Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Quote:
Originally Posted by
chalupa43087
Really great showing by everyone. David mentioned in his Top 8 profile that eldrazi were his only losses. The matchup seems very tough if they get the mimic spew but watching the finals matchup I am slightly excited to see that the deck is so reliant on its lands that even a single wasteland can crumble it. What were your thoughts on the eldrazi matchup. Since lands was so prevelant and had the highest conversion rate it seems are you mentally preparing for the winter orbs and more painter decks to show up?
I only played against it twice, The first time was against Gerry T, but I beat him with two fast kills turn 4 the first game and turn 3 the second. Nothing much he could have done. I lost to my other eldrazzi opponent in 3 games. It seems like a good match up to me, but I was ultimately defeated due to my opponent opening up with leyline of the void into chalice on 1 killed me. If you have some disruption for their mana and can find the combo in a timely fashion it tends to be pretty easy to beat.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
No P-fire, and a lot of black cards, this list by David Long looks like something already discussed by Jarvis Hue, iirc.
That said congrats with this result, mr. Long.
EDIT: congrats to all Lands-pilots. Mr. Doumanis, congrats on an excellent result! Can we expect a report?
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
I think I will have to do a larger update to the primer then just adding this deck to the list. Will do that on Tuesday.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
It seems like there's a Lands-thinktank over there in Philly :) It was a joy to watch, I went WTF every time Abrupt Decay and Thoughtseize hit the table. Congrats to all those people, for doing well and also for boldly playing what nobody had played before. Also a question if someone of these people also posts here, I do wonder about the synergy between Loam and Vortex/AD, as they both don't come back from the graveyard in contrast to Punishing Fire, and because Vortex is vulnerable to counterspells and Abrupt Decay.
Isn't that an issue when you're dredging away, and you really need one of those cards? That seems the biggest issue for these maindecked AD's and Vortexes.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
I top 8'd the Madrid BOM at the weekend, 2nd after the swiss.
Pretty standard list, will write a few thoughts later if I can think of anything useful to say.
On David Long's list. First impressions it looks a lot of fun, I like the added red sources for Vortex etc. Bob out of the board is good until people start predicting it and keeping bolt and plow in. However with Eldrazi running rampant I suspect people will be packing fewer Bolts. I'm interested in Abrupt Decay. It must make the miracles MU slightly better but I'm not sure if the downside that it is weaker to Bloodmoon is worth it. Certainly in an EU meta where Moon decks are common and that I predict an increase in Painter Decks to try to combat Eldrazi (whether this is good or not I don't know) and Lands. Anyway, time will tell.
Sib
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Chatto
Yeah, probably. Lots of strange things happened this tournament.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
I haven't seen any of the matches from the weekend (dual Modern GPT practice for the Modern GP this week) but I'm tickled pink to see people having success with jund colour lands. I'm curious how the (Jund Depths) deck Kennen Haas played stacks up against the jund colour lands decks from this weekend.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rivfader
Also a question if someone of these people also posts here, I do wonder about the synergy between Loam and Vortex/AD, as they both don't come back from the graveyard in contrast to Punishing Fire, and because Vortex is vulnerable to counterspells and Abrupt Decay.
Isn't that an issue when you're dredging away, and you really need one of those cards? That seems the biggest issue for these maindecked AD's and Vortexes.
The anti-synergy with Loam is the main reason why I don't like the "black build" with Vortexes and Decays maindeck: it's interesting for sure and opens up our sideboard to discard (Bob is cool too), but while you're gaining precious tools vs combo matchup, you're also losing consistency vs the rest of the field.
Dredging Punishing Fire brings smile on our faces, dredging Decay / Vortex brings tears.
Anyways Vortex seems really strong and maybe it's worthy 2 slot in the sideboard.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Sibelius
I'm interested in Abrupt Decay. It must make the miracles MU slightly better but I'm not sure if the downside that it is weaker to Bloodmoon is worth it. Certainly in an EU meta where Moon decks are common and that I predict an increase in Painter Decks to try to combat Eldrazi (whether this is good or not I don't know) and Lands. Anyway, time will tell.
Sib
On the other hand there's discard to snatch the moons before they enter play.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
barcode
I'm curious how the (Jund Depths) deck Kennen Haas played stacks up against the jund colour lands decks from this weekend.
I see them quite different, as JundDepths is for me a Punishing Pox deck featuring Liliana and Smallpox, and needing a manabase supporting double black.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Interesting to see a black splash doing well. I was playing a more traditional list locally with no main deck black cards, but using Bob and Decay in the sideboard. Bob made a great replacement for P Fire in matches where there were no good targets, or vs. graveyard hate. It's still 2 damage per turn, and our curve is so low that it's basically a Howling Mine.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
The abrupt decays are house in the miracles matchups where you draw cards naturally almost more than you dredge in some games. Counterbalance needs to be kept off of the table so we can resolve any/most of our spells and the decays main give us an opportunity to kill the balance on the spot.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rivfader
I do wonder about the synergy between Loam and Vortex/AD, as they both don't come back from the graveyard in contrast to Punishing Fire, and because Vortex is vulnerable to counterspells and Abrupt Decay.
Isn't that an issue when you're dredging away, and you really need one of those cards? That seems the biggest issue for these maindecked AD's and Vortexes.
My guess is that the MD Decays are there precisely because the Vorticies need to be drawn and are hence unreliable. Adding Decays gives you a pretty good chance to at least hit some removal while you stabalise - then you can try to draw into Vortex or Gamble.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Personally, I've always been in love with the Black splash in Lands precisely for Dark Confidant and Abrupt Decay, which is also why I've gravitated more towards the RUG build. It's nice to see people have success with these cards at the SCG event.
Also, I believe the move to maindeck Decays and Molten Vortex over Punishing Fire was a strict metagame call for that tournament. I think the players on this build of Lands were anticipating a lot of Eldrazi and a lot of Miracles, where Punishing Fire isn't all that spectacular in either matchup. Still, it's really nice to see people develop and innovate beyond traditional Lands molds and do well. Too many Legacy players are afraid of tinkering with established archetypes and leaving their comfort zone.
Lastly, big props to David Long. I met and talked with him at a GP Sea-Tac side event and he couldn't be more pleasant and friendly.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Quote:
Originally Posted by
hyp3r1on
Personally, I've always been in love with the Black splash in Lands precisely for Dark Confidant and Abrupt Decay, which is also why I've gravitated more towards the RUG build. It's nice to see people have success with these cards at the SCG event.
Lastly, big props to David Long. I met and talked with him at a GP Sea-Tac side event and he couldn't be more pleasant and friendly.
I played against the deck in Rounds 10 (Long) and 11 (King). The deck felt very strong from my side of the table in both matches. The Dark Confidants in particular gave me fits against Long. I got exactly 1 point from those two matches and felt fortunate to get that.
I second the props to David Long. We were shielded from the clock (it was not visible from the feature match area we were in for some reason), had a pretty drawn out three game set, and ended up not finishing game 3 for the draw. Despite the circumstances, he was incredibly friendly throughout.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Hello all. Just put together Long and company's black-splash list together on Modo. Not sure how I feel about it (Molten Vortex gets Decayed, and that sucks), but if people want to see a set of videos of the deck, I'm happy to make them. Let me know.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Quote:
Originally Posted by
gigapatrick
Hello all. Just put together Long and company's black-splash list together on Modo. Not sure how I feel about it (Molten Vortex gets Decayed, and that sucks), but if people want to see a set of videos of the deck, I'm happy to make them. Let me know.
Hey Patrick - created an account just to say I really enjoy your videos! They have been really helpful to a new Lands player like me. Would love to see a black splash game or two. Thanks for sharing and all your hard work!
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Quote:
Originally Posted by
gigapatrick
Hello all. Just put together Long and company's black-splash list together on Modo. Not sure how I feel about it (Molten Vortex gets Decayed, and that sucks), but if people want to see a set of videos of the deck, I'm happy to make them. Let me know.
Definitely interested! Thank you Patrick. For sure the black-splash improves the Miracles matchup and Bob is a strong alternative to our graveyard dependant engines. That said, it is interesting to understand how the change impacts the matchups where we were already strong.
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
I think I may test a black splash without molten vortex. I like vortex alot, but there is alot of Grixis & BUG delver in my meta, so I like being able to recur P Fire through loams and being able to gamble for it. One card I've wanted to test for awhile in the board is Slaughter Games, I think it would be solid against alot of combo decks, as well miracles. I also think Bob is a great choice for miracles as well as other matches where P Fires aren't good. For those running the Black splash, what is the split between Decay and Grip? 3 Decay & 2 grip seems like it would be right, anyone care to share?
Re: [Deck] R/G Combo Lands
Quote:
Originally Posted by
filln
Hey Patrick - created an account just to say I really enjoy your videos! They have been really helpful to a new Lands player like me. Would love to see a black splash game or two. Thanks for sharing and all your hard work!
All right. Will do. Glad you enjoy the videos. Every now and then, a pro will make a stupid mistake on a video and I'll feel slightly better about myself, but only slightly. Hope you like them despite my misplays.
