[Primer] Nic Fit

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Originally Posted by square_two

Thanks. I enjoy seeing the thoughts laid out here.

Question - what's the average number of fetches that you run? Do you also run Arbor as a fetch? Maybe we play with a significant difference in shuffle effects. Lot of the time, I spend my fetches to necessarily play things that turn and don't have the time to spend checking with Library/Guile. I see shuffle effects as a potential bonus when they line up that way. Mid-to-late game I will definitely hold fetches up for that effect though. Top was such a huge loss to us, it allowed us to just go crazy with consistency at just about any point in the game - any point in the TURN for that matter.

Is there a significant difference between Library and Guile in reference to card selection? Getting a shuffle at end of opp's turn is the same for both enchantments - you see 3 different cards. Guile lets you have a shuffle effect between the check/order top 3 and drawing which allows you to draw a random card as opposed to a known bad 3. Library means you are stuck with a single enhanced draw (though I guess you could shuffle in response to its trigger too? I don't think I've ever seen anyone do that in order to see 2 different cards).

IMO, Guile has zero card advantage. You play the card, and you get no cards back. It is -only- selection. This is the key difference which I think makes Library quite a bit better. When you exhaust your shuffle effects and are at a board stall/need pressure, then Library CAN dig you deeper all on its own.

I do think Leovold is an issue with Library though - a bug heavy meta would influence my decision on running it.

Agreed about toning down cmc - I love the lower to the ground bug fit lists. I like those backed up by a ton of card advantage in order to keep up pressure though. Guile being one cheaper isn't a key factor in considering the list as lower cmc though - to me, that is doing stuff like cutting 6-drops, limiting the number of 5's, etc. Having a buttload of 1-drops does make you weaker to chalice and I've noticed a drop in matches against those decks when I do try to run more and more 1 drops.

My own background is either with bug lists or combo-centric lists. I feel that Library/Guile effects simply aren't needed when you are running 4 Strix, 3-4 Tracker, 3 Jace, x Brainstorm, etc. Sneak fit wants the ability of Library to draw multiple things and suddenly combo out. Nyx fit likewise wants that ability (think I'm trying my next league with libraries back in).

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I always run 10 fetches. 4 Catacombs, 4 Heath and 2 Flats. And Dryad Arbor's a staple in my list as well. I rely very heavily on my fetches the first few turns. I fetch basics as much as possible. I don't run them specifically to interact w/ Guile though, I run them b/c it allows me to run only 21 lands (counting Arbor as a creature here, not a land) and still have 14 initial mana sources of every colour. Now here's the thing - if I know I'm running this many shuffle effects (10 fetch, 4 GSZ and 4 Explorers), why not create some synergy and get some extra value out of them? Whether you run Guile or Library, it allows you to be on par w/ blue in the card selection department without interfering w/ your gameplan. You get value from them simply by doing what you always do - fetch and GSZ like a madman.

On the quality of the card selection of Guile or Library - it doesn't matter all that much. If for some reason you can shuffle between Guile and Library triggers, it's probably b/c you set it up and chose not to shuffle at an earlier moment.

As for 1-drops vs. Chalice decks - that's more of a question of whether they have it or not (they'll only have it in hand about 40% of the time, and they'll also need a Sol-land to go with it), of whether or not you'll revert back to running a number of Abrupt Decay or of whether or not you'll try to get creative and either ignore it and execute your plan via GSZ or GSZ for Qasali Pridemage or something similar to deal with it.

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Originally Posted by Navsi

Optimally, you want to be spending 3 mana on turn 2 and then 4-5 mana on turn 5. However I don't know if this is necessarily a situation to be concerned about.

If you have 3 mana on turn two, one of three things happened:

- you Zenithed for Dryad Arbor. In this situation you probably have another Zenith in hand (so you can find Teeg now) or you need 3 mana for another specific piece of hate you're casting. Otherwise you would have waited with Zenith to make a Teeg on turn three. If you have Zenith and follow it up spending mana on library/guile, you are probably better off not casting the Zenith and holding it for X=2. In this situation, having Guile over Library does not help you.

- you cast Deathrite Shaman on turn one. In this situation, you still don't want to be spending mana on Guile or Library turn two. If you have disruption in hand you're casting it, or you're holding mana up to use Deathrite if you don't have anything else. Guile does have an advantage here (you can cast it while keeping a mana open to use Deathrite as graveyard hate) but I don't think that situation is going to be one that comes up frequently - or rather, casting Guile rather than holding up Library doesn't make that much difference to your game plan. You'd rather be casting disruption than either of them, still.

- you cast Explorer and Therapy, so now you have 3 mana available. In this situation you are probably happy to play either card, since you just cast two Cabal Therapies and your opponent is unlikely to go off and kill you immediately if you just flashbacked therapy, so you have a turn to dig for more disruption either way, and Library is better at actually getting you enough disruption to keep the opponent locked for long enough to actually kill them before they go off. You might be happier going explorer - therapy - guile + threat than you are going explorer - therapy - library/threat - pass turn - library/threat, but I'm not sure what I would prefer between a one turn faster clock and 2+ more cards in hand to disrupt / pressure with.

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Actually, in your second case having Guile out over having Library in hand makes a lot of difference. The chance of you getting your next hate card just got 3 times bigger, seeing as next turn you'll see 3 new cards instead of 1. Even if you don't have a single shuffle effect, you now have access to cards 2 turns earlier than you would have otherwise. Continuing that line into Lost Legacy b/c you dug it up early w/ Guile is considerably better than drawing into something that doesn't interact w/ your opponent for 1/2 turns and then drawing into Lost Legacy. You might have gotten Library out the turn after you dropped Guile, but that still means you would've waited for that Legacy an extra turn.

As for your last case - Paying 8 life to draw 2 w/ Library vs. ANT/TES seems like a rather dangerous proposition. You're now dead at stormcount 5. 4 if you've played 2 fetches.

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Originally Posted by Echelon

Actually, in your second case having Guile out over having Library in hand makes a lot of difference. The chance of you getting your next hate card just got 3 times bigger, seeing as next turn you'll see 3 new cards instead of 1. Even if you don't have a single shuffle effect, you now have access to cards 2 turns earlier than you would have otherwise. Continuing that line into Lost Legacy b/c you dug it up early w/ Guile is considerably better than drawing into something that doesn't interact w/ your opponent for 1/2 turns and then drawing into Lost Legacy. You might have gotten Library out the turn after you dropped Guile, but that still means you would've waited for that Legacy an extra turn.

As for your last case - Paying 8 life to draw 2 w/ Library vs. ANT/TES seems like a rather dangerous proposition. You're now dead at stormcount 5. 4 if you've played 2 fetches.

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The point I was making in the second case is that you don't want to be doing either of them, because you have no interaction before turn 3 and need to topdeck something to have some at that point. You should probably mulligan if your opener is deathrite + guile/library + no disruption, so which is better is not particularly relevant unless you're already looking at a 4-5 card hand.

You only pay life to draw cards with Library if it puts you at a significant advantage. If you're drawing 3 with Library, you just drew 3 business spells which means they definitely aren't going off any time soon.

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Originally Posted by Navsi

The point I was making in the second case is that you don't want to be doing either of them, because you have no interaction before turn 3 and need to topdeck something to have some at that point. You should probably mulligan if your opener is deathrite + guile/library + no disruption, so which is better is not particularly relevant unless you're already looking at a 4-5 card hand.

You only pay life to draw cards with Library if it puts you at a significant advantage. If you're drawing 3 with Library, you just drew 3 business spells which means they definitely aren't going off any time soon.

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Drawing cards with Library is something you can only do when you're ahead though. It's a bit of a win-more function.

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Originally Posted by Echelon

Drawing cards with Library is something you can only do when you're ahead though. It's a bit of a win-more function.

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Drawing cards with library is something you can only do when you're not under pressure, or your life total is irrelevant, or the cards will win you the game. Against combo decks in particular, paying 4 life to remove one of their cards with an additional discard spell is pretty much always worth it. Thing is, you can choose whether to pay the life after you see what they are, so it's not like you ever need to pay life needlessly.

Hello guys, report here :smile:
I was playing Nic Fit this Saturday.

18 Creatures
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Veteran Explorer
2 Deathrite Shaman
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Eternal Witness
1 Courser of Kruphix
1 Tireless Tracker
4 Siege Rhino
1 Meren of Clan Nel Toth
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons

6 Instants
4 Path to Exile
1 Crop Rotation
1 Abrupt Decay

11 Sorceries
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Painful Truths

3 Enchantments
1 Sylvan Library
2 Pernicious Deed

22 Lands
1 Karakas
1 Phyrexian Tower
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
3 Forest
2 Plains
3 Swamp
2 Bayou
1 Scrubland
1 Savannah

15 Sideboard
2 Pithing Needle
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Gaddock Teeg
3 Lost Legacy
2 Surgical Extraction
4 Duress
1 Golgari Charm
1 Zealous Persecution

Round 1, vs. 4C Loam (1-1)
I saw in the first game only Dark Depths, then killed him.
In the second game, I tried lost legacy on Vampire Hexmage. There weren't any :laugh: just Thespian´s Stage stage, damn. He killed me.
In the third game, I stripped his KotR, he disrupted my creatures and we weren't able to finish in time.

Round 2, vs. Burn (2-1)
The first game he killed me really fast. Then he was very confident.
I showed him in second and third game couple of Rhinos and he went cry.

Round 3, vs. Sultai Death´s Shadow (1:2)
This was really weird. In the first game, I was at 24 and attacked with rhino, while he had 2 Death´s Shadows around 5-7. He took his life to 1 and killed me from that point.
In the second game, I stripped his Death´s Shadows through Lost in Legacy, then the same for Tarmogoyfs and GG.
The third game was really big problem and I'm really upset because of this :mad:
I raced him pretty well. Then he dropped Spellskite. I was ok with that, I had Qasali Pridemage on my hand. Then he started using his ability in his main phase with an empty stack. I told him, he cants do that. He called the judge. The judge went to PC and we were waiting for the result like 5 minutes. Then he returned with the result - he can pay the ability without the target, same as the wasteland. Ok, he shocked himself to 11 and dropped two Death´s Shadows. I Pridemaged his Spellskite and killed Death´s Shadows. Dropped Rhino, then attacked. When I was running for lethal, he sacrificed the wasteland without any target (I had just basic lands) and pushed my Rhino. Dropped something like DrS. I had like 3 turns to get GSZ or one of three Rhinos in the deck. Topdecked just lands, GG

I reported score 1-2 and went to the toilet. When I returned, first one told me to draw, to get into top4 for both. I repeated that I lost, so new pairings were made.

Round 4, vs. Grixis (0:1)
The first game was hard and really grindy. Made some mistake and lost.
The second game went better. Almost killed him, but then he dropped two Gurmags and I was pretty stuck. Time ran out and I was like 1 turn from the win after the game ended.

I was looking on top4 for a while and then went out. Near the entrance of LGS owner/judge apologies to me: "I don't know, if it would be different, but my judgment was bad. He couldn't do that".

Ok, I missed my first top with nic fit because of bad ruling :mad:


Echelon, I modified after that tournament my list to look more like your list from page87 (07-03-2017):
I bought today a Vizier, so It's just:
-2 Mirri's Guile
-Volrath's Stronghold
+Karakas
+Painful Truths
+Sylvan Library

1) No love for Karakas? :tongue:
2) I'm still thinking about the package of 2 Crop Rotations + Bojuka Bog, but there is no place for this. I would have to put out 2 Libraries and 1 Guilde, but I like them more that Rotation + Bog
3) What do you think about Ramunap Excavator?

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Originally Posted by joXerus

Then he started using his ability in his main phase with an empty stack. I told him, he cants do that. He called the judge. The judge went to PC and we were waiting for the result like 5 minutes. Then he returned with the result - he can pay the ability without the target, same as the wasteland. Ok, he shocked himself to 11 and dropped two Death´s Shadows. I Pridemaged his Spellskite and killed Death´s Shadows. Dropped Rhino, then attacked. When I was running for lethal, he sacrificed the wasteland without any target (I had just basic lands) and pushed my Rhino. Dropped something like DrS. I had like 3 turns to get GSZ or one of three Rhinos in the deck. Topdecked just lands, GG

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Pretty sure he cannot activate Spellskite without any spell or ability on an empty stack. Spellskite has the ability that has a targeting requirement of "Target spell or ability". This is checked on activation and resolution.

However he is able to activate wasteland for wasteland itself is a legal target, just there it would be sacrificed as part of the activation cost and the destroy trigger will be countered upon resolution due to illegal target.

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Originally Posted by Navsi

Drawing cards with library is something you can only do when you're not under pressure, or your life total is irrelevant, or the cards will win you the game. Against combo decks in particular, paying 4 life to remove one of their cards with an additional discard spell is pretty much always worth it. Thing is, you can choose whether to pay the life after you see what they are, so it's not like you ever need to pay life needlessly.

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So when you're ahead (basically), or facing Infect. Gotcha.

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Originally Posted by joXerus

Hello guys, report here :smile:
I was playing Nic Fit this Saturday.

...List and report...

Echelon, I modified after that tournament my list to look more like your list from page87 (07-03-2017):
I bought today a Vizier, so It's just:
-2 Mirri's Guile
-Volrath's Stronghold
+Karakas
+Painful Truths
+Sylvan Library

1) No love for Karakas? :tongue:
2) I'm still thinking about the package of 2 Crop Rotations + Bojuka Bog, but there is no place for this. I would have to put out 2 Libraries and 1 Guilde, but I like them more that Rotation + Bog
3) What do you think about Ramunap Excavator?

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That just made my day! As for your points:
1) I love Karakas, especially when you plan to run some Crop Rotation. It actually does something for a few of our worse MUs - Reanimator and Sneak & Show. I wouldn't know what to cut from my list to support the package though. And then there's the price of Karakas - since I haven't found a way to run it yet, I've held off on buying one.
3) However much I love it I probably have to say it's The Danger Of Cool Things. You can do a lot of cool stuff if you build around it, but your deck will probably end up suffering for it in the end. It's probably best in a deck w/ Mox Diamonds, Explorations and such. In Nic Fit as it is now it's probably just a way of ensuring you get all your lands out. There's ofcourse the interaction of fetchland + Guile/Library, but I'm unsure of whether or not that's worth it.

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Originally Posted by fireiced

Pretty sure he cannot activate Spellskite without any spell or ability on an empty stack. Spellskite has the ability that has a targeting requirement of "Target spell or ability". This is checked on activation and resolution.

However he is able to activate wasteland for wasteland itself is a legal target, just there it would be sacrificed as part of the activation cost and the destroy trigger will be countered upon resolution due to illegal target.

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Yes, I was checking the web and I found that you can wasteland itself, but that is another story. My opponent clearly didn't know about that and judge also told it a bad way. You can't sacrifice that just without any target (yes, you can target that itself)

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Originally Posted by Echelon

So when you're ahead (basically), or facing Infect. Gotcha.
That just made my day! As for your points:
1) I love Karakas, especially when you plan to run some Crop Rotation. It actually does something for a few of our worse MUs - Reanimator and Sneak & Show. I wouldn't know what to cut from my list to support the package though. And then there's the price of Karakas - since I haven't found a way to run it yet, I've held off on buying one.
3) However much I love it I probably have to say it's The Danger Of Cool Things. You can do a lot of cool stuff if you build around it, but your deck will probably end up suffering for it in the end. It's probably best in a deck w/ Mox Diamonds, Explorations and such. In Nic Fit as it is now it's probably just a way of ensuring you get all your lands out. There's ofcourse the interaction of fetchland + Guile/Library, but I'm unsure of whether or not that's worth it.

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What part concretely made your day? :smile:
1) The price of Karakas isn't the issue, I've got that from times when I tried miracles. But now it's problem for me to buy Volrath (and Mirri's Guiles) :laugh:
3) Ok, maybe time will show us :smile: I think that it would be nice in maverick, where you can tutor for this naga, KotR, and wasteland and cycle them over and over again :smile:

@joXerus: It's always very flattering when someone takes inspiration from your lists.

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Originally Posted by Echelon

So when you're ahead (basically), or facing Infect. Gotcha.

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No, it's really not. Often you draw cards because you're behind and need more haymakers to stabilize or you need both a removal spell and a creature this turn, or you want to slam Deed but also need to discard countermagic first. Or you need both additional disruption and a threat to lock out a combo deck. These situations are not uncommon.

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Originally Posted by Navsi

No, it's really not. Often you draw cards because you're behind and need more haymakers to stabilize or you need both a removal spell and a creature this turn, or you want to slam Deed but also need to discard countermagic first. Or you need both additional disruption and a threat to lock out a combo deck. These situations are not uncommon.

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Or it's a typically normal early-to-mid game and you want 2 cards out of the 3, and you want to shuffle the third away so you can see a fresh 3 next turn. That one comes up most often for me - last night against ANT I grabbed a 3rd land + Lost Legacy. Yeah that basically said "pay 4 life to win the game".

Edit: Finished my second league with updated nyx fit - this time with two libraries instead of the vessels. Happy to say I'm 4-0 in matches against ANT. Feels good.

Are any of you fellow Nic-Fit reprobates planning to be at GP Toronto this weekend, July 22nd? I'll be the guy with a bag.....

I swear to god if I had the verdant catacombs for this, I'd be on it so fast it wouldn't even be funny. I have a list drawn up and everything.

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Originally Posted by square_two

1 Dryad Arbor
4 Veteran Explorer
1 Eternal Witness
4 Academy Rector
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons

3 Swords to Plowshares
4 Cabal Therapy
1 Abrupt Decay
2 Collective Brutality
3 Pernicious Deed
1 Cast Out
1 Starfield of Nyx
1 Curse of Death's Hold
1 Dovescape
1 Overwhelming Splendor

3 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Vessel of Nascency
3 Evolutionary Leap
2 Lingering Souls

3 Forest
2 Swamp
2 Plains
1 Cavern of Souls
2 Phyrexian Tower
2 Bayou
2 Savannah
1 Scrubland
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Windswept Heath

side:
3 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Lost Legacy
2 Toxic Deluge
1 Chromanticore
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Thoughtseize

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Why do you play Swords to Plowshares and not Fatal Push? I prefer Push, because you can also kill and trigger your Academy Rector with it.

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Originally Posted by Therealmslayer

I swear to god if I had the verdant catacombs for this, I'd be on it so fast it wouldn't even be funny. I have a list drawn up and everything.

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Well... YOLO..?

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Originally Posted by Hmmm_Really?

Are any of you fellow Nic-Fit reprobates planning to be at GP Toronto this weekend, July 22nd? I'll be the guy with a bag.....

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Unfortunately it's a bit of a drive from the Netherlands (and my car doesn't come with scuba gear), so I won't be making it.

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Originally Posted by Bärmudas

Why do you play Swords to Plowshares and not Fatal Push? I prefer Push, because you can also kill and trigger your Academy Rector with it.

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Swords kills Angler, Marit Lage, Griselbrand, Worldspine Wurm, Sire of Insanity, and you don't need Revolt to kill the format's 3-4 drops like KOTR, Magus of the Moon, and Leovold. Revolt isn't super easy for the list to get, especially in the opponent's turn. You have fetchlands, but that's about it.

Killing Rector isn't really difficult - we already have 11 sacrifice outlets for him which is a ton. Push has basically zero other upsides, because we're assembling a lock and don't really care about the opponent's life total very much.

I'm trying to build a junk list with Dark Depths. Has anyone tested Dark Depths, and if so, what were the results? Here is the list I am working on at the moment:

Creatures:19
1 Dryad Arbor
2 Deathrite Shaman
4 Veteran Explorer
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Eternal Witness
2 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Tireless Tracker
1 Centaur Vinecrasher
1 Meren of Clan Nel Toth
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 Titania, Protector of Argoth
1 Primeval Titan

Spells:19
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Path to Exile
3 Abrupt Decay
1 Into the North
1 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Pernicious Deed
1 Vindicate

Lands:22
1 Bayou
1 Dark Depths
1 Karakas
2 Verdant Catacombs
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Savannah
4 Snow-Covered Forest
2 Snow-Covered Plains
2 Snow-Covered Swamp
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Volrath's Stronghold
4 Windswept Heath

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

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Originally Posted by Hmmm_Really?

Are any of you fellow Nic-Fit reprobates planning to be at GP Toronto this weekend, July 22nd? I'll be the guy with a bag.....

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Yes strongly contemplating going

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Originally Posted by Vervandi

I'm trying to build a junk list with Dark Depths. Has anyone tested Dark Depths, and if so, what were the results? Here is the list I am working on at the moment:
(list)
Any suggestions would be appreciated.

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That has some similarities with my Cloudpost/NicFit hybrid, see here http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...=1#post1015935 . The maindeck is still the same, the sideboard is going through some minor changes.

Also, Brael tried Dark Depths in his earlier lists, but cut it and just kept the Crop Rotation package.

So, unless you want to try my actual list including the Cloudpost package (i like the list a lot, but it's of course different from your deck), one thing i would do at least:
You want to play Crop Rotation in this deck. Maybe not the full 4 copies like me, but at least 2. And you want Karakas and Bojuka Bog to get with that to deal with a couple otherwise problematic matchups. Knight can get those cards too, just Crop Rotation is faster and against combo decks you need all the speed you can get.

About results: I have still around 75% winrate on xmage after ~200 matches with this now. Depths plays a major role in my deck. Access to the combo has 3 big advantages:
1. Delver decks have not many answers to Marit Lage, if you can get the token into play they will usually lose. That allows me to get away with very few removal spells and still have a good Delver matchup (now i'm at 17-6 combined against different Delver decks - considering i'm playing Cloudposts, and Cloudpost decks are usually awful against Delver, i'm very happy with that).
2. Against combo decks, you have access to your own fast combo. That's rarely fast enough on its own (but it can happen), but it means you can often get away with just enough to disruption to stop their kill for 1 or 2 turns. My combo matchups are for the most part really good and almost certainly better than for other NicFit decks - that has other reasons too (Mox Diamonds, maindeck Gaddock Teeg), but without Marit Lage it would definitely be worse.
3. Against some BGx midrange decks, you have access to an "i win"-button - that way i have stolen lots of games i could never win with a fair game plan.

Notably, the combo is pretty bad against fair decks with white mana, especially Death&Taxes, so in those matchups you should board out the Depths and probably have a good alternative plan (for me, that plan involves Cloudposts, because those are the matchups where that plan is usually at its best).

With your deck, you will probably be a big favourite against Delver anyway, but the impact against combo decks is very relevant and the ability to steal hopeless games against other midrange decks is always relevant.

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Originally Posted by Leshrac82

That has some similarities with my Cloudpost/NicFit hybrid, see here http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...=1#post1015935 . The maindeck is still the same, the sideboard is going through some minor changes.

Also, Brael tried Dark Depths in his earlier lists, but cut it and just kept the Crop Rotation package.

So, unless you want to try my actual list including the Cloudpost package (i like the list a lot, but it's of course different from your deck), one thing i would do at least:
You want to play Crop Rotation in this deck. Maybe not the full 4 copies like me, but at least 2. And you want Karakas and Bojuka Bog to get with that to deal with a couple otherwise problematic matchups. Knight can get those cards too, just Crop Rotation is faster and against combo decks you need all the speed you can get.

About results: I have still around 75% winrate on xmage after ~200 matches with this now. Depths plays a major role in my deck. Access to the combo has 3 big advantages:
1. Delver decks have not many answers to Marit Lage, if you can get the token into play they will usually lose. That allows me to get away with very few removal spells and still have a good Delver matchup (now i'm at 17-6 combined against different Delver decks - considering i'm playing Cloudposts, and Cloudpost decks are usually awful against Delver, i'm very happy with that).
2. Against combo decks, you have access to your own fast combo. That's rarely fast enough on its own (but it can happen), but it means you can often get away with just enough to disruption to stop their kill for 1 or 2 turns. My combo matchups are for the most part really good and almost certainly better than for other NicFit decks - that has other reasons too (Mox Diamonds, maindeck Gaddock Teeg), but without Marit Lage it would definitely be worse.
3. Against some BGx midrange decks, you have access to an "i win"-button - that way i have stolen lots of games i could never win with a fair game plan.

Notably, the combo is pretty bad against fair decks with white mana, especially Death&Taxes, so in those matchups you should board out the Depths and probably have a good alternative plan (for me, that plan involves Cloudposts, because those are the matchups where that plan is usually at its best).

With your deck, you will probably be a big favourite against Delver anyway, but the impact against combo decks is very relevant and the ability to steal hopeless games against other midrange decks is always relevant.

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That's really interesting. I saw your list a while back (I lurk these boards but rarely post), and I even copy / pasted your list into tappedout and goldfished it a bit. Subconsciously, that may be where I got the idea for putting Dark Depths in my list. I had difficulty navigating the deck when I goldfished it, do you have any gameplay videos on Youtube or Twitch? Also, it is important that I finish a deck up that can hold it's own against Infect, Stoneblade and Burn, but not be too overly oppressive to them, as that is what my play group runs. How does your deck do in those matchups?