The Source Secret Santa 2018

2018 Christmas: Secret Santa from the Source

Thanks to many volunteers putting a lot of effort in the past dozen of years, our community has kept the spirit flowing. After its booming and flourishing years, the event has seen a decrease in attendance for the past 2 years. Nonetheless, I can attest they were as sweet as ever to experience:
2017 thread: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...a-2017-edition
2016 thread: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...ret-Santa-2016
If you feel like giving out something special and forging some friendship in this cyber space, don't miss out this time! Much credits to UseLess for a lot of copied rules from his post!

Your profile
- A contributor to this forum;
- Able to send a package worth bragging by insured shipment before 14 December (or 7 December for overseas);
- Willing to show your appreciation and share your gift in the bragging thread :cool:

Participation
Send me a PM with the following information before 23 November:
- A brief motivation if you are not sure being recognized as a contributor to this forum;
- Name and full address + alternative contact (mail/phone number/etc)
- Shipping region (within EU, North America, or no restriction)
- Your budget range *
- Your wishlist **

[*] Budget information (Courtesy of UseLess)
With respect to the budget, I’ve seen very wide ranges over the past years of SSS. Some people have more to spend and/or give than others, but we should all remember that this is not a contest who can give most or who can give the least but get the most. You should participate if you like the idea of the gifting, doing something nice for a fellow sourcer and hopefully getting a nice package yourself that makes you remember this event.
Ideally, I’m going to pair people that have similar budget ranges, in order to avoid major disappointments. That said, people should always realize that even if budget ranges are the same, that doesn’t mean everybody can buy the same amount or type of cards with it. In particular between the EU and US, there can be some large price differences, so what is expensive in the US may not be expensive in the EU, and vice versa. Some people may buy at local shops (to say support those) where things might be more expensive than some online stores.
In short: appreciate the gift, not the value. Don’t expect to make money from this event. I will of course try to avoid having someone who spends $100+ on his gift get a gift from someone who has a range of $20-30, but value differences between giving and sending are unavoidable.

[**] Wishlist information (Courtesy of UseLess)
I will directly forward your wishlist to whomever will be giving you your present. Please make sure that your wishlist consists of at least some cards that are generally accessible by your average legacy player. Not everyone can get their hands on nice cards in Japanese foil. Also, be realistic. Don’t fill up your wishlist with only $40+ cards, even when your own budget is $50-100. If you include some lower value cards, you can often get more from your actual wishlist than if it’s just a bunch of expensive cards. If you prefer to participate in this event without a wishlist, you can state that as well.

The Christmas spirit (Courtesy of UseLess)
To spice up your present and give a real Christmas feel, consider also sending something in addition to cards! Things to consider:
- A personal letter for your ‘victim’
- Other magic related articles (sleeves, deck boxes, playmats, etc.)
- Candy, chocolate or other food/drink related goodies
- Souvenirs typical for your home country

Important deadlines
- Registration closed: 23 November 2018
- Pairings information sent: 25 November 2018
- Overseas shipment due: 7 December 2018
- Domestic shipment due: 14 December 2018
- Receipt and bragging: as early as you wish, but please do support the community by sharing your experience!

Stay tuned!

Santa
- compacta_d --- sent --- bragged
- Dan Pyre --- sent --- bragged
- Goin Aggro --- sent --- bragged
- Krasman --- sent --- bragged
- meffeo --- sent --- bragged
- mistercakes --- sent --- bragged
- Mr. Safety --- sent --- bragged
- PirateKing --- sent --- bragged
- ronco --- sent --- bragged
- spartan117 --- sent --- bragged
- taconaut --- sent --- bragged
- tsabo_tavoc --- sent --- bragged
- UseLess --- sent --- bragged

I'm in, as usual.

Much better start than my 2016 attempt.

I'll join in as usual, thanks

Count me in again!

I'm in, as well!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PirateKing

Much better start than my 2016 attempt.

I'll join in as usual, thanks

---

Thank you PirateKing, we all remember you single handedly rescued the tradition :smile:

Great to see this initiative taken to keep the SSS alive! I had given up on seeing a thread emerge by now, but very happy Tsabo that you're taking the effort now. I'm definitely in for overseas :). I think last year went pretty well, so I have good hopes for this year! You'll get a PM with my info and wishlist a bit later. I got to figure out what to put on that list first.

I'm in

I'm in again for this year! Looking forward to shipping something across the pond :)

I'll do this this year. Sounds like fun. PM incoming.

I'm in.

Thank you all for participating! We are about to reach 10 people, and will for sure have some fun :laugh:
Please remember to send me a PM in the next 3 days!

Deadline in 1 day, hurry up for registration :eek:

I will then send the pairings during the weekend.

In for the 4th time if I may join :laugh:

EU would be best!

The pairings have been sent on Sunday.
Since more people have shown interest, I will keep the registration open. For the second rounders, if you want to know your pairing by this weekend, send me your information (read opening post) before Friday, 30 Nov!

Yes, target has been acquired. An interesting wishlist that gives some nice options for a good package!

PMed. I may be too late though. Hope everyone has fun!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by compacta_d

PMed. I may be too late though. Hope everyone has fun!

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Nice try, welcome to our party :laugh:

Wish everyone a nice start in December!

Tsabo, I'm having way more fun putting this together than I thought I would. I hope the receiver enjoys it. Still putting the finishing touches on the package....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ronco

Tsabo, I'm having way more fun putting this together than I thought I would. I hope the receiver enjoys it. Still putting the finishing touches on the package....

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Glad to hear, that's how we got addicted to it :laugh: You certainly have one of the more exotic wishlists, and let's look forward to the bragging in a few weeks :smile:

My package is almost complete! Just missing a few pieces to send with it that I should be able to acquire today. However, I'm currently on graveyard shifts. I'll probably be asleep while the post office is open today before my package is finished. If I get it into the post office before it closes on Saturday the 8th, will that be an issue or should I eschew sleep to get it in today?

I'll also send out tomorrow. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dan Pyre

My package is almost complete! Just missing a few pieces to send with it that I should be able to acquire today. However, I'm currently on graveyard shifts. I'll probably be asleep while the post office is open today before my package is finished. If I get it into the post office before it closes on Saturday the 8th, will that be an issue or should I eschew sleep to get it in today?

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Nice to hear the international shippers are getting ready. The rules are general guidelines, and please send your package at your convenience.
Happy dredging at your graveyard shifts, and hope you will have a fresh reanimation :laugh:

I have all the items for mine. I'll be getting it out probably early next week once I get it all packed up! Hoping the recipient enjoys!
Btw - do we provide tracking anywhere? Or just hang on to it to make sure things get delivered?

sent out! :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ronco

I have all the items for mine. I'll be getting it out probably early next week once I get it all packed up! Hoping the recipient enjoys!
Btw - do we provide tracking anywhere? Or just hang on to it to make sure things get delivered?

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Glad to hear! You can PM the tracking info to me, and I will only check it in case of no receipt until Christmas. Otherwise, it is a nice tool to track how close is your package to their recipient.

Sent!

I'm the absolute ~worst~! :cry:

Posting here for accountability, sending this morning the moment the post office is open!

EDIT: Package sent! I'll have the tracking number to you in PM soon.

The first gifts have arrived!
However, I got PMs about high import tax, which is frustrating to experience as part of the Secret Santa. I think it makes sense to open up a discussion here what is the best way for international shipment for this year (mostly too late) and the coming years. Personally, I have very limited experience dealing with customs, and a ~20% import tax into Germany is not too unreasonable. The delay and extra efforts of course suck. What would you do? Mark as gift, estimate a value below threshold, etc.?

I'll just share what I did (shipping from USA to CAN):
filled out customs forms broadly but honestly, and put in the dollar value (individual items were off, but the total was correct), and marked as gift. I could send it express for $50 bucks or "first class" for ~$25. So I chose the latter. I can't imagine canada having issues not delivering packages, but I guess we will see! I sent through USPS. Has anyone sent via fedex/ups and if so, what were the rates for those?

I havent shipped to europe in a LONG time (like 15 years - back when workshops were $150 and duals were $40 :cry:) I've always put the dollar value on there as what it is for 2 reasons:
1 - I don't want to do anything illegal and I feel like that is something they would take seriously, even if the variance was "small."
2 - If something does go wrong and I need to claim insurance I want to make sure I'm adequately covered.

As far as the import duties (and this goes for commercial sales, not necessarily this), Ive figured that just a cost of buying overseas for the buyer. They knew they were buying from the states and presumably know their country does things the way they do things, so I just let them deal with it. After a small number of sales created big headaches I stopped selling to Europe.

I apologize if this comes too rough for some but these sort of things really grind my gears and I'm always amazed by the lack of knowledge, ignorance and pure idiocy when people are shipping items.

All you (not pointing any fingers; general term), as a seller, had to do is to declare the value below whatever is the taxation line for the country you were shipping to, that is worldwide roughly 20$. So why was it so hard to just declare value of the package at let's say 5$ and everything would be fine.. but hell no, some ignoranus decided to declare full value, preferably from the highest online site just cause... WHY? So the recipient can pay 30% more on tax/duties. Here's get bent and Merry Christmas gift for you.

And to all the people who say "that's why I never ship to X country or outside of my hermetically sealed bubble I'm living in" just grow a pair and fill in the customs form/declare value (you do this at post office when you hand in the package). That's all you have to do, post officer can help you, it's not that hard.. it's basically you just being lazy (afraid?) af and taking an easy way out. And as said before there's no reason to declare real value except when you are paying for insurance. there nothing more moronic than paying tax to state for trading MAgic card. And what are you going to say to customs officer, "Sir, sir but have you checked the prices lately, after the UMA reprint, that Engineered explosives is now 30$ instead of the declared 80$" .. they won't care (it's arbitrary af is what i'm saying).

Disclaimer: Customs can always stop, open the package and raise queries to the recipient even if value is below the taxation line, but that's, even if unlucky, something recipient has accepted when signing up for SS 2018 international edition. But recipient sure as hell didn't sign up for the buttfuckery that will now happen because somebody decided to go ham and declare full value of items. Marking package as gift is basically a customs trap and in great majority fails horribly so just never mark it as such hoping for "Oh it's a gift, now I can send a Ferrari. I bet customs officer will be cool about it". Sure buddy, sure, maybe one day you will climb over that mountain where the sun goes down.

ps: I've done thousands of sales and buys internationally and from my end I've never had issues with customs. But I did have some rare instances where sellers were just too .. let's call it uneducated.

You're being harsh.

As for me, this was my first time shipping to another country. The FedEx person didn't say anything about import duties. I was unaware such a thing even existed, as again this was my first time. I asked everything I could think to ask. I declared value, because the original thread SPECIFICALLY SAID TO and I was following instructions. As expensive as it was, I certainly didn't think my recipient would have to pay almost the same price. Why wouldn't they charge ME for that when I sent it? Had I known all that I would have figured out an alternate method.

ronco, Mr Miagi, compact_d:
Thank you for sharing your experiences. I appreciate the veteran's insights as well as views from first timers.
The Source Secret Santa has a tradition encouraging oversea exchange. Going forward, we should make it as friendly as possible to all parties involved, including the customs.
My proposal for the future editions would be international (i.e., across tax zones) shipment should have a declared value below 20$. There is of course more freedom about how much value one would pack in. MtG cards fluctuate in value, and there is foil/altering/signature to factor in. It is impossible to determine the value except by transaction records, which do not apply to Secret Santa gifts. However, to keep us at peace with all parties, nobody signed in for international should send or expect 100$ in 'market' value. There is still room to explore, as many of us are here for the sentimental value of Secret Santa.
It was hard for this year as we don't have many participants, but I kept shipping across tax zones under a half. I'd like to hear better proposals for future Secret Santas and hope this discussion will serve us good for the coming years.

Geez.

Don't know if Mr. Miagi was directed towards my post or set off by it or just a coincidence, but I'll reiterate my point again for clarity

As a SELLER (and not as a gift sending) - I put the sale value of cards on the customs forms. If a card sells for 30, I put 30 on the form. If it's 200, I put 200. It's a federal offense to put anything but the value of what is being sent so that's what I put on there because I have records of it selling for that amount, thus, that is the value of the contents. Its the same as any insurance I put on, if I choose to. That way everything matches and is done by the book in the event of disputes or audits or what have you (whether the law is correct or just is a different story).

I don't believe anything is different for gifting vs a commercial transaction (that was part of the reason I wanted to stay in NA as well). If the source wants to encourage other behaviors or find some other way around this I'm all ears. As for what I did for the gift, I followed pretty much the same process. Marked as gift, put the value as roughly what the contents were worth on the forms, ie my recipients target/my budget for this and sent it on its way.

The declared value on mine was higher than the contents, which led to higher taxes (i believe after googling).

I was following what FedEx told me, but clearly it was not the right thing (or correct thing, or legal thing) to do.

Clearly I would not do that to make a recipient of a GIFT pay more intentionally.

There was definitely a misunderstanding, and I think the employee was not as aware of things, especially after all of this talk.

I think talking about it and knowing what to do in the future is really the way to go about it. This is all important information to remember for next year or for people that are shipping late! Easy as that. Take it into account and figure the best possible way.

I'm still happy to do international. Adds fun to things for me. Novice mistakes. :(

@ ronco
I appreciate and agree with your points on selling and gifting. This year, we get budgets ranging from 50$ to 150$, well above the import tax threshold. In the last post, I was playing around ideas, how one could make 20$ 'market' value of cards worth more sentimentally. Altering is a good example, which can easily double the perceived worth, or if poorly implemented, halve the value.
To clarify, we should not advocate exploiting the 'grey area', especially not on our beloved public forum. To draft a shipment guideline for future Secret Santas, we could go within tax zone: no budget constraint; across tax zone: $20. I hope future organizers can have smarter ideas, but our discussion can serve as a good record to learn from.

@ compact_d
You are an awesome Santa and can only get better with international experience :laugh:

I would like to close the discussion here to prevent it from going astray.
The domestic shipping deadline is approaching. Let's all get ready to send out our packages :smile:

My alters just need to dry and I need to pick up some stocking stuffers and I'll be ready to mail this weekend.

Unrelated: painting is hard :<

Urgh, it's a shame about the import taxes. I declared the value so I could get insurance on the gift - I wouldn't want to be completely out if something goes wrong but it is frustrating that the import tax is based on that. I still really enjoy doing international gifting, it is a lot of fun for me. I hope that it doesn't go away in future editions :(

Unless if you're sending a single card that's very close to the whole budget, you could also consider sending several smaller packages. (or one package, and some other envelops with the other cards.)

Presents sent out today. Now waiting for the braggin' thread.