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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Which kills me since a Diamond Valley is about the same price and has much more style than a foil High Market.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
I just got 3 Korean Diabolic Edicts, and 1 Korean Helm of Awakening for cheap, and I'd like to know how much are they worth? I'm not into Jap or Kor stuff so any help appreciated.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Ebay knows :P
But if I were to ballpark: $2-3 for the Edict (probably $3) and $7 for the Helm of Awakening. The issue is these cards aren't played much anymore so it's hard for them to spike up (since they're not played in EDH either), but I've always felt Helm of Awakening has potential to be broken in the future.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dahcmai
Which kills me since a Diamond Valley is about the same price and has much more style than a foil High Market.
Which is one of the defining reasons I have decided to hang up my boots for an extended period of time. Diamond Valley is not worth US$99.99. Foil High Market is not worth US$35.00. Sword of Fire and Ice is not worth US$50.00.
And the list goes on and on. It has become so increasingly annoying to hear about the massive price-hiking going on with these cards - be it for whatever reason - that I wouldn't be surprised if Brainstorm hits the ten dollar mark in a year or so. The prices on these cards keeps going up higher and higher because Legacy is growing in popularity at an exponential rate. I for one just don't want to be a part of this nonsense.
Don't get me wrong, I love Legacy, but I personally feel the value of (most) of the important Legacy staples are so absurdly overpriced that it makes no sense dipping into a format where you (at this point) barely - if ever - break even at the ratio of the price of the average competitive Legacy deck to the general prize support given at bigger Legacy events. Magic is an investment, and I know they are worth money as an asset, but is the price of acquiring one or more of these assets worth spending when prices on just about everything these days are so ridiculously high as it is?
I'm willing to bet that a hefty percentage of people who are participating in the Open Series and other large venues alike are either playing budget (which is why there was an abnormally large number of Dredge players, etc. at L.A.) or running decks with the Duals they already owned. For people looking to break in to the format, it is going to be astronomically expensive if they really and truly want to be able to hang with decks sporting Duals, Forces, etc. There was a time and place where the format was relatively affordable, and this is not one of those times.
Legacy can be affordable; I'm not disputing that. But I for one would get tired of playing a budget deck when I couldn't afford to play the upper-tier decks of the format - but wanted to - if I were just breaking in to Legacy and getting stomped week in and out and living with mediocre results on a constant basis.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Oddly enough, if you decided to dip into the wallet hard and buy into even a deck like Team America (probably one of the most expensive), you'd come out ahead by quite a bit when you decided to quit magic and sold out. It's especially proven true for the blue decks. I guess that's one advantage Legacy has over any other format.
People bitch and whine about the cost of cards, but I can tell you right now other hobbies typically are more expensive and definitely aren't productive when quitting. Golf can run you a staggering amount especially if you actually want to be competitive. I fix cars on the side and I can tell you some of the parts I have bought make Underground Seas, even the betas look dirt cheap. I've seen people who spend more on a computer than any collection of cards each year! How many hobbies can you think of that don't cost some amount of money. Then think how many of those that are cheaper pay you back when you quit them. Probably none.
You can't really expect to win so much money it pays for your hobby. Granted, I know some people, including myself, that it actually does pay for it, but that's a rarity. Anyway, you really don't have to have a foil High Market when the regular one is 50c to a dollar. Diamond Valley is an EDH card only and Sword of Fire and Ice mostly is.
I guess you could always hit up bars. That's cheap, well sorta. The ticket isn't.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dahcmai
Oddly enough, if you decided to dip into the wallet hard and buy into even a deck like Team America (probably one of the most expensive), you'd come out ahead by quite a bit when you decided to quit magic and sold out. It's especially proven true for the blue decks. I guess that's one advantage Legacy has over any other format.
People bitch and whine about the cost of cards, but I can tell you right now other hobbies typically are more expensive and definitely aren't productive when quitting. Golf can run you a staggering amount especially if you actually want to be competitive. I fix cars on the side and I can tell you some of the parts I have bought make Underground Seas, even the betas look dirt cheap. I've seen people who spend more on a computer than any collection of cards each year! How many hobbies can you think of that don't cost some amount of money. Then think how many of those that are cheaper pay you back when you quit them. Probably none.
You can't really expect to win so much money it pays for your hobby. Granted, I know some people, including myself, that it actually does pay for it, but that's a rarity. Anyway, you really don't have to have a foil High Market when the regular one is 50c to a dollar. Diamond Valley is an EDH card only and Sword of Fire and Ice mostly is.
I guess you could always hit up bars. That's cheap, well sorta. The ticket isn't.
This is it. You summed it up well. If I don't play MTG, I'm dumping money on other things. As the gamers we are, we tend to set aside some liquid money for our interests and are only willing to pay that much for hobbies (whether it's art, cars, golf, mtg, MMORPGs). When that barrier is crossed e.g. cards becoming more and more expensive, it's either time to re-evaluate spending perhaps more money in the hobby (if you still love it despite the higher costs now) or to move on to another one. I would say that if I had not had most of my Legacy staples, I would probably not be willing to get into MTG/legacy in today's state. But since I already have 80-90% of all the cards I need, I'll stick with the game.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Mike, I love ya, but get off your high horse. First, you keep selling your cards - so the 'entry barrier' for you is self-imposed. You made that choice, so don't whine about the consequences. Furthermore, you're friends with dozens of Legacy players, most of us having decent collections. You being unable to find cards to play Legacy seems unlikely. And this sense of community is what makes the format more accessible than mere numbers would seem to indicate. There is a new store in my area, with a curious player base and at least several people trying to jump into Legacy. I've traded with a couple of them to help them. When the store bites the bullet and announces a Legacy tourney, I may well be supplying a majority of the players cards or even complete decks. Should Wizards abolish (or at least re-work) the Reserved List? Absolutely they should (and hopefully the corporate....overseers...at Hasbro let them do so at some point). But the format, even if it stopped gaining players (number wise), would still have a healthy enough aggregate total.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
I've decided to throw in the towel, personally. I had already sold my duals, fetches, leds, NOs, Goyfs, Mox Diamonds, most of my Stax cards, etc... and kept basically just Merfolk, Dragon Stompy, and Dredge. The intent: To get some liquid assets to put into a new computer and some car repairs, and rebuy in to a specific deck at a later point... But watching the trend of prices it was getting harder and harder for me to feel justified in putting money into staples again, so I decided to move off Folk, Dragon Stompy, 3 out of 5 EDH decks, and my T2 stuff and turned it into a new TV, some CC bill money, and an Engagement ring.
I give full respect to the people who still have the coin to drop on staples, but I do still feel that with the rising prices that it's going to scare away a lot of potential newer players and stifle format growth. Hopefully there is a plan to alleviate this aside from just killing the format or pushing a new Neo-Extended. I loved 1.5 and I enjoy this format more than almost any other Magic format, I just can't do it anymore. So best of luck to you guys that stay in.
Looking like my MTG is mostly going to be what I already own on MODO, or MWS from here on out.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hollywood
Which is one of the defining reasons I have decided to hang up my boots for an extended period of time. Diamond Valley is not worth US$99.99. Foil High Market is not worth US$35.00. Sword of Fire and Ice is not worth US$50.00.
And the list goes on and on. It has become so increasingly annoying to hear about the massive price-hiking going on with these cards - be it for whatever reason - that I wouldn't be surprised if Brainstorm hits the ten dollar mark in a year or so. The prices on these cards keeps going up higher and higher because Legacy is growing in popularity at an exponential rate. I for one just don't want to be a part of this nonsense.
Don't get me wrong, I love Legacy, but I personally feel the value of (most) of the important Legacy staples are so absurdly overpriced that it makes no sense dipping into a format where you (at this point) barely - if ever - break even at the ratio of the price of the average competitive Legacy deck to the general prize support given at bigger Legacy events. Magic is an investment, and I know they are worth money as an asset, but is the price of acquiring one or more of these assets worth spending when prices on just about everything these days are so ridiculously high as it is?
I'm willing to bet that a hefty percentage of people who are participating in the Open Series and other large venues alike are either playing budget (which is why there was an abnormally large number of Dredge players, etc. at L.A.) or running decks with the Duals they already owned. For people looking to break in to the format, it is going to be astronomically expensive if they really and truly want to be able to hang with decks sporting Duals, Forces, etc. There was a time and place where the format was relatively affordable, and this is not one of those times.
Legacy can be affordable; I'm not disputing that. But I for one would get tired of playing a budget deck when I couldn't afford to play the upper-tier decks of the format - but wanted to - if I were just breaking in to Legacy and getting stomped week in and out and living with mediocre results on a constant basis.
Sound. All of this.
Except, you're lacking a certain mentality.
There are people (other) out there that'll pay $X for CardY. Thus, the market is in existence.
Settling for budget in any format is detrimental to the participant's experience. Sure not everyone can afford the high dollar cards, but if they know enough people they can regularly borrow cards, and hopefully lend them to make more friends. If one were to muster the $500+ on a competitive Legacy deck, they'd not only emmerse themselves in the format, they'd be making an investment instead of an expense. Barring a total bankrupcy of WotC and a defunct DCI where no tournaments would be held, only then would Legacy go to shit. It's a format on the rise, and these days now will be the ones we soon speak of in terms of "Oh, if only I would have..." or "I remember when X was worth only Y..."
Make it happen, man.
It's probably the best thing you can do for enriching your life (barring dependants and persons of that nature)
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Metalwalker
Ebay knows :P
But if I were to ballpark: $2-3 for the Edict (probably $3) and $7 for the Helm of Awakening. The issue is these cards aren't played much anymore so it's hard for them to spike up (since they're not played in EDH either), but I've always felt Helm of Awakening has potential to be broken in the future.
I see Helm played in EDH. With Future Sight and Top people end up drawing as much of their deck as they want.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
I sold my collection of rare Japanese Megadrive carts in 2009 and bought staples one playset at a time that year. Looking at the price of tournament staples now, the move was indeed a stupid good one. Buying in now makes less sense though, although I don't believe it's "too late" yet. There may be $ to be made (and definite joy to be had) even if you catch the wave a bit late. Sure it sucks to pay 60$ a pop for FOWs and 40$ for Wastelands when you could have them for 1/4 the price not 2 years ago. But let's face it: these will never be respectively 10 and 25$ ever again, even if WOTC goes bankrupt. When there is money to be made, there are always people hoarding the stuff just in case. Remember that guy who has something like 300 Force of Wills?
Has anyone seen anything else retarded since SoFI?
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Try to buy a Foil Decree of Pain or foil Karmic guide. That's a couple of good ones. EDH obviously.
I really don't think it's "too late" as I played Vintage and people never thought that a Mox would reach the heights they did. Much less the insane jump of Bazaars or Shops. I literally bought my Bazaars for $12 a piece and Shops for $25 a playset due to it being restricted at the time. Those rose practically overnight like Candelabra did. It's the same stuff, just different format.
Duals are the "Moxes" of Legacy. Force is becoming the Mana Drain and so on. It's just a good idea to keep your eye on any card that wasn't printed in other countries as they never had access to the older sets and it's quickly becoming a total worldwide game.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dahcmai
It's just a good idea to keep your eye on any card that wasn't printed in other countries as they never had access to the older sets and it's quickly becoming a total worldwide game.
Like Spinal Villain? Just recieved my playset today. All M/NM and 8 $ a piece. I'm quite satisfied, but I'm being told by someone who is both a professional player and a major dealer (He sells entire foil sets at a time - not playsets, actual sets. And has all the good stuff - BB duals, test foils etc.) that it's not a good card and too fragile. I haven't actually tried and played with it yet, but... I wonder if he's right.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dragon_Whelp
Like Spinal Villain? Just recieved my playset today. All M/NM and 8 $ a piece. I'm quite satisfied, but I'm being told by someone who is both a professional player and a major dealer (He sells entire foil sets at a time - not playsets, actual sets. And has all the good stuff - BB duals, test foils etc.) that it's not a good card and too fragile. I haven't actually tried and played with it yet, but... I wonder if he's right.
I would play anything that ROFLs Merfolks because I hate the deck so much. It's the only deck in Legacy that makes me QQ and Rage when playing against an opponent.
Also Spinal Villain + Painter = cute? :P
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Metalwalker
I would play anything that ROFLs Merfolks because I hate the deck so much. It's the only deck in Legacy that makes me QQ and Rage when playing against an opponent.
I just hate any kind of Tribal. The decks are so dumb. If there was a Villain for each colour, I'd run the red, green and blue ones.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
<3 Spinal Villain! To me the picture looks like what if spinal meningitus was turned into a creature. Anson Maddocks FTW!
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
picked up 4x nm U.Seas for 85 each and i got a playset of plateaus for 100. played obviously on the plateaus. glad some people aren't sidetracked by the SCG uprise in prices.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Spinal Villain is one of those hidden gems most people haven't caught onto. Shhhh.... I don't have my 4th yet.
Yes, it wtfpwns Merfolk all by himself. I actually hadn't thought about Painter with it. Hmmm.. That's funny he didn't think it was good. I sell foil sets too! lol
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
We already have a cheaper and better spinal villain, who's not worthless against other decks. His name is grim lavamancer.
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Re: Raise, raise, raise. The price of cardboard
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dahcmai
Spinal Villain is one of those hidden gems most people haven't caught onto. Shhhh.... I don't have my 4th yet.
Yes, it wtfpwns Merfolk all by himself. I actually hadn't thought about Painter with it. Hmmm.. That's funny he didn't think it was good. I sell foil sets too! lol
I honestly don't think he is good per se, but 1 in an imperial painter deck would be cute. I just like the flavor of the card completely.
