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4x Duress
4x Sinkhole
4x Smallpox
4x Hymn to Tourach
4x Vindicate
2x Crucible of Worlds
4x Swords to Plowshares
4x Innocent Blood
2x Ratchet Bomb
3x Bloodghast
3x Tombstalker
6x Swamp
1x Plains
1x Mishra's Factory
4x Marsh Flats
4x Scrublands
4x Wasteland
2x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
I added Ratchet Bomb to my Smallpox Decklist and they really are nice!
@Shough
I'm not really getting your mana base.
In mono black, we're considering running 4 Urborg, ToY yet in multicolor you're dropping it down to 2? :eyebrow:
How does your 1x Mishra's Factory matter? It's not a big enough beater that finding the singleton will give you more depth with the possible tactics you can employ. It doesn't really dodge any non-sorcery-speed hate.
8 spells / 38 need a single white. 4/19 lands should produce white mana.
Basically, you've given yourself 22 slots for lands.
4 ToY
4 Wasteland //don't count as color producing
1 Plains
4 Marsh Flats
6 Swamp
seems more appropriate. There is an extra possibility for white mana thrown in because marsh flats can get stifled.
@Hook76
That's the best hand your deck could get against zoo.
What would you do if you had say,
Bloodghast
Hymn
Pox
Nether Void
Urborg, ToY
2x Swamp?
Your right Bowvamp… There is no need for the single factory. I don’t worry about stifle as much as wasteland but, I can see your point. Perhaps and extra swamp would be better than U,ToY… Do you think U.ToY is that important?
My current deck list comprises of:
Sorcery (23)
4x Duress
4x Hymn to Tourach
3x Innocent Blood
3x Pox
4x Sinkhole
4x Smallpox
1x Syphon Life
Instant (4)
4x Dark Ritual
Land (22)
4x Mishra's Factory
12x Swamp
2x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4x Wasteland
Creature (5)
3x Nether Spirit
2x Tombstalker
Enchantment (3)
3x Contamination
Artifact (3)
3x Crucible of Worlds
Thoughts and comments? I really need help on building a sideboard too....
Eh
Ive never been overly fond of running dark ritual instead of lands. With 7 pox effects I feel like 22 lands is a little light. I also recommend running 4 urborg if you want to run pox with 4 factory 4 wasteland since BBB can be tough sometimes.
Im not sure how good contamination is. It seems like it's only really good against dedicated control which is the matchup you should be pwning anyway.
In any case I dont recommend running pox right now. It sucks since it's my favorite deck but there are far too many unfavorable matchups to make it worth running. You pretty much need the god hand (with your build) to beat zoo and survival game one and merfolk is nigh unwinable game one. :-/
Im sure pox will be good again sometime soon. But right now I would not recommend it. There may be an interesting BW version that runs ghostly prisons that can compete but Ive been too busy with school to explore such a deck.
Good luck
-clavio
Pox oddly enough is surviving a bit in my meta atm as we only have 2 matchs I can think of which hurts us that I run into there.... but then again I'm not that familiar with Pox to say that also :/
Maybe:
3x Bloodghast
2x Bojuka Bog
1x Cabal Pit
3x Crucible of Worlds
3x Extirpate
4x Hymn to Tourach
4x Innocent Blood
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Mishra's Factory
3x Nether Spirit
3x Pox
4x Sinkhole
4x Smallpox
8x Swamp
1x Syphon Life
2x Tombstalker
3x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4x Wasteland
extirpate is an interesting card. It's good against dredge and removing vengevines.
The one nice thing about pox is that its highly adaptable to your own meta. Itd be tough to give suggestions without knowing what exactly your meta is.Quote:
my meta
I've only plaid for about 2 months but, decks I've seen and played include the following- please take in account that some times these decks dont get played since people have their own tastes and will sometimes play one of their other decks-Quote:
Originally Posted by clavio
Zoo (Someone always plays this but only one deck ever)
Bant (two people play this, one always and one is off and on) [It sometimes is Survival, Pure, or a Home Brew of it]
Dredge (rarely played but there is a deck of it)
Burn (two people play this, one almost always, and the other some times in he is in the mood)
Mono Blue Control (Off and On)
White Staxx (Off and On)
Reanimator (It doesnt get played much anymore but, you see it at times)
ANT (One of the two combo players)
Show and Tell/Hideaway Combo (One of the two combo players)
The Game (Always played)
Enchantress (Always played)
White Weenie (Off and On)
Merfolk (I've seen it around but, not to often)
Goblins (One deck get passed around and someone will occassionally play this)
Eva Green (Lately someone has begun playing this)
Stompy (Not sure the name but it invovles a lot of morph, dues of calamity, and so forth- Usually played)
Theres the list I can remember, I have good memery but- it isnt perfect... Hopefully you can help me out- Would appreciate sideboard help too
I like the list a lot from what I see, simple but effective.Quote:
Originally Posted by Red_Death01
My only suggestion that sticks out is to SB Contamination then maybe bust it out against non-black control decks like Top or Standstill decks. I know this seems like a sketchy choice, but you should actually try Infernal Contract in its place. You can always board it out, but most aggro decks that don't run burn you can pretty much run yourself down to very low life to gain enough CA to put them in a choke hold. From my experience, if it ever resolved against those opponents 90% the time the game's yours.. 4 cards is just too much advantage to deal with, if they can't finish you off within the next turn it's usually gonna cost them.
I'm thinking of maybe:
3x Bloodghast
2x Bojuka Bog
1x Cabal Pit
3x Crucible of Worlds
4x Hymn to Tourach
4x Innocent Blood
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Mishra's Factory
2x Nether Spirit
3x Pox
4x Sinkhole
4x Smallpox
8x Swamp
4x The Rack
3x Tombstalker
3x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4x Wasteland
??? The build lost it's simplicity sorta- but... what do you guys think of it all?
Syphon Life looks really good on paper, but realistically, it's going to be useless most of the time. It's not good in the early game and really slow for -2 +2 a turn. I'd rather have a 4th Innocent Blood.
2 Tombstalker is not enough. Bump it to 3.
I can confidently say that regardless of your meta, you need to run at least 3 Extirpate in your sb. It sucks ass only if you mess up with it, trust me I know because I've went through plenty of games where I would have won with Extirpate on Tropical Island :( It is very versatile in this deck though, because you can use Extirpate to attack duals, Force of Wills, Vengevines, Jaces, other win conditions. Seriously, if you know when to use this card, it will be the card responsible for your match wins, or match losses if you fail to use it correctly.
If you are running crucible syphon life is fine. It will bail your ass out against zoo and gives you the inevitability you need some times the way cursed scroll did in 2004. I wouldnt run it as a four of but I have played it.
4 rack seems like alot . You seem light on lands.
I don't think Syphon Life is comparable to Cursed Scroll, though. Syphon Life gains you life against Zoo but it doesn't kill anything they have that slipped your removal.
I've been tuning my Pox deck for the past three months online (I had originally built it for a friend) and am here to necro this thread. I've had a lot of sucess of MWS (for all that's worth) and recenltly went 3-1 at a local tournament to get third of 14. I played, in order:
Steppe Lynx Zoo 2-0
Game one double smallpox, he fireblasted in response to the second one and took me to four, I kill him a turn before he drew the second burn spell he needed to kill me. I have wastelock with two wastes out, and waste his taiga with him having a fetch in play. He fetches in response, and I waste Taiga again in response to the fetch as to be safe from fireblast. He lost with a fireblast I had kept him off of and a bolt in hand.
Game two two innocent bloods followed by and a dystopia that ate a sylvan library and two goyfs. the abyss garner a quick concession once wastes join the party to keep him off white for pride-mage.
Enchantress 1-2
Game one I hymn away enchantress, grove. He draws an enchantress presence (boo, I had edict in hand had he drawn argothian instead) and goes off.
Game two I kill lands, drop a dystopia which eats three permanents and I upkeep until I'm at 3 life, and garner a concession.
Game three he is on the play, and I hymn away lands, eager to take complete control with the double dystopia in hand. He goes turn three aura of silence. Boo. It was a one-of that he had ripped off the top his turn three. 13 of the 15 hate cards I had were arts/enchants. By the time I landed dystopias, he had already started making angels and had dropped a Null chamber naming ratchet bomb. Boo.
Zoo (hatfield's list) 2-0
Edict, smallpox kill his threats and he is land-light. Factories beat down until top finds an abyss and I get the W.
Hymn, cullling scales, innocent blood, hymn bring this one home.
Survival Elves
Game one is over fast after he makes a llanowar pass, I inquisition a survival, he draws and plays a survival. Boo.
Game two edict priest into double plague gets there
Game three is very close, with him leading with two quick archdruids kept smallish by one plague, and ends with a race between how many guys he draws and the abyss. I rip an edict and swing the clock against him.
What I played:
// Deck file for Magic Workstation (http://www.magicworkstation.com)
// Lands
2 [ZEN] Marsh Flats
2 [ZEN] Verdant Catacombs
2 [OD] Cabal Pit
4 [IN] Swamp (2)
4 [DK] Maze of Ith
4 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (4)
4 [PLC] Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 [TE] Wasteland
1 [M10] Gargoyle Castle
// Creatures
1 [MM] Nether Spirit
// Spells
4 [SH] Mox Diamond
4 [TSP] Smallpox
4 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
3 [10E] Crucible of Worlds
4 [FE] Hymn to Tourach (1)
4 [ROE] Inquisition of Kozilek
2 [LG] The Abyss
4 [OD] Innocent Blood
3 [5E] Pox
// Sideboard
SB: 4 [FNM] Engineered Plague
SB: 3 [SOM] Ratchet Bomb
SB: 3 [PLC] Extirpate
SB: 3 [AL] Dystopia
SB: 2 [MR] Culling Scales
the side was incredible, and I've been happy to have extirpate against (the possibility of vengevine), sterling grove activation, control decks with counter-top, and occasionally mid- Ill gotten gains.
Gargoyle castle has served me very well against decks packing moats or enough swords to off my factories and spirit. Also incredible against lands if I can kill their engine with an extirpate so that I can win in the air.
Ratchet bomb has been amazing, killing swarms of fish, vials, anJd counterbalances (assuming it's set proactively) and Jace TMS. Culling scales, despite the moderate dis-synergy with mox diamond (though if you're casting a scales, you've likely got enough mana to play the rest of the game) performs amazingly, and has excellent synergy with top - targeting top if scales and top are the only permanents on board and then responding with tap, draw. drawing EoT if you plan on killing goyf, ect and then replaying second main.
The abyss wins so many games, I recommend anyone with physical copies (or access to them) give them a try.
The obvious omission of sinkholes is not for reasons of availability - four copies are sitting in my black binder, lamenting the number of dazes, sylvan rangers, and aggro decks in the metagame. Pox essentially replaced the sinks, taking a creature along with the land. Facilitated by mox daimonds, pox can even be played daze-proof without needing to sack two lands (three lands and mox diamond)
Mazes were a recent addition after the inclusion of mox diamond to fill the role of wretched banquet (my answer to the fast aggro and merfolk decks popping up in my meta) in stemming the bleeding early game, and aided me in bumping up my land count to 27 to support 7 poxes and mox diamonds, all without 'losing' the four removal slots. Having four urborgs feels dirty when tapping mazes for mana for a crucible only to have them hold back goyf the follwoing turn.
I hope someone regains interest in the deck after reading my mini-report and card analysis - the primer hasn't been updated in some time. I'll be playing my pox list at the next dual for forces two sundays from now, and will post results.
@Media314r8: I like your deck, not every last bit, but most of it.
- Your sideboard looks very good. From your report I see especially Dystopia has been helping a lot. You already adressed the dissynergy between Culling Scales from the board and Mox Diamond: if you ever cast them with a Mox on the table, you will have to wait three turns until you will have gotten your two card investment back. That seems bad to me. Do you board out Moxen in this case?
- I've been liking Sensei's divining Top in Pox. I've been playing two copies. How does it feel to play four? Isn't it too much?
- I've been considering the resiliency against mana-disruption one big advantage of monoblack lists. Your lists does nice tricks as you run both Mox Diamond and Crucible of Worlds but Blood Moon makes you scoop, doesn't it? Maze of Ith seems like a good idea but it doesn't produce mana. If an opponent wastes your Urborg or you don't draw into one, it's just bad. Maybe you could reduce the count of Maze of Ith.
- Pox is always quite week against Swords to Plowshares, yours twice so as you run only five and half win conditions. I guess you omit Tombstalker because of The Abyss, maybe man artifacts like Chimeric Idol can solve this problem if it is one for you?
- I agree that Pox should be in the deck, even over Sinkhole.
I don't board out the moxen, as having scales hit turn three and killing permanents turn four is essentially the same as having a mox and dropping it turn two, having it start killing ~their~ permanents turn four. Of course, having both mox and scales in an opener is unlikely (not rare, but unlikely) as there are only two SB scales. Having the power to make turn one hymns, smallpoxes, (to kill nacatl and a dual against zoo, for example) or ratchet bombs more than compensates for the occasional dys-synergy with scales. The tempo provided by cards like dark rit or mox diamond allows pox to take control of the game, and make up for the actual card advantage by our cards which cause our opponent to not be able to play the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tourach
Top is the ONLY source of CQ we have in pox. I've actually debated cuting a BBB pox for a crystal ball - I would never go below 4 tops, as they win wars of attrition, where we are looking for a wincon or a harder lock IE crucible+waste, and our opponent is looking for lands to get back in the game. This happens almost every match of pox I've played.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tourach
I have mox diamonds, 4 swamps+ 4 fetches, and 3 ratched bombs + 2 culling scales to play through or deal with magus. Maze of ith does produce mana if sitting next to a urborg, or pitched to a mox diamond. I needed more lands to reliably have mox diamond openers, and mazes fit the bill while serving as removal and occasionally tapping for mana. (tempo decks like merfolk and canadian thresh will often waste a maze if it's sitting next to an urborg, as they would rather kill you fast, and realize that as a pox deck, it's very difficult to mana-screw you due to your high land count.)Quote:
Originally Posted by Tourach
Gargoyle caste doesn't care about swords effects. We have a long time to win game one, and by the time I'm making gargoyles, I've likely found crucible (3 of em MD) and have all but locked my opponent out. Nether spirit is irked by swords, but he is there more as another maze of ith effect that likes to be pitched to pox, and occasionally wins by attacking. In my experience, my opponents board out removal other than burn as I run so few creatures. When my opponent does sandbag a card to two and I suspect swords, it just gives value to the 'dead' midgame hymns and inquisitions that can be used 1st main before we animate factory.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tourach
Hey all, I need some help fixing my mana base. So far my build is the following:
3 Nether Spirit
3 Tombstalker
3 Crucible of Worlds
4 Duress
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Innocent Blood
3 Phyrexian Totem
4 Pox
3 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Sinkhole
4 Smallpox
1 Raven's Crime
2 Urborg, T.o.Y.
4 Mishra's Factory
10 Swamp
4 Wasteland
Im trying to get up to 24 or so lands but I don't know what to take out. Raven's crime is definitely a choice but what else? Top?
Phyrexian Totem. Its inclusion is contradictory in a Pox deck.
@ Morton_Salt: I'd say the debatable slots in your decklist are:
1 Nether Spirit
3 Phyrexian Totem
1 Raven's Crime
1 Crucible of Wolds
3 Sensei's divining Top
1 Mishra's Factory
It might be dangerous to cut too many win conditions. Therefore, maybe -1 Nether Spirit, -1 Phyrexian Totem, -1 Raven's Crime, -1 Crucible of Worlds, +4 Swamp.
So a mana source that stays on the field after poxing that can also turn into a beater when you need it is contradictory? I think your comment might be contradictory hahaQuote:
Originally Posted by Shawon