Tog Smash

Guess I’m finally trying to play hulk smash again. Notably I’m going to try a tempo delver shell so that psychatog can be a finisher. This is going to be my starting point:

2 psychatog
3 dark confidant
4 baleful strix
4 delver of secrets
2 berserk
3 sinkhole
4 force of will
4 brainstorm
3 daze
1 force of negation
3 stifle
3 ponder
3 assassins trophy

2 misty rainforest
1 bayou
1 tropical island
4 polluted delta
4 underground sea
3 wasteland
1 yavimaya, cradle of growth
2 island
1 swamp

Sideboard
3 mindbreak trap
3 fatal push
1 grist the hunger tide
2 flusterstorm
2 energy flux
2 chains of Mephistopheles
2 surgical extraction


Not sure how good this will actually be, but delver is proven so there is that. At worst I’ll get to play a deck idea I’ve been wanting to for a while. Sideboard is going to be tricky but will probably look like my maybe board… like grist.

A single Life from the Loam would work with the mana-denial angle and has the side benefit of growing Psychatog. Does Yavimaya hurt your mana-denial plan?

I was thinking about a loam, much like I considered darkblast. I think this comes down to how often I expect tog to be relevant. The whole idea was to bring back berserk and tog, but in the tempo shell it just replaces a murktide. With that said I’ve done more goldfishing and as expected, non blue lands are bad. Yavimaya has become the 4th wasteland. At first I felt I needed green, but just drawing hands shows you can play without green. Green really is just giving me access to assassins trophy. Being able to main deck such a versatile removal spell is the reason for green. Loam feels secondary to need, but could still be a sideboard option.

If you're playing BUG tempo with Berserk, I think the 1 drop you want is either Death's Shadow or Dreadnought, not Delver. It would involve changing a few other slots but then at least your other threat is a significant clock and gets value out of Berserk.

Strix could go. It's a defensive midrange card, not an aggressive tempo card.

Deaths shadow was the first concept, but I wanted to pair that with doomsday. That reminded me of wanting to try to play tog again however.

Yeah I don’t feel excited about strix. It was an easy include because it cantrips and is blue. It’s easily one of the weakest links.

It could easily be replaced by Bowmasters at 2 mana. Not blue, but more proactive play.

Got some ideas that are looking to change things a bit. I may finally have a home for pteramander!

3 psychatog
3 pteramander
1 brazen borrower
4 delver of secrets
1 berserk
4 force of will
4 brainstorm
3 daze
2 force of negation
4 ponder
3 assassins trophy
3 careful study
4 Sauron’s ransom

2 misty rainforest
2 tropical island
4 polluted delta
4 underground sea
4 wasteland
2 island
1 swamp

Sideboard
3 mindbreak trap
3 fatal push
1 ethereal forager
2 flusterstorm
2 snapcaster mage
2 null rod
2 surgical extraction

This is what I ended up playing. I regret not sticking to energy flux. The deck played well and I think I may have to go cunning wish if I am to play it again. Berserk felt like a bad card every time it wasn’t going to win the game, even if it was green removal. Pteramander was great. The forager was just something I wanted to try, but it definitely doesn’t jive with the deck on the whole. I did keep some bad hands, but surprisingly to me, the deck was playable off of a single island. The ring likes psychatog.

Overall deck was fun and felt powerful. Definitely worth delving more into.

I think pteramander should be replaced with death shadow. Having both delver and ds. Psytog wants some number of troll of khazadoom and street wraiths in my opinion and they both push you towards ds which also goes nicely with beserk. edit:I also don't think careful study is where you want to be.

Why does psychatog want either of those? Do you have any reasoning for them as it comes off as random cards that you happen to know that don’t do anything relevant to the plan.

Troll, Wraith and Lorien Revealed are good for Psychatog (fill graveyard faster).

Shadow doesn't do much with Tog, but it's another good body to Berserk. Berserk is pretty bad with Delver and just OK with Pteramander.

If you're cutting Berserks instead of adding more creatures good with Berserk, then why not play red instead of green? Red offers DRC for another good 1 drop that's amazing at filling the graveyard. You can still play 1-of Temur Battle Rage or whatever.

Psychatog is basically 2003 Murktide, so it should work with DRC & Delver + spells.

Why are we playing tempo instead of madness? Psychatog is much much worse than beaters like murktide. But it’s not that much worse as a discard outlet than Lotleth Troll and Putrid Imp. At least there is an argument that it is a better topdeck to compensate for being slower.

What madness payoffs would you play? Rootwalla is not exciting on turn 3. The 4/4 wurms aren't so hot anymore when you can make a 3/3 flying for R. Putrid Imp is better in that you can vomit out Vengevine and Hollow One on turn 1, but doing that on turn 3 is much worse and lacks synergy with Tog.

Circular Logic might still be playable?

Playing tog because that was the goal. I wanted to be able to play hulk smash again.

Honestly after playing that list I did feel reanimator had potential. It does something there that I like, create an option low to the ground. The problem there is why not just be full on reanimator. That I feel is the main problem with where to go. I went tempo because tog is generally good in a control shell and it gave me a big finisher that is the only graveyard interaction I needed to play. If I can blank hate I’d argue that’s good. Berserk as I mentioned only felt good with tog, and off chance removal is cute, but I do think cunning wish would play better. I mainly want green for sideboard options and access to berserk.

To go grixis the madness plan could be interesting. It could add something to hollow one builds.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Weapon X

Why does psychatog want either of those? Do you have any reasoning for them as it comes off as random cards that you happen to know that don’t do anything relevant to the plan.

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wrath is a 0 mana hidden card neutral way to grow tog. Lorien and troll help fix your colors when you're playing wastelands in a 3c deck, they can even be played off of wasteland, being more cards your opponent might not think about that can grow your tog. Growing your tog at instant speed is important to play around combat and burn and doing so in ways your opponents can not see at a glance is even stronger. If you're already playing troll/lorien and street wraith which to me seem like a no brainer, they pair extremely well with shadow which is a significantly better card than pteramander.

For Tog, you still have that

DRC > Delver
Faithless Looting > Careful Study

So red looks good. Example:


//Creatures: 14
4 Dragon's Rage Channeler
4 Orcish Bowmasters
3 Psychatog
3 Troll of Kazadum

//Spells: 25
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Drown in the Loch
3 Sauron's Ransom
2 Lorien Revealed
1 Force of Negation
1 Temur Battle Rage

//Artifacts: 3
3 Mishra's Bauble

//Lands: 18
4 Wasteland
3 Polluted Delta
3 Scalding Tarn
3 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
2 Badlands
1 Island


Bauble is a free GY filler like Wraith, except even better with DRC.

DRC is the best graveyard filler in the format, seems much better to have it in the deck.

Drown in the Loch seems good in a GY-filling plan.

Temur Battle Rage is poor man's Berserk

I forgot about battle rage. Double strike makes me feel better.

Someone created a modern deck that reminded me of this thread. Thought it might be useful for future theorycrafters.

I rebuild this deck every once in a while because I loved hulk smash and always want to give a run. Frog is a better tog in that it permanently stays big so I will revisit this again at some point. I have ideas but it’s not my current focus.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Weapon X

I rebuild this deck every once in a while because I loved hulk smash and always want to give a run. Frog is a better tog in that it permanently stays big so I will revisit this again at some point. I have ideas but it’s not my current focus.

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Mind writing your ideas down or is it super secret deck tech? I just figure ideas being written down could help others who might be interested in experimenting with it.

Frog
Delver
Grief
2 Atraxa

Scam package/entomb

Tempo/control

That’s the gist of the one I think will work… and possibly a tropical and rancor.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Weapon X

Frog
Delver
Grief
2 Atraxa

Scam package/entomb

Tempo/control

That’s the gist of the one I think will work… and possibly a tropical and rancor.

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Frog Smash

3rd place MTGO Challenge 64 (76 players)

//Creatures: 20
4 Psychic Frog
4 Grief
4 Troll of Khazad-dûm
3 Orcish Bowmasters
2 Delver of Secrets
2 Nethergoyf
1 Brazen Borrower

//Spells: 24
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Reanimate
4 Daze
2 Fatal Push
1 Dismember
1 Sheoldred's Edict

//Lands: 16
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
3 Underground Sea
1 Undercity Sewers
1 Island
1 Swamp
4 Wasteland

https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=56688&d=622833&f=LE


1st place MTGO Challenge 32 (35 players)

//Creatures: 14
4 Psychic Frog
4 Grief
4 Troll of Khazad-dûm
1 Archon of Cruelty
1 Atraxa, Grand Unifier

//Spells: 29
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Entomb
4 Reanimate
4 Animate Dead
4 Daze
1 Force of Negation

//Lands: 17
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
4 Underground Sea
1 Undercity Sewers
1 Island
1 Swamp
4 Wasteland

https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=56577&d=621936&f=LE

This likely ends up with them banning Grief since they won't want to ban Frog while MH3 is brand new. Eventually I could see both Frog and Grief getting banned. UBx will be taking over more and more of the meta as time progresses

In the meantime there is gonna be Frog-Scam to be built as straight UB, UBG (Uro/Loam/Grist), or UB with Reanimator package (Atraxa/Archon/Animate Dead).

UBG seems the strongest on paper since Loam is so juicy with Frog and Green has a lot of good sideboard material (e.g. Veil for Scam; Deed for Saga and Artifacts).

Well I played this list to test the waters

FrogNought
4 delver of secrets
4 psychic frog
2 brazen borrower
1 true-name nemesis
1 murktide regent
2 Phyrexian dreadnought

4 force of will
4 stifle
3 daze
2 spell pierce
1 misdirection
1 flusterstorm
1 counterspell
1 spell snare
4 brainstorm
4 ponder
1 dress down
2 standstill

4 wasteland
1 tropical island
2 underground sea
1 undercity sewers
8 blue fetches
2 island
1 swamp

SIDEBOARD
2 surgical extraction
1 grafdiggers cage
3 thoughtseize
2 null rod
2 chill
1 assassins trophy
2 abrupt decay
1 long goodbye
1 sheoldreds edict

How did it go?

UB Frog is already a Tier 1 deck. You could just play that. Standstill is risky when you lose the die roll, since so many decks are getting on board fast now.

If you want to brew with a Frog-Standstill hybrid, Nethergoyf and Tamiyo, Inquisitive Student are much better 1cmc threats to drop under a Standstill. Just be wary of opponent playing them too. Currency Converter is also an option, giving insane value with Psychic Frog discards or under Standstill.

Dreadnought seems unnecessary. If you want to force it, play some Consign to Memory in the 75. It enables Dreadnought and also counters Chalice/Eldrazi/Mystic Forge.

It went well in spite of my mana screw mulligans. This was the blue side I was curious about. Delver shell is already good and I felt the black splash for frog over murktide is a good space to be.

Standstill felt like a necessary evil, two may even be the right number. Threat into standstill for the reactive deck is great and helped me maintain pressure.

I agree nought isn’t necessary. I was going for the mana denial plan, but if it lines up it’s a fast clock.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Weapon X

This was the blue side I was curious about. Delver shell is already good and I felt the black splash for frog over murktide is a good space to be.

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Delver isn't good anymore. The "Delver shell" now plays 0 Delver. They've pivoted to Nethergoyf, Tamiyo, and Dragon's Rage Channeler. So if you want to build off the success of that tempo shell, Nethergoyf and Tamiyo are still the top 1 cmcs to consider. They're also amazing to stick T1 before a T2 Standstill.