[Deck] ANT (Ad Nauseam Tendrils) Storm Combo

While this strategy is pretty strong against Decks with only countermagic,it takes many turns to prepare a perfect setup.You have just 1 chance to execute the combo,if you fail to sequence your spells in the right order you will just die most of the time.you have to be 100% sure that your Natural Tendrils Plan works.
One of many ways to beat Decks like UR Delver,Patriot,Miracle and Landstill etc.

This strategy has also a few downsides as well:
you will loose to discard spells like hymn to tourach more often.
Remember that you want to assemble a hand with 7+1 Spell to combo off and each spell matters.
Secondly, this technique requires a lot of turns so it's not recommendet in a
combomirror.But that should be obvious.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Togores

Also there for the bolts matchups
Burn
Parriot
Rug delver
Ur delver

Also for miracles and blade control decks.

U can assemble the win thru lots of hard counters by putting u in a a hand of 8 cards and make them counter or chain cantrips to end in a lethal storm.

Also vs delver decks it gets changed for the ad nauseam. There you can nake like brainstorm, led led petal. Gain 10 lives and go on. Then win with the other tendrillss.
Also you can infernal for one tendrills with the other.
So u can go. Ritual ritual petal therapy. Tendrilss tendrills. And win.

Here you can see how good the second tendrills is. I showboated a bit but there u can get the idea.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6yeF6n_F-0w

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I'm personally not sure if the second Tendrils is better than say subbing in an Empty for AdNaus in the delver matchups.

I tested the empty one month long and also like 10 hours vs rug delver and always was a bad card. Everytime I didnt draw it naturaly was ust better to go any other route if I go to resolve and inferal with mana.

Thanks for the input will make sure to add a couple of carpets and start testing in our weekly legacy events.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Togores

Ur welcome
And congrats on your finish!

Just one question.
I already play 3 decay. U changed 2 carpets for 2 decay making the decay count to 5?
Dosnt seems right >.<

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yep, indeed.

the 5th AD is actually a karakas xp. Cause we got gaddock here...

Sry for the mistype ... was very tired aftrr the tournament

One thing I am uncertain of is what cards to take out for sideboarding. Should it be preordain first then probe and therapies?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Howishotgun

One thing I am uncertain of is what cards to take out for sideboarding. Should it be preordain first then probe and therapies?

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You want to figure out what you want to do and then go from there. Preordain is usually a safe cut, but:
http://www.starcitygames.com/article...mboarding.html

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zombie

You want to figure out what you want to do and then go from there. Preordain is usually a safe cut, but:
http://www.starcitygames.com/article...mboarding.html

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Thanks just what I was looking for

Going to GP:NJ, expected meta is as follows..

1. Miracles (18.4%)
2. UR Delver (12.3%)
3. Elves (7.9%)
4. DeathBlade (7.9%)
5. ANT (6.1%)
6. UWR Delver (4.4%)
7. RUG Delver (4.4%)
8. Reanimator (4.4%)

What would you suggest for a sideboard? How do you sideboard / play against U/R Delver? I'm playing all cantrips, except -1 preordain for +1 grim tutor. no tops, wishes, etc.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by southfloridamagic

Going to GP:NJ, expected meta is as follows..

1. Miracles (18.4%)
2. UR Delver (12.3%)
3. Elves (7.9%)
4. DeathBlade (7.9%)
5. ANT (6.1%)
6. UWR Delver (4.4%)
7. RUG Delver (4.4%)
8. Reanimator (4.4%)

What would you suggest for a sideboard?

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I think I would go with these 15:
3 Abrupt Decay (Miracles and generic anti-hate)
2 Pithing Needle (To combat top and to a lesser extent cards like Griselbrand/Sneak Attack/Shaman/Lilly)
2 Massacre (Very nice vs UWR and Deathblade in addition to the pure hatebear decks)
2 Chain of Vapor (catch all answer which can build storm)
2 Carpet of Flowers (UWR/RUG, not for BUG/UR/Miracles imo)
2 Xantid Swarm (SnT, Reanimate, can be okay against Miracles but they usually have answers)
1 Flusterstorm (For combo MU's and can be okay vs discard/tempo)
1 Empty the Warrens (I like it vs Tempo, not too bad vs Miracles either)

This weekend there is a huge Legacy Event Ladies and Gents:
Prague Eternal 2

One thing i can promise you is that i'll count to 10 again to defend my crown :)
Recently I got many questions about my current Deck build and thoughts on the perfect Stormdeck in our new metagame so i would like to share them with you.

Grinding station felt great during the latest testing sessions: it's a good feeling if you play against lets say UR Delver and have a natural Tendrils kill because we don't care about Grafdiggers Cage,Null Rod and Countermagic in general except Flusterstorm.
It's hard to execute but there is almost no way for our opponent to interact
with us because there is not a single spell which HAS to resolve except Mana.Multiple Past of Flames and Tendrils of Agony/Empty the Warrens are a good choice in a Metagame full of Countermagic for sure.

On the other side i also like fast kills.
As you know, i played a Ant Deck at BoM 9 with 2 Ad Nauseams and 1 Chrome Mox main to gain maximum speed and i liked it a lot because of all the turn 1-2 ad nauseam kills -> freewins.The perfect tool to crush elves,death&taxes,combodecks in general and other nonblue decks.


As an conclusion i want to play both (!) strategies this time in my Ant Deck to make it more flexible from Superfast to Superresistent.

I'll play one of the 2 strategies in my mainboard and play the other in my sideboard.
For example 2 Tendrils 1 Empty 2 Past in Flames in my Maindeck and 2 Ad Nauseams and 1 Chrome Mox in my Sideboard.
These Sideboardslots are totally worth it in my opinion and it feels great to sidestep my opponents hate. (ad nauseam doesn't care about GY hate for example unlike Past in Flames whereas Past in Flames works even on low life where Ad Nauseam becomes a dead card).

I'll post my list later but these are my thoughts for now.
Only 3 days left until Prag Eternal,looking forward to see you all there !

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sawatarix

Grinding station felt great during the latest testing sessions: it's a good feeling if you play against lets say UR Delver and have a natural Tendrils kill because we don't care about Grafdiggers Cage,Null Rod and Countermagic in general except Flusterstorm.

As an conclusion i want to play both (!) strategies this time in my Ant Deck to make it more flexible from Superfast to Superresistent.

I'll play one of the 2 strategies in my mainboard and play the other in my sideboard.
I'll post my list later but these are my thoughts for now.

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anxiously awaiting! dusting off non-TES storm this weekend and have never been into >12 cantrip ANT (and don't own a Grim Tutor)...

Imo not having access to grim tutor is not that bad. I have had one for a while and I am still just liking top better in it's spot.

Also I'm not sure how much I like having only empty and maybe pithing needle against bug with the sb up there, just feels awkward.

I like the second tendrils plan against ur delver, although I am still a player that has a tough time boarding out ad nauseam even against delver decks, I either draw it and brainstorm it back or am able to cast it fast before they can mount any offense. I realize it's bad but every time I see ad nauseam it's just 'pffftt legacy' and then winning.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sawatarix

This weekend there is a huge Legacy Event Ladies and Gents:
Prague Eternal 2

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Can't await it.
And the opponents will be like:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vt11202CXk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sawatarix

This weekend there is a huge Legacy Event Ladies and Gents:
Prague Eternal 2

One thing i can promise you is that i'll count to 10 again to defend my crown :)
Recently I got many questions about my current Deck build and thoughts on the perfect Stormdeck in our new metagame so i would like to share them with you.

Grinding station felt great during the latest testing sessions: it's a good feeling if you play against lets say UR Delver and have a natural Tendrils kill because we don't care about Grafdiggers Cage,Null Rod and Countermagic in general except Flusterstorm.
It's hard to execute but there is almost no way for our opponent to interact
with us because there is not a single spell which HAS to resolve except Mana.Multiple Past of Flames and Tendrils of Agony/Empty the Warrens are a good choice in a Metagame full of Countermagic for sure.

On the other side i also like fast kills.
As you know, i played a Ant Deck at BoM 9 with 2 Ad Nauseams and 1 Chrome Mox main to gain maximum speed and i liked it a lot because of all the turn 1-2 ad nauseam kills -> freewins.The perfect tool to crush elves,death&taxes,combodecks in general and other nonblue decks.


As an conclusion i want to play both (!) strategies this time in my Ant Deck to make it more flexible from Superfast to Superresistent.

I'll play one of the 2 strategies in my mainboard and play the other in my sideboard.
For example 2 Tendrils 1 Empty 2 Past in Flames in my Maindeck and 2 Ad Nauseams and 1 Chrome Mox in my Sideboard.
These Sideboardslots are totally worth it in my opinion and it feels great to sidestep my opponents hate. (ad nauseam doesn't care about GY hate for example unlike Past in Flames whereas Past in Flames works even on low life where Ad Nauseam becomes a dead card).

I'll post my list later but these are my thoughts for now.
Only 3 days left until Prag Eternal,looking forward to see you all there !

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Kai, if you want to gain an edge against Delver, as well as MB outs to stuff like Thalia or DRS, I suggest running MB Lightning Bolts. Removing their clock gives you plenty of time to sculpt a natural chain. Against decks which have no target of value for Bolts, they drastically reduce the required stormcount for natural chains. Nice feature: Lightning Bolts don't interfere with your MB Ad Nauseam like additional PIFs or the like would

Examples:
Bolt + opponents fetchland = only 8 stormcount required
2 opposing Fetchlands + Bolt + PIF = 6 stormcount required (like Bolting your opponents face eot and flash it back during your killturn)

My testlist atm with that idea in mind:

4 Polluted Delta
1 Island
2 Underground Sea
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Swamp
1 Tropical Island
1 Badlands
1 Volcanic Island

4 Duress
4 Brainstorm
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Ponder
3 Cabal Therapy
3 Lightning Bolt
1 Ad Nauseam
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Past in Flames
4 Lotus Petal
4 Lion's Eye Diamond

Best Wishes for Prague!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lemnear

Kai, if you want to gain an edge against Delver, as well as MB outs to stuff like Thalia or DRS, I suggest running MB Lightning Bolts. Removing their clock gives you plenty of time to sculpt a natural chain. Against decks which have no target of value for Bolts, they drastically reduce the required stormcount for natural chains. Nice feature: Lightning Bolts don't interfere with your MB Ad Nauseam like additional PIFs or the like would

Examples:
Bolt + opponents fetchland = only 8 stormcount required
2 opposing Fetchlands + Bolt + PIF = 6 stormcount required (like Bolting your opponents face eot and flash it back during your killturn)

My testlist atm with that idea in mind:

4 Polluted Delta
1 Island
2 Underground Sea
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Swamp
1 Tropical Island
1 Badlands
1 Volcanic Island

4 Duress
4 Brainstorm
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Ponder
3 Cabal Therapy
3 Lightning Bolt
1 Ad Nauseam
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Past in Flames
4 Lotus Petal
4 Lion's Eye Diamond

Best Wishes for Prague!

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I've recently come back to my true home of ANT and bolts are what I am currently testing as well. I've been trying a 2 MB (-2 preordain)/2 SB (-2 flusterstorm) approach and have liked it. I seldom have found them worthless.

Quote:

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mples:
Bolt + opponents fetchland = only 8 stormcount required
2 opposing Fetchlands + Bolt + PIF = 6 stormcount required (like Bolting your opponents face eot and flash it back during your killturn)

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Another idea for generating storm is lava dart, when you are generating storm: lava dart=+2 storm and 2 damage but lightning bolt is better with past of flames.

With so many ur delvers decks arround is time to storm again !!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lemnear

Kai, if you want to gain an edge against Delver, as well as MB outs to stuff like Thalia or DRS, I suggest running MB Lightning Bolts. Removing their clock gives you plenty of time to sculpt a natural chain. Against decks which have no target of value for Bolts, they drastically reduce the required stormcount for natural chains. Nice feature: Lightning Bolts don't interfere with your MB Ad Nauseam like additional PIFs or the like would

Examples:
Bolt + opponents fetchland = only 8 stormcount required
2 opposing Fetchlands + Bolt + PIF = 6 stormcount required (like Bolting your opponents face eot and flash it back during your killturn)

My testlist atm with that idea in mind:

4 Polluted Delta
1 Island
2 Underground Sea
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Swamp
1 Tropical Island
1 Badlands
1 Volcanic Island

4 Duress
4 Brainstorm
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Ponder
3 Cabal Therapy
3 Lightning Bolt
1 Ad Nauseam
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Past in Flames
4 Lotus Petal
4 Lion's Eye Diamond

Best Wishes for Prague!

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3 is too much, played 2 today into mediocre 2:2
1:2 Mono R control (seriously, insane Burn list running both Pillars and Eidolon, Simian Spirit guide and stuff like 4x Cave-In, obv. he had T1 Eidolon/Pillar every game and two if I can kill through one)
2:1 Rip Miracles (W leyline, hexproof guy, cannonist, I don't want face this ever again)
0:2 UR (slow hands sometimes they just have it)
2:1 Ant w MD Pyroblast (WTF?) - first time ever I wanted to SB out more cards then SB in, my SB was too experimental

I'll probably run it in a PE trial tomorrow, I like the SDTs a lot but meta just calls for Bolts

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Garritano

Thanks for the kind words!
Tendrils serves double duty, as it replaces Ad Nauseum against aggro decks that run burn and it comes in against Miracles.
I think you can shave 1 Chain of Vapor and use Abrupt Decay in its place. You already have 3x Xantid Swarm which you can use to beat Leyline of Sanctity.
(Leyline's function is protect the Show and Tell player from Duress, but you bypass that with Swarm which allows you to cast Ad Nauseum which finds the Chain of Vapor to hit the Leyline of Sanctity, clearing the way for Tendrils of Agony)
I'd consider swapping Dread of Night and Massacre.
Massacre does a good job against Thalia / Mother of Runes, and really only has trouble against Gaddok Teeg.
(Although Dread of Night doesn't kill Teeg, it does kill Mother of Runes, which clears the way for your Abrupt Decay to target Teeg).
However, Massacre also has utility against Esper after game 1, where you can use it to kill Meddling Mage, Stoneforge Mystic, and Deathrite Shaman. (of course, Dread of Night is unplayable against Esper).
If you had 3-4 slots against white, I'd probably recommend Dread of Night because 4x Dread of Night is better than 4x Massacre vs D&T, but at 2x I think Massacre is very good in its place.

I'd consider
(minor swap on your anti-white cards)
-2 Dread of Night
+2 Massacre
-1 Chain of Vapor
+1 Krosan Grip

I really really want to fit Empty the Warrens / Tendrils of Agony in your sideboard.
At this point, we're at impasse as we run out of cards.
You either drop to 2 Xantid Swarms or 1x Flusterstorm, and both are kind of ugly.
I think I'd rather run 1 Flusterstorm 1 ToA/EtW over 2 Flusterstorm, despite how awkward looking it is to have a singleton Flusterstorm in the sideboard. You're going to run into a ton of UR Delver, where you'll want to board -1 Ad Nauseum +1 ToA. The question is whether you'll willing to lose some match win % against the mirror in order to "upgrade" Flusterstorm into Tendrils against UR Delver. I am personally okay with this.

Lastly, make sure you do more consideration of Pithing Needle. It really is an awesome card, but would require you to play a new strategy vs Miracles.

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I'm getting more and more convinced about the second Tendrils in the board as I continue testing it, more vs. Miracles than UR Delver/Tempo.decks . But I'll come back to it later. Following your order of topics: I know that Massacre is really good, especially because it's a godlike card even vs deathblade, and I agree that as a 2-of Massacre is maybe better. But what pushes me to Dread is that you land it and it kills Aven Mindcensors that could be flashed in when you try to go off, and also Vialed-in Thalias. I lost some matches for not being able to get rid of the Mindcensor in opponent's hand, and I'm stuck on Dread for that, mainly. Yes it doesn't kill Canonists and Revokers, but it kills Mother of Runes, which allows you to Decay/bounce the annoying hatebears.

As said before, I agree with you in trying to fit a Tendrils in the board, but I considered some things. Thanks to Bob Huang we can figure out what the current meta is right now:

1. Miracles (18.4%)
2. UR Delver (12.3%)
3. Elves (7.9%)
4. DeathBlade (7.9%)
5. ANT (6.1%)
(5. Show.decks: OmniTell 3.5% + Sneak & Show 2.6% = 6.1%)
6. UWR Delver (4.4%) (Team America in Europe)
7. RUG Delver (4.4%)
8. Reanimator (4.4%)

In Italy (and Europe in general, I think) we have not so much Patriot (UWR Delver), but we have Team America, and we have not so much Elves and Reanimator as the U.S. have, but we have a considerable number of Show decks. I have united the two decks into a unique Show and Tell archetype to show that it has a considerable slice of the metagame, as it's equal to the one of ANT, at the fifth place.
Considering that, the cards that I for sure *don't want* to drop are:
3 abrupt decay
3 xantid swarm
2 chain of vapor

And I think we are pretty much sure about that.
I thought I could drop a Top, going down to 1 in the board, and a Chain, going to 2, in order to have room for 2 cards, which could be 2 Krosan Grips or 1 Krosan Grip and 1 Tendrils.
Talking about Flusterstorm, I'm liking it a lot right now, because it's really good against a lot of the tier decks of the moment. Let's analyze the list above: Flusterstorm is great against ANT, RUG Delver (Canadian Threshold), Show.decks, Reanimator, maybe Team America if we talk about the new versions with no-discard and Stifles. Those are 5 tier decks, where Flusterstorm really shines, and that's why I'm so reluctant to drop them. On the other hand the second Tendrils is great against Miracles, UR Delver, and Canadian Threshold. And I must consider that I'm really fine not boarding at all against UR Delver, as I think it is a really really easy match-up, isn't it? So, right now, I'm thinking about something like:
1 Sensei's Divining Top
2 Flusterstorm
2 Chain of Vapor
2 Dread of Night
2 Krosan Grip OR 1 Krosan Grip 1 Tendrils of Agony
3 Xantid Swarm
3 Abrupt Decay.
What do you think about my whole point?

I don't know if this is the right thread but I have to say that multiple tendrils is a very good strategy in actual metagame. Less discard makes this strategy pretty successful, since it is unexpected and punishes unprepared opponents. Assembling 8 black mana is quite easy after all, when you only care about stifles and flusterstorms and your opponents are waiting to counter your nauseam or infernal tutor.

For reference, my recent list is a stock Grinding Station list:
15 lands (bayou and tropical among them)
4 brainstorms
4 ponders
4 probes
4 cabal therapies
2 duresses
4 dark rituals
4 cabal rituals
1 rain of filth (awesome)
4 tendrils
2 pif
4 leds
4 lotus petals
4 infernal tutors

Sideboard:
3 carpets of flowers (necessary to support multiple tendrils strategy)
4 abrupt decays
2 krosan grips
2 chain of vapors
4 meta slots: for storm and fast combo mainly