[Deck] Aggro Loam

I stand corrected.

@ SDE Mat: I have to be honest, I never really liked the Grove/Fires combo. It's clunky and slow. However, since the last time I experimented with it, three significant things have changed:
1. Faithless Looting - allows you to turn punishing fires into extra cards. This is a CA combo I really like.
2. Deathrite Shaman - more accel speeds the combo up and the fact that everyone's playing Deathrite also makes Fires that much more relevant as recurring remova.
3. Abrupt Decay has slowed down the format -at the very least, the fair decks are a bit slower now, making Punishing Grove more playable.

that said, the Grove itself still kinda trashes your manabase. Furthermore, with Deathrite now, it seems like tip-toeing across the finish line by dinging them here and there with a bob attack and some drain life activations lavamancer shots and bolts will happen a lot more often. That's a big part of the reason I plan on running lightning bolt again. Giving them life via grove is a little counter-intuitive to that plan.

Lastly, running terravore seems kinda loose. Run 4 deathrite 4 crusher. Those guys are insane. And if you're going to experiment with the grove/fires, just run four fires so you can get a real good idea of how good it is. Personally, I wouId not run more than 1 sylvan. I like the interaction of recuring fires with faithless. I might have to try it myself.

There's also the fact that Grove is actually just awful by itself. If you side out Fires - and I tended to against decks that didn't have a lot of creatures because it was glacially slow - you're still stuck with this terrible land in your maindeck that you can't fetch and rarely want to use for colored mana.

Plus, I think most opponents have figured out that the correct time to nab your Fires is in response to their return triggers. It's very hard to proactively return a Punishing Fire to your hand against graveyard hate.

Hi,

What do you think about making AggroLoam deck in way similar to popular Jund? I'm thinking about adding Bloodbride Elves, Lilianas, maybe some discard etc.

3 Mox Diamond

4 Deathrite Shaman
3 Bloodbraid Elf
3 Countryside Crusher
4 Dark Confidant
2 Tarmogoyf

3 Seismic Assault

3 Life from the Loam
1 Maelstrom Pulse

4 Abrupt Decay
2 Inquisition of Kozilek

3 Liliana of the Veil

1 Forest
1 Badlands
2 Bayou
2 Bloodstained Mire
4 Forgotten Cave
3 Taiga
1 Tranquil Thicket
4 Wasteland
4 Wooded Foothills
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Swamp
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Barren Moor

For sure it is not an ideal list, treat it like a example. Maybe it is time to cut Mox Diamonds and add more discard?

BBE doesn't look that great in that list. Cascading into Mox Diamond, LftL, or discard is so-so, while cascading into Assault means you win pretty much regardless of your BBE. Liliana and Assault in the same deck strains your mana even with Diamond and DRS, and that problem will get worse if you decide to cut Diamonds since your available fixing drops to just fetches and DRS (and Loam if you squint, but that requires mana and time). Granted, Assault is a finisher and Liliana is something you want to get going in the midgame, but it still makes your fetching decisions awkward since you want access to BB, RR, and G around turn three or four so you can cast Crusher, Abrupt Decay, Liliana, and/or Loam if you have them, and then you want RRR at some indeterminate point in the future to actually win.

You also seem light on ways to kill an opposing DRS. I'd want some Bolts at least.

If I'm going to cut Diamonds for discard, I'd want to dispense with Loam entirely and just play Jund. That deck is doing much better right now and doesn't have "DRS Me Out Of The Game" written all over it. If you're going Aggro Loam, play to the deck's strength as a midrange board control deck.

I tried running Deathrite over Diamond, but there's just too much maindeck Rest In Peace locally to make it worth it. Switched back to Diamond and tried a threat base of 2 Goyf, 2 Ooze, 4 Crusher, 4 Bob, 2 Koth main this week. Went 2/2, lost to Cascade BUG with Leyline/Helm postboard, and Enchantress (lost one I should have won), beat Countertop and Esper Blade, fairly happy with Koth so far.

This is my current list as of today:

4 Mox Diamond
4 Chalice of the void

3 Seismic Assault
4 Life from the loam

4 Dark Confidant
4 Countryside crusger
4 Tarmogoyf
1 Terravore
1 Eternal Witness

2 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Abrupt Decay

3 Taiga
3 Badlands
2 Mountain
1 Forest
2 Wooded foothills
3 Bloodstained Mire
1 Verdant catacombs
3 Forgotten Cave
3 Tranquil Thicket
4 Wasteland
1 Volrath's Stronghold

I love running Chalice of the void in place of playing any 1 drop. Deathrite Shaman has not been a problem so far. The Chalice keeps any treat I play from being easely removed (unless killed via Abrupt Decay of course). Really helps against combo too. You guys should try it.

I wish I could fit one Sylvan Library into my list, but I feel like every card shouldn't be removed. Terravore won me so many games by itself. Eternal Witness made me win a few games getting back Seismic Assault or removal.

It's a strong list. I am running the punishing fire/ deathrite version right now and i have to say it's quite fast and has strong synergy. I would agree with you that chalice is the very strong and does keeps your threats safe but it could just get removes with a decay then everything would be fair play again. And it is strong against combo but most of the best combo decks right now are the show n tell decks, now even elves running Natural Order. So I guess my the only thing that would also help me justifying your main; whats your Side Board look like? lol

Example of synergy that i always seem to get.

On the play.

Land fetch, DRS. Pass. Opponent usually tends to ponder, delver, opposing DRS, discard or just pass the turn.
Wasteland. Exile with DRS for mana, tap into.... Dark Confidant, Goyf, Loam, Punishing Fire....
If you had a mox thats a turn two crusher, waste.. now hes at four.... or an early assault...

So yes Chalice does protect your creatures from removal and does shut a lot of shit down but does it help enough.... Punishing fire makes tribal decks look bad and can slow down lingering souls a whole lot. I'm not really being a huge supporter of the fires but its very strong right now also and deathrite has a lot of pluses.... life gaining, mana dork, and a win condition for close games.


lol sorry... basically whats your sideboard? I love this deck, hands down my favorite to play. I want this deck crushing again and I don't care if nobody likes it or doesn't want to play it lol I know theres a whole lot of ppl who's still beasting with this deck.

My current sideboard is :

3 Zuran Orb
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Confusion in the Ranks
3 Mindbreak Trap
2 Devastating Dreams
1 Engineered Explosives

None of these cost 1 to cast. Devastating dreams are in place for NIC FIT and high tide match up at my local game store.

Ok Ok so you've basically fixed for the meta at your store....

Confusion in ranks seems really good against show n tell decks lol great tech.... I notice you don't have any control or graveyard hate..

I'm still debating chalice in the main or on the side or even at all... I just like the fact that deathrite puts another body and threat on the field.

IMO, this deck wrecks control list. Especially when they can't Swords to plowshares your treats. I have graveyard hates in my sideboard, which is 3 Tormod's Crypt. Finaly, Devastating dreams is also good against control list. But that's based on my play testing. I love this deck.

I haven't played aggro loam in over a year. I kept a copy of my decklist, I was thinking of going back to it. My list is similar to JohnLightings so I'm just going to post the differences.

-1 Seismic Assault
-1 Life from the Loam
-1 Countryside Crusher
-1 Terravore

+4 Burning Wish

-3 Abrupt Decay
+2 Devastating Dreams
+1 Azusa, Lost but Seeking

-1 Badlands
+1 Bayou

-1 Fetch
+1 Kessig Wolf Run

I have a long list for SB options so I'm not going to post all them. This was my list for Dark Ascension so not Decays yet. Since the format is slower you think burning wish is playable in here again?

You have a very valid point that I have been thinking about also.... The format is kind of slow at the same time though there's a resurgence of combo base decks leading there to also be an increase of control decks (esper mainly). So in conclusion I almost feel like I rather run burning wish list rather than wasting my time with punishing fire, the only thing is that both of the cards are very relevant. I guess I can cut abrupt decays and run some burning wishes which i think seems far more awesome because abrupt decay can only answer soo much. I'll test and report back....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Petree

You have a very valid point that I have been thinking about also.... The format is kind of slow at the same time though there's a resurgence of combo base decks leading there to also be an increase of control decks (esper mainly). So in conclusion I almost feel like I rather run burning wish list rather than wasting my time with punishing fire, the only thing is that both of the cards are very relevant. I guess I can cut abrupt decays and run some burning wishes which i think seems far more awesome because abrupt decay can only answer soo much. I'll test and report back....

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The resurgence of combo happened awhile ago. But combo is huge in my area anyways, people seem to leave that part out: meta's are local. In the Northeast, combo is fucking -huge-. Any big tournament I go to I regularly face combo rounds 1-3 out of 7, inevitably lose against two of them and then clean up on fair decks.

At SCG Edison, out of 9 rounds, I played 8 combo decks:
Hypergenesis
Belcher
Oops
Show And Tell
Dredge
Tin Fins
Elves
Scapewish combo

your correct when it comes to a local meta because not everyone can suddenly afford to play multiple decks especially in legacy but I would say the meta in general, combo is making a strong come back just because of the amount of fair decks. And when combo has its comeback so does control. I'm just the type of player that at least is prepared for a lot of stuff. bad habit. I just think that abrupt decay is really good and so is punishing fire bc there's a lot drs and rug is still deck and its a control players worst time to deal with punishing fire. But..... burning wish is also very powerful and I would sometimes prefer it over decay or fires. If we had burning wish, we'd have to give up one or the other IMO unless i cut moxes lol.... hmmm....

I agree, but you can always change things up for combo. I just like wish because it gives me more options MD to everything game 1. My meta is half fair half combo. I'm putting 4 Hymn to Tourach in my SB.

-2 Devastating Dreams
-2 Maelstrom Pulse
+4 Hymn to Tourach

I will probably keep Pulse in the SB though and use 2 Decays. Still brainstorming ideas. Plan on playing this Sunday.

Hey guys! I'm slowly reading through the thread at the moment, but I have a slightly different take on the Aggro Loam archetype: forgoing the red for white giving access to KotR. Also using grisly salvage to boost terravore/KotR fast and have E Wit there to go back anything I need. Haven't really done any work with the SB yet since the mainboard is still a work in progress.


Lands - 24
4 Bayou
4 Savannah
4 Windswept Heath
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland
1 Dryad Arbor
2 Horizon Canopy
1 Volrath's Stronghold

Creatures - 12
4 Terravore
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Eternal Witness

Spells - 16
4 Life from the Loam
2 Armageddon
4 Grisly Salvage
3 Cabal Therapy
3 Abrupt Decay

Art/Ench - 8
2 Crucible of Worlds
4 Mox Diamond
2 Exploration

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trevaftw

Hey guys! I'm slowly reading through the thread at the moment, but I have a slightly different take on the Aggro Loam archetype: forgoing the red for white giving access to KotR. Also using grisly salvage to boost terravore/KotR fast and have E Wit there to go back anything I need. Haven't really done any work with the SB yet since the mainboard is still a work in progress.

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The biggest issue with this list is that your options of closing the game out all revolve around 3 drop creatures, your Loam's are mostly going to waste since you have no means of putting the land back into the graveyard so your Knights and Terravores can't really benefit from it, and removing Red removes most of the reason to play the deck. I also don't love Cabal Therapy with the only relevant creature to flash it back with is an Eternal Witness. You could similarly run Inquisition of Kozilek and just use E Witness to get that back and cast it again, and you're still 2 for 1'ing them but not losing a dude.

I also don't love the lack of cycle lands, which is probably the biggest reason to run Loam in the first place. Without them, I would cut your loam count down to 2, cut Exploration since that isn't really doing anything, and put 4 Swords to Plowshares. And then probably give you a link to the thread for "The Rock" which I think is closer to what you're looking for.

When I get around to picking up this deck again I'll likely be playing this list:


4x Deathrite Shaman
4x Dark Confidant
4x Countryside Crusher

4x Life from the Loam
3x Seismic Assault

4x Hymn to Tourach
1x Maelstrom Pulse
3x Abrupt Decay
4x Lightning Bolt

4x Mox Diamond
2x Taiga
3x Badlands
2x Bayou
4x Wooded Foothills
2x Bloodstained Mire
3x Wasteland
4x Forgotten Cave
2x Tranquil Thicket
2x Mountain
1x Swamp

// Sideboard:
4x Chalice of the Void
3x Crop Rotation
1x Karakas
1x Bojuka Bog
3x Pyroclasm
3x Surgical Extraction

Probably something like that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kich867

The biggest issue with this list is that your options of closing the game out all revolve around 3 drop creatures, your Loam's are mostly going to waste since you have no means of putting the land back into the graveyard so your Knights and Terravores can't really benefit from it, and removing Red removes most of the reason to play the deck. I also don't love Cabal Therapy with the only relevant creature to flash it back with is an Eternal Witness. You could similarly run Inquisition of Kozilek and just use E Witness to get that back and cast it again, and you're still 2 for 1'ing them but not losing a dude.

I also don't love the lack of cycle lands, which is probably the biggest reason to run Loam in the first place. Without them, I would cut your loam count down to 2, cut Exploration since that isn't really doing anything, and put 4 Swords to Plowshares. And then probably give you a link to the thread for "The Rock" which I think is closer to what you're looking for.

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The Loams I would use either on fetches, wastelands, or horizon canopy thereby allowing me to keep the GY full. Also, by adding white it allows me to add Armageddon which can be brutal to your opponent if they have no means to get their land back, unlike us (Crucible of Worlds/Lftl+Mox Diamonds in play). Cabal therapy I have in there to use by playing it, followed by cracking a fetch, getting Dryad Arbor and saccing it to recur Cabal Therapy. I can then use LftL to repeat this cycle as necessary (although to be fair I can never decide whether or not I prefer using Cabal Therapy or IoK in general). Exploration I'm still undecided in. I probably will cut them so I can run 4x Abrupt Decay and another discard spell. I think anohter combination that is being overlooked is Grisly Salvage + Eternal Witness. Think of Grisly savage as adding +4/+4 to you guys and if you pitch something you needed, use that eternal witness you reveal to get it back. Looking at your list I understand why red is good, but I think white adds some different elements I prefer while still maintaining the aggro loam feel.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trevaftw

The Loams I would use either on fetches, wastelands, or horizon canopy thereby allowing me to keep the GY full. Also, by adding white it allows me to add Armageddon which can be brutal to your opponent if they have no means to get their land back, unlike us (Crucible of Worlds/Lftl+Mox Diamonds in play). Cabal therapy I have in there to use by playing it, followed by cracking a fetch, getting Dryad Arbor and saccing it to recur Cabal Therapy. I can then use LftL to repeat this cycle as necessary (although to be fair I can never decide whether or not I prefer using Cabal Therapy or IoK in general). Exploration I'm still undecided in. I probably will cut them so I can run 4x Abrupt Decay and another discard spell. I think anohter combination that is being overlooked is Grisly Salvage + Eternal Witness. Think of Grisly savage as adding +4/+4 to you guys and if you pitch something you needed, use that eternal witness you reveal to get it back. Looking at your list I understand why red is good, but I think white adds some different elements I prefer while still maintaining the aggro loam feel.

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BGW Loam, BG loam, Loam Pox and Aggro loam are totally different decks altogether. They only share a few cards in common.
I understand your idea (I even tried to use it once, but tbh I missed the chalices), but that's not the thread for it (with all due respect, I'm not trying to start a fight). If you can't find the thread for the deck (I, for one, am too lazy to search), you can start a new one in the developmental decks. I'm sure that if you revive such a discussion a lot of people will participate.

I just started playing this deck a few days ago, and last night I took it a legacy event at my LGS. Here is my list:


Creatures - 11
4 Dark Confidant
3 Countryside Crusher
3 Tarmogoyf
1 Terrovore
1 Scavanging Ooze

Artifact/Enchantment - 13
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Diamond
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Seismic Assault

Spells - 9
4 Life from the Loam
2 Devastating Dreams
1 Abrupt Decay
2 Liliana of the Veil

Lands - 27
4 Tranquil Thicket
4 Forgotten Cave
2 Taiga
1 Badlands
1 Bayou
4 Wasteland
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Bloodstained Mire
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Volrath's Stronghold
2 Mountain
1 Forest

Sideboard - 15
1 Koth of the Hammer
2 Zuran Orb
2 Tormod's Crypt
2 (Can't remember, I'll edit when I get home)
2 Blood Moon
3 Abrupt Decay
3 Lightning Bolt

I went 2-2. Beat Slivers and Merfolk then lost to OmniTell and Sneak n Show.

Looking back on my matches, facing Show and Tell (with the bad sideboard I had) was terrible. I had really no way to interact with them. Maindeck Chalice of the Void was nice, but I found myself siding it out for Abrupt Decays and Lightning Bolt. Also, Devastating Dreams was good in the first 2 matches, but didn't do well against Show and Tell. I'll probably move Chalice of the Void to the sideboard, and replace its maindeck slots with Lightning Bolt, Abrupt Decay or some kind of hand disruption (IoK, Thoughseize, or Raven's Crime). Since I didn't see that many decks, I'm not sure how the other sideboard cards would've done. I literally only brought in Bolt and Decay, lol. I'm going to make changes and play the deck again next week. If you have any suggestions, it is greatly accepted.