Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Am I missing something. Why all the islands? Wouldn't some fetches make Brainstorm and Top much better?
Enjoy!
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ScottW
Am I missing something. Why all the islands? Wouldn't some fetches make Brainstorm and Top much better?
Enjoy!
Yeah you are right, totally spaced out fetches would do the job actually. Thanks for that Scott. :cool:
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
I would also play at least 2 Ancient Tomb and 1 City of Traitors to accelerate the combo. 4 FoW is a must. Some Intuitions to find whatever you need wouldn't hurt either.
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
keys
I would also play at least 2 Ancient Tomb and 1 City of Traitors to accelerate the combo. 4 FoW is a must. Some Intuitions to find whatever you need wouldn't hurt either.
Great thanks for the suggestions guys. I've thrown in 4 Ancient Tombs and have noticed a positive impact in the few times I've been able to play test it this weekend. I don't have any City of Traitors but i'll look into upgrading. Intuition is a great card, I just don't know what I should take out of the main deck to exchange them with. Thanks for the help thus far, should I just go all out and play more than the four fetches? I understand how they can help with Top but is it really necessary to have a lot in a mono deck? Why pay one life to search for an island when you could just play one? I am all ears if anyone has any fetch strategy pointers.
Here is the new iteration: (Minus the Intuitions which I haven't put in yet):
4 Donate
2 Counterspell
4 Illusions of Grandeur
4 Lotus Petal
4 Brainstorm
2 Energy Field
11 Island
2 Ponder
2 Sapphire Medallion
1 Daze
4 Grindstone
4 Painter's Servant
2 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Force of Will
1 Academy Ruins
1 Maze of Ith
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Polluted Delta
//Sideboard
SB: 3 Hydroblast
SB: 3 Blue Elemental Blast
SB: 1 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 3 Fabricate
SB: 1 Surgical Extraction
SB: 1 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 1 Back to Basics
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
I don't like diluting a blue combo deck with Illusions and Donate. The problem is that they're both completely dead cards on their own.
If you want to go "2-Card Monte" style and have two instant win conditions, Painter+Grindstone and another one here are some better options:
Mindcrank + Duskmantle Guildmage (cheaper than Illusion/Donate, involves a 2/2 body for alt win, interacts with Grindstone, but requires Black)
Helm of Obedience + Leyline of the Void / Rest in Peace (splash damage against dredge, Helm isn't dead on it's own against decks like Reanimator, but requires white or black)
Dreadnought + Stifle (classic!)
Mind Over Matter + Temple Bell (arguably better than Illusions/Donate, though it does require you to have some reshuffle effect)
Laboratory Maniac + Thought Lash (Mainac kind of works with Grindstone - heck, you can combo yourself if you want to avoid Emrakul or Gaea's Blessing. Thought Lash helps hold down the fort against aggro till you win)
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Some number of Misdirection in the 75 would help against pesky Abrupt Decays.
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MaximumC
I don't like diluting a blue combo deck with Illusions and Donate. The problem is that they're both completely dead cards on their own.
If you want to go "2-Card Monte" style and have two instant win conditions, Painter+Grindstone and another one here are some better options:
Mindcrank + Duskmantle Guildmage (cheaper than Illusion/Donate, involves a 2/2 body for alt win, interacts with Grindstone, but requires Black)
Helm of Obedience + Leyline of the Void / Rest in Peace (splash damage against dredge, Helm isn't dead on it's own against decks like Reanimator, but requires white or black)
Dreadnought + Stifle (classic!)
Mind Over Matter + Temple Bell (arguably better than Illusions/Donate, though it does require you to have some reshuffle effect)
Laboratory Maniac + Thought Lash (Mainac kind of works with Grindstone - heck, you can combo yourself if you want to avoid Emrakul or Gaea's Blessing. Thought Lash helps hold down the fort against aggro till you win)
Whoa, thanks for all the tips. You make some real valid points about having dead cards. Thank you for taking the time to share some "2-card-monte" gems. I really enjoy reading about them. You rock. The Dreadnought + Stifle hits so hard haha. I like the Mindcrank combo just don't know if I'm ready to incorporate black yet, but I like it. One of the things I really like about the 2 card monte style is that in theory at least in a 2-3 game tournament round setup, even if you hit with one combo and your opponent tries to sideboard you can hit them with the other method game two. :cool:
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Blastoderm
Some number of Misdirection in the 75 would help against pesky Abrupt Decays.
Word. Good to keep in mind, I'm always open to new ideas for sideboarding. Thanks
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
The idea has been discussed before. Also using stuff like Pucca's Mischief.
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...1-Deck-Trixorz
Considering that instant speed removal like Pyroblast makes Illusions into a game loss, it's pretty risky to run in a competitive setting.
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Fetchlands are a liability with energy field. even if you don't crack them they can be targeted by wasteland
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MaximumC
I don't like diluting a blue combo deck with Illusions and Donate. The problem is that they're both completely dead cards on their own.
If you want to go "2-Card Monte" style and have two instant win conditions, Painter+Grindstone and another one here are some better options:
Mindcrank + Duskmantle Guildmage (cheaper than Illusion/Donate, involves a 2/2 body for alt win, interacts with Grindstone, but requires Black)
Helm of Obedience + Leyline of the Void / Rest in Peace (splash damage against dredge, Helm isn't dead on it's own against decks like Reanimator, but requires white or black)
Dreadnought + Stifle (classic!)
Mind Over Matter + Temple Bell (arguably better than Illusions/Donate, though it does require you to have some reshuffle effect)
Laboratory Maniac + Thought Lash (Mainac kind of works with Grindstone - heck, you can combo yourself if you want to avoid Emrakul or Gaea's Blessing. Thought Lash helps hold down the fort against aggro till you win)
These are all great suggestions, but Illusions does give you 20 extra life, so that can prolong the game if needed for you to complete the combo. I wouldn't call that a dead card. I think OP will enjoy tinkering with these different builds.
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ESG
These are all great suggestions, but Illusions does give you 20 extra life, so that can prolong the game if needed for you to complete the combo. I wouldn't call that a dead card. I think OP will enjoy tinkering with these different builds.
That is a very good point. 20 life can be huge. I notice you are based in Seattle, do you ever play legacy on a causal basis? I might be keen to meet up with some other legacy players I'm just getting back into the game after a really long hiatus and am new to the Seattle mtg scene. I guess I could just "hey mister" over at MOX...
As for the deck I have enjoyed continuing to tinker with it :)
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rufus
True ATM I am leaning on replacing the Illusions/donate combo with the Dreadnought/Stifle.. The mana cost is reduced, and with that I can replace the 2x sapphire medallions with 2x trinket mages, which I can use to search for either a grindstone or a dreadnought.
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fallen_Empire
True ATM I am leaning on replacing the Illusions/donate combo with the Dreadnought/Stifle.. The mana cost is reduced, and with that I can replace the 2x sapphire medallions with 2x trinket mages, which I can use to search for either a grindstone or a dreadnought.
I guess then technically if I replace the Illusions/Donate it won't be a "trix" deck, but I am committed to designing a mono blue painter, 2 card monte style preferably. Here is my current design:
2 Counterspell
4 Lotus Petal
4 Brainstorm
2 Energy Field -- (Has been helpful but prevents you from cracking fetches: I'm only running 4 currently -open to any suggestions)
11 Island
2 Ponder
1 Daze -- (Like the one of just to keep the opponent on guard if they know it is in the deck)
4 Grindstone
4 Painter's Servant
2 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Force of Will
1 Academy Ruins
1 Maze of Ith
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Flooded Strand
4 Stifle
4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
2 Trinket Mage
//Sideboard
SB: 3 Hydroblast
SB: 3 Blue Elemental Blast
SB: 1 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 3 Fabricate
SB: 1 Surgical Extraction
SB: 1 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 1 Back to Basics
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
SB: 1 XXXXXXXXX
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fallen_Empire
I guess then technically if I replace the Illusions/Donate it won't be a "trix" deck, but I am committed to designing a mono blue painter, 2 card monte style preferably. Here is my current design:
2 Counterspell
4 Lotus Petal
4 Brainstorm
2 Energy Field -- (Has been helpful but prevents you from cracking fetches: I'm only running 4 currently -open to any suggestions)
11 Island
2 Ponder
1 Daze -- (Like the one of just to keep the opponent on guard if they know it is in the deck)
4 Grindstone
4 Painter's Servant
2 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Force of Will
1 Academy Ruins
1 Maze of Ith
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Flooded Strand
4 Stifle
4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
2 Trinket Mage
//Sideboard
SB: 3 Hydroblast
SB: 3 Blue Elemental Blast
SB: 1 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 3 Fabricate
SB: 1 Surgical Extraction
SB: 1 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 1 Back to Basics
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
SB: 1 XXXXXXXXX
Energy field can be cut. I am not sure that I would play 4 dreadnought's either with trinket mage. Too many things kill dreadnought for it to be your main plan. If you are going to play 4, I would try Cloudform.
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fallen_Empire
That is a very good point. 20 life can be huge. I notice you are based in Seattle, do you ever play legacy on a causal basis? I might be keen to meet up with some other legacy players I'm just getting back into the game after a really long hiatus and am new to the Seattle mtg scene. I guess I could just "hey mister" over at MOX...
As for the deck I have enjoyed continuing to tinker with it :)
I don't have a lot of free time, so usually my Magic time goes toward tournaments. But, yeah, if you're in Seattle, you definitely should check out Card Kingdom in Ballard on Mondays (6:30 p.m.) and Mox Boarding House in Bellevue on Thursdays (7 p.m.) for weekly Legacy. There's also a Legacy 1K being held at Mox Boarding House this Saturday at noon. I encourage you to come out and get a feel for these places. There are also casual gaming groups if you find out you aren't digging the competitive scene (this group is one that appears to still be going strong: http://www.meetup.com/mtg-15/). Ultimately, there's no better way to tune a deck than to take it into battle and find out what works and what doesn't.
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ESG
I don't have a lot of free time, so usually my Magic time goes toward tournaments. But, yeah, if you're in Seattle, you definitely should check out Card Kingdom in Ballard on Mondays (6:30 p.m.) and Mox Boarding House in Bellevue on Thursdays (7 p.m.) for weekly Legacy. There's also a Legacy 1K being held at Mox Boarding House this Saturday at noon. I encourage you to come out and get a feel for these places. There are also casual gaming groups if you find out you aren't digging the competitive scene (this group is one that appears to still be going strong:
http://www.meetup.com/mtg-15/). Ultimately, there's no better way to tune a deck than to take it into battle and find out what works and what doesn't.
Very good to know! Thanks for all the advice I'll have to check it all out!
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fallen_Empire
2 Muddle the mixture
3 Lotus Petal
4 brainstorm
8 Island
4 Ponder
3 Daze
4 Grindstone
4 Painter's Servant
3 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Force of Will
1 Academy Ruins
2 back to basics
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Flooded Strand
3 city of traitors
3 Counterbalance
2 Trinket Mage
2 hydroblast
//Sideboard
SB: 3 misdirection
SB: 3 ensnaring bridge
SB: 1 Blue Elemental Blast
SB: 2 hydroblast
SB: 1 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 1 tormods crypt
SB: 1 Surgical Extraction
SB: 1 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 1 Back to Basics
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
I edited the list to something close to what i used to play when i tried mono blue painter. Finding some space for intuitions or jace tms would be nice. More fetches and removal/bounces could help also.
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Nouille
I edited the list to something close to what i used to play when i tried mono blue painter. Finding some space for intuitions or jace tms would be nice. More fetches and removal/bounces could help also.
Thanks for the advice! I'll continue to tinker with different builds. How do you fight against Emrakul, Progenitus, or any other cards (and you know there will be more in the future) that break the Painterstone mill combo by being reshuffled into the deck?
Call me crazy but I feel like having at least two different win conditions really strengthens the versatility of the deck. At least incorporating the Dreadnought/Stifle combo gives you access to Stife, which could be used against Emrakul being put back in the deck, but you are still screwed if they have more copies. Maybe I should try putting in 4x Laboratory Maniac's and mill myself? :cool:
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fallen_Empire
...
Call me crazy but I feel like having at least two different win conditions really strengthens the versatility of the deck.
...
We don't really see combo decks with 16 cards for 2 different A+B combos doing well. We typically see alternative win conditions as 1or 2 ofs instead.
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fallen_Empire
Thanks for the advice! I'll continue to tinker with different builds. How do you fight against Emrakul, Progenitus, or any other cards (and you know there will be more in the future) that break the Painterstone mill combo by being reshuffled into the deck?
Call me crazy but I feel like having at least two different win conditions really strengthens the versatility of the deck. At least incorporating the Dreadnought/Stifle combo gives you access to Stife, which could be used against Emrakul being put back in the deck, but you are still screwed if they have more copies. Maybe I should try putting in 4x Laboratory Maniac's and mill myself? :cool:
When you play a combo deck, you have to stick to your main combo in my opinion. There is only few deck that feature Emrakul, and there is no deck that feature progenitus (maybe some unusual elfs lists...), and for these emrakul decks you'll have to get your tormod's crypt, and activate it to the emrakul trigger. Of course it will be hard matchups, but all decks have bad matchups (+ for emrakul decks, you have back to basics, pithing needle... to tempo). Split to multiple combos will weaken each combo (less library manipulation, less counters...).
By the way, the list I proposed here have another awesome combo =>sensei+counterbalance hahaha. And the cool thing is that the sensei top is needed in this deck anyway and will be useful in a lot a situations (unlike dreadnought or stifle).
Re: Mono Blue Trix Painter
I hear people saying that it is better to not go with two different combos. I understand it isn't obviously a common practice. However assuming you were in a 2-3 game match and your opponent doesn't know what you are playing right away, if you went with plan A in the first game, they would probably sideboard for A when you can go with B in game two.
Also food for thought: if you have 8 cards in a 60 card deck that have a win combo such as: 4x Grindstone / 4x Painter's Serviant there is about a 16% chance you have a copy of both in your opening hand. Now obviously having cards like SDT and Brainstorm will help you dig, but if you also have another 8 cards in the deck that also have a 16% chance of opening with say 4x Thought Lash / 4x Laboratory Maniac tell me that isn't better odds of getting the win conditions you need to win faster? Surgical Extraction got you down on one combo, you can keep swinging! :wink:
Current list (stilll need to think about counterbalance):
2 Counterspell
4 Lotus Petal
4 Brainstorm
8 Island
1 Daze
4 Grindstone
4 Painter's Servant
3 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Force of Will
1 Academy Ruins
1 Maze of Ith
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Flooded Strand
1 Seat of the Synod
4 Fabricate
4 Laboratory Maniac
4 Thought Lash
2 Shelldock Isle
1 Mirror of Fate
//Sideboard
SB: 3 Hydroblast
SB: 1 Surgical Extraction
SB: 2 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Misdirection
SB: 2 Ensnaring Bridge
SB: 1 Trinisphere
SB: 2 Trinket Mage
SB: 1 Tormod's Crypt
