All B/R update speculation.

[H]

Oh no

The issue is being looked into, in the meantime, for everyone, please don't click on weird links no matter who seems to have posted them.

[colo]

Well this ain't good :/ I've STONITH'd Zilla's account for now, let's see how we can resolve this. Thanks for taking care of some of the visible fall fallout!

I might have to take the site down later today, you do not have to worry more than you might do now in that case ;)

The forum's admin panel has been secured by another means, in addition to the vB account system, some time ago, so I _think_ Zilla's account takeover should have no wider repercussions (unless there's RCE involved, which I am not currecntly aware of).

I'll try to contact Zilla and reinstate his account in due course.


FTR, the file linked to in the spoofed posting was infected with this: https://www.virustotal.com/gui/file/...d34d9f68e3585f

[Barook]

All attractions and sticker cards banned

Good riddance

[Lord Seth]

No changes to any banlist this announcement, just them talking about their current thoughts on all of the formats and why there are no changes. They did have an interesting remark regarding Legacy indicating that we could be seeing bans (and maybe unbans?) in August:
https://magic.wizards.com/en/news/an...d-announcement

We are approaching Legacy similarly to Modern right now. Modern Horizons 3 has brought major changes to the format, and we're waiting to see how it responds to this release. While the community explores Modern Horizons 3, we will continue to monitor the play rate and win rate of reanimator, as it has surged dramatically in recent months. We intend to take a hard look at Legacy in our next announcement coming in late August.

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

It gets worse: their legacy format expert said ban grief:
https://clips.twitch.tv/GeniusAgitat...IIQBsrb4KF8-sK
"I won't shy away from it, the person who plays the most legacy said ban Grief"

[PirateKing]

Don't worry, once they finish their allocation of Modern Horizon 3 collector boosters (with retro frame Elementals) and are sure there's no more money left to be made, they'll ban Grief.
You're having a laugh if you think the people who play the format make the decision to ban a card currently sold in packs, high margin packs at that.

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

The banned fury tho.

[Gunseng]

Weakening Reanimator seems necessary given that it has as 25% share of the metagame right now according to MTG goldfish. I think the best card to ban is Entomb. The card itself is fine but the recent additions to the format allow you to create very small reanimation packages. Removing entomb makes it more difficult to consistently reanimate something. Troll of Khazad-dûm might be an alternative as he is both a mana fixer and an enabler at the same time. Banning Grief would affect more decks than reanimator / scam, so I don't think that this is the best choice even though I dislike the card.

[Purple Blood]

I'll repost what I said a few days ago in the Tog Smash thread:

This likely ends up with them banning Grief since they won't want to ban Frog while MH3 is brand new. Eventually I could see both Frog and Grief getting banned. UBx will be taking over more and more of the meta as time progresses

In the meantime there is gonna be Frog-Scam to be built as straight UB, UBG (Uro/Loam/Grist), or UB with Reanimator package (Atraxa/Archon/Animate Dead.

Frog and Scam fit so naturally together in what is already the highest Meta share deck. Frog can/will end up being the EI for these builds (except with a clock/enabler tacked on) and we all saw how that turned out.

[KobeBryan]

They never ban that soon. They need to sell the box and once box sales are slowing down, they drop the ban hammer.

[H]

Grief banned today: https://magic.wizards.com/en/news/an...d-announcement

Legacy can take a lot of power. The format sees play with some of the game's most powerful cards. But regardless of how powerful your cards are, you need to be able to cast them to take advantage of them. Much like in Modern, Grief prevents players from being able to do that.

While folks in Modern use narrow cards like Malakir Rebirth or Ephemerate to take advantage of Grief's manaless evoke ability, Legacy has Reanimate and Animate Dead backed up with protective elements like Daze and Force of Will. Various flavors of Reanimator strategies have long been viable in Legacy, but they have been generally kept in check by the strongest anti-graveyard cards ever printed being widely available. Grief presents a threat that synergizes well with reanimation effects while being able to attack the hate cards opponents would traditionally present.


Simply put, Legacy has not been able to self-correct to handle the powerful combination of Grief and Reanimate. With Dimir Reanimator's ever-growing metagame share, we've decided to ban Grief in Legacy.


Again, as in Modern, we considered a handful of other cards for this round of changes. We looked at the new Eldrazi deck, featuring several Modern Horizons 3 cards, and talked a lot about Psychic Frog. However, Grief and Reanimator is such a large part of the current Legacy metagame that we wanted to make the clear and obvious change to the format before making further changes. Specifically, Grief and Psychic Frog are featured together in Dimir Reanimator. Psychic Frog also appears in various Delver shells, but it stands to reason that it should have a smaller metagame presence once Grief has been removed.

[FTW]

Good ban. The fast tempo disruption is oppressive.

Good to keep Frog legal too. As people said years ago in this thread Dark Confidant dies to Lightning Bolt.

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

Get fucked grief

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

Good ban. The fast tempo disruption is oppressive.

Good to keep Frog legal too. As people said years ago in this thread Dark Confidant dies to Lightning Bolt.

Impressive how concisely you managed to be wrong about so many things.

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

Anyone who thinks this is going to fix the format is very bad at the game

[FTW]

Anyone who thinks this is going to fix the format is very bad at the game

No one said it would "fix" the format. But people have been sick of Grief for a while, it should have been banned last time.

UB won't decline, Frog is OP, but least it's a fundamentally fair mechanic. It's not a turn 0 non-game mechanic. It's a 2 mana creature that dies to removal and doesn't give advantage till you untap.

Like Bob was. People cried for Bob bans and Goyf bans in their day. They were too power crept for their time and saw large meta share. But they're still 2 mana creatures that die to removal and need you to untap. ("dies to Bolt" was the counterargument to banBob)

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

No one said it would "fix" the format. But people have been sick of Grief for a while, it should have been banned last time.

UB won't decline, Frog is OP, but least it's a fundamentally fair mechanic. It's not a turn 0 non-game mechanic. It's a 2 mana creature that dies to removal and doesn't give advantage till you untap.

Like Bob was. People cried for Bob bans and Goyf bans in their day. They were too power crept for their time and saw large meta share. But they're still 2 mana creatures that die to removal and need you to untap. ("dies to Bolt" was the counterargument to banBob)

Don't recite the deep magics to me, witch.

Describing Unmask on legs as a "turn 0 non-game unfair mechanic" is laughable. No one even played it for the first year it was legal.

Banning Grief is Wizards banning the completely fair card in an unfair deck instead of the actually degenerate parts. It is the thing you are trying to pretend banning Frog would be while Frog is an almost impossible to answer low cost perpetual CA engine that notably, does not fucking die to Bolt

Also people are absolutely claiming and have claimed this will fix things. Because they are little babies who want to play no LD/Counters/Discard and can't identify actual problem cards to save their lives.

[thefreakaccident]

Don't recite the deep magics to me, witch.

Describing Unmask on legs as a "turn 0 non-game unfair mechanic" is laughable. No one even played it for the first year it was legal.

Banning Grief is Wizards banning the completely fair card in an unfair deck instead of the actually degenerate parts. It is the thing you are trying to pretend banning Frog would be while Frog is an almost impossible to answer low cost perpetual CA engine that notably, does not fucking die to Bolt

Also people are absolutely claiming and have claimed this will fix things. Because they are little babies who want to play no LD/Counters/Discard and can't identify actual problem cards to save their lives.

My knee-jerk reaction was to argue with you here IBA, but I do agree to a point. Grief was only truly broken in reanimator decks, and in this the card reanimate is just as big of a culprit. I think the reason they went with Grief though is the fact that it gives that specific deck immense redundancy in disruption and threats. Don't have a troll or entombe to just win? Grief reanimate strips your opponent of their best options and plans moving forward. Top decked griefs serve as a bridge later on to add additional pressure and further disruption, etc. It's not that entombed reanimate is not busted, turn 1-2 archon/Atraxa on board will always be gross ofc, but Grief gave the deck just too much flexibility and consistency. At least, that's the reasoning others are likely going with.

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

To be clear, Reanimate is the real obvious problem card. I mean there’s compounding variables but the part where they undercosted a card by three whole mana is, as usual when such is the case, the actual issue that will keep causing problems until they ban it. “Turn 1 double Unmask” was never even the worst of the problems with the card.

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

Wouldn’t mind seeing Entomb or Frog go either tho