@lio-Golgari charm splits the difference between grip and dread of night while still being relevant vs elves or an ambitious empty the warrens.
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@lio-Golgari charm splits the difference between grip and dread of night while still being relevant vs elves or an ambitious empty the warrens.
yes, you are right. I had Golgari Charm in my SB exactly for this purpose. But with all the Sneak and Show decks, I believe at least one Krosan Grip is a must nowadays (even as an addition to Golgari Charm).
If you're going to cut the NoTWs, you'd better be running Expedition Maps over Into the Norths. More answers to Karakas are needed that won't further tax Pithing Needles.
I'm going to run this list at the qualifier
* 12 Combo lands
* 1 GQ
* 1 Sejiri
* 1 Bog
* 2 Bayou
* 2 Verdant
* 2 Basics
* 3 Blooming Marsh
* 1 Factory
* 4 Crop Rotation
* 3 Into
* 4 Tseize
* 4 Duress
* 2 IoK
* 4 Sylvan
* 4 Petal
* 4 ESG
* 4 Needle
* 4 Hexmage
Sideboard (Would like to work in 2ish trackers). Meta is Leovold/Storm/Delver heavy.
* 3 Surgical
* 3 Decay
* 1 Karakas
* 4 Sphere
* 1 Deluge
* 1 Charm
* 2 NoTW
I play lands but I've been thinking rug depths might be really strong. Any thoughts here?
The decks in this thread are running black for Hexmage / Urborg / Discard. What does dropping black for RU give, and how does that differ from a more standard RUG lands?Quote:
Originally Posted by inevitablepnut
Oh oops I meant bug! LolQuote:
Originally Posted by tapp
My thoughts here are you loose speed but gain some other outs. Almost like bug control with depths. I have no idea if this would work but I feel it could be quite strong.
Go to the RG Combolands thread
jdmdave, what do you like about playing 2 Verdant Catacombs instead of 4? If you're not playing NotW in the main, how do you feel about ovate's suggestion about Expedition Map over Into the North? Overall I like the list, let us know how it works for you.
Nice list, but I wouldn't play Mishras Factory maindeck. Preboard, this land has basically zero utility, only producing coroless mana that can fuel up your only two spells (Sylvan and into the north). If you need an extra land, play Karakas maindeck. Or switch it for some Sb card - Deluge or Decay.Quote:
Originally Posted by jdmdave
Also with two basics and two Bayou, third fetchland could replace one Blooming Marsh. More options to fetch basic and less situations where you topdeck tapped Marsh instead of another land.
Otherwise Sb looks solid for open meta.
Now I noticed you run 25 lands - why so?
I like Into the North because it makes the deck faster, particularly when combined with fast mana.
As for 24 lands, the deck technically runs 4 lands that don't serve as mana sources, so I like to err on the side of caution. I wrote the manabase down incorrectly, should be 12 combo lands, 1 GQ, 1 factory, 1 sejiri, 1 bog, 2 verdant, 2 basics, 2 bayou, 2 marsh.
Here is the correctly formatted list
* 12 combo lands
* 2 Marsh
* 2 Bayou
* 2 Verdant
* 2 Basics
* 1 GQ
* 1 Steppe
* 1 Bog
* 1 Factory
* 4 Tseize
* 4 Duress
* 3 Needle
* 4 Crop Rotation
* 4 Sylvan
* 3 Into
* 4 Hexmage
* 4 ESG
* 4 Lotus Petal
* 2 IoK
Sideboard
* 4 Sphere
* 1 Needle
* 1 Deluge
* 1 Karakas
* 3 Surgical
* 3 Abrupt
* 2 NoTW
Almost spot on with my list. Sphere has been stellar out of the board.
Can anyone tell me why they're still enamored with blooming marsh and expedition map? Playing map in my experience has been awful. Blooming marsh has lost me a ton of games where I need a 4th land to pop depths and I draw it over another fetch or bayou. Submerge is rarely played and I feel citp clauses are just so bad
Expedtition map is clearly of the power level of crop rotation ; turn one map should be forced of will if opponent doesn't have an answer to marit lage ; it enables turn three token with urborg/depth/thespian which race most decksQuote:
Can anyone tell me why they're still enamored with blooming marsh and expedition map? Playing map in my experience has been awful. Blooming marsh has lost me a ton of games where I need a 4th land to pop depths and I draw it over another fetch or bayou. Submerge is rarely played and I feel citp clauses are just so bad
It also makes the deck less dependant to colored sources.
If you play the turbo list which I don't recommand cause it has less tutor ; less interaction ie more autistic list/all in ; dropping expedition map might be a solution with more speed cards like into the north but you are way less consistant and solid against hate.
As for blooming marsh submerge see some play in infect and some others decks, which might cause you to just lose the match if it is not an issue for you go for bayou ; I don't have any problem with blooming marsh or in very rares occasions.
I just don't know if I like maps more than North. I could do a split and test it.
in my testing with map, I had some openers like Marsh, Urborg, Map, Lotus Petal, Spirit Guide, Thoughtseize, Duress, if the map had been into the north it would have been a lot more useful. I feel like map is too slow so I personally will not be playing it. It might work in more control/slower builds but that is not where I am trying to be.
That opener with ItN instead of map is still not a kill, you still need to draw a Vampire Hexmage, a Thespian's Stage or a Crop Rotation off the top which makes Map the better card. If you draw a Dark Depths or another copy of ItN it just becomes useless, whereas map will let you combo anyway. Map costs 1 mana and you can sit behind it waiting to make a move, be it search a Bojuka Bog if opponent is putting some dredge pressure or setting up threshold, find the missing combo land, or get a Sejiri Steppe if you happen to draw the combo naturally and need to get past a blocker. Map > ItN.Quote:
Originally Posted by chaosjace
ItN only seems better when you have a good opener including Urborg and Stage/Hexmage, other than that it seems pretty bad.
Has anyone tested Ancient Stirrings lately, I've never tried it but it seems like it could work same role as Map or ItN? Hits lands, needles, petals, maps, NOTW. Doesn't dig very deep though.
Play what you like. There were numerous instances at GP Chiba where ITTN led to a T2 20/20, whereas a map would've been too slow.
I really do think I'll do a 2/1 split on the side of map for Louisville since I will be having a Karakas MB. The utility to grab my silver bullets leads me this way.