[Deck] Jund

Playing the Punishing Fire combo maindeck, my sideboard would be the following:

3 Pyroblast
3 Duress
1 Hymn to Tourach
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
2 Obstinate Baloth or Pithing Needle
1 Rakdos Charm
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Krosan Grip
1 Nihill Spellbomb

Taking into account that the top 3 tier decks are Esperblade, Jund and RUG/BUG, I think that Batterskull, Jitte and Obstinate Baloth may be very good against Mirror and BUG, while Rakdos, Ancient and Krosan are useful against Esper and Pyro, Nihill and Rakdos against RUG.

Pithing is a house against Jace or Pernicious or ToP so I have doubts between this and Obstinate (which is also very helpful against Burn and tribal decks in general).

The rest of the side should be focused to beat combo...

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Originally Posted by James

Playing the Punishing Fire combo maindeck, my sideboard would be the following:

3 Pyroblast
3 Duress
1 Hymn to Tourach
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
2 Obstinate Baloth or Pithing Needle
1 Rakdos Charm
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Krosan Grip
1 Nihill Spellbomb

Taking into account that the top 3 tier decks are Esperblade, Jund and RUG/BUG, I think that Batterskull, Jitte and Obstinate Baloth may be very good against Mirror and BUG, while Rakdos, Ancient and Krosan are useful against Esper and Pyro, Nihill and Rakdos against RUG.

Pithing is a house against Jace or Pernicious or ToP so I have doubts between this and Obstinate (which is also very helpful against Burn and tribal decks in general).

The rest of the side should be focused to beat combo...

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Nihil spellbomb doesn't really hurt RUG. I wouldn't bring it in...

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Originally Posted by tonychu88

Wasteland is very good, and is worth tweaking and adjusting the mana base for the shear power. I think the deck definitely needs 23-24 lands depending, if you notice I was running 23 lands + a Loam, which acts like a 24th land. I thought the land count was about as low as it gets and you can't trim anymore. Wasteland is very good in a lot of matchups because of the mana boost that deathrite shaman can give you. Just being able to wasteland on t2+playing a 2-drop is usually insane amounts of tempo. Also, the free win variable, there are a lot of greedy mana bases and having wasteland in your deck can just be a huge blowout.

As an aside, there's a certain mental aspect involved with playing wasteland in your deck, people tend to fetch basics a lot and sometimes this can end up screwing them out of a color later eventhough you may not have wasteland.

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Good call, thanks. I'll try it out again.

I think the most difficult thing to deal with in BUG decks are tombstalkers. I'm find that three mana removal spells are just not getting it done, I'm thinking about terminate and go for the throat as potential board cards as I have 4 spots open now in my board (non-PFires JUND).

Placed 6-3 at Edison with this list ended up at 37th place, I'm not in the final standings at 37th but 137th for round 9 but if you check round 8 I was 45 or 46 and winning mirror bumped me to 37th!

Creatures x 15
4x Deathrite Shaman
4x Dark Confidant
4x Tarmogoyf
3x Bloodbraid Elf

Spells x 22
4x Thoughtseize
4x Liliana of the Veil
3x Lightning Bolt
3x Punishing Fire
3x Hymn to Tourach
3x Abrupt Decay
1x Sylvan Library
1x Life from the Loam

Lands x 23
3x Badlands
2x Bayou
3x Bloodstained Mire
2x Wooded Foothill
4x Verdant Catacombs
3x Wasteland
4x Grove of the Burnwillows
1x Swamp
1x Forest


3x Duress
3x Pyroblast
3x Mindbreak Trap
2x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Malestrom Pulse
1x Ancient Grudge
1x Bloodbraid Elf
1x Umezawa's Jitte

Round 1 Beat RuG Delver 2-1
Round 2 Beat TES, Piloted via Bryant Cook, I did get luck as I needed 2-0
Round 3 Beat UWR Delver 2-1
Round 4 Lost to RuG Delver piloted via AJ Sacher 0-2
Round 5 Beat Stoneblade 2-0
Round 6 Beat Junk Nic Fit 2-1
Round 7 Lost to Merfolk via mana screw, and missing DRS gain life trigger to not die to Bob fml. 0-2
Round 8 Lost to Sneak and Show 0-2
Round 9 Beat Mirror 2-0

Overall had a really fun weekend, made a lot of new friends, had Bryant Cook sign my goblin tokens for storm, went 3-1 in legacy challenge with TES. Good weekend

Went 5-3-1 at Edison, first time playing the deck. Absolutely curb stomped High Tide, Bant, NO Bant, Zombardment and Punishing Maverick. Drew with Lands because I forgot graveyard hate. All my losses were to ANT or TES.

Any advice for the storm matchup? I had to double hymn and duress a guy just to force game three.

Mindbreak traps are pretty good, as a 2 of or 3 of depending on the meta and your personal call.

I thought combo decks typically prey on non-blue midrange, grindy type decks like Jund, Junk, Maverick, etc. Not saying we should just give up on the matchup, but it's important to realize that some matchups will just be really tough to overcome on a consistent basis.

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Originally Posted by Arsenal

I thought combo decks typically prey on non-blue midrange, grindy type decks like Jund, Junk, Maverick, etc. Not saying we should just give up on the matchup, but it's important to realize that some matchups will just be really tough to overcome on a consistent basis.

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I am well aware. I'm just trying to find the best defense for this deck. Discard seems to be our best line of attack; after that, something that interacts with their spells instant-speed (Mindbreak Trap, Pyrostatic Pillar, etc.)

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Originally Posted by zulander

I think the most difficult thing to deal with in BUG decks are tombstalkers. I'm find that three mana removal spells are just not getting it done, I'm thinking about terminate and go for the throat as potential board cards as I have 4 spots open now in my board (non-PFires JUND).

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Have you considered Dead / Gone? Seems like it's incredibly flexible as it can still do the job of early red removal but with an additional bonus of removing some problematic creatures, even though temporarily.

Now that I'm mentioning split cards, I can only imagine how hilarious it would be to BBE into Boom / Bust and observe your Miracle opponent's facial reaction when you announce you are casting Bust :laugh:

EDIT: Dreadbore seems like another flexible alternative, since it has applications versus control decks relying on PWs.

Anybody considered Jund Charm? Obviously mana intensive but looks very versatile.

I am not super-certain that Modern Jund cards will be good in Legacy. Completely different decks that you need to face. Jund Charm is ok, and can do some nice tricks, but I don't know if it's worth it. It doesn't help with your bad match-ups at all.

I still think Show and Tell and Miracles are the #1 problem, with some other combo decks in tow. The rest is easily handled.

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Originally Posted by razvan

I am not super-certain that Modern Jund cards will be good in Legacy. Completely different decks that you need to face. Jund Charm is ok, and can do some nice tricks, but I don't know if it's worth it. It doesn't help with your bad match-ups at all.

I still think Show and Tell and Miracles are the #1 problem, with some other combo decks in tow. The rest is easily handled.

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My thought was the ability to have graveyard hate while also having other useful modes for other matchups. Rakdos and Golgari charm also have these qualities.

I'm not a huge fan of Jund Charm, I think dreadbore is playable since it can come in against Jund/Control. Golgari Charm is okay because it's great against Helm Combo control (actually just is a beast in that matchup).

Why run Jund Charm and Dreadbore for cards you can't answer? What's wrong with Maelstrom Pulse?

Yeah Jund Charm sucks, despite some people playing up to 4 in their Modern sideboards it's a 2 of at best, mostly because 3 mana is pretty clumsy...

Golgari Charm on the other hand seems super sweet, especially in Legacy. The modes are all good, in fact you can bring it in against a lot of decks and as a 2 mana instant it's cheap enough for what it does. In an open meta I think I would play at least 1, more likely 2 of them. I really like how it can crush random decks like Enchantress and DnT while also be viable against tier 1 decks.

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Originally Posted by dunkle_stille

Yeah Jund Charm sucks, despite some people playing up to 4 in their Modern sideboards it's a 2 of at best, mostly because 3 mana is pretty clumsy...

Golgari Charm on the other hand seems super sweet, especially in Legacy. The modes are all good, in fact you can bring it in against a lot of decks and as a 2 mana instant it's cheap enough for what it does. In an open meta I think I would play at least 1, more likely 2 of them. I really like how it can crush random decks like Enchantress and DnT while also be viable against tier 1 decks.

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I run three in my Junk sideboard alongside a pair of deeds. It's always been good.

Well, Golgari Charm does help against Sneak Attack, Rest in Peace and that stupid Leyline of Sanctity.

So now we have to evaluate how that is better than Naturalize or Krosan Grip.

So what does that charm do:

- Can randomly kill stuff. Hey, Lingering Souls is still a card, so are goblins, and even Merfolk before they set up a lord.
- -1/-1 on a SFM with Jitte is good, if only for one turn.
- If they get a Dark Confidant first, you can kill theirs.
- Regenerate all creatures is good against Supreme Verdict.

Hm. I might be convinced to play one! It's actually not bad.

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Originally Posted by Barbed Blightning

Went 5-3-1 at Edison, first time playing the deck. Absolutely curb stomped High Tide, Bant, NO Bant, Zombardment and Punishing Maverick. Drew with Lands because I forgot graveyard hate. All my losses were to ANT or TES.

Any advice for the storm matchup? I had to double hymn and duress a guy just to force game three.

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mindbreak trap is a good start.

Combo matchup is bad for Jund. People who play combo currently are geared against discard which is big right now. I'm sure with experience and the right cards, you should be able to handle it.

Can you describe your PF Maverick game? Do you know the decklist? I was under the impression that PF Maverick was a pretty bad matchup for Jund.

Congrats on your finish.

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Originally Posted by razvan

Well, Golgari Charm does help against Sneak Attack, Rest in Peace and that stupid Leyline of Sanctity.

So now we have to evaluate how that is better than Naturalize or Krosan Grip.

So what does that charm do:

- Can randomly kill stuff. Hey, Lingering Souls is still a card, so are goblins, and even Merfolk before they set up a lord.
- -1/-1 on a SFM with Jitte is good, if only for one turn.
- If they get a Dark Confidant first, you can kill theirs.
- Regenerate all creatures is good against Supreme Verdict.

Hm. I might be convinced to play one! It's actually not bad.

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Regeneration through a Deed, profiting on combat, and kills D&T/Maverick. Good spell is good. The BUG list that made second at Edison ran some

My current 75 after SCG Edison is as such,

Creatures x 15
4x Deathrite Shaman
4x Dark Confidant
4x Tarmogoyf
3x Bloodbraid Elf

Spells x 21
4x Thoughtseize
4x Liliana of the Veil
3x Lightning Bolt
3x Punishing Fire
3x Hymn to Tourach
3x Abrupt Decay
1x Sylvan Library

Lands x 24
3x Badlands
2x Bayou
4x Bloodstained Mire
2x Wooded Foothill
4x Verdant Catacombs
3x Wasteland
4x Grove of the Burnwillows
1x Swamp
1x Forest

Sideboard

4x Duress
3x Chalice of the Void
3x Pyroblast
1x Bloodbraid Elf
1x Life from the Loam
1x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Umezawa's Jitte

Main Deck changes

I wanted to go back up to 24 lands, which is what I felt was the right number before I played with Punishing Fire. Originally I went down to 23 lands with the incorporation of Punishing Fire and had the Life from the Loam to act as the 24 land. As nice as Loam was in the main deck, I felt like not having the direct 24th land put me in awkward mulligans. Jund thrives off of continuously applying strong pressure to their opponents. Failing to play a land for the first 4 turns inhibits you from applying pressure and stripping resources, which is just not what you want to be doing. Both my loses in SCG Edison ended up with a Mulligan with a questionable hand due to mana (both hands had two playable lands, a Deathrite Shaman and good spells). I was wasted early both games which lead to me playing catch up with the DRS and not proactively playing threats or answers. while testing 24 lands my draws almost never resulted in missing a land drop for at least the first 3 turns. I do believe 24 is the right number of lands for both punishing Jund and regular stock Jund.

Sideboard Changes

I took my ancient grudge out because the only match up's I wanted it in were MUD and Stoneblade. With my experience facing Stoneblade while running punishing fire, the grudge is lackluster and unnecessary. The fires usually can handle their creatures that get equipped as well as Tarmogoyf usually being bigger than their Batterskull germ. Abrupt Decay helps to fight off Umezawa's Jitte or the creatures equipped to it. I don't feel the grudge is needed in my meta at the moment. I also cut 3 Mindbreak Traps for 3 Chalice of the Void, primarily to fight storm and burn. I like sideboard cards that help fight through multiple decks. Chalice at 0 addresses storm's mana artifacts and chalice at 1 stops burn from casting Lighting Bolt, Goblin Guide, Chain Lightning, Grim Lavamancer, Lava Spike, and Figure of Destiny which will allow you to stabilize your life total and start to apply pressure. Sure they have a much of other spells that will hit you but if you stop at least 12 spells thats 1/5 of their threats from hitting you. I do admit the appeal of holding a Mindbreak Trap against storm on the draw is better than chalice, but I felt like I have no cards for burn and I want to bring in something besides Umezawa's Jitte. There are stronger cards to fight burn but then I weaken my matchup against combo, which is more relevant in my meta. I added in the Life from the Loam in the board from the main deck to fight the greedy tri to quad color decks that don't run basics. I don't know if it's needed or necessary, but I do not want to get wasteland locked and I want to take advantage of my opponents greedy mana bases. The last change was dropping down to 1 spell bomb and adding in the 4th duress. I'm sure it's a risky idea lowering my hate count for dredge, but I want to prepare for more popular combos decks such as storm and more importantly Show and Tell variants. I do believe that Show and Tell is Jund's worst matchup. What they are trying to do is so much more powerful then what you're trying to do. Since we, unlike Junk, do not have access to Karakas, Gaddock Teeg or Swords to Plowshares, we need to rely on Discard, Pyroblast, and Liliana sac to fight them. You need to be able to apply quick pressure to their hand and to their life total, or ensure a Lilana in play before the drop a Griselbrand, Emrakul, or Omniscience for a successful match. If dredge becomes a deck that I need to consider seeing more often, I will put more hate it but right now there the boogie man is hiding under the bed.