[Brainstorming] Ad Nauseam

Ad Nauseum :3::b::b:
Instant Rare
Reveal the top card of your library and put that card into your hand. You lose life equal to its converted mana cost. You may repeat this process any number of times.

Considering the CC and the fact that it's not that hard to push the average cc down, this can work pretty well in a pure combo deck...

12x Swamp
4x Chrome Mox
4x Lotus Petal
4x Lion's Eye Diamond
4x Ornithopter
4x Phyrexian Walker
4x Dark Ritual
4x Culling the Weak
4x Duress
2x Cabal Ritual
4x Infernal Tutor
4x Diabolic Intent
2x Tendrils of Agony
4x Ad Nauseam

Ad Naseum seems busted. Is it better than running Infernal Contract/Cruel Bargain, though?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rufus

Ad Nauseum :3::b::b:
Instant Rare
Reveal the top card of your library and put that card into your hand. You lose life equal to its converted mana cost. You may repeat this process any number of times.

Considering the CC and the fact that it's not that hard to push the average cc down, this can work pretty well in a pure combo deck...

12x Swamp
4x Chrome Mox
4x Lotus Petal
4x Lion's Eye Diamond
4x Ornithopter
4x Phyrexian Walker
4x Dark Ritual
4x Culling the Weak
4x Duress
2x Cabal Ritual
4x Infernal Tutor
4x Diabolic Intent
2x Tendrils of Agony
4x Ad Nauseam

---

Pact of Negation might have a spot here for easy combo protection.

THat's just broken. Essentially if you just resolve that one card you win the game.

Seems really powerful in vintage where mana flows

I wouldn't Brainstorm anything. This is obviously getting banned/restricted in the eternal formats.

as i said in the preview thread

this plus angels grace is a two card instant win combo.....lol

This alone is basically a one card instant win. Putting this in an SI-esque shell instead of the Draw4s, with MD disruption seems really busted. The list in the opening post seems like a good start to breaking this card.

The card is already broken.

Alfred is probably right in saying that this is 'pre-ban' material.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cire

as i said in the preview thread

this plus angels grace is a two card instant win combo.....lol

---

Angel's Grace doesn't protect from life loss, only from damage so it doesn't really get you any more cards.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rufus

Angel's Grace doesn't protect from life loss, only from damage so it doesn't really get you any more cards.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Angel's Grace

...You can't lose the game this turn and your opponents can't win the game this turn...

---

Infernal Tutor and Diabolic Intent should be the Draw 4s, just cut out the tutors and concentrate on the threats.

You'll hit top gold fishing speeds with SI, but what makes Ad Nauseam broken is a TPS build that drops LED for FoW, IMO.

This card may be broken but there are things about it that may prevent it from being banned.

Things that are bad about the card:

- it's five mana.

- it's going to get countered resulting in tempo loss.

- running 4 makes it more likely that you would lose 4-5 life multiple times, maybe killing yourself in the process.

- and again, it's five mana.

I think you guys are overestimating this card. It may be good, but I envision it performing better in a TES shell rather than a SI shell. In Vintage it's definitely going to be restricted. But being five mana in Legacy it might actually see the light of day.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MTG Guru

This card may be broken but there are things about it that may prevent it from being banned.

Things that are bad about the card:

- it's five mana.

---

Mind's Desire.

Quote:

---

- it's going to get countered resulting in tempo loss.

---

Goblin Charbelcher. It's also an instant.

Quote:

---

- running 4 makes it more likely that you would lose 4-5 life multiple times, maybe killing yourself in the process.

---

This card allows you to choose to continue after each card. That means that unless you turn up multiples in a row, you'll know when to stop.

Quote:

---

- and again, it's five mana.

---

Yawgmoth's Bargain, Timespiral, Dream Halls.

Quote:

---

I think you guys are overestimating this card. It may be good, but I envision it performing better in a TES shell rather than a SI shell. In Vintage it's definitely going to be banned. But being five mana in Legacy it might actually see the light of day.

---

If this is printed in it's current form, I will bet money that this will be either pre-banned in Legacy, or banned after the first ban announcement.

Assuming it's a 5c win condition, just compare it with Goblin Charbelcher, Empty the Warrens and the Infernal Tutor loop, and there's literally no contest. Unbanning Mind's Desire would be more balanced than not banning Ad Nauseam, it's ridiculously good.

Mind's Desire can't be countered.

But it is comparable to Yawgmoth's Bargain in storm combo, and for that reason alone it'll probably be banned.

Which is sad, because in Coffers- or general Black-based control it'd be powerful but more or less fair. I was really looking forward to trying this in Truffle Shuffle.

With main Pact of Negation and Thougthsieze, this deck is pretty stupid. Resolve AdN and win seems hardly fair. Even casting it on turn 3 isn't too fair.

It looks quite potent. Just tested it in an IGGy shell and it's very powerfull in goldfishing. But I wonder how strong it would be against a real opponent who can deal damage.

BB

I'm finding that with Tendrils and other Ad Nauseums as your only <2 cc cards, after testing 20 games, the average cards pulled before going over 10 life was about 10 (although 5-6 was more average, with the occasional massive haul of 15-20)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TheInfamousBearAssassin

I'm finding that with Tendrils and other Ad Nauseums as your only <2 cc cards, after testing 20 games, the average cards pulled before going over 10 life was about 10 (although 5-6 was more average, with the occasional massive haul of 15-20)

---

Then it basically replaces Cruel Bargain and Infernal Contract. For 2 mana more, you get 6 extra cards. That's pretty awesome.

Although a single LED doesn't pay its costs...it'll complement the other cards then; still pretty broken.

With the list of the initial post I'm getting first to third turn kills on a very regular basis. You usually drop to about 10 life, only lower if you happen to reveal an Ad Nauseam. Tendrils then hits for 20-22 minimum and went as high as 38. Often I even had a Duress a round before I started.

Apart from play errors that could have been avoided with more practice I fizzles only once because I killed myself with Ad Nauseam while not finding a single tutor for Tendrils in 25-30 cards.

The deck is also very flexible when it comes to mulligans.

Even without further testing against blue/black decks the card's power level is way to high for Legacy. I'm not whining btw, just stating how I see it.

This card is stoopid good. I went to try to break it, then I just realized, you can get five mana then cast it. Done.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shugyosha

Apart from play errors that could have been avoided with more practice I fizzles only once because I killed myself with Ad Nauseam while not finding a single tutor for Tendrils in 25-30 cards.

---

There are 8 tutors and 2 tendrils. Assuming you burned one of those initially, that's still 9 cards any one of which should work, so the odds of failing to find one in 20 cards are about 1 in 1600.

Quote:

---

There are 8 tutors and 2 tendrils. Assuming you burned one of those initially, that's still 9 cards any one of which should work, so the odds of failing to find one in 20 cards are about 1 in 1600.

---

So a little more frequent then fizzling with desire:laugh:

Ways to break Drawing at will

Get 3BB. There, done.

Side note, this allows you to play force because you can stop midresolution and mini tendrils then just cast a 2nd one.

This card reads

3BB
Instant (SERIOUSLY WTF SHOUlD AT LEAST BE SORC!!)
If this card resolves, win the game.

Guess what there are a list of cards stronger then this, and they are the top 20-40 best cards in magic, this WILL take a spot there.

Just to clarify, you cannot play any spells until Ad Nauseum has resolved (you must choose to stop paying life and drawing cards before playing anything else). So you can't play Angel's Grace then keep on drawing.

Who cares.

1) 50 cards that dont hurt you in a dec (lands)

or

2) Average CC of 1.5-2 + combo Heres an example of possible flips.

4 1/0 CC accel
1 win con 2 or 4 mana
1 land
1 Adnausium

13 life lost, accel into tendrils win.

The card truly is insane, I got myself 4 already for €10,- total, that's about $14/$15,- ^^

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Poesjuh

The card truly is insane, I got myself 4 already for €10,- total, that's about $14/$15,- ^^

---

Then we know that it is officially printed as we have it listed? :confused:

Anyway, I think I'll hold off on buying any. I still remember my 8 Mind's Desires :cry: .

I'm thinking of overhauling the posted deck list by adding red and removing the Culling/Critters/Diabolic. Also, Pact of Negation is stupid-stupid in this deck. Run it.

I don't know. Msn buddy has some guy in Australia where he can buy for very cheap, so I said that if the card is being printed as it is know, I want 4 :P

I know what you mean though, had it a few times. Thought a card was going to sell high, but it didn't :P

It seems like we finally got our "Blackt or Fiction". Fuck you, Moonlight Bargain.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by undone

3BB
Instant ( SERIOUSLY WTF SHOUlD AT LEAST BE SORC!! )
If this card resolves, win the game.

---

Not really. I don't know what reasoning they have for this card, if printed as was posted, to be an Instant... But I'm kind of glad, personally. As an Instant, this card cannot be Burning Wished for, and can easily be played in other black based control/board control decks and not just tendrils and storm combo.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CorruptedAngel

Not really. I don't know what reasoning they have for this card, if printed as was posted, to be an Instant.

---

It could be Necrologia 2.0 which would make it a whole lot less potent.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jaynel

Just to clarify, you cannot play any spells until Ad Nauseum has resolved (you must choose to stop paying life and drawing cards before playing anything else). So you can't play Angel's Grace then keep on drawing.

---

1. Cast angel's grace (it says until EOT)
2. Cast ad nauseam
3. ???
4. Win

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Frenger

1. Cast angel's grace (it says until EOT)
2. Cast ad nauseam
3. ???
4. Win

---

I wouldn't play a two card combo when you could be playing a one card combo. Ad Nauseum is pretty nuts by itself.

Quote:

---

1. Cast ad nauseam
2. ???
3. Profit

---

Fix'd. In this case, the ??? is actually winning the entire tournament, because your deck includes cheese like Ad Nauseum. Here's hoping for a pre-release banning for all formats besides vintage, where it will probably be restricted.


Hell, I'd consider putting this in Non-Combo decks, just because it could provide so much card advantage. It's manacost becomes a little restrictive at that point, but still, 5 mana for draw 6 and lose 4 life? Not bad.

1) Cast As Nauseum
2) Stuff happens.
3) Collect first place

4) Go get some beers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by The_Red_Panda

Here's hoping for a pre-release banning for all formats besides vintage, where it will probably be restricted.

---

It wont be restricted in Vintage. There are too many other high-CC cards that will win you the game faster than this that would have to be cut in order to make it work. It's got "Mana Drain me" written all over it.

In Legacy, I'm looking forward to both building a deck around it, as well as countering it and getting a 3-for-1.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by m03

It wont be restricted in Vintage. There are too many other high-CC cards that will win you the game faster than this that would have to be cut in order to make it work. It's got "Mana Drain me" written all over it.

---

Couldn't you say the same thing for Mind's Desire?

I love wizards for making TES more and more broken. <3

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Peter_Rotten

Couldn't you say the same thing for Mind's
Desire?

---

Difference is when they Drain a Desire, they'll never get to their next turn to actually get the mana, as the Storm copies from Desire will likely allow the game to be marked up to the Desire player as a W.