[Deck] Zoo

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Originally Posted by Loxodon Baileyarch

I don't see what difference that makes. I'd announce it over a microphone to the entire world if i could.

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As much as it counts, I have to agree.

I have been playing Zoo for a lot and Fireblast has always been cute at best and never relevant when I drew it.

Moreso if you're playing heaploads of non-mountain lands like Fetches, Canopy, Savannah and the basics.
Hatfield list played a grand total of 6 Mountains and most of the time playing a Fireblast for its alt cost means giving up all of your red mana.

I know it's often meant to end games but drawing 2 early on is worse than drawing pretty much each and every other playable burn spell in the format.

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Originally Posted by Loxodon Baileyarch

To me Firespout is just hate. You gotta play through the hate.

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That philosophy is really stupid. You think Ichorid runs Chain of Vapor to deal with Wild Nacatls? Zoo is just like any other deck. It's ideally tuned to beat a specific metagame. If the metagame shifts at all, you should be taking notes and likely making adjustments, at least in the sideboard.

Firespout simply wasn't played before, so the Landstill matchup was taken strictly as a bye and the strategy was simply to goldfish. Now Zoo has to worry about Landstill, so that probably means a few changes have to be made.

Slowing the deck down plays into their hands (and likely weakens other matchups), so I agree with you in that sense, but simply ignoring the existence of Firespout, and especially saying "it's only hate" is stupid.

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Originally Posted by Forbiddian

That philosophy is really stupid. You think Ichorid runs Chain of Vapor to deal with Wild Nacatls? Zoo is just like any other deck. It's ideally tuned to beat a specific metagame. If the metagame shifts at all, you should be taking notes and likely making adjustments, at least in the sideboard.

Firespout simply wasn't played before, so the Landstill matchup was taken strictly as a bye and the strategy was simply to goldfish. Now Zoo has to worry about Landstill, so that probably means a few changes have to be made.

Slowing the deck down plays into their hands (and likely weakens other matchups), so I agree with you in that sense, but simply ignoring the existence of Firespout, and especially saying "it's only hate" is stupid.

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Well what does the great Zoo guru Forbiddian suggest to oneiros76 since my logic is just stupid?

Besides I've given other ways to combat Firespout by holding back when you don't need the extra creatures in play, boarding stuff out etc. What other card could you put in Zoo's maindeck or sideboard to combat Firespout? What card would be good enough to make it?

Cursed Scroll!

That or just board in the IGG loop and take it down :)

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Originally Posted by Pulp_Fiction

Cursed Scroll!

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Boom! Cursed Scroll wins AGAIN!
Well, if you want to run Black you could play Bloodghast. That first 10 life is always easy anyway :tongue:

3 damage to our dudes will kill all but goyf and whatever 2-of biggie is in the list you play. Sweepers are in a category of hate that traditionally just doesn't seem worth boarding strictly against to me. The options are: be slower and use more dudes with 4 toughness (no), board against it (Ramosian Rally lol), or play through it (yep).

And forbiddian I don't think he necessarily meant to just ignore it as a philosophy on how he builds decks, just quickly assessed the above.

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Originally Posted by Pulp_Fiction

Cursed Scroll!

That or just board in the IGG loop and take it down :)

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But seriously. Cursed Scroll is an answer to Firespout. Non removable damage? Check.

Transformational Sideboard into LEDx4, InfernalTutorx4, Badlandx2, Tendrils of Corruptionx1, IGGx2, Dark Ritualx2. That is probably all wrong because i suck at combo, but you get the idea.

Yeah i know he didn't mean it like that. But like me, he comes off like a dick in every post, so it's all good :laugh:

Jitte is quite nice for protection... Some people play Vines of Vastwood already, maybe that would be a good sb choice?

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Originally Posted by Micki

Jitte is quite nice for protection... Some people play Vines of Vastwood already, maybe that would be a good sb choice?

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cute factor at best... but if you play against removal.dec constantly it might warrant SB space, I'd never see the need for it presently in my meta....

However, if you are one of the more prominent players in your area, and people hate against your personal deck, sometimes those 'cute' cards really win games in a big way... if you know what you're up against

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Originally Posted by Gibsonmac

cute factor at best... but if you play against removal.dec constantly it might warrant SB space, I'd never see the need for it presently in my meta....

However, if you are one of the more prominent players in your area, and people hate against your personal deck, sometimes those 'cute' cards really win games in a big way... if you know what you're up against

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Have i started some "cute" revolution or something? :confused:

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Originally Posted by Loxodon Baileyarch

Have i started some "cute" revolution or something? :confused:

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Vines of vastewood... if you proposed it, then perhaps... I'm not saying its good or bad, just is has the 'cute' factor going for it, in that it would be unexpected and pwn people as they play into it... It is something that I might run a a random tournament solely because of this... otherwise, on a regular basis I'd tend to stay away from such cards

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Originally Posted by Loxodon Baileyarch

But seriously. Cursed Scroll is an answer to Firespout. Non removable damage? Check.

Transformational Sideboard into LEDx4, InfernalTutorx4, Badlandx2, Tendrils of Corruptionx1, IGGx2, Dark Ritualx2. That is probably all wrong because i suck at combo, but you get the idea.

Yeah i know he didn't mean it like that. But like me, he comes off like a dick in every post, so it's all good :laugh:

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Play the Badlands main.

4 LED
4 Infernal Tutor
1 Tendrils of Agony (not Corruption)
2 IGG
4 Dark Ritual

Golly, that seems just terrible enough to work. NAWT!

Mark of Asylum.

Here's an idea: What about Reverent Mantra?

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...ent_mantra.jpg

Granted the deck does not play a ton of white cards but you should still be able to pitch something for the alternate casting cost to save your crew from a board sweeper like Firespout. Depending on build, you could have Qasali Pridemage, Wooly Thoctar, Path to Exile, Figure of Destiny, Knight of the Reliquary, or Lightning Helix.

Certainly seems a couple Sideboard copies of Mantra would be better than a schwag fifteen-card "switch" into bad combo.

What situation(s) would it be for?

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Originally Posted by P.S.

Here's an idea: What about Reverent Mantra?

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...ent_mantra.jpg

Granted the deck does not play a ton of white cards but you should still be able to pitch something for the alternate casting cost to save your crew from a board sweeper like Firespout. Depending on build, you could have Qasali Pridemage, Wooly Thoctar, Path to Exile, Figure of Destiny, Knight of the Reliquary, or Lightning Helix.

Certainly seems a couple Sideboard copies of Mantra would be better than a schwag fifteen-card "switch" into bad combo.

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There's also Cho-Manno's Blessing if one were inclined to go down the protection path. Both Reverent Mantra and Cho-Manno's Blessing could also be used in the mirror or to force through damage. Either of these cards seems better than Vines of the Vastwood.

@ Jandax, the situation is Firespout.

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Originally Posted by jandax

What situation(s) would it be for?

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So not only do you not read the thread but you can't even be hassled to read the last page of it? Really? Maybe it was my fault for not using the quote feature. So, for that, I apologize.

Mantra seems good. In execution, we will see. It was certainly MVP in the old Rebel decks of Standard yesteryear.

You could just run that new Standard card instead. It's one white mana to give your team protection from a color. You don't pitch another valuable card for it so that's a plus.

The only problem with Brave the Elements is that it only works for white creatures. Would Harm's Way work here? Most of the guys we're going to be saving have 3 toughness, so we could save two of them (or one pridemage) and deal 2 to them while we're at it.

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Originally Posted by P.S.

So not only do you not read the thread but you can't even be hassled to read the last page of it? Really? Maybe it was my fault for not using the quote feature. So, for that, I apologize.

Mantra seems good. In execution, we will see. It was certainly MVP in the old Rebel decks of Standard yesteryear.

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hi, not only have I read this entire thread more times than you have, but that question was meant to illicit a philosophy as to why this card is better than what is already being run, what unique problems it solves, or why one would want to ditch a Helix/Throctar/etc in order to give temporary pro:from.

I'll pause while you take your head out of your ass.

You're a liar. The last page was obviously talking about Firespout. Not only that, but Cursed Scroll had already been suggested and this was a continuation of that conversation (which you obviously didn't read).