[Deck] bUrg Tempo

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Originally Posted by Manipulato

New article from Friedman about his current 4c Delver list incl. boarding guide.
http://www.gatheringmagic.com/benfri...-color-delver/

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interesting read, personally I'd cut one thoughtseize from the board, as well as the spell pierce, for two invasive surgery, but that's me (edge vs show, loam, and miracles, stops cold Infernal tutor), true, you lose this slow vs LoTV or Counterbalance but, both can be answered by decay, and still, we are speaking of a lone 1 of, so it may be worthy to try.

Also, I see he keep focusing on the midrange route, and keeps referring to cutting delvers... shouldn't he be playing 4c goodstuffs from Tomas Mar? Yet having played both, I get the feeling, at times the Mar list seems to lose power, yet, Mar uses Goyf and strix, we use Nemesis and Frogs, it gives me thinking about melting the two decks and see what happens...

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Originally Posted by NegatorITA

...me thinking about melting the two decks and see what happens...

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Maybe this is what you're looking for: http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=14230&d=284799&f=LE

I'm toying with this types of decks too atm

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Originally Posted by Fl0do

Maybe this is what you're looking for: http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=14230&d=284799&f=LE

I'm toying with this types of decks too atm

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yes, this is the kind of deck I'd like to try, there also was another online here

Right now i have only one question on my mind: is essential the splash for the 4th color right now?

Red mean bolt reb kommand, in midrange version we play only 2 bolt. With this meta where high pecent of decks play waste

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Originally Posted by ORDAL

Right now i have only one question on my mind: is essential the splash for the 4th color right now?

Red mean bolt reb kommand, in midrange version we play only 2 bolt. With this meta where high pecent of decks play waste

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for sure it gives reach and flexibility, but I too had the fear of the 4th color in general, I'd say that if black had access to a rightful 1 black removal, we wouldn't need of it.
Disfigure isn't often enough, because bolt can reach the opponent out, so in order to beat the side effect, I'd say we would need a black removal equal or similar to StP, which, the best we have atm, is dismember.
Unsure though, I've hardly played any delver without bolt, I guess I've to try a straight bug list before I can really say something.

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Originally Posted by NegatorITA

for sure it gives reach and flexibility, but I too had the fear of the 4th color in general, I'd say that if black had access to a rightful 1 black removal, we wouldn't need of it.
Disfigure isn't often enough, because bolt can reach the opponent out, so in order to beat the side effect, I'd say we would need a black removal equal or similar to StP, which, the best we have atm, is dismember.
Unsure though, I've hardly played any delver without bolt, I guess I've to try a straight bug list before I can really say something.

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speaking of the devil...


http://mythicspoiler.com/aer/cards/fatalpush.jpg

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Originally Posted by NegatorITA

speaking of the devil...


http://mythicspoiler.com/aer/cards/fatalpush.jpg

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This is a good card. Even works with fetch lands

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Originally Posted by NegatorITA

speaking of the devil...


http://mythicspoiler.com/aer/cards/fatalpush.jpg

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Really true. The devil has come.

I hate that this card has bad art, because we'll be seeing a LOT of it.

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Originally Posted by Whitefaces

I hate that this card has bad art, because we'll be seeing a LOT of it.

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100% agree, thought the same :laugh:

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Originally Posted by Whitefaces

I hate that this card has bad art, because we'll be seeing a LOT of it.

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It is true, but each time you play you can say: THiS IS SPARTA!!!
This might be funny.

We have to think about that card. Not only in our deck. If we play it, how many? In main board, in sideboard?
How do we fight it? In Ben Friedmann decklist? In decklist with Goyf?

I think it is a great addition to bolt. I like a lot bolt, but I'm considering playing BUG Delver or BUG Midrange without Goyf, because this card would be to good against Goyf in matchups where we need it.
In BUrg, I'll play a split of Bolt/Decay/Push, maybe something like 3/3/2 + 1 in sideboard or 4/3/1 + 2 in SB, with 2/3 Snapcaster mage. Snap becomes greater than before with this new target.

Another deck that will benefit from it is Grixis Delver. Before the card, the deck have trouble to handle Goyf without dismember or Strix, these cards have huge cost in comparaison of Fatal Push. I think Spell pierce will not be good enough to stop this one mana removal in a lot of matchup.

I write this quickly in the train. It might be unaccured, but I really want that we discuss the card.

Okay, let's be clear: That is Jackie Chan in his armor from Dragon Blade kicking the Persian emissary off of Kami's Lookout from Dragon Ball Z. Jeez people, isn't that obvious? (Yeah, yeah, it's a Skyship, I know...)

And Fatally Pushed is a very interesting card. AfroSmile is on the right track, though I think it brings up the question of whether or not this could become a BUG Delver deck now, without Bolt or Goyf, with 4 of this? It is dead against far fewer creatures than Bolt though you obviously lose direct damage. It would improve the manabase consistency as well. Also, it triggers off Wasteland and Daze, as well as fetches and chump blockers.

As some people have alluded to, the cards main problem weirdly enough is Abrupt Decay. There are too many matchups where removal is dead, we can't overload on this effect. At the same time, we can't really cut Decay when playing straight BUG because of Counterbalance. It's going to be tough to find the balance (no pun intended). I also agree that AfroSmile is on the right track with numbers.

BUG Delver has always been the most midrange flavor of Delver decks, so in that sense I think it will benefit the most since it's not losing any bolts or decays to make room for this anyway. I'm not sure 4c will need or want more than 2 in the 75.

Went 4-2 with the Burger today at our attempt at having a big event.

Rd1: Lands 1-2
Rd2: Elves 2-1
Rd3: Miracle of Science (Miracles and Omniscience mashed together): 1-2
Rd4: Eldrazi and Taxes: 2-1
Rd5: Death and Taxes: 2-1
Rd6: Some Junk Nic Fit thing: 2-1

4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
1 Gurmag Angler
2 Snapcaster Mage
1 Tombstalker
2 True-Name Nemesis
3 Abrupt Decay
4 Brainstorm
1 Counterspell
4 Daze
4 Force of Will
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Spell Pierce
1 Spell Snare
4 Ponder
4 Flooded Strand
1 Misty Rainforest
3 Polluted Delta
2 Tropical Island
3 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland

SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
SB: 1 Diabolic Edict
SB: 1 Dismember
SB: 1 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 1 Painful Truths
SB: 2 Red Elemental Blast
SB: 1 Sudden Demise
SB: 1 Sulfur Elemental
SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
SB: 3 Thoughtseize
SB: 1 Umezawa's Jitte

The losses were pretty meh, Lands did it's Lands vs Delver thing and I couldn't draw a threat in the middle game against Miracles of Science to put him away after I won this sweet counter-war:

http://i.imgur.com/fQwqGU8.png

Tombstalker was mildly difficult to cast at times but basically won me all my matches against what should have been horrendous matchups. Counterspell continues to shine against basically everything that isn't the Delver mirror and is easily my favourite card in the deck. I think this deck is definitely an aggro-control deck as opposed to tempo/midrange deck (like grixis delver) and UU - stop your shit ends up synergising so well with the rest of what we're doing.

Deck still feels like the best deck I've ever played and is just a boatload of fun to play compared to everything else in the format.

Good luck to all the BURGers at GP Louisville!

4 copies of our beloved 4c Delver made it Top 32 at GP Louisville! Good job guys! All on the Friedman list.

http://magic.wizards.com/en/events/c...sts-2017-01-08

Solid showing for greedymanabase.dec! Just need one of them to crack the top 8 and take it down now.

Quite interesting that Noah Walker has moved away from Grixis Delver to Tomas Mars list, might mean he doesn't feel like it's that well positioned at the moment (which I agree with). At the same time, two quite stock Grixis lists made top 8.

I'd love to read a report if any of the players sees this.

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Originally Posted by Whitefaces

Solid showing for greedymanabase.dec! Just need one of them to crack the top 8 and take it down now.

Quite interesting that Noah Walker has moved away from Grixis Delver to Tomas Mars list, might mean he doesn't feel like it's that well positioned at the moment (which I agree with). At the same time, two quite stock Grixis lists made top 8.

I'd love to read a report if any of the players sees this.

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I also cant explain why Grixis Delver stll has good results at big tournaments...I think the positioning in the meta is really not the best and it struggles vs so many strategies even among the tier 1 decks.

The performance outside of the Top 8 were also weak, no one within the Top 32 and in general just around 2-3 versions day 2! I think it's more the strong players than the deck itself.

I think BUG Delver & 4c Delver are way better positioned atm especially with Fatal Push coming which offers BUG good one mana removal.

Edit: I'm still not sure about 2 Jitte's in the SB, even with 3 TNN. They're just super slow & clunky especially vs decks like DnT where the manabase is under pressure & getting 2 counters on it is difficult because of mom or Thalia + Karakas.
I really enjoy something like 2 Forked Bolt + 1 Sulfur + 1 DoN to beat all those weenie decks even if Sulfur + DoN are just good vs DnT.
FB also synergizeses well with something like SCM.
Any experience on this topic?

Hey bUrgers,

any feedback from GP grinders or other "bigger" tourneys within europe? Come out of your caves :wink:

I suck at manabases. Can someone explain why Friedman's list runs a 1 of Badlands?

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Originally Posted by Xerlic

I suck at manabases. Can someone explain why Friedman's list runs a 1 of Badlands?

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If you look at the manabase there are three Tropical Islands, and it will often be the land you lead on turn one. Badlands provides the other two colours to cast either Abrupt Decay or Lightning Bolt on turn two. You don't fetch it up that often, but there are enough situations where you want it to go alongside a Trop to warrant the inclusion.