[DTB] Sneak Attack

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Originally Posted by akatsuki

Congrats Zach! What do you think about Sneak and Show vs. Omni-Tell and Hive Mind? Which MUs do you see as more favored and less favored for each?

Also, I totally agree with the Misdirections and D-Grids. So much countermagic and discard running around these days.

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I see my version to be much more streamlined and more threat heavy. The omniscience versions are generally forced to play less countermagic due to having to include burning wishes, etc. The meta right now has no hate for this type of deck so I wanted to be as consistent as possible with as much countermagic as I could. The omniscience versions are usually trying to assemble a 3 card combo where my version is only 2 that are all 4 ofs. I even tested against the omniscience version and it is very lopsided in my favor. They can only win off of show and tell where you have sneak attack to haste your creatures. Basically all you have to do is drop your emrakul into play after they show and tell and untap and annihilate them. Every 6-7 games they will have their 3 card combo and enough countermagic to push through, but I still found the matchup to be at least 70-30.

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Originally Posted by akatsuki

Congrats Zach! What do you think about Sneak and Show vs. Omni-Tell and Hive Mind? Which MUs do you see as more favored and less favored for each?

Also, I totally agree with the Misdirections and D-Grids. So much countermagic and discard running around these days.

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Misdirection was awesome. I got to do some sweet stuff like:

- misdirection a maelstrom pulse on my sneak attack to their flipped delver.
- misdirection a thoughtseize to make them discard a Bob and reveal that they had no counterspells so I could go for it next turn.
- misdirection a hymn to tourach to my opponent
- misdirection a counterspell while at one life (couldn't force of will because it would kill me)

There were probably others but those stood out the most

Sneaky Show just won SCG Las Vegas!

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Originally Posted by Esper3k

Sneaky Show just won SCG Las Vegas!

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It was only a matter of time ;)

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Originally Posted by Esper3k

Sneaky Show just won SCG Las Vegas!

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Certainly not the first time Sneak Attack has won a big event, but I do recall someone said he'd eat his Black Lotus if that ever happened. Anyone know if he stayed true to his word?

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Originally Posted by lordofthepit

Certainly not the first time Sneak Attack has won a big event

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The 3rd time ;) Jonathan Hickerson in May at SCG Nashville, Chris Bergeson at GenCon and now Richard Centanni. It makes Top 8 pretty often, but winning a whole tournament is rather rare.

Congratulations to Richard, maybe he reads this and shares some of his thoughts about how the deck worked in the tournament. :-)

I can't comment on the rest of his rounds, but Top 4 match Game 2 went like this:

Probed/Duressed for Blood Moon.
SnT's Griselbrand - bounced with Karakas, draw 14 cards. Discard ~10 lands leaving Sneak Attack, Grisel, Emmy, Fow, blue card, Volc <Ponder?>
Duress'd - counter with FOW. Duressed again same turn, taking Sneak.
Plays land - Ponder into: Flusterstorm, SnT, Sneak Attack, stack SnT-Sneak-Flusterstorm and drawing Flusterstorm.
Flusterstorm Infernal Tutor on Storm 5.
Cast Sneak Attack, activate to put Emmy (Karakas'd) put in Emmy again, putting me down to 1.
I play Fetch, go.
Sneak Grisel GG

Richard got very unlucky with the Griselbrand draws, but the Ponder made up for it.

A couple questions on sb choices:

1. How useful is Surgical Extraction and when is it brought in? I presume vs. other Show and Tell decks, but what about vs. Miracles or EsperBlade? It seems like Defense Grid and REBs are just stronger
2. How about Wipe Away? Obviously it seems good vs. Humility, but isn't a better strategy to win before it gets to that point? I can see potential uses vs. CounterTop lock, but again, I think winning earlier and using proactive disruption (Defense Grid) with cheap counterspells seems better.
3. I presume Shattering Spree and Ancient Grudge are for Pithing Needle and Chalices etc., I think Spree is probably better.
4. I presume Stifles are for Karakas and Jace, but it seems like Karakas/Needle themselves are stronger.
5. When is Through the Breach useful? I guess when you want business spells 9 and 10? Maybe against decks with a lot of counterspells? Someone explain this to me?

I'm coming over from playing Hive Mind and I'm thinking about picking up this deck. Basically it seems to me like the easiest way to win the blue match-up is to resolve a Defense Grid (or make them waste their counters on it) and then cast Show or Sneak.

Vs. the fair decks, Pithing Needle and Karakas seem sufficient.

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Originally Posted by akatsuki

A couple questions on sb choices:

1. How useful is Surgical Extraction and when is it brought in? I presume vs. other Show and Tell decks, but what about vs. Miracles or EsperBlade? It seems like Defense Grid and REBs are just stronger

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Didn't Run it. Felt that Grafdigger's cage was sufficient as GY hate and is also decent against GSZ deckis. Defense grid would be very good versus Stoneblade. Might test that in the sideboard...

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Originally Posted by akatsuki

2. How about Wipe Away? Obviously it seems good vs. Humility, but isn't a better strategy to win before it gets to that point? I can see potential uses vs. CounterTop lock, but again, I think winning earlier and using proactive disruption (Defense Grid) with cheap counterspells seems better.

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Wipe Away is great in that it deals with any problematic permanent, especially when you are on the Show and Tell plan. Defense Grid --> SNT --> Emrakul will win a truck load of games, but when they put humility, detention sphere, ensnaring bridge, etc in off of show and tell you can be in serious shit.

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Originally Posted by akatsuki

3. I presume Shattering Spree and Ancient Grudge are for Pithing Needle and Chalices etc., I think Spree is probably better.

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Shattering spree is another catch all. I've been a fan of it since I was playing vintage in that it gets passed things like Chalice of the Void. It's also an insane spell versus affinity and is a lot more useful versus TES than misdirection's in that you can blow up LEDs, Petals, and Chrome moxes if they haven't gone off yet.

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Originally Posted by akatsuki

4. I presume Stifles are for Karakas and Jace, but it seems like Karakas/Needle themselves are stronger.

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Stifles are for Karakas, Jace, Fetch lands, Pact trigger's on upkeep against hive mind, against any spell with Storm, against Wasteland, etc. They are really good and I'd be lost without them.

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Originally Posted by akatsuki

5. When is Through the Breach useful? I guess when you want business spells 9 and 10? Maybe against decks with a lot of counterspells? Someone explain this to me?

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It's incredibly useful when you know they side in something to fuck you over with. Often times players will hold humility, ensnaring bridge, etc, waiting for you to cast show and tell so that they can put it into play without presenting an oppurtunity for you to counter it. It is also extremely relevant in the mirror where I often -2 Show and Tell and +2 Through the Breach, thus bypassing the chance that they put anything into play.

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Originally Posted by akatsuki

I'm coming over from playing Hive Mind and I'm thinking about picking up this deck. Basically it seems to me like the easiest way to win the blue match-up is to resolve a Defense Grid (or make them waste their counters on it) and then cast Show or Sneak.

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Defense grid could be very good. I'm not sure. It's a double edged sword, though. Be careful when playing it.

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Originally Posted by akatsuki

Vs. the fair decks, Pithing Needle and Karakas seem sufficient.

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Probably. I think our toughest match-up is probably Esper Stoneblade or the psuedo mirror.

Really? I'm fairly sure the worst match-ups would be disruption heavy Team America and RUG.

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Originally Posted by akatsuki

Really? I'm fairly sure the worst match-ups would be disruption heavy Team America and RUG.

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All of their non-FOW counters are pay counters. Daze, Spell Pierce, etc. All you need to beat that is patience and sol lands. Not to mention they almost always run few or no basics and just die to blood moon. That's my opinion, though. I've never had a problem beating RUG or BUG and lose handily to Stoneblade every time I play against a decent pilot.

Fenrus, which decks did you play against in the tournament and how did you side against them? Did Repeal do its work? How was the countersuite?

Would love to hear your thoughts.

I'm pretty sure it's a lot worse than you're making it out to be. If they land a turn 1 Delver or Goose, you won't have the luxury of waiting. Blood Moon is good, but often times they can just kill you with their turn 1 creature. If it's BUG they have discard too.

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Originally Posted by JPAnghelescu

Fenrus, which decks did you play against in the tournament and how did you side against them? Did Repeal do its work? How was the countersuite?

Would love to hear your thoughts.

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I played against Burn Twice, Rest in peace miracles, Stone Blade, UR Delver, and Belcher. My loss was against Stone Blade in round 5. I drew with AJ Sacher to get into Top 8 in the last round. I didn't write down what my round three or four opponents were playing, I know one was RIP Miracles but I can't remember what the other match was.

I played Repeal as I was originally going to play Cloudpost, and when I took that apart to put Sneak and Show back together I was left with a choice--Two Repeals or two Preordains. I never really liked preordain in here, either. I think Repeal was pretty amazing all day. I used it to bounce flipped delvers, various creatures/threats to buy time, I often had it in hand to bounce Ensnaring Bridge, Humility, etc in Games 2 and 3 but my opponents never drew them. I also used it to bounce my own Lotus Petals at EOT to dig when needed or to bounce their 7th Permanent before swinging in with Emrakul to prevent a lethal alpha strike. I don't think I'll be taking them out any time soon.

The countersuite was really good. I especially loved the main deck flusterstorms. Mindbreak trap saved my ass in round seven versus belcher when he had the ability to make fourteen goblins on turn one through a force of will in game three. I would not have made top 8 without it.

Sideboarding:
Against Burn on the draw: -2 Daze -2 Show and Tell -1 Repeal +1 Spell Pierce +2 Through the Breach +1 Wipe Away +1 Shattering Spree. On the play I sided the Dazes back in for Pierce/Wipe away

Rip Miracles: -2 Daze +2 REB

UR Delver: Cannot remember, sorry.

Stoneblade: -2 daze -2 Show and Tell -1 Repeal +2 REB +1 Through the Breach +2 Blood Moon

Belcher: -2 Misdirection -2 Repeal +2 Stifle +1 Mindbreak Trap +1 Spell Pierce

Storm: -2 Misdirection -2 Repeal +2 Blood Moon +1 Mindbreak Trap +1 Spell Pierce

Hive Mind: -2 Show and Tell -2 Repeal -2 Misdirection +2 Through the Breach +1 Shattering Spree +1 Spell Pierce +2 Stifle

I think that's how I sideboarded in the matches I can remember. Sorry, there may be some errors.

Thanks a lot for sharing this. :-)

Im new to this deck, gonna play it at a tournament this upcoming weekend. I am curious what kind of hand you generally want to keep or throw back? Is it you want either 1 fattie in your hand or 1 SnT? Or would you rather have a hand of cantrips? Or throw the hands back if you don't have a cantrip?

Depends on your opponent.

Against a deck with Stifle (if you are on the draw), you'll want an Island or multiple fetches.

Against a deck with Wasteland, you'll also want a basic Island.

Against discard decks, hands with Brainstorm are more powerful (so you can hide threats).

Against fast aggro decks with minimal disruption, you'll want a fast hand.

Against slower decks, you can opt for a fast hand if you have protection or a slower hand with lots of cantrips so that you can sculpt your hand.

Generally, a hand with 1-2 lands, 1-2 cantrips, 1-2 counterspells, and 1-2 combo cards is a good hand, but I'm quite sure you could apply this statement to 90% of the decks in Legacy and be correct.

You almost always want access to a blue mana source. Also, be mindful of redundant or dead cards. Daze loses value on the draw. Force of Will or Misdirection requires another blue card. Multiples of the same creature (Emrakul or Griselbrand) are usually dead cards (unless you are going to play them in subsequent turns with Sneak Attack). Repeal (if you run it) is close to useless vs. certain decks. Multiple Show and Tells and Sneak Attacks can also be dead, although sometimes are good if you are playing against counterspell decks because you can run one out to bait their counterspell and then play the next one the following turn.

Thanks! It is very much appreciated! Anybody ever test a transformational sideboard into Hive Mind? It doesn't seem good to me but me and my teammate were discussing it.

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Originally Posted by Jodzilla

Thanks! It is very much appreciated! Anybody ever test a transformational sideboard into Hive Mind? It doesn't seem good to me but me and my teammate were discussing it.

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ok my quick response to that is, you will have no other cards in your board and you are still just a show and tell deck. aka it makes no sense to transform from Sneak attack to Hivemind because despite those names. they are really Show and tell decks, except Hivemind has grim monolith to cast hivemind. so do you also board in grims? and when will this ever win the game for you where sneak attack wouldn't win. theirs more effect ways to use your sideboard.

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Originally Posted by lordofthepit

Certainly not the first time Sneak Attack has won a big event, but I do recall someone said he'd eat his Black Lotus if that ever happened. Anyone know if he stayed true to his word?

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Originally Posted by majikal

LOL @ Sneak Attack! If this strategy ever wins a large tournament I will eat my Black Lotus.

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