All B/R update speculation.

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Originally Posted by Julian23

Whenever Mental Misstep hitting Dark Ritual or High Tide actually wins a game it will most of the time be due to one (or both) of two things:

1) The Combo player is just bad.
2) He's being pressured quite hard thus having to just go for it unprotected. In this case, Mental Misstep didn't actually win the game. It was just the last card played.

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There have been plenty of times when I say to myself "I can play around (x) free counterspells, but then my opponent has (x) + a Misstep. Once you get to the point where most of the blue decks play 12 free counterspells, it becomes difficult to correctly guess how many they're holding, and they usually have one more than you think, lol.

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Originally Posted by Admiral_Arzar

There have been plenty of times when I say to myself "I can play around (x) free counterspells, but then my opponent has (x) + a Misstep. Once you get to the point where most of the blue decks play 12 free counterspells, it becomes difficult to correctly guess how many they're holding, and they usually have one more than you think, lol.

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Yeah, it's called combo is supposed to lose most of the time to counterspell heavy decks with a clock. If it didn't then what could possibly beat it?

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Originally Posted by dontbiteitholmes

Yeah, it's called combo is supposed to lose most of the time to counterspell heavy decks with a clock. If it didn't then what could possibly beat it?

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Other combo decks.

Or combo decks with counterspells. You know a format is dead when fast combo decks with a heavy counter suite are the deck to beat. (Necro Winter)

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Originally Posted by dontbiteitholmes

Yeah, it's called combo is supposed to lose most of the time to counterspell heavy decks with a clock. If it didn't then what could possibly beat it?

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When the control player has to think about his plays I'll even agree with on that one. But just tapping out every turn doing your thing while having ALL of your counterspells active is just plain stupid.

Given a good hand I bet a freaking monkey could beat Storm now with a Merfolk deck.

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Originally Posted by alderon666

When the control player has to think about his plays I'll even agree with on that one. But just tapping out every turn doing your thing while having ALL of your counterspells active is just plain stupid.

Given a good hand I bet a freaking monkey could beat Storm now with a Merfolk deck.

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-And what exactly is wrong with paper beating rock?

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Originally Posted by alderon666

When the control player has to think about his plays I'll even agree with on that one. But just tapping out every turn doing your thing while having ALL of your counterspells active is just plain stupid.

Given a good hand I bet a freaking monkey could beat Storm now with a Merfolk deck.

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So to recap you are mad that blue decks heavy on counterspells have a really good matchup vs. combo, and you think they should ban Mental Misstep so that you will have better game vs. Fish decks with your combo deck (even though fish decks are the best type of decks to play to beat combo) and then every deck without blue will go back to being a 70%+ matchup for anything with High Tides, Rite of Flames, or Dark Rits. Yeah I bet you would like that. Too bad combo players have absolutely no room to talk about unfair matchups since they have had years upon years of some of the most lopsided matchups in history.

I can't frickin wait for the announcement, my anxiety is killing me. I have a project blue deck on the line and I wish they don't ban Brainstorm!

Looking at the most recent top 8 decks I see more Mental Missteps than Stoneforges, if that's any indication.


EDIT

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Originally Posted by dontbiteitholmes

Too bad combo players have absolutely no room to talk about unfair matchups since they have had years upon years of some of the most lopsided matchups in history.

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I feel guilty so QFT..

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Originally Posted by death

I can't frickin wait for the announcement, my anxiety is killing me. I have a project blue deck on the line and I wish they don't ban Brainstorm!

Looking at the most recent top 8 decks I see more Mental Missteps than Stoneforges, if that's any indication.

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- I can see SFM, NO, or SnT getting banned before MMS.

Regardless, if MMS gets banned, CounterTop, Dredge, Goblins, and Storm decks will return.

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Originally Posted by DragoFireheart

- I can see SFM, NO, or SnT getting banned before MMS.

Regardless, if MMS gets banned, CounterTop, Dredge, Goblins, and Storm decks will return.

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Counter-top was dead before the Misstep ban. Dredge is already a DTB. Goblins and Storm will return in strength, to be sure.

-People want MMS banned so they can play their 1-drops.
-They get their wish and then spend the next x months getting their 1-drops countered by Counterbalance.
-???
-Profit!

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Originally Posted by Admiral_Arzar

Counter-top was dead before the Misstep ban. Dredge is already a DTB. Goblins and Storm will return in strength, to be sure.

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Disagree. GSZ weakened it at one point, for sure, but there were a lot more builds scaling up their mana curve in the last months before Misstep was printed. I think if MMS had never been printed, Counterbalance would have changed enough to be just as obnoxious.

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Originally Posted by Admiral_Arzar

Counter-top was dead before the Misstep ban. Dredge is already a DTB. Goblins and Storm will return in strength, to be sure.

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Counter-Top was losing popularity due to Merfolk being popular. MMS just sealed the deal. Dredge is not a DTB atm due to MMS.

Blade Control and No Rug might go away. Team America as well. Looks like a meta shift and no net gain or loss to me.

Edit:

- No Rug
- Bladecontrol
- Team America
(maybe) - Hivemind

+ Goblins
+ CounterTop
+ Storm
+ Dredge

Frankly, I don't want to see CounterTop or Storm return.

Does anyone know at which exact time will the announcement take place?

I apologize is someone already posed this question before.

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Originally Posted by tangram

Does anyone know at which exact time will the announcement take place?

I apologize is someone already posed this question before.

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Announcement is for weaks, someone @ salvation rumor mill might find the post before it goes up, as happened to SotF

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Originally Posted by DragoFireheart

I can see SFM, NO, or SnT getting banned before MMS.

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I hope not. Legacy can stay the same with or without MM but not the other way around without 2 or 3 of those cards.

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Originally Posted by tangram

Does anyone know at which exact time will the announcement take place?

I apologize is someone already posed this question before.

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Midnight, PST.

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Originally Posted by death

I hope not. Legacy can stay the same with or without MM but not the other way around without 2 or 3 of those cards.

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Legacy will not stay the same if MMS gets banned. Anyways, I feel MMS is more like Tarmogoyf rather than SotF:

- It's not a tutor.

- It's not an enabler for a card (SotF ---> Vengevine).

- It doesn't force decks to run their own to fight it. (Argue that however you want)

My prediction:

Legacy:

Earthcraft is unbanned
Mystical Tutor is unbanned

Thats right, MT unbanned. You know what else. No Land Tax again (Though I would really really love to see this leave the list).

Also, Mental Misstep will not be banned. Why you ask, look up the history of this thread back in 2009. There's that vanilla creature that was the talk of the format. Personally, I think Mental Misstep reduced the playability of a lot of decks, kinda like how Goyf reduced the playability of a lot of great creatures pre-Futuresight but it wasn't as broken as Survival that despite all hate, was still putting up great numbers. To be honest, I hate Mental Misstep but I'd rather have new cards shifting the format than having a stale eternal format.

Two years from now, we'll be adapted to a format with Mental Misstep just like how we've adapted to Goyf. Hell, Mental Misstep might even suck two-three years from now, like how CounterTop sucked now.

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Originally Posted by Admiral_Arzar

Zilla I agree with basically everything you've said except for this post. If you think Mental Misstep isn't a game-winning play, you've probably never had Dark Ritual or High Tide Misstepped.

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I should have named this as an exception, because it's absolutely true. Misstep against Storm combo can absolutely be a game-winning play. It is a must-answer for those decks.

My post was a response to the idea that every deck has to run Misstep in order to answer Misstep, which, generally speaking, is ridiculous.

I do recognize how crippling Misstep has been for Storm's metagame presence. Sorry for the oversight.

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Originally Posted by (nameless one)

My prediction:

Legacy:

Earthcraft is unbanned
Mystical Tutor is unbanned

Thats right, MT unbanned. You know what else. No Land Tax again (Though I would really really love to see this leave the list).

Also, Mental Misstep will not be banned...

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Agree with Mental Misstep.

However, why do you want Mystical Tutor unbanned? It might not warp the format, but it would sure strengthen some blue decks by miles, pushing other colours out of presence.

My hope:

Brainstorm is banned.
Earthcraft is no longer banned.

If it ends up like this, I would buy Booster boxes for the first time in my life to thank WotC. Well, other cards can be unbanned, but one by one is fine for me.

Edit: I am a combo player and have been spoiled by Brainstorm. However, just for the aesthetic respect, I would love to see the 5 colours more balanced.

Vengevine is banned.
Survival of the Fittest is no longer banned.

I mean, going the way of Gush isn't that bad as long as they don't catch or surpass it. And I think they can't by now unless they try extremely hard. Too bad it won't happen.

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Originally Posted by tsabo_tavoc

Agree with Mental Misstep.

However, why do you want Mystical Tutor unbanned? It might not warp the format, but it would sure strengthen some blue decks by miles, pushing other colours out of presence.

My hope:

Brainstorm is banned.
Earthcraft is no longer banned.

If it ends up like this, I would buy Booster boxes for the first time in my life to thank WotC. Well, other cards can be unbanned, but one by one is fine for me.

Edit: I am a combo player and have been spoiled by Brainstorm. However, just for the aesthetic respect, I would love to see the 5 colours more balanced.

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My wish, Brainstorm Banned. mindtwist unbanned.