[Deck] Painter-Stone

[Whippoorwill]

I've generally been happy with Spellskite. The last time I played the deck it ate a Pridemage that would have otherwise killed off one of my combo pieces. It also acted as a wall which slowed my opponent down til I could combo out. As for Misdirection, I like it better as a sideboard option due to the limited uses. Sure its nice when you redirect your opponent's spells to hurt them instead, but quite often it can be a dead card or a pitch card to FoW (Does nothing against Pridemage, Natural Order or SnT for example). Granted Spellskite doesn't do anything against NO or SnT either, but it can be used with Transmute Artifact, Thirst and Welder to get something more useful at least.

In that same Match (Game 2 though) Transmute Artifact ended up being the MVP. My opponent had 2 Pridemages and TA resolved getting me Pithing Needle which shut down the Cats.


Current List I'm running:

2 Island
1 Mountain
3 Volcanic Island
4 Seat of the Synod
3 Great Furnace
3 Ancient Tomb
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Flooded Strand

4 Goblin Welder
4 Painter's Servant
2 Spellskite
1 Wurmcoil Engine

4 Brainstorm
3 Mental Misstep
3 Transmute Artifact
2 Thirst for Knowledge
4 Force of Will

3 Mox Opal
1 Tormod's Crypt
3 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Grindstone
1 Ensnaring Bridge

Sideboard:
1 Mental Misstep
3 Red Elemental Blast
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Pithing Needle
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Myr Battlesphere
1 Duplicant
1 Phyrexian Metamorph

The last 3 spots of the SB are flex spots and change depending on what I think I'll need for the night (Llawan, etc).

For me, I'll have to replace the Missteps with something Blue to keep my blue count up, so I was considering Spell Pierce or Flusterstorm depending on what becomes popular in my meta.

Also semi-considering 1-2 Laboratory Maniac as an alternate win condition. Or possibly 2-3 Vendilion Clique and taking out the Wurmcoil from main.

Edit While Posting:

Looking over the Innistrad Spoiler, would this be worth considering:

Memory's Journey 1U
Instant
Target player shuffles up to 3 target cards from their graveyard into their library.
Flashback: G

Seems like a decent blue card against Dredge early on and can shuffle back stuff from our own graveyards (Mainly non-artifacts).

[deadlock]

Whippoorwill I dont agree with your build as you are running alot of cards which are sideboard material / missing cards. Also posting a pre MM banning list doesnt make a lot of sense to begin with ;)

Some comments:
- Its okay to cut City with 3 TA, but I disagree with the basic mountain. The 6th Fetch is the better choice here.
- Spellskite is dead in a couple of matchups, I prefer to run more business instead.
- Wurmcoil without Grim doesnt seem too hot.
- Thirst is more of a control card then a combo card, the cardadvantage is nice, but we want to win quickly.
- No Intuition is a huge mistake imo, this card is a core card of Welder Painter.
- Tormods and Bridge, both good cards but also dead in a lot of cases. Perfectly fine to run them in the board.
- The 4th SDT should also be in your deck, considering the huge synergy and as a Mox Opal enabler.

Currently I see two approaches to this deck. The first one is to simply replace the MM with other protections spells like Misdirection and Spell Pierce, while the second one is to run the Transmute package, which implies to run less protection, but more business.

My current approach to the second option:
3 Volcanic Island
2 Scalding Tarn
4 Seat of the Synod
2 Polluted Delta
2 Island
2 Misty Rainforest
3 Great Furnace
3 Ancient Tomb

3 Mox Opal
3 Grim Monolith

4 Painter's Servant
4 Grindstone
1 Wurmcoil Engine (I consider moving it to the side, as an alt win is not strictly required maindeck. Instead I probably would add the second Misdirection).

4 Goblin Welder
4 Intuition
3 Transmute Artifact

4 Brainstorm
4 Sensei's Divining Top

4 Force of Will
1 Misdirection

Preliminary board:
SB: 2 Pyroblast
SB: 3 Red Elemental Blast
SB: 1 Tormod's Crypt
SB: 3 Blood Moon
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
SB: 1 Ensnaring Bridge
SB: 1 Wurmcoil Engine
SB: 3 Spellskite

Key points of this list are:
- 16 blue cards to support FoW.
- 7 tutors with 3 Grim Monolith to support TA and to enable Wurmcoil.
- TA based silver bullet SB.

[TheProfessor]

Waw i've been gone for a quite a while @.@

Need to catch up on whats happened.

I like your design deadlock. You plan on playing that anytime soon? Would love to hear your experience with that in a post-mm world?

Its basically tuned towards accomplishing the combo how about protection for the combo? We sorta dropped the rebs and stuff? Do you think that is a problem?

[deadlock]

Welcome back! I plan to play Painter on the next local tournament in my area, yes. But I havent decided upon on which build. Currently I have to prepare for an examination, therefore my testing time is limited, but in a week or so I will have plenty of time.

As I said, the list posted is just one approach (business heavy, protection light).
My other list is basically Wilson Hunters GP list -4 MM +2 Spell Pierce +2 Misdirection with the Show And Tell Plan in the side.
Would be glad to hear opinions from others, in order to focus testing on one particular direction.

[TheProfessor]

Thats great deadlock! Please share your experience here in the forums when you do. Would be awesome to hear about it.

Actually I feel that Wilson's list is one of better ones -LED, is pierce better than a REB/Pyro? Misdirection I can understand since we have to deal with more removal now such as dismember.

The SnT plan seems workable still I think. However I think we can do some sort of "MUD" type side board? (i'm just throwing ideas out there :D)

[Solthos]

Is a transformational SB to Hive Mind Viable? Adding maybe 2-3 Pact of Negations in the MB and then having the set of Hive Mind + Red Pacts off the board?

Or do you guys think its too janky?

[Seems Good]

I've always been very interested in this archetype and I'm considering building in for the upcoming meta that's about to unfold.

Concerning transformational sideboards: I've heard bomberman is the best option for this. Anyone have thoughts/opinions? I suppose you need to be running LED main, right?

[Sintheros]

I've always been very interested in this archetype and I'm considering building in for the upcoming meta that's about to unfold.

Concerning transformational sideboards: I've heard bomberman is the best option for this. Anyone have thoughts/opinions? I suppose you need to be running LED main, right?

If you're running a transformational sideboard, definitely do bomberman over SNT/Emrakul. Too many people are gunning for that. You should try to run a single LED main anyway - if you have a welder in play and go EOT intuition for LED/Painter/Stone you just flat out win. Then you can just side the LED out if you're planning on a slower game 2.

[Sloshthedark]

@Deadlock - I'm not fan of TA based lists (inconsistent UU, slower, card disadvantage), but 7 tutor build is tempting... you should definitely run 1 bridge, I most truly believe its and imperative to run 1 in any build of Intuition based Painter (and even more in SB), I play it 4 months as a 61st card and have never regretted it, it randomly kills or considerably slows down half of decks and is excellent in Intuition pile...

@Seems good - Bomberman seems bad... in fact it is bad, uberbad, the combo dies to same hate, you splash a color, its untutorable and hard to protect by itself... SnT is a dead-end plan as all white decks run karakas some with Kotr on the top, but is good in some matchups at least, Bomberman... I can't think about matchup i would even like to run it...


In present I'm testing heretic idea of not playing FoW at all.. It's card disadvantage and only time its good is protecting the combo... I hate it in opening hand unless I have T1 painter as I have to pitch better cards into it, is bad topdeck and has limited utility... I test more Blasts and Fire/ice instead (main reason Grim lavamancer and Dark Confidant, great versatility) and the deck is successful (XX games on MWS) and won last M-league trial with it (stifle build)... I don't say you should play like it, its just out-of-the-box idea to consider yourselves...

and other tech - try Jaya in SB its great with control/chalice and games you are hiding behind bridges and spellkites // Inkwell leviathan vs any extirpate.dec if playing multiple LEDs

[death]

@Slosh - what do you board out when you put in Jaya/Bridge/Spellskites?

also, why Fire/Ice over Lightning Bolt?

[Seems Good]

Just finishing up my first list now. Is Grim necessary? Also I'm having a tough time deciding between Bridge/Crypt/Wurmcoil main or board. With TA it's so tempting to play one-of's

Thoughts anyone?


//Lands
3 Volcanic Island
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Seat of the Synod
2 Island
2 Misty Rainforest
3 Great Furnace
4 Ancient Tomb

//Spells
3 Mox Opal
4 Painter's Servant
4 Grindstone
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Goblin Welder
4 Intuition
3 Transmute Artifact
4 Brainstorm
4 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Force of Will
3 Red Elemental Blast

//Sideboard
3 Pyroblast
1 Tormod's Crypt
3 Blood Moon
1 Pithing Needle
3 Fire
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Spellskite

[keys]

If you want to play Wurmcoil... Grim's are pretty necessary.

[Sloshthedark]

@death 2 jaya = 2 blasts unless its blue super-heavy ... the rest is different with every deck, usually 1 mox, 1 led, fire/ice, stifle if I'm oriented for long game behind the bridge brainstorms (or few intuitions with black) since its just cantrip with no hand...

Fire/ice is more versatile, can kill problematic creature (read confidant, pridemage) and still can operate in role blast would - eliminate 1 open mana but eot and without painter .. pitches to Fow.. if i played it =) .. and when I realized it can have more than 2 targets... i like the card as current builds lack moment of surprise and tend to drop LED which is really bad direction in my eyes

[Patrunkenphat7]

Hey guys,
I'm Wilson - I have been gone from the forums for quite a while! (new job, new puppy, married, ect... haha) I would love to get back into playtesting this deck. Miser Misdirection in the maindeck seems solid, although I can't confirm this with any kind of testing. Spellskite seems sick, although I know it is a controversial and sometimes dead card. It just seems amazing against all those cards that are hard to deal with. I am not opposed to Show and Tell package in the SB for certain events like Starcity, and I might play. I really don't like losing to bad Burn decks...

[TheProfessor]

Hi Wilson!

Congratulations on getting married man :D How you been? Hows the dog? and Hows married life?

I think you and I have had a pretty long hiatus in the forums.

At the moment this is what I'm getting

1.) Spellskite works well.
2.) Misdirection works but not as often as we want it.
3.) Meta has gotten faster now that MM is gone
4.) SnT packages are still good but were trying to find a better alternative if any?
5.) Congratulations to Max Jacob on his placing on SCG! WOHOO Go Painter (lol)

[Sloshthedark]

unfortunately Max Jacob played Merfolks in front of the camera so wrong list got published or wrong name was in the match, Jacob Baugh played S&T painter in a another feature match so maybe its his...

[lordofthepit]

This was a DTB several months ago, before Mental Misstep got printed. Ostensibly, it seems like Mental Misstep hurt this deck more than it helped it, considering it runs several very important 1-drops (Welder, Top, Grindstone), and the recent banning of Mental Misstep should propel this deck back to Tier 1 status.

However, I think that the rise of Surgical Extraction as a popular piece of graveyard hate from the sideboard in this metagame can also be pretty brutal to this deck. Whereas traditional graveyard hate like Tormod's Crypt and Relic of Progenitus did little to affect the deck, a well-timed Surgical Extraction can knock out your entire combo. The opponent only has to counter, destroy, or force you to discard either combo piece and follow it up with a resolved Surgical Extraction to completely take away the combo. Moreover, even if your opponent fails to do so, the deck remains somewhat reliant on the graveyard since it often relies on Welder, Intuition, or occasionally, even milling one's self with Grindstone.

Am I overstating the impact of Surgical Extraction? If not, is it time to take this deck in a slightly different direction (i.e. include a Transmute Artifact->Robot piece maindeck in case the primary combo gets knocked out, not only by Surgical Extraction, but also by previously existing avenues of hate).

[sdematt]

I've been playing the following list to excellent results:

4 Seat of the Synod
2 Great Furnace
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Polluted Delta
4 Volcanic Island
1 Island
4 Ancient Tomb

4 Goblin Welder
4 Painter's Servant
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Inkwell Leviathan

4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
3 Transmute Artifact
3 Intuition
3 Grim Monolith
3 Mox Opal
1 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Grindstone
3 Sensei's Divining Top
2 Thirst for Knowledge

Thoughts or suggestions? Most of the Spellskite and REB stuff is in the board.

[Seems Good]

Plan for Inkwell is to Intuition/Xmute/Thirst for knowledge it into the yard then weld it out? How well has this been working for you?

Maindeck no REB/Pyro working ok?

[sdematt]

So far, so good. It's nice to be able to have the ability to use Grim as a Transmute target for the combo, as well. Transmuting an active Grim into Painter is game, and most people don't count it out. You don't pay any difference, and you float three mana for activation. Or, Transmute Opal for LED and win. Seems good, once again, plus they can't do anything once it's resolved (unless they muck your Servant).

Grim is also really good in terms of Weld in a Grim for 3 extra mana? Weld a tapped one for an untapped one? I'm in! :)

Having the extra out of Inkwell has also been useful, since sometimes you can bait removal on Welder instead of an upcoming Servant if you've dropped fatties in the yard. Or, if you manage to get Inkwell out, they can never really remove it. Grinding advantage with Wurmcoil against aggro is so dirty; the lifelink and creation of tokens is brutal against aggro. Ideally though, I'd love to have Spellskites and REB's in the main, but just no room.

The Thirsts, although slow, have been really good, I have to say, and Transmute has been an all-star. I do miss more countermagic main, but oh well.

-Matt