernicious Deed, both heavily played in Legacy.
Concerning your card choices, they are good suggestions, but suboptimal within the current deck configuration.
The equipments played in the deck serve both as a removal and as a pumper. The ability to remove a Dark Confidant, some Goblin/Elf/Merfolk, etc. shines in various matchups. Moldervine Cloak may compete slots with Swords of Fire and Ice which seldom fulfills its removal role due to the lack of evasion, but never Jittes.
Overgrowth is only safe to be played on Forest, on which occasion you probably are not short of G manas. Moreover, with 4cc on top of the curve, 3cc mana accelerants do not deserve a slot, as was the argument for Wood Elves.
Bind is neat, yet passive and conditional. Stompy decks play aggresively; they tap out lands in the main phrase. Briarhorn is an exception which is just too good to be excluded from the deck. Choke is a better option against U-based Controls.
I've been thinking about Natural Order/Progenitus recently, and I came to the conclusion that it's exactly what this deck needs. It's awesome vs. board control, and it wins the game in a hurry. Also, I've been debating the pros and cons of running maindeck Choke. In a highly developed metagame (read: blue metagame) Elephant Stompy could be a force to be reckoned with. The doubts I've been having about this deck are starting to vanish.
Maybe something like:
4x Ancient Tomb
4x City of Traitors
10x Forest
4x Spawnwrithe
4x Tarmogoyf
4x Elvish Spirit Guide
3/4x Briarhorn
2x Chameleon Colossus
3/4x Call of the Herd
1x Progenitus
4x Natural Order
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Chrome Mox
4x Garruk Wildspeaker
4x Tangle Wire
I wish there were more good creatures at 2G, but there aren't. Some number of Briarhorn, Colossus, and Tangle Wire could be cut for Choke/Trinisphere. Otherwise both go in the sideboard.
I've been working on the same thing, actually. My list (its only been goldfished so far, but meh)...Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuma
Threats:
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Spawnwrithe
3 Briarhorn
3 Garruk Wildspeaker
4 Call of the Herd
3 Rushwood Legate
1 Progenitus
Other Spells:
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Harmonize
2 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Natural Order
Mana:
4 Chrome Mox
3 ESG
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
10 Forest
Some of the numbers are rough (3 ESG, 3 Garruk) but I doubt its a huge deal. I really like Rushwood Legate in here, because it costs you zero mana an overwhelming amount of the time, and even if it doesn't, it still fits the curve. It also lets you Natural Order out of nowhere with only 4 open mana. That being said, a Gray Ogre is still a Gray Ogre, so it might not make the final cut.
I'm not sure whether I'm going to keep the Jitte's, but they seem like they really could give the deck some much-needed utility, and are fast with Rushwood.
I also really want maindeck Chokes, but I'm afraid of them being dead draws... at least Rushwood can still do something when the opponent isn't running Islands.
Couple of ideas: what about Saproling Burst? Sounds decent with Garruks Overrun basically creating an instant win.
Also I think Skyshroud Poacher + Deranged Hermit could be what this deck needs. It wins when you get to activate it. Also allows for like a toolbox, we could add like Nullmage Shepherd which in combo with all the tokens could be decent. That said, this approach doesnt particulary solve the big inconsistency issue.
I dont know about tangle wire it seems good but Chrome Mox forces a choice between Jitte and Wire and I would have to give the nod to Jitte.
Is Spawnwrithe really worth it btw? You really need Briarhorn or Garruks Overrun to get it going. I mean I could see it being insane sometimes but other times very unimpressive as its very easy to stop as we have no access to removal.
Iīm considering on playing 4 loaming shaman maindeck (because it has 3 power and make goyfs (most played card on legacy) smaller and smaller) and playing survival of the fittest with the natural order_progenitus combo in it.
order is only 2gg casting cost, you can sacrify one of the spawnwrithe copies and with progenitus you can kill very fast.
Survival is for discarding progenitus when itīs in your hand and to search any crerature.resorce anytime.
What do you think about it??
I've cut Chameleon Colossus from my list entirely. With the addition of Natural Order, the deck has too many four mana cards. Right now I'm running Imperious Perfect to help ensure there are green creatures for Natural Order. Colossus is awesome, but Progenitus is so much better in the mid to late game.
Way too much mana.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantis
Way, Way too much mana.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantis
Tangle Wire is incredibly strong. Spawnwrithe followed by Tangle Wire is gg. Choke + Tangle Wire = gg. Garruk lets you virtually ignore Tangle Wire. Tangle Wire plus Trinisphere... you get the point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantis
Yes. Hell yes. Spawnwrithe is the second best creature in the deck after goyf. He ends games quickly if he isn't immediately stopped. You'd be surprised how often opponents can't block him early. Briarhorn, Tangle Wire, and Chalice at one make him even harder to stop.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mantis
Three Garruk is criminal. The card is too powerful to run less than four. Even if Rushwood Legate can be played for free, a 2/1 with no abilities is not what this deck needs. I'd cut it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roman Candle
I think if you're going to put Survival of the Fittest in Elephant Stompy, you should just play TEES or dedicated Survival instead.Quote:
Originally Posted by zabuza
Have you guys thought about Xantid Swarm main deck? What I mean is that Dragon Stompy got the moon effect to protect him. Playing a Green deck you can be very vulnerable to what your opponent play during your turn. Xantid Swarm can be played out the first turn and can be remove from the game for the Chrome Mox too.
With the addition of Progenitus and Natural Order to the deck, I think we need to be able to lock the table and protect ourself better. And same thing with the Blood Moon, they can be sided out if need be. Also Xantid Swarm can used like this:
Turn 1: Ancient Tomb + Chrome Mox + Xantid Swarm followed by a Chalice if you got one hehehe
Turn 2: Forest + Attack with Xantid Swarm + Natural Order (Sack Xantid Swarm here)
= Progenitus mouhahahaha!
I'm trying Werebear instead of Tarmogoyf. With the mana accel it provide it think it's going to be easier to play the chameleon, garruk and natural order.
So here how I'm going to playtest the deck:
Mana (26)
4x Ancient Tomb
4x City of Traitors
10x Forest
4x Elvish Spirit Guide
4x Chrome Mox
Threats (17 + 4 Xantid = 21)
4x Spawnwrithe
4x Werebear
2x Chameleon Colossus
3x Call of the Herd
1x Progenitus
4x Xantid Swarm
3x Garruk Wildspeaker
Lock and Progenitus Gear (13)
4x Natural Order
4x Chalice of the Void
3x Trinisphere
2x Tangle Wire
Sideboard (15)
3x City of Solitude
12x Insert "Meta Card" Here
I play in a CounterTop heavy meta. Let me know if I'm full of sh*t! hehehe
I took my latest Elephant Stompy list to my Friday legacy tournament and ended up splitting for first with a 4-1-1 record. Here's my list:
10x Forest
4x Ancient Tomb
4x City of Traitors
4x Chrome Mox
4x Elvish Spirit Guide
4x Tarmogoyf
4x Spawnwrithe
4x Briarhorn
3x Call of the Herd
2x Imperious Perfect
4x Natural Order
1x Progenitus
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Tangle Wire
4x Garruk Wildspeaker
Sideboard:
4x Trinisphere
4x Choke
4x Krosan Grip
3x Pithing Needle
Round one: Domain Zoo
Game one: I play an early Spawnwrithe, but it gets Lightning Bolted. He beats me down to 11 with Kird Ape and Wild Nacatl, but I take two to resolve Natural Order for Progenitus. He swings his Nacatl and Ape into Progenitus and I block the Nacatl putting me at 7. I swing with Progenitus and drop a Tangle Wire which seals the deal. He showed me his hand after the game and he would have killed me if I didn't drop the Tangle Wire. Tangle Wire forced him to choose between playing burn or attacking instead of both.
I don't have any sideboard so we go to game two.
Game two: I get off to a rocky start taking hits from a Kird Ape. A Tidehollow Sculler takes Natural Order out of my hand, but I stabalize with a goyf followed by an Imperious Perfect and a Call of the Herd token. He gets mana flooded and I'm able to win with a creature horde by evoking Briarhorn to let Spawnwrithe trample over his Kird Ape.
1-0
Round two: OneBigSquirrelGod playing Armageddon Stax
Game one: I don't have a lot of details about this game. All I remember is that I resolved Natural Order turn three and he didn't have an answer for Progenitus.
-4 Chalice of the Void, +4 Krosan Grip
Game two: I drop an early Spawnwrithe that gets removed with a Swords to Plowshares. He's stuck on a Flagstones and a City of Traitors, so I drop a Tangle Wire which buys me two turns. I play another Spawnwrithe which gets Oblivion Ringed, and he drops a Ghostly Prison. I draw Krosan Grip and I'm holding Grip, Chrome Mox, City of Traitors and two Natural Orders. I Grip his Oblivion Ring to get my Spawnwrithe back, play City of Traitors and Chrome Mox imprinting Natural Order, and play my last Natural Order for Progenitus. He can't find a Runed Halo or Armageddon effect and dies in two swings.
2-0
Round three: Rg Goblins
Game one: I drop an early Spawnwrithe and a Call of the Herd token. He leads with Mogg Fanatic and Goblin Piledriver. I hit with Spawnwrithe netting a token, but he drops Warchief and takes me to 9. I Natural Order for Progentius to his surprise, and a Tangle Wire seals the deal again.
-4 Chalice, +3 Pithing Needle, +1 Krosan Grip
Game two: I mull to six and keep an iffy but playable hand of City, ESG, Mox, Natural Order and two Tangle Wires. He leads with a Fanatic and I draw a third Tangle Wire. To make a long story short, the Tangle Wires buy me a lot of time, but I can't swing the game from his fast start and he overwhelms me.
+4 Chalice, -3 Pithing Needle, -1 Krosan Grip
Game three: I'm forced to mull to six again, but I get a ridiculous hand. Turn two Spawnwrithe, two goyfs on turn three and Natural Order on turn four. He never had a prayer.
3-0
Round four: yawg07 playing Ur Painter
I get paired down and give him the win so he can make the playoffs. We play for fun since he wants to see Elephant Stompy in action after hearing about its earlier exploits.
Game one: I mull to six again, but drop threats on turns one two and three and overwhelm him before he can set up the combo.
-4 Briarhorn, -2 Imperious Perfect, -1 Tangle Wire, -4 Natural Order, -1 Progenitus, +4 Krosan Grip, +4 Trinisphere, +4 Choke
I decided to board out the Natural Order combo since his deck was creature light, removal light and loaded with countermagic. The Briarhorns came out because he didn't have creatures big enough to be worth ambushing. I'd be interested to hear opinions on these board choices since this is my most controversial sideboarding of the night.
Game two: He leads with Grindstone and I lead with Chalice at one which he lets resolve. Turn two he plays a Painter's Servant, and I smile because I'm holding a Krosan Grip. I debate which of his artifacts to Grip, and decide on the Grindstone. I was fairly sure he didn't run bounce, and my Chalice already shut off his blasts. I pass the turn and he drops a third land (whew!) and swings with Painter taking me to 15. I try to play two Tarmogoyfs, but the second one is Dazed. I play Garruk which is also Dazed, and swing with a now 5/6 goyf. I play Call of the Herd which makes goyf a 6/7 and take him to 7.
He plays Engineered Explosives at zero and decides to chump my goyf with his painter. Next turn I take him to one, forcing him to blow Engineered Explosives to stay alive. Next turn he topdecks Grindstone, but he was stuck on four mana and couldn't blow explosives and play and activate Grindstone even if he still had his painter. Goyf finishes the job.
3-1 since I gave him the win
Top four vs. White Weenie:
Game one: I drop a turn two Garruk off ESG and untap two lands to play Call of the Herd. He drops a True Believer and passes the turn. I play another Call of the Herd and untap two lands for a Tangle Wire. I swing taking him to 17. I make a beast next turn and swing taking him to 11. He's still stuck under Tangle Wire and I activate Garruk's ultimate ability and finish him off.
I don't sideboard. This turns out to be a mistake.
Game two: He drops a turn one Mother of Runes, and a turn two Soltari Priest. I drop a turn two Call of the Herd and plan on dropping a turn three Garruk plus beater. However, he plays Ghostly Prison on his third turn, which turns out to be even better when I top deck a Spawnwrithe. I have a swarm of creatures, most of which have to sit on the sidelines, and I can only get him to 14 before a Serra Avenger and the Soltari Priest finish the job. Along the way he Oblivion Rings something of mine and tells me he has Runed Halo for Progenitus.
-2 Imperious Perfect, -1 Call of the Herd, -1 Briarhorn, +4 Krosan Grip. I'm not going to make the same mistake twice.
Game three: I'm a little tight on mana, but I play an early Call of the Herd followed by Tangle Wire. He has a turn one Mother of Runes, but I keep it locked down with my first and later a second Tangle Wire. I beat him down to 2 before my Tangle Wires run out of steam. I haven't been able to play anything else because of my Tangle Wires, and he drops a Soltari Priest and a Serra Avenger and hacks away at my life points.
Along the way I resolve two Tarmogoyfs, but he plays a Runed Halo naming Tarmogoyf. Fortunately I'm holding a Krosan Grip. He plays a Silver Knight and a True Believer. On my turn I swing with two goyfs and he asks the rest of the store's players who are now eagerly watching our game if I can Krosan Grip Runed Halo before damage. They tell him yes, and he debates whether or not I have the Grip and correctly decides to chump both goyfs while blocking my Call of the Herd token with his Mother of Runes. He plays a second Mother of Runes and takes me down to 6.
He's got a Mother of Runes, a Serra Avenger, and his sick Mother of Runes untapped against my two goyfs and elephant. I swing with everything since that's my only option for victory. He messes up and decides to let one of the goyfs through and I respond by Gripping the Halo.
4-1
I split in the top two with yawg07, finishing 4-1-1, and we all play some EDH.
I considered cutting Tangle Wire, but it won me four games that night. It definitely belongs in the deck as a four-pack.
Imperious Perfects were underwhelming all night. I'm going to cut them for a Call of the Herd and an Empyrial Archangel.
Natural Order/Progenitus won me five games and it is definitely the MVP of Elephant Stompy. Before Progenitus, there was no reason to play Elephant Stompy. Now I feel confidant saying that there is a reason to play Elephant Stompy. Faerie Stompy has Force of Will and eight Chalices, Dragon Stompy has eight moons, and Elephant Stompy has Natural Order and Tarmogoyf.
I think we can take the deck to Established as soon as I write a primer.
First of all, good job on your top 2! As I was reading your post I noticed that you sideboarded the Briarhorn a couple time. Was it that useful? I mentionned Xantid Swarm today. I know it got some anti synergy with the chalice but I think it could be a great way to use the Progenitus combo inside this deck. Either Xantid or City of Solitude MD to protect ourselves against countermagic, discard, etc.
Tell me what you think!
Thanks!Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfred
Briarhorn's main purpose is to ambush creatures during combat. Its secondary purposes are to help Spawnwrithe get over blockers and win goyf wars. It has some other miscellaneous uses like evoking to remove Bridge From Below.
Briarhorn wasn't particularly useful in that tournament, only winning me one game where it helped Spawnwrithe get over blockers. Still, he definitely belongs in the deck. He's invaluable versus aggro and aggro-control, although Briarhorn number four is a weak slot.
I took him out versus Painter because its biggest creature was 2/2. I took out one versus White Weenie because its biggest creature was 3/3 and multiples tend to be redundant.
I don't like Xantid Swarm. It's not a threat on its own, and it makes the deck too reliant on Natural Order. Trinisphere and Choke fill much of Xantid Swarm's purpose by hurting countermagic and the decks that run it. The same goes for City of Solitude. Keep in mind that City of Solitude makes Briarhorn terrible.
Remember, I won five games with Progenitus and five games without it. It's not the end all be all of the deck.
You're probably better off boarding out Natural Order against counter heavy, creature light decks like Painter and MUC.
That make a lot of sense. Then I think 3x Briarhorn should be good. I playtested with it a lot and I rarely used it. Maybe I got too exited by the Natural Order/Progenitus combo hehehe.
City of Solitude have to be in the sideboard at least I think. What was your sideboard?
I edited my tournament report to include my list and sideboard.
There is no reason to run City of Solitude. Trinisphere and Choke do the same thing and much more. They also don't hurt Briarhorn.
Alright, I've been working on Elephant Stompy (people in the local meta found it hilarious for me to unload early Garruks) and I've had a fair amount of success (Split top 2 of a 14 man tournament, watched my friend nearly win a dual at a side event for a Time Walk tournament). And after reading the success of Natural Order + Progenitus, I'm going to test that version out. Here's what I was working with:
4 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
10 Forest
4 Chrome Mox
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Spawnwrithe
3 Briarhorn
4 Call of the Herd
4 Garruk Wildspeaker
4 Wickerbough Elder
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Trinisphere
3 Sword of Fire and Ice
2 Sword of Light and Shadow
3 Harmonize
Board:
4 Krosan Grip
4 Giant Solifuge (Testing slot)
3 Tsunami
4 Loaming Shaman
A couple comments about card choices:
Wickerbough Elders have been fantastic in the main, they take care of so many problems. The Swords are perfect for the curve most of the time, and they randomly win you entire matchups. Harmonize lets you throw away an extra card or two to put down a Turn 1 Trinisphere, and lets you reload.
Tsunami vs. Choke - I tried out Choke, but since the deck usually has to take out win conditions to board in more disruption, Choke gives them too much of a chance to destroy Choke, whereas the combination of Tsunami and Trinisphere will take them almost out of the game entirely.
Right now, I'm testing out Giant Solifuge in the board, versus decks heavier on the creature control (Landstill is prominent in my meta).
When I get my hands on some incredibly overpriced Natural Orders I'm going to try out Progenitus and Empyrial Archangel.
I tried with order and progenitus but there is a reason because iīm not sold on it. If you draw progenitus you canīt discard it in order to order for it. It will remain in your hand till you won or die.
Kuma did you notice it. In your tourney this situation occurs? How can you discard progenitus to combo with the order??
Tangle wire in this deck is a house. And with spawnwrithe is nuts.
what do you think about playing manaplasm with tower above in order to kill opponentīs creatures and to make lot of damage. I think plasm belongs to this deck because you always are playing spells that pumps the ooze and its cc3 is really good in this deck. (tower above is easily playable in this deck).
iīll be waiting for your answers.
Well you can always throw Progenitus to a Chrome Mox. I don't think that the natural order combo is the only reason to play this deck. We run a high number of threats in the deck so Progenitus is not the only solution.
Manaplasm:
Card type: Creature
Creature type: Ooze
Power/Toughness:1/1
Casting cost: 2G
Card text: Whenever you play a spell, Manaplasm gets +X/+X until end of turn, where X is that spell's converted mana cost.
Tower Above:
Card type: Sorcery
Casting cost: 2g2g2g
Card text: ((2g) can be paid with any two mana or with G. This card's converted mana cost is 6.)
Until end of turn, target creature gets +4/+4 and gains trample, wither, and "When this creature attacks, target creature blocks it this turn if able." (It deals damage to creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters.)
I don't think we need a creature that become a threat sometimes. So I don't like that one. For Tower Above, I think Briarhorn is still better since we can use it as a beater too. And the GGG mana cost is not what we want.
I've given the Tower Above argument some thought, and I think it's worth testing in some builds. If you're running Tarmogoyf, you probably won't need anything besides Briarhorn to get through damage. I cut Tarmogoyf from my build, as it rarely got larger than a 2/3 on my own, and it ended up being incredibly underwhelming in the early game.
In non-Tarmogoyf builds, you've got to have another way to circumvent a large Tarmogoyf - I'm running Briarhorns and Swords, which is more than enough for my 3/3's to get there, since I'm usually not fueling the graveyard.
Granted, I'm unfamiliar with the Tangle Wire builds, and I think that'll give enough of an edge versus some decks to let Spawnwrithe take over.
The thing is that green hasnīt any solution to creatures. With tower avobe plasm becomes 11 trample wither and "destroy a creature an opponent controls". I think itīs a good thing. And you can tower a Spawn Writhe to make him pass through enemyīs army.
Beside of that plasm is going to grow almost every turn. Call of the herd (x2) and any other spell you play makes this guy bigger and bigger. also it fits perfectly with its 3cc (2G).
Order is awesome with progenitus, but without it, what creature are you going to look for?? a goyf?? a writhe?. Iīm not sure about it, but i think is necessary a way to discard progenitus when needed. I thought on using 1 gigapode so you can order it (when neccesary) and trade the 6/1 shroud to discard progenitus for ordering it later. What do you think about it?
thanks.
(Uyaro) Bee Sting and Hail Storm would like a word with you :smile:Quote:
Originally Posted by zabuza
I drew Progenitus once in eleven games. The amount of power you gain by running Natural Order is well worth drawing Progenitus once in a while. I'm going to add an Empyrial Archangel to my list for when I need to swing damage races. It will also help ensure I always have a Natural Order target.Quote:
Originally Posted by zabuza
Why on earth would you run Manaplasm + Tower Above when you could run Natural Order + Progenitus/Empyrial Archangel?Quote:
Originally Posted by zabuza
I've never tested Manaplasm, but I can see it being awesome once in a while and poor most of the time, especially with Tangle Wire.
Tower Above is garbage. It's dead if you don't have a creature and its mana cost means you won't be able to use it to boost Spawnwrithes early. Briarhorn >> Tower Above.
BriarhornQuote:
Originally Posted by zabuza
Fixed that for you.Quote:
Originally Posted by zabuza
It's not worth a slot in the deck to discard Progenitus the rare time you draw it. Just add an Empyrial Archangel.Quote:
Originally Posted by zabuza
The problem with Archangel is that it is also a dead draw. I have been testing a single copy of Krosan Tusker as an alternate Order target that is also not dead in the hand.
I don't know if it will end up being better than just running a second prog/angel, but I figured I'd give it a try.
Archangel may be a dead draw, but it can swing damage races when you're low on life. It's a far, far more attractive target than Krosan Tusker.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zork
Besides, Krosan Tusker is a dead draw 99% of the time if you're looking for a creature.
Hi people!
The first thing I want to say I'm glad to see people desinging interesting funny-to-play decks because I'm realy sick of Force of Will + Tarmo dominating the format. So the second thing is how to replace the fucking ugly big peace of I dunno what (Tarmo) in this interesting and funny-to-play deck? Our main problem is the lack of low-costed cool creatures/spells. We have Spawnwrithe, we have Trinisphere/Tangle Wire, but we really need the third one (Call of the Herd is bad 3cc + awful 4cc, but it's 1 card, so we still play it). And here we realy have no choice but to use that STRONG/FAT shit-color (yes, I hate Tarmo :tongue: ) monster for 2 mana.
Not long ago I've played with the original green stompy. That deck had 9 or 10 lands, lot 1cc dudes, pumping, berserk AND... Invigorate+Kavu Predator. It was fun almost casual (IMHO) deck with the very cute silly 32/32 suicide stampeding kavu on turn 2 (sometimes:smile:).
So my idea is to try that old-school Invigorate+Kavu in chalice/order shell. Let's look a little closer on Kavu. It's a 2/2 trampler for 2 (not so bad) that knocks out opponent's life gain (if any). Now Invigorate. +4/+4 for 3 smells bad, BUT! Here is the Chalice Aggro! 3cc is the best cc for us! And if we run Tangle Wire (not Trini) main, this card can help us to make realy funky tricks:cool: . And it's +4/+4 now and +3/+3 later for free with Predator. So here comes my version of Nature Stompy (IMHO this name suits the deck best)
/ Lands
4 Ancient Tomb
10 Forest
4 City of Traitors
// Creatures
2/3 Briarhorn
4 Spawnwrithe
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Garruk Wildspeaker
1 Progenitus
1/0 Empyrial Archangel
4 Kavu Predator
// Spells
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Chrome Mox
2 Call of the Herd
4 Tangle Wire
4 Natural Order
4 Invigorate
// Sideboard
SB: 4 Choke
SB: 3 Krosan Grip
SB: 4 Pithing Needle
SB: 4 Trinisphere
4 Tarmo -->4 Kavu Predator, here's no question (I don't want to say it's better this way, but it's boring to watch over that tarmowars).
But what to cut for Invigorate? Other Chalice Aggro decks run 6-8 equipment. I think that Invigorate must be somewhere in the equipment slot (no freaking metal, let's smoke some funny grass :wink: ). So I decided to play 4 invigorate + 2/3 Briarhorn in that slot. I want to run 3, but again, what to cut? Need to test (the list is about 20 min old:smile: ), but I think I'll try to cut Empyrial Archangel cause i never used 2 Orders in 1 match with original list. That's all for now. Sorry for somanywords and good luck to all with our green monster:smile:
Congratulations! I am looking forward to your primer!Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuma
Natural Order better fulfills the roles formerly done by Umezawa's Jitte. However, the deck is still not very consistently putting a Goyf/Spawn/Elephant on table and casting an Order next turn. What about running 9 Forests+2 Fetchs or 8 Forests+4 Fetchs?
I like your name suggestion Nature Stompy very much:smile: You hate Tarmogoyfs. Well, but he just rocks and replacing him just makes your deck more casual.Quote:
Originally Posted by eq.firemind
NATURE STOMPY (cool name)
I was thinking about this archetype some weeks ago, but I came up with something more like a Winter Orb/Tangle Wire/Quirion Ranger kinda thing. The list hasnt been tested yet, but it goes like
CREATURES
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Quirion Ranger
4 Wall of Roots
4 Goyf
2-3 Wickerbough Elder
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
2-3 Briarhorn
4 Garruk
OTHER SPELLS
3 Cursed Scroll
4 Tangle Wire
3 Winter Orb
3 Jitte
LANDS
4 Rishadan Port
4 Wasteland
10 Forest
SB
4Chalice of the Void
4 Trinisphere
4 Pithing Needle
3 Krosan Grip
The deck is meant to work directly on the mana base of the opponent, since you can easily get rid of the tangling and the orb effect with llanowar/ranger/wor. I personally see the elves as a much better option than mox in this list. Curse and Jitte are in to increase the aggro match up. Since the mechanics of the deck, I dont think Choke will be needed in the sideboard. Any comments?
I think the thing with tower above that people are missing is that it costs any of: GGG, 2GG, 4G, or 6. 2GG is a cost that could help an early spawnwrithe, so is 4G. It would be a sideboard card for sure, but I can see it having some use in a meta with a lot of aggro.
Seems like Empyrial Archangel is a sideboard card. Glad to see some solid work here. I'll have to test the Tangle Wire and see if it's worth it.
I'd board the Archangel, but the remaining 3cc options are so underwhelming.
My current list is the same as the last one I posted except -2 Imperious Perfect, +1 Call of the Herd, +1 Empyrial Archangel.
I'd love to see what you've been working on, Phantom. Haven't seen a list from you in a while.
Sadly I haven't been able to do much since Progenitus came out mull the deck over in my head. I was thinking of running 4 (?) fetches and a Dryad Arbor to help out natural order. That could fill the last spot. Or you could mainboard a Grip, which is almost always useful. Plus there's useful :2::g: cyclers like Wildsize or just straight up Ice Storm.
(I supppose there's always Gilt-Leaf Ambush which is a token generator and possible removal)
Iīm testing manaplasm (yes, i love it so much) with wildsize and itīs going very good for me. Plasm gains +5/+5 and trample wiz the wildsize (and you draw a card ;). The cost of this pumper is very good (2G) and itīs useful to make sapwnwrithe pass trough.
The tanglewires are wonderful, the buy for me lot of time to beat with writhe or to find order. The only thing is that if only we can play anything to recover them ;)
Iīm playing with 2 genitus too because if you draw one, you have another to look for, and i donīt like archangel (itīs easy to an aggro deck like goblins burn or stompy to kill her).
what do you think about this everybody?