Gold Digger [UWr Delve Control]

I went 2-1-1 yesterday. I'm pretty fed up with continuing to get draws in every tournament. I'm making decisions quickly (although possibly not as quickly as possible / necessary?), but my opponents are taking their sweet time. Have to say that's one big thing I miss about Storm and Delver.

I was still trying out Stoneforge. I still like it more than Moat / Baneslayer and theoretically it should allow me to close games faster. Academy Ruins rebuying Batterskull was good in the pseudo-mirror (the winning list vs mine, we drew). Someone in the thread claimed that any discussion of Stoneforge disqualifies the deck from this thread. That's unreasonable, the key difference between this and Stoneblade is the cantrip and Dig suite. The finisher is yet to be determined clearly.

R1 - Burn - he played and boarded poorly but I don't think I was likely to lose the match. 1-0
R2 - Mirror - he resolved Jace first, and was just barely able to defend it and kill mine. He Jaced me out (maybe I should have conceded when my chances were slim?). Game 2 was really interesting, the person ahead switched back several times. Both of us got Batterskulls shattered, but I had a cute play Stoneforge, trigger on the stack put Batterskull on top with Ruins play. Game 3 we were even on board. 1-0-1
R3 - ESG's Delver brew - BURG Delver without Stifles or Wastes. He flooded horribly game 1, but killed all my creatures. Snapcaster eventually picked up a Jitte and ended it. Game 2 he had grudges aplenty, and lots of pressure. Game 3 I plowed Goyf then resolved Blood Moon on turn 3, locking him out. 2-0-1
R4 - Miracles - the pairdown against a person playing Miracles for the first time. I made a big mistake with a Ponder by not sequencing a couple turns in advance (didn't put a land on top), which made me play Jace without Pyroblast up, which allowed him to win the counterwar on Entreat. That got there. Game 2 I got him down to 5 with Meddling Mage on Counterbalance, but then he found a Plow, played Counterbalance, and locked me out.

So far I've gone 1-3 against Miracles. Obviously I need to test or approach the matchup differently since I'm getting such different results from alphastryk. I wasn't boarding in Flusterstorms and I was boarding out Pierce, so that's a big difference. What do you guys think is a good board plan with the Stoneforge builds? Should those be favored more?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AnziD

So here are a couple of my thoughts:

1) I want more ways to kill a resolved Jace.
2) Pierce has surprising utility in that it can stop delve spells that are cast off of 4+ mana
3) What's the verdict for?

---

You have 3 blasts and 3 cliques if it resolves - which has happened once in all the games I've played. Fight hard over Jace - it's usually the only card they have that matters.

Verdict is obviously the worst card left, but it is a backup answer to entreat - this is where I would consider BEB.

Edit: The lists with more creatures might have a worse Miracles matchup - I've been winning by going over the top and being an even longer game control deck. Pierce is excellent against CB and Jace, as well as Entreat if they mess up.

My plan is usually to try to get them to fight over the first delve spell, then slam Jace. If they don't fight over the delve spell, or you win the fight, you're so far ahead it's very hard for them to come back.

You definitely have to play super fast given how many actions you have to take. Even moreso than Miracles, which could be difficult if you are not used to it.

Has anyone tried Luminarch's Acension? Seems really good with the Moat plan but weak to Abrupt decay.

I d like to question the 1 of TC that we see in most of the lists. How has it been doing for you ?
For those on the Moat build, wouldn t Clique be a better card to have instead ? Providing a much needed clock G1 Vs Combo and protecting Moat.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jizz

I d like to question the 1 of TC that we see in most of the lists. How has it been doing for you ?
For those on the Moat build, wouldn t Clique be a better card to have instead ? Providing a much needed clock G1 Vs Combo and protecting Moat.

---

I personally dislike the Cruise, I understand why it is there but it never feels as good as casting Dig. I'm planning on cutting it for something like another Bolt or something similiar to Impulse.

@alphastryk Have you gotten in more testing vs UR delver? I'm wondering what your experience was if so.

I felt good against other delver decks (especially UWr delver - batterskull doesn't fare too well across the moat!), but in testing I couldn't quite stabilize against UR.

Concerning, given how large a share UR has among the delver lists currently.

Another option, akin to how some Miracles sideboards side, is to have the SFM package in the board.

The one Cruise is definitely awkward. Keep in mind the deck started with 2. I've tried another Preordain, I've tried Impulse. I may still try Fact or Fiction. Impulse was the second best card, but wasn't super exciting either.

I got a lot of testing in vs UR delver tonight, and here's where I've gotten to (this list will consistently win matches). Game 1 is still unfavored, but not horribly, and games 2 & 3 are favored.


4 Flooded Strand
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Arid Mesa
3 Tundra
2 Volcanic Island
3 Island
2 Plains
1 Mountain
1 Academy Ruins

4 Ponder
4 Brainstorm
1 Preordain
1 Treasure Cruise
4 Dig Through Time

3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Baneslayer Angel

1 Moat
2 Engineered Explosives
2 Pyroclasm
1 Supreme Verdict
4 Swords to Plowshares

2 Pyroblast
2 Spell Pierce
3 Counterspell
4 Force of Will

SB:
3 Vendilion Clique
2 Flusterstorm
3 Nyx-Fleece Ram
2 Blue Elemental Blast
1 Red Elemental Blast
1 Wear // Tear
1 Blood Moon
2 Containment Priest


I ended up on Ram over Firewalker simply because it was hard to produce WW early enough for it to matter. I'm up to 3 cards to make sure I see one by about turn 4. Ram either helps you stabilize while blocking or keeps you from dying to topdecked burn late.

Here's how I'm boarding for the matchup:
-1 Jace, -2 DTT, -1 Cruise, -3 Counterspell
+2 BEB, +3 Ram, +1 Fluster, +1 REB

Counterspell seems like it should be fine, but often you don't have UU available when you want it.

I hate boarding down WinCons, but Jace is pretty awkward until the game is locked up. There's not a lot of other spells I'd want to cut either, and REB makes Jace pretty awkward. I want another Baneslayer but I'm not sure what to cut.

There's an argument for not taking out so many delve spells, but you need to make sure you don't lose by turn 4, not make sure you win on turn 8.

Played this list last night to a 4-2 record. First time playing the deck, and a bit rusty as I have not played much lately.

//Wincons (4):
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Entreat the angels

//Business (34)
4 Brainstorm
2 Counterspell
4 Dig Through Time
2 Engineered Explosives
4 Force of Will
4 Ponder
2 Pyroblast
2 Flusterstorm
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Treasure Cruise
1 Preordain
1 Sensei's divining top
1 Moat
2 Supreme Verdict

//Lands (22)
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Academy Ruins
1 Arid Mesa
4 Flooded Strand
1 Karakas
3 Island
2 Plains
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Tundra
2 Volcanic Island

//SB
2 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Pyroblast
2 Pyroclasm
2 Vendilion Clique
1 Wear//Tear
1 ETA
2 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Counterbalance
1 Council's Judgement

Round 1: Mono R painter
G1 i manage the key spells from his side and bury him in cardavantage.
G2 I horribly missplay and lose to the combo
G3 was same as G1, simply higher cardquality and dodging the early moon.

1-0, (2-1)

Round 2: Death and Taxes
Game 1 i manage lifetotal and after moat lands i only have to handle his flickerwisps and a quick concession follows after wisp#3 is handled.
Game 2: I fail to draw enough relevant spells and lose to sofai equipped creatures.
Game 3: Vclique and ETA angel beats after stabilizing with moat.

2-0 (4-2)

Round 3: Death and Taxes (again)
Game 1 Again i easily manage lifetotal and after moat lands i handle his flickerwisps and ETA beats him.
Game 2: same as above

3-0(6-2)

Round 4: Bug Delver
G1: I wiff on 2 brainstorms and the deck craps all over me and i lose to not finding any additional lands or cheap cantrips.
G2: I resolve 2 DTT, 5x 1mana cantrips and see no sweepers or moat and lose to goyf beats :-/

Felt a winnable MU, but no luck this round
3-1 (6-4)

Round 5: Sneak & Show (w.progenitus)
G1 I lose to a sneak attack, i can handle everything for a while but he eventually gets there. I did see a progenitus though and did not mind! :)
G2: I have way more answer than he does business, and Utli jaces him for the win.
G3: Here i have a lot of counters and not much else. He loses a lot of life to A.tomb, so clique kan sweep up in 4 attacks.

4-1 (8-5)

Round 6: UR Delver
Not much to write about, he draws gas and resolve 3x TC in both games where i resolve no delve spells. Not close - 0-2.

4-2 (8-7)
Missed top 4 by 1pt :-/

Pleased with the deck, just my playstyle! Not as taxing to play as other control decks, as you burn your spells quite fast in this build.

Thoughts:
-Moat is the real deal! Awesome all day!
-Baneslayer was missed, will play it over eta next time around
-1 top in main overperformed. Will not play more, but it was really good all day. It also pegged people to put me on stock miracles :-)
-TC was underwhelming, never cast it, pitched it to force once though.
-2 supreme was overkill, will reduce to 1 - most like a pyroclasm will be brought in instead
-2 Flusters main was awesome, glad they were not peirces!

Dissapointed in the perfomance vs delvers, will ditch the CB sb plan for Rams i think and some more flex - most likely another baneslayer too.
I think my 2 losses boils down to variance, but non the less i will be working on shoring up th UR delver MU going forward.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jedi_gof

I missed Banesslayer

---

Baneslayer would have had a hard time against double D&T in rounds 1 & 2.
I bet EtA felt nice as a wincon here :wink:

I can see that BSA is nice against BUGxyz & UR but anything running White (aka STP) just makes her look bad.

To quote something about the original deck which can be translated to the deck v2 aswell for to Baneslayer or to not Baneslayer.

Quote:

---

Racks or Angels?

Warren Chang suggested that there is no reason to allow the opponent the opportunity to use anti-creature cards at all. He has advocated using 2 Racks instead, as the Serras wouldn't come out before the Sceptre/Counterspell lock anyway. Along with this change, the Moat could be replaced by the Abyss, which removes creatures instead of just neutralizing them, and works against flyers as well.

Brian Weissman objects to these changes. In his own words:

I totally disagree with Warren Changs suggestion of removing the Angels from "The Deck", to completely render my opponent's creature defense innefective. He has totally missed the point. I NEED creatures in my deck to prevent this from happening, as I give my opponent far to great of an advantage if he gets to sideboard out all of his creature defense.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Holly

To quote something about the original deck which can be translated to the deck v2 aswell for to Baneslayer or to not Baneslayer.

---

And that's exactly why I'm proposing BSA as a SB choice.

I mean we're not talking about D&T only when it comes to BSA being susceptible to STP.
* Miracles (!)
* UWR xyz
* Mirror
* Deadguy (still well-represented at bigger events)
* Maverick
* etc.
-
and the we'll have to consider any deck running Liliana:
* BUG xyz
* BG xyz
* Pox
* etc

I kind off agree Klaus. But D&T feels quite favored already, regardless of wincon. Ulti jace works fine as well :) Games won by angels would have been won by jace within a few turns anyway.

Ux (UR Especially) Delver does not feel as favored. So after very little testing, thats is my preliminary conclusion.
If further testing shows differently i will make a change accordingly naturally:)

@phazonmutant

I play the CFB list, and have found Miracles to be pretty good. I think that I am something like 8-2 in matches against it, mainly in dailies. What I think is mot important is to sufficiently play around counterbalance. It more or less has to be countered, which is most difficult in the early game. I board out SFM mystic against them to hold up more counters, leaving me with 3 jace and 3 clique to win. Hitting land drops is important and I generally do not like being the first to go for a Jace. Maximum hand size has sometimes been an issue.

after some extensive testing online and in paper this is my deck list that I,m bringing to the GP:

14 cantrips

3 counterspell
4 force of will
2 spell pierce
1 pyroblast

4 dig through time
2 jace
1 Elspeth
1 Batterskull

1 crucible of worlds

4 swords to Plowshares
2 Pyroclasm
2 explosives

3 wastelands
1 academy
8 fetch lands
4 tundra
2 volcanic
3 island

it's a list that plays more like a landstill deck and I think it has more game Vs 12 post and dark depth.

what do you guys think of the inclusion of wasteland and crucible in this deck ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kaslan

after some extensive testing online and in paper this is my deck list that I,m bringing to the GP:

3 counterspell
4 force of will
2 spell pierce
1 pyroblast
4 dig through time
2 jace
1 Elspeth
1 Batterskull
1 crucible of worlds
4 swords to Plowshares
2 Pyroclasm
2 explosives
3 wastelands
1 academy
8 fetch lands
4 tundra
2 volcanic
3 island
it's a list that plays more like a landstill deck and I think it has more game Vs 12 post and dark depth.
what do you guys think of the inclusion of wasteland and crucible in this deck ?

---

I don't like Wasteland at all tbh. It's a strategy that tempo decks can benefit from. Trading mana sources hurts them less in general as they can still apply pressure via cheap threats. However even UR has abandoned it, which alone should speak for itself.
Gold Digger has quite the opposite approach: it aims to buy time and amass mana as much as possible to be able to continously cast delve spells and keep up mana for counterspells.
Furthermore, adding colorless land butchers the manabase & Crucible doesn't make up for it. Reducing fetchlands hurts the delve engine and you don't even have room for a basic Plains anymore.

That being said, I do like Elspeth. I feel she hasn't gotten the love she deserves from people testing out efficient wincons.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by klaus

I don't like Wasteland at all tbh. It's a strategy that tempo decks can benefit from. Trading mana sources hurts them less in general as they can still apply pressure via cheap threats. However even UR has abandoned it, which alone should speak for itself.
Gold Digger has quite the opposite approach: it aims to buy time and amass mana as much as possible to be able to continously cast delve spells and keep up mana for counterspells.
Furthermore, adding colorless land butchers the manabase & Crucible doesn't make up for it. Reducing fetchlands hurts the delve engine and you don't even have room for a basic Plains anymore.

That being said, I do like Elspeth. I feel she hasn't gotten the love she deserves from people testing out efficient wincons.

---

I do agree that using Wasteland aggressively can be used as a tempo play. In my version I only use them if it's needed (If I'm flooding, absolutely need to kill a specific land or if I see that my opponent is missing land drops)

On top of that wasteland make spell pierce even better if the mid to late game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by alphastryk

SB:
[...]
2 Blue Elemental Blast
1 Red Elemental Blast
[...]

---

Any reason you are not using Hydroblast resp. another Pyroblast instead?

wasteland seems bad, this deck cannot afford to run so much colourless when you often want uuuu, or uuww available. maybe as a one-of it can find utility in the deck.

elspeth is a nice choice, she works great with moat!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kobal

Any reason you are not using Hydroblast resp. another Pyroblast instead?

---

I believe that the idea is Blue Elemental Blast is marginally better, as it can't be misdirected to misdirection (where hydroblast can be when it's in counterspell mode).

I think REB is the choice in the board instead of another Pyro out of respect for card-name hosers (e.g. Meddling Mage, Cabal Therapy).