[Deck] Goblins

About the G1 against reanimator : you can tell whether you're fighting dredge or rea by the land they drop : dredge runs cephalid coliseum, city of brass, gemstone mine, and maybe 1 tarnished citadel, while reanimator runs classic UB fetches + bilands, and none of the above.
Either way, countering the discard outlet seems like a good choice, because if you let it through, your misstep can counter reanimate, but not exhume... Not like it matters anyway, since misstep is banned (:

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Originally Posted by andrebonotto

At some point during the match he Stifled my Piledriver’s +2 combat trigger. I asked if it was possible, because of my Piledriver’s “protection from blue”, but he insisted. I called the judge, who seemed to know less of the rules than I do. My opponent explains to me again, that “the trigger is on the stack, not on the creature”, and that “the trigger don’t have the protection”. It makes sense, so I okayed it. (Is this play correct?)

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Yes, he can Stifle the Piledriver trigger, because it is on the stack. You can even Stifle Emrakul's Annihilator trigger. (still reading the report)

I miss a Tin Street Hooligan in your list. This is one of the best reasons to run the G splash.

What do others think about how he managed g2 vs reanimator with his 2 crypts?
1) I'd wait until he casts his first reanimator
2) Id' immediately play both

Am i missing sth?

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Originally Posted by GoboLord

Deckprimer Vial-Goblins
[...]
Goblin Piledriver
Piledriver is one of the 3 main win-conditions of the deck. His insane triggered ability causes heavy damage to opponents lifepoints, when unblocked. However this is often not the case, since opponents place creatures and removal in his way – in fact he can be seen as an removal for creatures like Tarmogoyf, Tombstalker and sometimes even Knight of the Reliquary.
Did you know that?
Thanks to protection from blue Piledriver is a very good solution for cards like Rhox War Monk, Master of Etherium and any Merfolk. In the case of RWM Piledriver even nullifies lifelink: protection, ergo no damage, ergo no lifelink. However we should be cautious when playing against Stifle: one Stifle is enough to set him back to 1/2 - protection blue does not protect the triggered ability. Another thing we need to know is, that the ability counts attacking goblins on resolution. This means that his power decreases even if the opponent removes a creature in the attacker declare-step in response to Piledriver’s ability.

[...]

Thanks for reading my primer

GoboLord

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Originally Posted by unicoerner

I miss a Tin Street Hooligan in your list. This is one of the best reasons to run the G splash.

What do others think about how he managed g2 vs reanimator with his 2 crypts?
1) I'd wait until he casts his first reanimator
2) Id' immediately play both

Am i missing sth?

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For starters, I would play both Crypts. If he Thoughtseized or Chain of Vapore'd it, you'd be sorry.
I do not know if I'd wait for a reanimate spell, since by then he could have drawn a Stifle (another good reason for having both Crypts into play already).

@ ScatmanX and @ GoboLord:

Well, thanks for remembering me this issue. I did read the primer but unfortunately forgot about it...



@ r0ckstAr:

Hmm... I did not know well both lists. It's a very helpful information for me.



@ unicoerner:

I substitued THS for Sharpshooter, because on some of my tests I was a little insatisfied with THS's bad synergy with Warchief, and because some of the last posts here made me see some great benefits from using Sharpshooter. But now, I think I'm reconsidering get TSH back to (main)deck.

Regarding the Reanimate match, I did not have experience against it, so the only thing I thought about was that "bait play". I did not know that he could have other answers - Thoughtseize or Chain of Vapor, as ScatmanX well-pointed. I'll be more cautious next time.

Congrats Andre! I'm glad you got a chance to use MM before the banning officially starts. Goblins gets a HUGE advantage when you can stop opposing 1 drops. I will miss it...
TSH is the best artifact removal Goblins has. If you are already splashing green then it's the card to use!

Now that MM is banned how are people preparing? MM kept combo from showing up in large numbers at local events. With it gone I'd expect the meta to return to 6 months ago with SFM/Batterskull still sticking around for a while.

I've sleeved up Mono-Red Moxtigator again. It seems like the best chance to race combo game 1...

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Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew

Now that MM is banned how are people preparing? MM kept combo from showing up in large numbers at local events. With it gone I'd expect the meta to return to 6 months ago with SFM/Batterskull still sticking around for a while.

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I think its important to try to figure out what kind of combo is going to come back.
This are the ones I'm considering: High Tide decks / Hive Mind / TES / Reanimator /dredge / AdnT / Elves / Belcher. Of these, I think Hive Mind will be the one less played, which is good for us.
Now our hate cards and decks they affect the most are: (in order of the relevance of the card)

High Tide : Pyroblast, Chalice of the Void, Scald, Pirostatic Pillar, Mindbreak Trap, Thorn of Amethyst. (discard is good too)
TES: Chalice, MB Trap, Thorn, gravehate (Iggy). (discard is good too)
Reanimator: Gravehate, Chalice, Pyroblast, Stingscourger. (Discard and Weirding are good)
Hive Mind: Pyroblast, Stingscourger. (May have Leyline against discard, but Extirpate is good)
Dredge: Gravehate, Pyroknesis. (discard is useless)
AdnT: Chalice, MB Trap, Thorn, gravehate (Iggy). (discard and Earwig Squad are good too)
Elves: Pyroknesis, Chalice, maybe MB Trap. (Perish is nice)
Belcher: MB Trap, Pithing Needle, Pyroknesis, Chalice. (Discard is useful only on the play)

With these you can focus on the decks you want to have a stronger games 2 and 3. Try using cards that are good on other MUs too, like Pyroblast, Squad and Chalice.
It is not that impossible to beat specific combo if you have the right Hate. But if you build your side expecting High tide and Hive Mind, and is paired against Reanimator and Dredge, you are going to have a ruff time...

Edit: Think I derailed myself a bit, but hope it was clear... I'm quite tired...

What I got from that was Chalice of the Void, Mindbreak Trap, and grave-hate :wink:
I hate having dead cards against combo games 2 and 3. Vial and removal are too slow and dead cards respectively so at *least* 8 cards come out. CotV is great because it is good against some non-combo too (zoo and burn come to mind).

I think Pyrokinesis and Perish occupy the same position in a Goblin sideboard (Pyro for mono-red and Perish for black splash). The only sideboard slots I go back and forth on is REBs or artifact destruction.

This might be a bit sudden, but why not add a few Pyroblasts to the maindeck?

It's a quasi Mental Misstep against High Tide, ANT, Reanimator, TES and Hive Mind. Countering Brainstorm with MM was a great play against those decks. Pyroblast can also counter FoW and a host of other relevant cards in those decks. As an additional benefit, the card is REALLY decent against Merfolk. In a similar vein it is also useful against decks like Team America and NO RUG, or even UW Stoneblade.

Granted, it does practically squat against decks like Zoo and various Rock decks but this I feel is somewhat eased by the fact that sideboarding would be much more straightforward and the fact that now you have more SB space to dedicate to other problematic matchups (more combo hate could be useful).

I'm not yet certain about numbers but 2 might be a good place to start, maybe even 3.

I had the same idea 2 days ago.
Main Blasts work really decent so far.

Pyroblast is a dead card for many matchups (Zoo, Deadguy Ale, The Rock, Meverick, Burn...) that I believe it's a waste of space. Also you can't play it turn 1 when you put your 1-drop on the table.
For my believes MM had some kind of a removal spot in the deck-therefore I placed 2 Pyrokinesis instead, which are paid without mana as well and trade fair most of the time 2 for 2. This also leaves some space in SB and isn't a goblin. Combo matchup isn't improved, but you got Ports and Wastes for them otherwise you need to rush.
Chalice, Crypt and Pyroblast will do the rest game 2 and 3.

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Originally Posted by BigBopper

Pyroblast is a dead card for many matchups (Zoo, Deadguy Ale, The Rock, Meverick, Burn...) that I believe it's a waste of space. Also you can't play it turn 1 when you put your 1-drop on the table.
For my believes MM had some kind of a removal spot in the deck-therefore I placed 2 Pyrokinesis instead, which are paid without mana as well and trade fair most of the time 2 for 2. This also leaves some space in SB and isn't a goblin. Combo matchup isn't improved, but you got Ports and Wastes for them otherwise you need to rush.
Chalice, Crypt and Pyroblast will do the rest game 2 and 3.

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Apart from Zoo and Maverick all of those decks aren't exactly widely played. They are fringe decks just like we are. Over half of the decks in the DTB section of the forum are blue decks so playing Pyroblast might not be so bad, to the contrary. You can always easily swap it for Pyrokinesis against which it is a dead card.

That being said, maindecking Pyrokinesis is also reasonable in a aggro heavy meta. The goal is more or less the same; free up sideboard space for more disruption against combo or solutions against aggro decks.

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Originally Posted by ScatmanX

High Tide : Pyroblast, Chalice of the Void, Scald, Pirostatic Pillar, Mindbreak Trap, Thorn of Amethyst. (discard is good too)
TES: Chalice, MB Trap, Thorn, gravehate (Iggy). (discard is good too)
Reanimator: Gravehate, Chalice, Pyroblast, Stingscourger. (Discard and Weirding are good)
Hive Mind: Pyroblast, Stingscourger. (May have Leyline against discard, but Extirpate is good)
Dredge: Gravehate, Pyroknesis. (discard is useless)
AdnT: Chalice, MB Trap, Thorn, gravehate (Iggy). (discard and Earwig Squad are good too)
Elves: Pyroknesis, Chalice, maybe MB Trap. (Perish is nice)
Belcher: MB Trap, Pithing Needle, Pyroknesis, Chalice. (Discard is useful only on the play)

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I'm newbie in using chalice, so could you tell me how many counters should I place on it in different matchups?

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Originally Posted by qazwer

I'm newbie in using chalice, so could you tell me how many counters should I place on it in different matchups?

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High Tide: @1
TES: @0, because they have discard, and can take it out of your hand before you set it @1. If they have played their 0cc cards already, play for 1 next turn.
Reanimator: @1. Stops Entomb, Reanimate, Carefull Study of the useful cards for their combo.
Belcher: @0. You may not have another turn to play it at 1.
Elves: @1.
Dredge/Hive Mind: Don't use it.
AdnT: @1. You need to stop their cantrips. They don't have less 0cc cards than TES.

Building upon what Scatman said:

CotV has applications against Zoo @1; Burn @1; Stiflenaught @1

if id play a SB like this, would i basically take all "necessary" precautions atm:

3x Mindbreak Trap
2x Red Elemental Blast
3x Leyline of the Void
2x Pyrokinesis
3x Perish
2x Replicate

assumin ill meet the current dominating decks..

or would u replace smtgh? (if u had no idea about the meta in general, just a basic Q)

I'm wondering which splash to play in the current meta. Green seems good with Batterskull floating around, but is it still as prominent as it used to be? And the black splash to fight Reanimator seems good, but anyone have any more ideas?

you could well consider a white splash instead of green.
It gives you access to Stp and Enlightened Tutor board.

....neither of which I find particularly attractive. StP is less needed with everyone and their mother relying on X/1's and X/2's, and the white options for the sideboard aren't nearly as attractive.

*EDIT
Here's a list I'm fooling around with. Opinions welcome.
Lands:
2x Badlands
2x Taiga
4x Scalding Tarn
4x Arid Mesa
3x Mountain
3x Rishadan Port
4x Wasteland
Creatures:
4x Goblin Lackey
2x Mogg Fanatic
1x Skirk Prospector
4x Goblin Piledriver
3x Mogg War Marshall
1x Tin Street Hooligan
3x Gempalm Incinerator
4x Goblin Matron
4x Goblin Warchief
1x Goblin Sharpshooter
4x Goblin Ringleader
2x Siege-Gang Commander
Spells:
1x Warren Weirding
Sideboard:
1x Tormod's Crypt
4x Chalice of the Void
1x Tin Street Hooligan
4x Leyline of the Void
1x Mindbreak Trap
1x Nature's Claim
1x Warren Weirding
2x Perish

Testing well vs. Snapcaster BUG, but the testing partner (myself) is certainly not up to snuff.