Printable View
UR with...
...Quote:
Originally Posted by Tangle.Wire
Go home. Srsly.
Standstill is also a 4-of auto-include imho as they will most likely help you to lead constantly in resource wars and/or cycle through your library to complement Stifle-Nought.
I'd also play UR because it has got a very solid manabase which helps against a lot of matchups (we have a lot of Loam here in Hassloch).
Have you guys been in trouble with ur-list against goblins and zoo? If they are on play and drop 1st turn Goblin lackey, Wild nacatl, Vial or similar and you don't have fow in opening hand i see a big problem there. Especially 1st turn unsolved lackey is kinda big issue. We get help from sideboard for both matchups but still. Have you started to play maindeck lightning bolts for those decks? I looked Roodamish's maindeck and there weren't any Lightning bolts in main. So what's your throughts about that?
Like i said, i love them in the mainboard, it is so good against most Decks, even now where a lot of pridemages are around bolts can also handle those, same for sowers, confidants, nacatl (all of them seen on maindecks) so we don't have to rely on the boardings to get 2 wins if you lose the first game to them.
Also by packing Bolts main i don't have to remove Submerges from the sideboard since i had to choose one of them for the 3-4 slots.
@Adan beside flaming about 3 Noughts:
#4 Landstill will sure be added since i miss them too without 4 cb and goofies, maybe i'll cut a 3rd top for it or a bolt.
Lightning Bolt Main Deck are really nice to play, both in UR and UGR, but I won't cut spell snares for them, and won't go down to 2 tops and 3 counterbalance -1 random thing so I'll leave them in the side.
And Bolts aren't always boarded and I leave Snares in 90% of the games, so I'll stick them to the board.
I play UGR and never had problems against zoo, goblins sometimes had problems preboard, but early noughts just win games and poast board firespout is your MVP.
I have a few concerns about Ugr ('standard', most common mainboard build)
1. What is the right division of Daze and Spell Snare? I'm playing 3 Daze/2 Snare - agree with opinion few posts above that we should play 3-4 Daze or none, and for the Snare I would love to fit third but don't really know what to remove..
2. I have as well mainboard/sideboard problem - I play with following side:
3x Pyroblast/REB
3x Hydroblast/BEB
3x Krosan Grip
3x Firespout
2x Relic of Progenitus
1x Crypt
Three 'crypt effects' are really needed - few Dredge/Ichorid decks in my meta, new Reanimator, Loam
I don't want to cut from side neither Hydro/BEB or Pyro/REB because of my various meta, but as well I would love to fit in 3x Lightning Bolts, or sort of 'similar' removal effect (Merfolks,Leckey in Goblins, Fish decks, Confidant etc. etc.). My question is - is it any solution at all to leave sideboard as it is while cutting from the mainboard 2 Spell Snare and 1 Sensei's (going down to three, while playing on 4 Counterbalance's) and putting in 3 Lightning Bolts or 3 Fire and Ice?? If no why and if yes which of them is better?
Thanks for your help guys!
SBQuote:
Originally Posted by KubaM
-1 BEB (3 is alot, whereas the REB is great in a counter war, and kills RWM, CB, Sower etc. so 3-4 is great... personally I'd cut them all and run sower/burn/removal... it's more effective against aggro/tribal)
-1 Relic (relic fucks your goyf, 2 is more than enough hate, you can trinket for them after all)
-2 grip (don't really need it, what do you bring it in against? cb? 1 is good nuff)
+4 Lightning bolt
-I hope you are playing trickbind
-fire//ice sucks in this deck
-you should really only be playing 3 tops to begin with, so then you can play 3 spell snare in the slot, alternatively you could play 3 bolts in the place of spell snare yes... either way, in Ugr the 'correct' split is 3/4 top/cb, so you're golden...
good luck, its a fun deck
Just cut the BEB and 1 Relic and play 4 Lightning Bolts.Go down to 3 Sensei and play 3/3 Daze/SpellSnare.Quote:
Originally Posted by KubaM
Just cut 3 Bebs for 3 Lightning bolt and 1 Relic for Ravenous Trap. And yes, go down to 3 Tops main for 3/3 Snare-Daze split.
Thanks for your advice - I'll give Bolts a try instead of BEB's I guess that it's not a huge difference, however BEB's would be better than Bolts for Dragon Stompy matchup. Against Goblins it should be the same.
With the Top's I made a mistake in my post - I'm playing 4 Balance and 3 Top's at the moment while playing 3 Daze/2 Snare. So cutting Top and going down to 2, for the 3'rd Snare is to risky I guess?
Lightning Bolt against goblins is pretty much the same as BeB, but it's much more versatile and helps against zoo and merfolk.
As for the Top I don't like playing just 2.. Ok, you can tutor them with Trinket Mage, but 3 seems optimal to me. If you post your entire list we can see/suggest how to arrange it..
My Ugr list:
Mainboard (60)
3x Phyrexian Dreadnought
4x Tarmogoyf
2x Trinket Mage
4x Force of Will
3x Daze
4x Brainstorm
2x Spell Snare
4x Stifle
1x Trickbind
3x Standstill
4x Counterbalance
3x Sensei's Dividing Top
2x Engineered Explosives
3x Polluted Delta
3x Flooded Strand
4x Mishra's Factory
3x Wasteland
2x Volcanic Island
3x Tropical Island
3x Island
Sideboard (15):
3x Firespout
3x Krosan Grip
3x Blue Elemental Blast
3x Red Elemental Blast
2x Relic of Progenitus
1x Tormod's Crypt
As pippo84 is suggesting I'll give 3xBolts a try cutting 3xBEB's from side. Will see how it goes..
However I would like to show you how various my local meta is, and why I wanted to play 3xBEB/3xREB. Almost every tournament everyone is playing different deck HOWEVER Zoo, Merfolks and Goblins (sort of 'pure' aggro decks) are not very popular. I don't want to spam here, so I'll give you just list of metagame from last tournament:
2x Aggro Loam
2x Dragon Stompy
2x Dredge (1x LED, 1x nonLED-Landfall)
2x Goblins (1x RBg, 1x RG)
1x 4c Counterbalance
1x 4c Counterbalance + Intuition-Loam
1x Ugb Intuition Control
1x Pro Bant
1x MUC
1x U Merfolks
1x U Ninja
1x UW Fish
1x Bwg Deadguy Ale
1x Eva Green
1x Zoo
1x Mono Green Berserk Stompy
1x Reanimator
1x Bu Demigod Control
1x Affinity
1x BGr Madness-Unearth
1x Mono Red Burn
@KubaM:
Your list is almost the same as mine. In the SB just -3 Beb + 3 Lightning Bolt -1 Relic of Progenitus + 1 Pithing Needle.
And in Main Deck I just added 1 Spell Snare playing 61 cards.
Oh, another slight difference is I play different fetches, but that's really a small difference. 1 Polluted Delta 1 Flooded Strand 2 Scalding Tarn 2 Misty Rainforest
Lightning bolt takes care of all DS's dudes (save slogger)Quote:
Originally Posted by KubaM
definitely do NOT go below 3 top's... Rood plays 2, but he's playing Ur and is one of the 'founding fathers' or 'the' actually... Ur is an entirely different with most of the same cards that has a much different play style... its funny what 4 little green cards do for you...
Ive build my new deck, its Dread but not Still ;o)
I prefer this build because its fits my playstyle better than R Versions.
Well, i guess the choices are obvious, theres no room for stuff.
But, u never know:
// Lands
4 [A] Tropical Island
4 [TE] Wasteland
2 [ON] Flooded Strand
3 [B] Tundra
1 [B] Island
4 [A] Underground Sea
2 [ZEN] Misty Rainforest
2 [ON] Polluted Delta
// Creatures
3 [RAV] Dark Confidant
4 [FUT] Tarmogoyf
3 [MI] Phyrexian Dreadnought
// Spells
3 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
4 [AL] Force of Will
4 [NE] Daze
1 [TSP] Trickbind
4 [SC] Stifle
4 [A] Swords to Plowshares
4 [CS] Counterbalance
4 [IA] Brainstorm
// Sideboard
SB: 3 [TSP] Krosan Grip
SB: 3 [ALA] Rhox War Monk
SB: 4 [DK] Tormod's Crypt
SB: 4 [PS] Meddling Mage
SB: 1 [LRW] Sower of Temptation
I can't agree with that. Bolt wont kill Slogger, Demigod/Deus (I have seen them in few lists recently) and in many games it wont kill Mauler and Gathan Riders. But what is more important, it wont destroy Blood Moon, which can be real pain for a Ugr version where you play on 3-4 basic lands.Quote:
Lightning bolt takes care of all DS's dudes (save slogger)
Hit Gathan Raiders during their draw step. Fetch Basics. Don't board in green cards.Quote:
Originally Posted by KubaM
On a different note, I have cut the 4th Counterbalance for the 3rd Daze. IMO, there is less control out there, so Counterbalance doesn't get countered as much, and you really want Daze against aggro and it is still pretty good against combo. Also, I have cut the third Dreadnought and Trickbind for 2 Sowers of Temptation. This is mostly to free SB space, because with Reanimator becoming more popular, I want some Crypts in the board.
3 Bolt
3 Spout
3 Crypt
2 REB
2 Grip
1 Needle
1 Grudge
Hi, do you really need the duals as a four off? I mean you only play Confidants that need black mana. So 3 or even 2 would be enough. You can therefore include more fetchies or basics to make your 4 colored mana-base more stable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Humphrey
I hope this is a "u never know post" ;)
I dont think 1 or 2 Basics more really matters. Im dead if opponents resolves Moon, B2b or similar things. Maybe -1Usea + 1Fetch, but I need much Mana for CB-T, so I wont go lower on real Lands.
if moon/b2b kills you, wouldnt a singleton forest could be of use? For the krosan in your sb.Quote:
Originally Posted by Humphrey
I played at a tournament today and just wanted to say that Dreadstill is not dead in the current meta!
There were 70 players, top8 and prizes for top 16.
I arrived 14th.
This was my list.
3 Phyrexian Dreadnought
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Trinket Mage
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
3 Daze
3 Spell Snare
4 Stifle
1 Trickbind
3 Standstill
4 Counterbalance
3 Sensei's Divining Top
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Island
3 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Scalding Tarn
1 Polluted Delta
1 Flooded Strand
3 Mishra's Workshop
3 Wasteland
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Pithing Needle
3 Krosan Grip
3 Firespout
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Red Elemental Blast
I start badly losing 2-0 from UBR Faeries.
Game 1 I have a top in play and find nothing for the whole match. He just kills me in a long game with a 1/1 faerie.
Game 2 I mull to 5 we both end up doing some damage to each other, but found no answers to bitterblossom or the faerie tokens. I finally find a Stifle, cast Dreadnought that would have killed him, but he answers with Tombstalker, blocks some damage and kills me with many faerie tokens.
Game 2 is against Landstill. Win 2-0
I manage to drop a turn 2 Nought with counter backup and win.
The second match I drop Counterbalance, we bid each other with mishra's and both counter some stuff. Then drop nought and win.
Game 3, Burn. Win 2-0
Drop Counterbalance both games and it's enought to win with goyfs.
Game 4 against some hybrid between Zoo and Aggro Loam. Lose 2-1
Match 1 quick nought wins after he pops counterbalance.
Match 2 he had some huge night of the reliquary beat me.
Match 3 I look at my opening 7 and decide to keep: Island, Dreadnought, Stifle, Brainstorm, Sensei's Divining Top, Daze, Force. Keep.
In a long match I can't find my second land and lose terribly.
Game 5 Canadian ThreshThreshThreshThreshThresh. Win 2-1
Really long game. Almost ended up at time.
Match 1 fast nought wins.
Match 2 he just beats me with goyfs.
Match 3 is really long. I drop Counterbalance and Goyf. He has Goyf and Lavamancer. I find some sideboarded cards and manage to win.
Game 6 Merfolk. Win 2-0
Match 1 another early Dreadnought seals the game.
Match 2 Firespout is MVP and wins the game.
Game 7 against Aggro Loam. Win 2-1
He wins match 1 with some huge Reliquary Knight with Jitte and Rafiq, backup. I had 2 Dreadnoughts in play but it wasn't enought! He also had a Maze of It and I would have liked to see a Wasteland.
Match 2 is pretty easy with nought and goyf.
Match 3 is long, we both beat with Goyf, but Mishra's factory takes the win home!
Btw agains the Canadian ThreshThreshThreshThreshThresh player in a game he managed to counter 1 goyf and 2 Nought+Stifle in turns 3-4-5!
I'm happy because the list is really solid, and took a prize home.
I faced many Krosan Grip and some Quasali Pridemage and Trygon Predator, but this hate is just not enought to stop the deck!
Quite long post, I am sure I didn't write some nice and interesting moments of the matches but would have taken to long.
Ended up going 5 Wins - 2 Losses in total.