[Deck] Aggro Loam

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Koby

There are always StP and PtE, but Tony is still hesitant to splash White.

---

Four colors fuck up the mana way too much in this deck. Many decks with Delver and/or Tombstalker will have Wasteland and I don't want to need a Mox Diamond to avoid getting tempo'd out of my removal. Terminate, Go for the Throat, and Dreadbore are already on-color and I don't think Spell Snare is that hot right now (and not really against this deck, either); it's just that you want your removal to be Daze- and Spell Pierce-proof as soon as possible in those matchups.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aggro_zombies

Four colors fuck up the mana way too much in this deck. Many decks with Delver and/or Tombstalker will have Wasteland and I don't want to need a Mox Diamond to avoid getting tempo'd out of my removal. Terminate, Go for the Throat, and Dreadbore are already on-color and I don't think Spell Snare is that hot right now (and not really against this deck, either); it's just that you want your removal to be Daze- and Spell Pierce-proof as soon as possible in those matchups.

---

We're playing Dearthrite Shaman now right? He provides some color fixing. Mox Diamond too. What is the risk? There is no 1 mana removal that will satisfy both "deals with any creature" and "not become countered". Those are mutually exclusive.

You could try dreadbore. Sure it's a 2 mana sorcery but it's good against delver and stalker as well as jace, TMS. It's really sad that ghastly demise doesn't work at all right now since it doesn't kill stalker or opposing shamans for that matter.

Spell snare is kind of picking up in popularity a little but spell pierce is still the main issue with the card in my eyes.

Dismember is something this deck really doesn't want with the -4 life part of it. And if you're paying just 2 life why not terminate?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Koby

We're playing Dearthrite Shaman now right? He provides some color fixing. Mox Diamond too. What is the risk? There is no 1 mana removal that will satisfy both "deals with any creature" and "not become countered". Those are mutually exclusive.

---

Eh, I'm still reluctant to do it. It feels like an on-color solution would be safer even if it means giving up some raw power.

Dreadbore may be better against slower BUG decks, but they probably don't leave their Lilis in after sideboarding, so who knows. I'm also suspicious of sorcery-speed.

I don't think it's worth splashing white for Swords or Path.

I think plain old Lightning Bolt might be the best. Kills Delver more reliably than anything else in black. Tombstalker might be annoying but you have Shaman and Ooze to eat their graveyard and Maelstrom Pulse if he hits play.

If you want strictly instant-speed general purpose removal Go for the Throat is probably best.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by trivial_matters

I don't think it's worth splashing white for Swords or Path.

I think plain old Lightning Bolt might be the best. Kills Delver more reliably than anything else compared in black. Tombstalker might be annoying but you have Shaman and Ooze to eat their graveyard and Maelstrom Pulse if he hits play.

If you want strictly instant-speed removal Go for the Throat is probably best.

---

Terminate is the best 2-drop removal. The decks plays abundant red sources, and there's no point to play inferior removal.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Koby

Terminate is the best 2-drop removal. The decks plays abundant red sources, and there's no point to play inferior removal.

---

Yeah, I guess Terminate is better. For some reason I'm always a bit hesitant to play it due to its casting cost. Most likely unwarranted though, especially now with Shaman.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by trivial_matters

Yeah, I guess Terminate is better. For some reason I'm always a bit hesitant to play it due to its casting cost. Most likely unwarranted though, especially now with Shaman.

---

I haven't played this deck since Abrupt Decay came out, so I'm not entirely sure how fetching priorities have changed, but having black mana was usually more of an issue than red.

The three best options I have in mind thus far:

Bolt: kills delver and shaman, teams up with lavamancer against goyfs and tombstalkers, instant.

Forked Bolt: kills delver and shaman, two-for-ones people, etc.

Spark Spray: kills all X/1's at instant and can save loam via cycle. I like the versatility of this, but not getting shaman is a major drawback.

4 Countryside Crusher
4 Dark Confidant
4 Deathrite Shaman
2 Grim Lavamancer
2 Tarmogoyf

Lands (26)

1 Forest
1 Swamp
2 Badlands
1 Barren Moor
1 Bayou
1 Bloodstained Mire
4 Forgotten Cave
3 Taiga
1 Tranquil Thicket
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland
2 Wooded Foothills
1 Volrath's Stronghold

Spells (18)

2 Engineered Explosives
3 Mox Diamond
2 Seismic Assault
1 Sylvan Library
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Life from the Loam
2 Maelstrom Pulse

Sideboard
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Tormod's Crypt
4 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Choke

7th Place at StarCityGames.com Legacy Open on 12/16/2012

use this as a jumping off point

I would probably drop the EEs and Pulses for Bolts, as it's one of the best ways to kill Jace and he's basically all we care about that Decay can't hit. I'd also find a place for Koth in the board, because I think he might be the answer to the Miracles/Stoneblade matchups. Otherwise I think this is pretty close to the list a friend made Day 2 at GP Denver with. Maybe someday he'll post it.

Does Koth kill them fast enough, though? The 4/4 can easily get trumped by Lingering Souls/Batterskull and you don't actually run that many Mountains for the ultimate.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aggro_zombies

Does Koth kill them fast enough, though? The 4/4 can easily get trumped by Lingering Souls/Batterskull and you don't actually run that many Mountains for the ultimate.

---

Honestly haven't tested it. I just like it on paper because we know Loam/Seismic is going to be attacked postboard, most likely through grave hate. You can still drop guys they have to deal with like Crusher and Shaman, and even if you don't use his ultimate as a kill condition, you can use it to clear out a bunch of souls tokens, Jace, Snapcaster, Stoneforge, etc. I think between Mox/Deathrite cranking him out on turn 3, and Bolt/Decay snubbing the Stoneforges, his +1 is probably pretty useful.

played list i posted at a 22 man event on tuesday, went 3-0-2, drew with elves unintentional, and drew intentional last round, deck was interesting, explosives is exellent against current meta of goblins, bug and other creatures, it was an interesting experience playing the build. Chalice out of the board was insane, just insane all day. Revoker was very good in almost every matchup, unlike needle, you can name a mana producer such as mox opal and completely shut down deathrite shamans.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FlyingSkull13

played list i posted at a 22 man event on tuesday, went 3-0-2, drew with elves unintentional, and drew intentional last round, deck was interesting, explosives is exellent against current meta of goblins, bug and other creatures, it was an interesting experience playing the build. Chalice out of the board was insane, just insane all day. Revoker was very good in almost every matchup, unlike needle, you can name a mana producer such as mox opal and completely shut down deathrite shamans.

---

Pithing Needle shuts down Deathrite Shaman as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by trivial_matters

Pithing Needle shuts down Deathrite Shaman as well.

---

Does not shut off land exiling as that is a mana ability.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Antonius

Does not shut off land exiling as that is a mana ability.

---

From Oracle 10/1/2012: Because the first ability requires a target, it is not a mana ability. It uses the stack and can be responded to.

My list I'm tinkering with:

3 Deathrite Shaman
3 Countryside Crusher
2 Terravore
4 Dark Confidant
2 Tarmogoyf
14

4 Life from the Loam
2 Seismic Assault
2 Punishing Fire
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Lightning Bolt
2 Sylvan Library
2 Faithless Looting
3 Mox Diamond
22

3 Grove of the Burnwillows
2 Taiga
2 Badlands
1 Bayou
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Bloodstained Mire
3 Wasteland
1 Volrath's Stronghold
3 Forgotten Cave
2 Tranquil Thicket
1 Forest
1 Mountain
25

-Matt

@Deathrite Shaman and Pithing Needle: Pithing Needle stops all three abilities of Shaman. Also, if you exile the card targeted by Shaman the ability fizzles. Useful if you have your own Shaman or a Scavenging Ooze out and want to deny your opponent the mana or the life-gain/loss.

@sdematt: I would be hesitant to cut both Maelstrom Pulse and Engineered Explosives because of Miracles. Apart from that and only 3 Wastelands, it looks good. Punishing Fire is a cool card. Maybe add a 3rd though?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by _Fe_

From Oracle 10/1/2012: Because the first ability requires a target, it is not a mana ability. It uses the stack and can be responded to.

---

Also note that all his abilities have the exile clause after the colon, and are therefore not part of the cost like with Lavamancer. Learned that one the hard way.