[Deck] Death and Taxes

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Originally Posted by mrjumbo03

I play Arbiter and to a certain extent it does the same thing. Problem with Mindcensor for me, is its 3cc compared to 2 for Arbiter. Regarding the Revokers, I play 3 Main and the 4th one on the side, I decided would much better be a Pithing Needle for the corner case scenarios of needing to needle a land.

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I have not tested arbiter, mainly because I have a green splash and wayfarer + fetches don't go well with it. You still have a negative synergy with stoneforge in the mono-W lists, but that's minor enough to be tolerable I guess. The main problem with it though, is that if your opponent really needs that jitte, he'll just wait a turn or two to cast his stoneforge. Also, flash and flying matters. You could try it I guess, but my feeling is that mindcensor > arbiter unless you commit a lot more to the mana denial plan with ghost quarter and / or PtE, which is a bad idea imo because those cards are pretty meh without arbiter.

MM is indeed something to consider, but I don't think we want it. Imo, it fits two type of decks / strategies : tempo decks (TT, TA, merfolk, possibly zoo), and decks which get really crippled by certain 1cc spells (merfolk again, landstill, reanimator, possibly zoo again, ...). I don't think D&T belongs to any of these two categories, so I don't find MM particularly appealing in the deck.

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Originally Posted by tsabo_tavoc

Would anyone consider playing Mental Misstep in DnT?

I tested a handful of games against UGr NO (with 4 MMS) and it feels 4-6 in their favor. I lost each time Progenitus came down as the deck is not good at punching through early damage to enable a race by an equipped flyer. Mindcensor should improve the MU and being a flyer, it feels generally better than Arbiter. Is the Flickerwisp VS Mindcensor a metagame choice? Any comments on their shining MUs?

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Did you know that Burrenton Forge-tender Fogs Progenitus? Runes Halo also stops it completely, and with an active SoLaS and BFT, you can indefinitly fog Progenitus. Just some ideas n how to deal with Progenitus.

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Originally Posted by rukcus

Did you know that Burrenton Forge-tender Fogs Progenitus? Runes Halo also stops it completely, and with an active SoLaS and BFT, you can indefinitly fog Progenitus. Just some ideas n how to deal with Progenitus.

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Tendrils is a much better way to deal with Progenitus.

A lot of decks should not be getting to 4 mana against DnT.... It might actually be viable to Swords a Noble (definitely viable to Oust one).

Granted the last I played this deck was before New Phyrexia came out, but I was thinking of maybe using it next time I go to a tourney, but I think that sowap is not as good as solas because of the card advantage thing was previously mentioned. I also think that Batterskull could potentially be an interesting addition to the deck (I play a mono white version) with a set of stoneforges. Since I have yet to test it with the New Phyrexia out I am only saying what I think, not what I know. However I do know that Leonin arbiter is a house and just shuts down so many cards, kotr, stoneforge, fetches, NO, GSZ, and there are other, less common deck searches out there like land grant. I also advocate the use of Jotun Grunt if not main(which would be ridiculous if you aren't runningat least 2 if not 3 main) then at the very least in the side, again as already mentioned in several previous posts. The revokers are amazing I play 3 main and 1 side. Personally I don't think that my 76 (I play 61 main, I know, I know, but I can't figure out what to cut for the last card, that and it works quite well) will be changing because of New Phyrexia's release.

I'm looking for SB cards. I decided that Cataclysm has too high of a CMC. That leaves me 2 cards. Here's my SB:

3x Wing Shards
3x Enlightened tutor
2x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Phyrexian Revoker
1x Pithing Needle
1x Wheel of the Sun and Moon
1x Tormod's Crypt
1x Oblivion Ring
2x empty slot


My Maindeck is:
10x Plains
3x Rishadan Port
4x Wasteland
4x Karakas

4x Mother of Runes
3x Stoneforge Mystic
3x Jötun Grunt
4x Serra Avenger
4x Leonin Arbiter
3x Phyrexian Revoker
4x Flickerwisp
3x Mangara of Corondor

4x Aether Vial
4x Swords to Plowshares
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Light and Shadow
1x Sword of Fire and Ice

Null Rod and/or Serenity I think could deserve slots depending on your meta.

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Originally Posted by mrjumbo03

Null Rod and/or Serenity I think could deserve slots depending on your meta.

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I like Kataki, War's Wage better versus Affinity - it shouldn't disable/destroy our own Vials and Equipment. You could run 2 in the last slots if that's a meta concern.

I think Serenity is passable in the SB, since it's brought in against decks it will hurt much more than it hurts DnT. I can't really get behind Null Rod though it blanks too much in this deck even if it does provide a powerful effect.

Thorn of Amethyst, an extra Pithing Needle or Aura of Silence could be good silver bullet options if you're looking to have broader application (Enchantress, Combo, Landstill, etc).

Kataki would be awesome if he was an artifact or equment because of the enlightened tutors in the board. As it stands, there are 4 Pseudo Null Rods, and 4 Pseudo Serenities in the board. Moreover, you bring in Null Rods against decks that are totally wrecked by it, and so losing the use of your vials and/or equipments wouldn't matter as much because you are in a way superior position to win.

Null Rod against Storm Combo goes a long way too.

I haven't played this deck for a while but I'm thinking of putting it back together. I have found Phyrexian Metamorph to be very good in other decks where I use a Tutor SB, it takes care of opponents Progenitus, Jitte, Iona... or it can just give you a of copy any creature or artifact you (or your opponent) have. Has anybody tried Methamorph in a D&T list?

Micki, I think most players now have one in their sideboards. You are right. It is pretty darned good. It is not perfect for its role, but it is close.

So I'm building DnT deck but with a budget mana base. I have the core worked out but I can't decide what the last 10 MD cards should be in light of my restrictive mana base.

Here is what I have so far:


11 Plains
3 Ghost Quarter
4 Wasteland
2 Karakas
2 Windswept Heath

4 Flickerwisp
3 Mangara of Corondor
4 Mother of Runes
4 Serra Avenger
2 Jotun Grunt

4 Aether Vial
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Crucible of Worlds

4 Swords to Plowshares


Because I only have 2 Karakas I feel like I should go back to the Wayfarer builds of old, using the last 10 slots for 4 Weathered Wayfarer, 3 Stoneforge Mystic, 1 Sword of Feast and Famine, 2 Mirran Crusader.

Or I can try and focus on resource denial with the Ghost Quarters and run something like, 4 Phyrexian Revoker, 4 Leonin Arbiter, 2 Aven Mindcensor.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

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Originally Posted by Jabari

So I'm building DnT deck but with a budget mana base.

11 Plains
3 Ghost Quarter
4 Wasteland
2 Karakas
2 Windswept Heath

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Plains > Windswept Heath, Mishra's Factory > Ghost Quarter. I'd suggest trade Heaths for a Karakas, or cut Karakas and Mangaras altogether.

figured one of you guys would know:

when using vial for flickerwisp targeting mangara can you use mangara again the turn she comes back to play? as in when a creature removed from game does it come back with summoning sickness?

No, you cannot. Mangara will come back sick when it is blinked.

Does he earn a spot in the deck??? Spoiled today for M12 release.

Grand Abolisher
WW
Rare
Creature - Human Cleric
During your turn, your opponents can't cast spells or activate abilities of artifacts, creatures, or enchantments.
2/2

Have to admit I am intrigued by the deck...been out of the game for along time and am looking to play something in Cincy in a couple of weeks with some friends....D&T looks like a possibility.

I like him, but he doesn't grant the same protection on the other players turn. All they have to do is wait to draw and untap before slaying your dudes.

agreed, but with the prevalence of blue in recent events (FoW, MM, Daze, etc) has to be at least considered for the deck to put so many dead cards in their hand. Sure, Zoo will laugh at him, but at least it keeps all other decks spending mana on their turn, rather then saving it to Brainstorm or such on your turn. I'm not jumping up and down saying it's an auto-include, but just something to keep in mind with the metagame shifts.

The problem is, in terms of tempo, there is absolutely no difference between them Brainstorming or removing your creature in their turn or in yours. In that sense, it doesn't even slow them down. All it does is blank all their counters until they can remove it. The other big plus it offers is saving you from removal in response to equipping, which Mother already does most of the time.

i think that removal in response to equip is a big deal,.... it slows us down byat least one turn if not worse

i played a lot with this and agaisnt this deck as well, and i have found my creatures put only real pressure if equipped, otherwise they are to easy to handle, and if a creature would help preventing the opponent from removing in response to equip than i think that creature may deserve a slot, because it is not like we have mother every game

btw. what equips does everyone use right now?
i have the following

1 jitte
1 sofi
1 solas
1 soff

and i feel quite comfortable with it

Hey guys..
played today this deck in a 11-men-tournament and ranked 1st!

//lands (21)
1x Karakas
3x Rishadan Port
4x Wasteland
13x Plains

//Creatures (25)
4x Mirran Crusader
4x Phyrexian Revoker
4x Flickerwisp
4x Mother of Runes
3x Mangara of Corondor
3x Jötun Grunt
3x Stoneforge Mystic

//Spells (7)
4x Swords to Plowshares
3x Oblivion Ring

//Artifacts (7)
1x Sword of Body and Mind
1x Sword of Light and Shadow
1x Umezawa's Jitte
4x Aether Vial

//Sideboard (15)
4x Thorn of Amethyst
3x Tormod's Crypt
3x Leonin Arbiter
1x Umezawa's Jitte
2x Phyrexian Metamorph
2x Oust

Ok, here is my report.

Game 1: Enchantress
g1) Tapped out his utopia-sprawl-mana with 2 rishadan ports. I play and play. win!
g2) Lost against his red enchantment. He skipped his draw step and burned me 2dmg for each. lost
g3) double shroud enchantment + 4/4 flyer. lost

0/1

Game 2: Freewin ( 11 men tournament. lol )

1/1

Game 3: Zoo
This was the easiest one.
g1) 2 Mirran Crusader = dead. win
g2) Mangara + flickerwisp his red creatures + crusader + flyer. win

2/1

Game 4: LED-less Dredge

g1) Lost against Ichorids + Bridge -.-
g2) Crypt boarded - start hand crypt - remove = win
g3) this was funny. He had the chance to win, but he forgot to bring in his Ichorids and i finished with Jötun Grunt

3/1

Plateau <3

I was worry about only 1 Karakas and a SoBaM instead of SoFaI.

All in all, im happy about this and normally i would play 4 Karakas :D