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Tops and Liliana make the blasts much less dead than they'd otherwise be in non-blue matchups. The only thing that I see that is a little bit iffy is 14 black mana sources and 6 :b::b: spells. Even then the tops would help find the second black source against somebody wasting one of the first two.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rizso
Has anyone seen the list CVM played against BBD in the versus video in GPNJ?
His version was one of the japanese ones with rabblemasters instead of bloodbraids.Quote:
Originally Posted by ceustice
I was a bit skeptical about the Tops over Sylvan, but being able to have Liliana +1'ing constantly while floating REB for Cruise and able to draw it makes me appreciate it.
That is very true. Being able to top to maximize Liliana even more is pretty good.Quote:
Originally Posted by Claymore
It is pretty good, but it's also a pretty narrow usage. You have to find the scenario where you have mana to screw around with Top, where you have one of your two REBs sitting on top, where you don't have a Punishing Fire to ritually pitch, and where Liliana consistently ticking up isn't already winning the game. Sure, there are corner cases. I've certainly lost after a Lili ultimate, but that alone is not enough to justify Sensei's Divining Top over Sylvan Library. Top helps. Library wins games. There are points when Top is more useful than Sylvan Library, but there really aren't enough of those reasons in the stock Jund list.Quote:
Originally Posted by razvan
Top works better with chain of mephist then the library.
There's a list of more than thirteen thousand cards that work great with Chains of Mephistopheles. If you've landed a Chains against a deck that cares about Chains, you can typically probably just ride it out with Squire beats. Mainboarding 2Chains could be seen as a reason to run Sensei's Divining Top. 2Chains main with two copies of a Top-effect means that they'll be frequently seen in tandem. But for those decks that continue to have Chains in the side, there's no reason to dilute your mainboard for such improbable and overall insignificant scenario. Chains Vs Library. No matter who wins, they lose.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rizso
I decided to dust off Jund for the LGS in a weekly event. To be honest it was a last second choice due to my opponent who I knew was a DnT player I kept losing too week after week with reanimator. This makes me wonder...does Jund go to time so much? I don't remember it doing that when I played it a year ago.
I was in Top 8 contention for once which was awesome
R1...Some weird ass ashiok deck. I seriously thought I was facing DnT due to the player.
G1 I beat him down with Goyf fast enough that I don't know his deck. But I saw no creatures and it was U/B.
G2 In my INFINITE wisdom I boarded out my punishing fires. He resolves the Ashiok and I get milled to death. He was stealing my poor goyfs
G3 We ended on turns
0-0-1
R2 Maverick
G1 I decide to wastelock him but he has only a Maze of Ith out. So I kept pecking him to death with a dark confidant since he kept untapping my BBE.
G2 Sword of Feast and famine from him and a big ass KotR is staring me down and I topdeck a lucky abrupt decay on the sword. He misplays his lingering souls allowing me to eat it with DRS, but he did have 6 of them on the field I use Maelstrom Pulse on. I use Punishing fire to peck him to death and DRS to shrink his knight.
1-0-1
R3 12 Post
Never faced this deck before I think...this is a positive matchup
G1 Three bloodbraid elves in a row allow me to beat him into submission.
G2 I had him down to 4 life then when I tried to +1 Lily he responded by drawing with Top into an obstinate baloth and it all went downhill there. I took a overloaded cyclonic rift and was beaten to death by a hardcasted emakrul.
G3 Ended on Turns.
1-0-2
R4 BURN
I really wanted to scoop here
G1 He had to have kept a bad hand here. I managed to get two DRS online to absorb his dead swiftspears from punishing fires. I went extremely aggressive here and fetched Badlands over basics for great results.
G2 Turn 1 DRS, Turn 2 Lili, Turn 3 BBE into Jitte. I used Jitte to kill his lavamancers and I proceed to just keep gaining life.
2-0-2
I'm glad to have used this deck again to great results though I might have to adjust the list to the current meta.
Main Deck (60)
Creatures (15)
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Dark Confidant
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Bloodbraid Elf
Spells (22)
1 Lightning Bolt
4 Thoughtseize
2 Sylvan Library
3 Hymn to Tourach
3 Punishing Fire
4 Abrupt Decay
1 Maelstrom Pulse
4 Liliana of the Veil
Lands (23)
1 Forest
1 Wooded Foothills
2 Bayou
2 Swamp
3 Badlands
3 Bloodstained Mire
3 Wasteland
4 Grove of the Burnwillows
4 Verdant Catacombs
Sideboard (15)
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Pithing Needle
2 Pyroblast
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Life from the Loam
1 Rakdos Charm
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Golgari Charm
2 Pernicious Deed
Hey everyone, I decided to run a list of Jund at the SCG Open here in Atlanta. I decided to run a rather unique list that strays from what people think of Jund. I had maybe 8 Rounds of Magic under my belt with the deck before the event started. In the Open Trial I went 2-2 but I knew if I had played better I would have been 4-0. First I will share my list :
Ape Jund
4 Deathrite Shaman
3 Scavenging Ooze
3 Tarmogoyf
2 Coursers of Kruphix
2 Bloodbraid Elf
1 Hooting Mandrils
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Thoughtseize
3 Inquisition of Kozelik
3 Punishing Fire
3 Lightning Bolt
1 Funeral Charm
2 Sylvan Library
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Badlands
1 Bayou
1 Taiga
2 Swamp
2 Forest
4 Grove of the Burnwillows
4 Wasteland
4 Verdant Catacomb
3 Bloodstained Mire
SB:
1 Ancient Grudge
2 Chains of Mephistopheles
1 Golgari Charm
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Krosan Grip
1 Life from the Loam
1 Maelstrom Pulse
2 Pernicious Deed
1 Pithing Needle
1 Red Elemental Blast
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Tsabo's Web
So as you can see there is an obvious lack of Dark Confidant. I never was a fan of the card and as the format has sped up, I always saw him as a liability instead of a card advantage generator. I may be wrong but I never missed it once, and in multiple matches it would have hindered me rather then propelled me.
The second most obvious thing you will notice it 2 choices that are indeed legal in standard. Courser of Kruphix was the all star for the event. Courser is the sole reason I won many games, not only though life gain but card selection. Hooting Mandrills was also insane, the card is Tarmogoyf number 5 in many matches and much better then Tarmogoyf then others.
Here are my matches and my feelings on them,
Round 1:
Andres C. (Very nice deck and very experienced player)
EsperDeathBlade, 2-0, Very Favorable
1-0
Round 2:
Nick O (Stated he was new to legacy or something)
Quad Laser Dredge, 2-1, Equal
2-0
Round 3:
Nate B. (Newer Miracles Player)
Miracles, 1-1-1, Slightly Unfavorable
2-0-1
Round 4:
Chris A. (Wont Comment)
RG Lands, 2-1, Slightly Favored
3-0-1
Round 5:
Jack F. (Talented Miracles Man)
Miracles, 1-2, Slightly Unfavorable
3-1-1
Round 6:
Adrian T. (Local Friend)
B/G Rock, 0-2, Slightly Unflavored
3-2-1
Round 7:
Joseph M.
SFM Affinity, 2-0, Very Favorable
4-2-1
Round 8;
Chris Yarbrough (Nice Fella)
Bant Lands, 1-2, Slightly Unfavored
4-3-1
Round 9:
Arya R. (Jund man who 9-0'd Day 1 of the GP)
Jund, 2-1, Slightly Favored
5-3-1 good for 47th out of 24X.
Overall I was very impressed with the deck and the list I decided to play. If I was smart I would have taken a loss instead of a draw as I knew the Miracles Draw bracket would be a tough road ahead. Going forward this is the list I would play at an event tomorrow.
4 Deathrite Shaman
3 Scavenging Ooze
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Coursers of Kruphix
1 Hooting Mandrils
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Thoughtseize
3 Inquisition of Kozelik
3 Punishing Fire
3 Lightning Bolt
1 Call of the Herd
1 Life from the Loam
2 Sylvan Library
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Badlands
2 Bayou
1 Taiga
1 Swamp
1 Forest
4 Grove of the Burnwillows
4 Wasteland
4 Verdant Catacomb
3 Bloodstained Mire
1 Wooded Foothills
SB:
1 Ancient Grudge
2 Chains of Mephistopheles
2 Golgari Charm
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Life from the Loam
2 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Pithing Needle
1 Red Elemental Blast
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Tsabo's Web
The deck actually felt insane all day and with a bit more tuning I think this list will easily be the best deck. The reason I did not do better was my poor play and lack of experience with the deck.
IMO:
-Call of the herd, BBE, Mandrills should be bobs.
-Swap one Scavenging Ooze a GSZ. No reason for 3 Scooze; this gives you the third virtually while improving your abilty to get DRS, Goyf, or Courser.
Maybe I'll give your list (or similar) a go and see how it fairs, but I really feel like Scooze #3, Mandrills, and Call of the herd are just worse than Bob/GSZ. I understand call gives you two 3/3s against miracles, but Bob gets you cards => more dudes.
That said, congrats on doing well. I hope I'm as fortunate this weekend.
I don't think you want Dark Confidant in the deck anymore, Mandrill was INSANE all weekend and Scoozes were always threats and always live. Dark Confidant always dies without getting some advantage or being a threat. In my opinion, Jund needs to be closer to the ground with more targeted Discard, Raw Removal, and just raw power threats.Quote:
Originally Posted by tescrin
I have tried Courser, and it was ok. I should try it more. I need to figure out a way to properly insert it in the deck.
Bob is probably worse in a meta full of Delver decks, it always has been. Ooze, of course, is amazing in this same meta. If you are certain you will face lots of Delvers, of course, this is the correct call.
But you will lose the ability to win long games against decks that don't care about removal. Bob is a must-kill, and if he survives even one turn, chances are he will win you the game. It's as close to a bomb as this deck has. It's not necessarily wrong to ever experiment, but I (personally) think this is not optimal.
Erm it might be just me but if I want to put a delve crewture in Jund colors, Tombstalker is the go to card, not Mandril. It flies above tokens and blocks most goyfs/batterskulls. What gives?
On the Top discussion:
The main reason I would like Top over Sylvan is the fact that this deck has very few proper turn one plays. Thoughtseize and Deathrite are our only good ones, which will cause us to quite often not have a card to play on turn one. Top is a great turn one play, and we don't necessarily have to use it all the time.
You're not wrong, but it is probably optimal to run Dark Confidant, which kind of makes it impossible to play Tombstalker anyway. If we were to not play Confidant, Stalker would be my first choice as a Delve dude also, but I am not willing to ditch Confidant just yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by aluisiocsantos
I want to try top as well. Not only its a great turn one play, we dont lose turn two for Livrary, opening to other good plays such as t1, drs, t2 top, wasteland.
Or, it opens to great top3 variations onthe fly with fetchlands. The use of mana is the only drawback, which is the actual need of testing to see how better it would fare.
On the delve card: i want to try out a list like a mix of the brazillian and the gp Nj one.. No bbes and 2 Bobs, but with top, tombstalker and pyroblast. Might go to cockatrice later today
I picked up jund again and went 3-1-2 a few days ago. The two draws were surprising but I guess the list is a bit more grindy than usual lists.
I won over miracles, miracles and ur delver, lost to maverick (which shouldnt have happened) and drew against D&T and something i forgot.
The list was as follows:
3 goyf
3 bob
4 DRS
2 courser of kruphix
4 bolt
2 pyroblast
3 decay
3 p.fire
1 m.pulse
2 liliana
1 garruk relentless
2 sylvan library
4 thoughtseize
3 hymn
4 waste
1 forest
1 swamp
3 grove
3 badlands
3 bayou
8 fetch
Courser, double library and garruk were awesome however the clock a bit slow.
The board featured dual chokes which one me 3 games, 1 chains and 1 pyroblast. The hate on blue is so fun atm!
I used top when I first played Jund. It worked great in grindier matchups but it's a manasink and a half. It's harder to hold up B/G mana to bluff an abrupt decay which lead me to use Library instead. Whenever I play the deck Library seems to get thoughtseized more than the top ever did.
I tried one top and one library in my list i really liked it even tho its a little clunky late game its great with bob to see more cards or to set up a board state with BBE after a wrathQuote:
Originally Posted by aluisiocsantos
And it will bring out Force of Will if they're sitting on it almost every time. That makes the turn 2 plays better. They'll suffer through Thoughtseize on the draw and they'll remove DRS but they'll force a turn 1 top every time if they can.Quote:
Originally Posted by Asthereal