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Magic, seriously tho' I don't understand it either, it's so conditional and resource intensive that you just lose as soon as they establish a board presence. Between threats, counters and equipment it's just so hard to come back vs a tripple Time Walk from UWR.Quote:
Originally Posted by AmokPL
Hi guys, played a small tournament yesterday (40 peeps) with Manaless. Awesome times and lots of fun. Quick recap:
R1 teammate Jo with BUG delver.
G1 I open a Chancellor and that slows him down. T1 nothing, T2 a delver, T3 delver flipped and delver 2 lands. But I manage to blow him out next turn.
G2 Chancellor again, but he lets me start. No fun, but hey, at least he nows that he has to let me start. Unfortunately he lands T2 Cage and I manage to flip 2 narco's and 1 BfB with my one Wraith. Nut that was not enough to stop him. On to G3!
G3 Chancellor again and he never really gets in the game because he is stuck on 2 lands. So yeah, 2-1.
R2 Kevin with LED-dredge
G1 he starts with T1 double LED, Colliseum. T2 he goes bonkers and dumps like 40 cards in his GY. But unfortunately no Narco's and no DR, but the full complement of 4 bridges. So in my T2 I let Ichorid enter the BF and just let it die. Poof go the bridges and it's an easy race for me.
G2 is a blowout for me. He is too fast and ther is not much I can do.
G3 is a grindfest and we go in time but after a huge dredge from his part he somehow manages to miss the flayer in my GY and just dumps lots of bodies on the BF. In my last turn I just return all my Ichorids & Shadows and DR Flayer, DR GGT for a gazillion damage to the dome. 2-1 it is!
R3 Jona with Sneak and Tell
I know what Jona plays and I'm not so happy. I think this is one of our hardest MU. A relatively fast combo with counters and sided GY-hate.
G1 I open a Chancellor and that slows him down a bit. On his T2 he goes S&T into Grisel, but I drop the Chancellor and that slows him down enough to give me the win at 2 life.
G2 he opens with T1 S&T into Griselbrand after letting me start. I drop Griselbrand too. But it's not enough and he kills me with dual attack of Spaghetti and Grisel.
G3 he lands a T1 Cage and I can't find the Silence or Claims before a dual attack kills me. 1-2
R4 Guillaume with Affinity
A very nice guy. He comments that it is his very first legacy tournament and that he is not sure about his deck. We'll see...
G1 he opens very strong, but no Plating or Ravager. That is enough for me to kill him in one swift alpha strike with FKZ.
Before G2 during sideboarding he is talking about the deck that he's intrigued with it and knows that he should let me start since there is no downside to that for him. So we start G2 and he... starts!!! Okay, if you just said it and then don't want to get a free card and turn, I'm fine with it! But all to no prevail and he kills me in 3 attacks. The Relic of progenitus also helped a bit.
G3 is mine again with DR Flayer and huge GGT. 2-1
R5 teammate Marijn with Esperblade.
G1 I manage to get him on 12 life, but a timely Supreme verdict wipes my board and removes my bridges. He then continues to drop a TNN with a Jitte and that spells doom for me. I die with him on 1 life...
G2 is a topdecked spellpierce the nail in my coffin. Along with a duo of TNN... 0-2
R6 is announced and I'm 10th. If I win this match, I still have a shot at top 8 but it will depend on my resistance.
I'm paired against Steven with UWBlade
G1 his deck doesn't do much and I Flayer him for a total of 36.
G2 is a grindfest with a duo of Meddling Mages opposite me. One on Therapy (T2), next one on DR (T3). But Ichorid, narco's and Shadows munch his life away and give me the win. 2-0
Standings are posted and I'm... 9th :( Because my R3 opponent was high enough he just ID'ed and that sealed my fate. I miss T8 with 0.1% difference with N°8. But hey, lots of fun and awesome games. I'm not unhappy!
Awesome report my man! Rep'ing Manaless!
Mind sharing your list?
Sure, it's a pretty standard list:
4 GGT
4 Thug
4 SImp
4 Wraith
4 Shadow
4 Ichorid
4 Narco
4 Chancellor of the Annex
4 Dryad Arbor
4 Cabal therapy
4 Dread Return
4 serum Powder
4 BfB
4 Phanta
2 Griselbrand
1 FKZ
1 Flayer
SB:
4 MBT
2 Wooded Foothills
1 Forest
3 Nature's Claim
2 Reverent Silence
3 Faerie Macabre
All in all I was pretty happy with the list. The Powders were underwhelming. I never used them and I find it difficult siding with them. If you chose to leave them in to increase the chances of drawing your SBanswers, then what do you remove? I usually sided out a variety of spells. Some DR + targets, a Phanta and most of the time the powders. Pretty contradictory, no? Over all the games I've only mulled twice. And both times my hand was absolute garbage. No dredgers, no phanta, no Wraith and a few narco's.
Next tournament I will try the Autumn list and cut the powders.
How was running only 12 Dredgers?Quote:
Originally Posted by Darklingske
I never had any problems with it. But i admit that I feel more comfortable with some extra dredgers. Next time I might go back to 15 dredgers and no Chancellors MD. But then I also need to find room for the Salvages and the Ghasts and Autumns. Ahh, dilemma, dilemma :smile:
I've always felt that Manaless needed to open up with a Dredger its in opening hand, or first card drawn. But hey, if it works for you. :smile:
In the tournament I never had a hand without a dredger in it. No, that's a lie. The one time I didn't have a dredger in it, I had a powder to get 7 fresh ones and there were dredgers in it then.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Froggy
Here's a game I had vs DeathBlade, thought it was pretty good.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGi1PS8wV5Q
I'm telling you, Deathrite Shaman is just not that great against the deck. Is it decent? Sure. But it's not that effective when you run two to three times as many sets of cards that beat it.
It's honestly just a really bad Relic against us.
Decks that run Rest in Peace tend be control-based strategies. Most of those decks aren't going to kill you in a turn or two, and if they have protection for their hate card, that's just hard to beat in general and you aren't likely winning the match.Quote:
Originally Posted by AmokPL
Possible, but not likely. Depends on the config.
"Time Walking" an opponent with no relevant clock for two turns is fine. As I previously mentioned: I had to double-Contagion a Deathrite Shaman through Force of Will before against BUG in a large tournament - I wound up winning both the game and round. Granted, that doesn't happen often, but control decks by nature are just slower so you have more time.
I'm also starting to like Leyline of Sanctity in the board. I never thought I would, but I just can't say enough about how good it has been.
Dropping that card is worth the 'Walk against a deck like Storm or Belcher. Empty the Warrens is still a thing (even though I haven't lost to it in four years), but so is Mindbreak Trap. I really don't like losing to Storm, and it's an omnipresent deck and one of our worst matchups. It also helps against decks like Burn and 12-Post where Bogs do nothing against you.
Remember, I change and test new sideboards...all...the...time. I'm just saying that I like it and it has worked great for me thus far.
I was finally able to put my Nature's Claims to good use!
I had no clue what I was playing against though...
I win Game 1 (he plays Semblance Anvil lockdown/combo?) because he doesn't do anything to really stop me.
I lose Game 2 since I didn't know what I should board in; he opens up with LotV. Scoop.
I win Game 3 after mull to 6 with both Arbor and Nature's Claim. He opens up with LotV. I kill it, proceed to kill him with Flayer combo.
Congrats. It feels good to beat hate. Not sporting to think there are many, many douche's in the world, especially to Dredge players, and especially to manaless dredge players, but yeah, if the opponent was, even sweeter.
He didn't say much at all, actually, lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by ahg113
But I felt good beig able to beat LotV. :)
What is this?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Froggy
I had no clue, laid it down turn 1-2 with City of Traitors, and started crapping out 3CMC artifacts (Ensnaring Bridge for example).Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenCid
Got the go-ahead to do the new primer.
Bout time :smile:Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood
I was about to win vs Mono-White Soldiers with Manaless (I even killed his RiP), and then MTGO shat on me.. -_-
The point is Deathrite Shaman shouldn't even be good vs us, it should be bad vs us because there's no other card Manaless Dredge could play, be it Unmask, Gitaxian Probe, Fetchlands, Shambling Shells, Dakmor Salvages or Bloodghasts that's going to contribute more to your win% vs the field. Even if Deathrite Shaman only has a, for example, 8% chance of winning the game outright it may as well be only a, for example, 4% chance as long as Chancellor of the Annex is generically good vs everything else - and it is in my opinion - it may not be necessary in order for Manaless Dredge to compete in a Deathrite Shaman based metagame, but it's definitely the highest EV card we can add in a Deathrite Shaman based metagame.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood