[Deck] The Gate

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Originally Posted by kirbysdl

The Gate has become a bit of a casual/pet deck for me, so despite a small green splash for Deathrite and Decay being the usual route, I'd like to keep it mono-black. How crazy is it to add fetchlands and Deathrites just for mana acceleration and reach, and stay mono-black?

Deathrite could power out turn 2 Nighthawks, Gatekeepers, and Lilianas, with a backup plan of turn-2 Dark Confidant and Hymn (and optionally Bitterblossom) if we don't open on Deathrite. I'll try to come up with a sample list.

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A friend of mine has had decent success playing The Gate splash DRS on and off at FNM for the last year or so. Here's his current MD:

4x Deathrite Shaman
3x Gifted Aetherborn
3x Asylum Visitor (-->Dark Confidant)
4x Gatekeeper of Malakir
4x Vampire Nighthawk

4x Fatal Push
4x Thoughtseize
3x Cabal Therpay
3x Hymn to Tourach
3x Bitterblossom
3x Liliana of the Veil

6x Fetchland
11x Swamp
1x Overgrown Tomb (-->Bayou)
4x Wasteland

Despite some "sub-optimal" cards like Asylum Visitor and Overgrown Tomb he's done really well considering that our FNM is quite competitive (4-0 a few weeks ago).

The SB changes up but often includes a transformation into Leyline of the Void + Helm of Obedience (with Dark Rituals to power it out) which really catches people off guard.

To add in my 2 cents, I've played a build with more of a green splash and a few exceptions due to a spicy meta to some success and some fails but the overall theme of the deck feels pretty strong. I am not sure if this is more of a terrible Eva Green Deck rather than an oddly built The Gate with a green splash

4x bayou
4x verdant catacombs
2x marsh flats
7x swamp
1x forest

4x dark ritual
4x duress
4x fatal push
4x hymn to tourach
3x abrupt decay

3x sylvan library
2x liliana of the veil

4x deathrite shaman
3x gifted aetherborn
2x packrat
1x gatekeeper of malkir
3x vampire nighthawk
4x phyrexian obliterator
2x gray street merchant

sb:
4x lotv
2x helm of obedience
3x toxic deluge
3x inquisition of kozliek
2x pithing needle
1x abrupt decay

Thanks for the ideas, folks. I had something like Seraphix's list in mind. Thinking about this:

8 Fetches
7 Swamp
4 Wasteland
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth

4 Dark Confidant
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Gifted Aetherborn
3 Gatekeeper of Malakir
3 Vampire Nighthawk

4 Fatal Push
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Liliana of the Veil
4 Thoughtseize
3 Bitterblossom
2 Umezawa's Jitte

I'd love to fit 2-3 Cabal Therapy but not sure where to find the room. I'm also a fan of Reanimate in The Gate with all our discard and sacrifice effects. Might go there instead of Therapies if I can only find 1-2 slots. Imagine finding your Jitte with their SFM, or smacking them with their own TNN!

Aetherborn is a freakin house. I gotta rebuild my version, though, I really got a lot of mileage out of Top.

Blood Moon actually seems like a good idea. Contamination/Bitterblossom is tempting, but a t2 Moon off DRS + 2 basic swamps seems pretty sick with all the greed running around now.

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Originally Posted by kirbysdl

Thanks for the ideas, folks. I had something like Seraphix's list in mind. Thinking about this:

8 Fetches
7 Swamp
4 Wasteland
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth

4 Dark Confidant
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Gifted Aetherborn
3 Gatekeeper of Malakir
3 Vampire Nighthawk

4 Fatal Push
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Liliana of the Veil
4 Thoughtseize
3 Bitterblossom
2 Umezawa's Jitte

I'd love to fit 2-3 Cabal Therapy but not sure where to find the room. I'm also a fan of Reanimate in The Gate with all our discard and sacrifice effects. Might go there instead of Therapies if I can only find 1-2 slots. Imagine finding your Jitte with their SFM, or smacking them with their own TNN!

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IMO you should drop liliana completely. She just isn't good in this deck and also she's a 3 drop which hurts on bob.

I really like the idea of a few reanimate, especially to get a jitte off their SFM, that's genius! Unfortunately I don't think I can spare enough slots for that strat to be worth it :S

The list I'm goldfishing with atm goes something like this:

10 swamp
4 wasteland
1 urborg
2 Bayou
4 fetches

4 gifted aetherborn
4 dark confidant
2 abyssal persecutor
3 gatekeeper of malakir
4 deathrite

4 hymn
3 Therapy
3 thoughtseize
4 Fatal Push
2 Innocent Blood // Geth's Verdict

2 Jitte
2 smuggler's copter

2 bitterblossom

Side:

3 Leylines
3 Surgical
3 Decays
2 marsh casualties
1 Golgari Charm
1 Sylvan Library
2 Needle

Thanks for the thoughts! With respect to Lili I'm not at all worried about life loss due to Bob (famous last words) because I'm running 7 lifelinkers and two Jittes. The deck worked fine in the past with Abyssal Persecutors, so I'm not too concerned with Liliana. That said, I'm dropping down to 3 for now, and might even go down to 2 depending on testing.

I'm more curious why you think she's not good for the deck. She seems to fit perfectly: pitch extra cards from Bob to her, or have her augment our removal (now that we're getting rid of Innocent Blood and going down a Gatekeeper).

She's just win-more in this deck. She works really well when you're ahead but that's about it.

I mean 2 is fine, but I don't want the deck to be a Pox-like deck (control). We need creatures to trigger equip Jitte and apply pressure.

Just to make it clearer, I don't hate lili but copter can give use to late game discard while also filtering through the deck and apply good pressure.

A long time ago, when I first started playing Legacy, I remember always wanting to play The Gate. But sadly it kinda stopped being developed, so I moved on to different decks. Fast forward to now, and I'm interested in trying it out again, but it doesn't seem like there are that many accepted lists going around. So I decided to do some testing and research on my own. Here are the results:

The decklist I tested with:
Maindeck
Artifact
2 Umezawa's Jitte
Creature
2 Abyssal Persecutor
3 Viscera Seer
3 Dark Confidant
2 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Gifted Aetherborn
3 Mardu Strike Leader
Enchantment
3 Bitterblossom
Instant
2 Victim of Night
3 Fatal Push
1 Tragic Slip
Land
3 Ancient Tomb
3 Swamp
2 Bojuka Bog
2 Karakas
3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Wasteland
2 Marsh Flats
3 Bloodstained Mire
2 Polluted Delta
Planeswalker
2 Liliana of the Veil
Sorcery
4 Thoughtseize
4 Cabal Therapy
Sideboard
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 3 Chalice of the Void
SB: 3 Thorn of Amethyst
SB: 3 Leyline of the Void
SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
SB: 2 Toxic Deluge

I decided not to play any splashes because I felt that they were unnecessary. In hindsight, Abrupt Decay may have helped, but I feel that the Ancient Tombs and Urborgs made up for the lack of Deathrite Shamans. The list is just a basic monoblack tempoish list adapted from old and new lists. Most of the card choices are fairly standard, with the addition of Viscera Seer.

Overall, the results were kinda disappointing. The best descriptor being underwhelming. It felt like every play I made was an uphill climb. The deck (at least this list) just doesn't do enough powerful stuff in my experience to keep up with the broken nature of Legacy. Whether you're staring down the grizzly face of a True-Name Nemesis, or trying to fight off an opponent's Griselbrand, there just isn't enough the deck can do to really keep up. It's disappointing because it'd be so cool to make this deck work on a larger scale. But I honestly don't know if there is a way to currently make a mono black tempo deck work well in this format.

That being said.....

Have any of you checked out Hareruya's website? I found something really interesting in their tournament archives. There are some people playing a substantially different version of this deck, and they seem like they are doing pretty well. They call it Demon Stompy, and it seems to do what The Gate wants to do, while also keeping up with Legacy in general.

I think their lists are worth exploring if anyone wants to check out some new stuff. Here are some links:
http://www.hareruyamtg.com/en/k/kD01578T/
http://www.hareruyamtg.com/en/k/kD04829W/
http://www.hareruyamtg.com/en/k/kD06156S/
http://www.hareruyamtg.com/en/k/kD06074K/
http://www.hareruyamtg.com/en/k/kD01539T/
http://www.hareruyamtg.com/en/k/kD01578T/

The lists are mostly doing well at small events, but there are a couple larger events where people seem to be winning with it. I've no idea if this is the right direction to be going with this deck, but it seems like an option. It'd be cool to create a fully developed version of this deck at some point.


I think that right now the main issue that needs to be solved is the over-fairness of this deck. So what can we do to make this deck more unfair, to keep up with the rest of the format?

Mardu Strike Leaders. I can support this...!

What are our options? Not particular cards perse but what sort of effects/synergies would be beneficial?

Dark Rituals/Lotus Petals to crank out something T1-2?
Maybe a delve dude or two just to eat up our own GY, I dunno.
Not too sure. Any sweet enchants we can abuse to weird effect?
I am always a fan of land destruction (sink hole, etc) but unless we can play it fo' free, we aint busted enough lolz

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kirbysdl

Thanks for the ideas, folks. I had something like Seraphix's list in mind. Thinking about this:

8 Fetches
7 Swamp
4 Wasteland
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth

4 Dark Confidant
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Gifted Aetherborn
3 Gatekeeper of Malakir
3 Vampire Nighthawk

4 Fatal Push
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Liliana of the Veil
4 Thoughtseize
3 Bitterblossom
2 Umezawa's Jitte

I'd love to fit 2-3 Cabal Therapy but not sure where to find the room. I'm also a fan of Reanimate in The Gate with all our discard and sacrifice effects. Might go there instead of Therapies if I can only find 1-2 slots. Imagine finding your Jitte with their SFM, or smacking them with their own TNN!

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I think with this list in particular, you'd be much better with Unearth instead of Reanimate. No life loss, hits all of your creatures, and you can dig for action.

I think the reason you never see unearth is that it has to hit your own graveyard. I could see it in Delver (where you could use something that is a "Sorcery" but is basically a creature), but in fair decks Reanimate will be "live" more often. While Unearth can always be live in the sense you can cycle it, Reanimate targets opposing graveyards as well. A possible opening for this deck then on the play is to Push their 1-drop on their turn or Sieze them; then Reanimate it on your turn so you have a threat. Reanimate also allows you to abuse the expensive cards that this deck specifically eschews. The advantage is that you're always (in theory) on an even footing with your opponent since their biggest/best dude is always available for you to play as well.


On Lily:
While she's waned in the last couple years with the rise of token prominence and much more CA oriented decks being able to counter her natural CA; in the end she's one of the best options this deck has for CA and removal. Being in Non blue (my forte for several years) you want a density of interaction against combo, and you need every bit of it. That she counts as both is pretty slick.

Collective Brutality:
Have you guys been looking at this as a possible Lily replacement instead then? (or w/e) It's great with Therapy (ditch Therapy, hit with Brutality, then hit with Therapy) and is quite versatile; between the life gain being relevant, pushing your clock, killing a dude, or just pitching a land to get psuedo-CA. It's also color light and live in virtually any MU.

Yeah, I tried cutting Lily but it never actually worked. I wanted to play two Persys but it feels just so bad to lose your creature to a 1 mana removal everytime...
I put her back in the list now so I'm testing this pile:

4 BoB
4 DRS
3 Gatekeeper
4 Aetherborn

2 BB
1 Library
2 Copter
2 Jitte
2 lotv

4 Push
2 Go for the Throat
3 therapy
3 hymns
3 thoughtseize

2 Bayou
1 Cabal Pit
3 Wasteland
1 Urborg
6 Fetches
8 Swamp

SB: 3 Abrupt Decay
SB: 3 Surgical Extraction
SB: 2 Sorcerous Spyglass
SB: 2 Engineered Plague
SB: 2 Diabolic Edict
SB: 2 Lost Legacy
SB: 1 Golgari Charm

@zebotc thanks for the hareruya links! That seems like a much different deck but I still dig it.

Did anyone ever try the Blood Moon idea? How about if we do it and also sinkhole their basics?

4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Dark Confidant
4 Gifted Aetherborn
1 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet

4 Fatal Push
4 Thoughtseize
3 Sinkhole
3 Blood Moon
2 Bitterblossom
2 Kolaghan's Command
2 Liliana of the Veil

2 Smuggler's Copter
2 Chrome Mox
2 Umezawa's Jitte

6 Swamp
4 Wasteland
4 Bloodstained Mire
3 Badlands
3 Marsh Flats
1 Bayou

3 Surgical Extraction
2 Pyroblast
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Yahenni's Expertise
2 Duress
2 Pithing Needle
1 Krosan Grip
1 Liliana, the Last Hope

@maharis: looks pretty fun, think I'll give it a shot as well

I must admit adding R is tempting if only for Kcommand. It works so well with Gatekeeper (kinda like it does with snapcaster) and gives us artifact removal.

Although I will probably never understand why some people like Kalitas.. it's so mediocre I'd much rather play Persy or Obliterator.

I just went 3-1 on The GATE at my weekly.

Round 1: WIN vs MUD - didn't have much resistance. Nothing much to say, wasteland + removal get rid of the very few threats I see.
Round 2: LOSE vs Steel Stompy - it was pretty close but I ended up not being able to cast spells for a while in the third game since I was being taxed twice (actually had lots of answers in my hand).
Round 3: WIN vs Deadguy Ale - He mulligan and I discard what's left, no real threat here. Copter was a beast to keep applying pressure while looting dead discard later on.
Round 4: WIN vs Steel Stompy - Games 1/2 were massacres on each side. Game 3 was closer but I made a critical misplay that almost lost me the game (Hangarback makes FLYERS). Had the board pretty well locked when I lost my 6 loyalty liliana last hope in a single hit from a 6/6 copter. I really should have killed it instead of the ravager earlier since I had Aetherborn in play. I still managed to pull out of it by finding more removal right before it was too late.

Here is the list:

4x Dark Confidant
4x Deathrite Shaman
4x Gatekeeper of Malakir
3x Gifted Aetherborn
4x Hymn to Tourach
3x Inquisition of Kozilek
3x Thoughtseize
4x Fatal Push
2x Liliana of the Veil
3x Smuggler's Copter
2x Umezawa's Jitte
2x Bitterblossom
1x Sylvan Library
2x Bayou
2x Bloodstained Mire
2x Polluted Delta
8x Swamp
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2x Verdant Catacombs
4x Wasteland

3x Abrupt Decay
2x Diabolic Edict
2x Golgari Charm
1x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Liliana, the Last Hope
2x Pithing Needle
3x Surgical Extraction

Nice, I would consider another library.

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Originally Posted by Cpt-Qc

I must admit adding R is tempting if only for Kcommand. It works so well with Gatekeeper (kinda like it does with snapcaster) and gives us artifact removal.
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I'm currently on the red splash in Pox(not the Gate, I know) - Young Pyromancer plays really well with Smallpox and Innocent Blood, and K-Command is AMAZING. I understand why BUG decks splash for it. Also, Magus of the Moon holds a Jitte really well, and Abrade, Dreadbore are great removal upgrades. I think the red splash in this deck could work really well. I'm blurring the lines on my Pox build - moving away from some of the traditional Pox tropes and try out things like card advantage, efficient removal and win conditions, so I'm checking out some lists in here.

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Originally Posted by ntropy

i'm currently on the red splash in pox(not the gate, i know) - young pyromancer plays really well with smallpox and innocent blood, and k-command is amazing. I understand why bug decks splash for it. Also, magus of the moon holds a jitte really well, and abrade, dreadbore are great removal upgrades. I think the red splash in this deck could work really well. I'm blurring the lines on my pox build - moving away from some of the traditional pox tropes and try out things like card advantage, efficient removal and win conditions, so i'm checking out some lists in here.

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Blood moon!