[Deck] Goblins

I really don't want to crash the party, but I fear that Goblins are even less playable now than before.

For the last few months Jon (jrw1985) has been the only one reporting good results with Goblins on a regular basis. However, what made his list different from most other decklists was the inclusion of a full playset of Mental Misstep.
Secondly, what made Goblins such a poor deck lately was not Mental Misstep but the rise of Stoneforge-strategies and several other decks that are just too good preboard for Goblins to stand a chance. A playset of Missteps seemed to help Jon to drag those decks down on a level where he could beat them.
Now, call me a pessimist, but IMO there is no "dragging down unfair decks" anymore.

Our major problem seems to be that we rely on our core functioning, and that means we really do need our lackeys.. If lackeys connect then we can play more siege gangs and pump piledrivers.
So Mental Missstep did help protect lackeys from stp & l.bolts, but now it has been banned how else do we protect our lackeys?
What about mother of runes? in my white list i would just replace my stps, although this would mean i have less removal however it might help my lackeys and afterwards piledrivers. Of course this requires an extra turn to drop the mother of runes first.
after all going all out with instigators and chieftains doesn't seem to race other decks enough, so i fall back to stalling and playing for my matrons and ringleaders for the mid game, or the gang bang explosive start.
Because our core is 26 cards with a minimum of 22 land and we need 30 goblins, we don't have many non goblin / non vial free slots ( eg 3-4 cards), but we need something. Are mother of runes playable for us?

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Originally Posted by GoboLord

I really don't want to crash the party, but I fear that Goblins are even less playable now than before.

For the last few months Jon (jrw1985) has been the only one reporting good results with Goblins on a regular basis. However, what made his list different from most other decklists was the inclusion of a full playset of Mental Misstep.
Secondly, what made Goblins such a poor deck lately was not Mental Misstep but the rise of Stoneforge-strategies and several other decks that are just too good preboard for Goblins to stand a chance. A playset of Missteps seemed to help Jon to drag those decks down on a level where he could beat them.
Now, call me a pessimist, but IMO there is no "dragging down unfair decks" anymore.

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Originally Posted by Sarcomot

Correct me if I'm wrong (relatively new to Legacy), but wasn't it Mental Misstep that allowed Mystic decks to come to power in the first place?

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I'm pretty sure it was batterskull.

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Originally Posted by Sarcomot

Correct me if I'm wrong (relatively new to Legacy), but wasn't it Mental Misstep that allowed Mystic decks to come to power in the first place?

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No, actually it was Batterskull who empowered them. The many non-U Stoneforge-strategies (like Maverick, Patriot) have been (and will be) much more problematic than UW-Stoneblade.

On the bright side, if this deck isn't competitive anymore that makes it much more likely they will unban Recruiter in December.

Edit: And on a slightly more constructive note if the meta shifts to a direction where we need to answer creatures you can just switch your MM's for Bolts.

Mental Misstep was banned today. I think the next step is to play a set of bolts or tarfires to deal with turn 2 mystics. Hopefully we should be able to keep them off Batterskull mana.

Resurgence?

I think Goblins will be back to the radar, even if not at full power. In fact, it's been a long time since goblins were at full power, so nothing new here.
Goblins had to play Misstep to handle opposing missteps. Without opposing missteps, it will be harder for opponents to handle first turn vials, and they'll have to spend removal or trade 1-drops with lackey. If they don't have removal/one-drops, we know what happens.
Also, decks that have a good early-game are favored in an environment without misstep.
Last, if equipment is a problem, we can always splash green for TSH, Ancient Grudge or Krosan Grip.

Goblin players, welcome back.

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Originally Posted by DragoFireheart

Goblin players, welcome back.

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Woot :) missed my little green men.

Yeah, the banning of Mental Misstep certainly helps Goblins to at least become a tier-two deck again. It had completely fallen off the map in large part because matchups with blue decks that were previously favorable became non-favorable because vial and lackey could be countered much easier. Now, in a post-misstep Legacy, Goblins becomes a viable choice against a heavy-blue meta that is light on combo decks.

I for one look forward to being terrified at the sight of a pesky little 1/1 on turn 1 sitting across the table from me again. Just please, don't hit me in the face.

Am I the only one who is concerned that with MM out of the picture our combo matchup is back in the pits? I use to play the full playset and was loving it.

I'm not overly concerned with Batterskull and Stoneforge Mystic because I didn't need MM to beat those cards (just Tarfire which might be even better now with MM gone) but I seriously have no idea how to deal with combo decks now...

Mental Misstep is dead, long lives Gutshot :))

Combo decks are still problematic like they've always been. It's too soon to tell what flavor of storm will make a resurgence. Cabal Therapy and REB are pretty good against High Tide and Chalice of the Void is good against the Dark Ritual variants.

... I also recommend becoming a religious man.

Combo will be as hard as it was before. I used to run 6-8 combo hate sb (between ReB, Chalice, Trap, Cabal, Squad, Thorn...).
Max on ReBs because of Merfolk and CB. It is also useful vs Storm.
We need Grave-Hate again, more than ever. If it can be useful against Storm, better.
My MD will be tailored to fight creature decks, with Tarfires and stuff. SB against broken stuff.

I think goblins can be great in the new environment.

I haven't actually had the chance to use Chalice against combo decks but it sound's decent. I presume one plays it for 0 against ANT, to stop them from casting their artifact mana, or maybe set it to 1 against high tide and such?

Also, one of the cards the beats my face more often then not is Dueling Grounds. Has anyone had any similar experiences with that card?

I still have mixed feelings about MM-banning. Can't fight StP anymore or Combo Brainstorm or the Bolt, that hindered my lethal Piledriver from killing the opponent...
So are there any ideas for the free spots? I acutally like mother of runes on second thought, cause it makes lackey connect even lategame and drop an important guy.
Before packing Bolts, I'd play 1-2 Pyrokinesis MD, cause it trades 2 to 1-4 and doesn't require mana at all.
I was playing 2 Tarfires already, so maybe making it a playset? What about Mogg Fanatic, MWM or even Goblin Guide to increase the pressure?
I still believe splashing black is a great idea these days, cause so many green creatures are walking tall and perish is a bomb. For artifact hate I got to like Tuktuk but Ancient Grudge is still a 1 for 2 so thoughts about that?
I'd like to get some nice arguments for splashing white before we can jump up and down, that MM is gone.

I was not kidding btw.
Gutshot is really good right now :D just tested in in a few games
and its a tempo bomb against many targets.

Sad to see misstep go. next time, either don't print cards like these, or leave them unbanned.

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Originally Posted by ThoSha

I was not kidding btw.
Gutshot is really good right now :D just tested in in a few games
and its a tempo bomb against many targets.

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My problem with it and Mogg Fanatic is that they can't take out a Stoneforge Mystic. You REALLY need to take that guy out before they cheat Batterskull in.