that is a nice report you got here !
The list is however a bit too spicy for me :p
How do you feel about the surgical ? I tried it in the past but I switched back to faerie (or leyline sometimes) because of the nonbo with chalice. Most of the time you try to stick a chalice on 1 against decks where surgical is useful : rea, phoenix, dredge.
On another topic, I also tried traxos in my list for ~10 games. I'm still uncertain about it, it doesn't have the same impact as our big payoffs and is still reliant on our draws. I need more time to test it but for the "big" event i'm going to attend this week end I'm not sure he will be in my list.
Thanks, I'm trying to keep notes on what is sided in and out immediately after the game, but sometimes I forget to do it.
Surgical is better in a few matches, like maverick and lands that if you doesn't take the loams, they can do lots of stuff even with a spyglass on wasteland and in those matches you may prefer to start with chalice on zero if you keep it. I like surgical way better than faeries, but as you said, there is the nonbo. I was running 3 faeries as they can be fetched with flute. I really recommend you try Citanul Flute, the card is insane in our deck, specially with 2-3 ballista.
I see your point.
I will first have to buy the card :p But yeah it seems interesting.
Although I really like the possibility to fetch for anything with kuldotha, it seems harder than before to have enough artifacts to sack. For now I am only playing 1 ballista, mainly because of the fact I'm still playing with 3 kuldotha. I guess if you are on the citanul flute plan you can go down to 1 kuldotha and add more ballista. I guess I will try your stock list when I got time :)
Hello everyone.
New legacy and new MUD player here. Played my second legacy evening and played MUD for the first time. I had some deck pieces for a big while and thought about playing this deck after talking to some people from my LGS. Someone recommended the forum to me and i read quite a bit here to get a decklist and sideboard together. This was extremly useful, especially the match reports. The games were really fun and i ended up playing 3:1 for the day with 11 people playing at the FNM. My decklist is nearly a copy of Jorruks decklist i think: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/spicy-mud-legacy/
Match 1 Infect:
Game 1
Me 1: I start with Ancient Tomb, nothing
Opponent 1: Land, Glistener Elf
Me 2: Glimmerpost and Metal Worker
Opponent 2: Land, Attacks, I block with Metalworker, he pumps to kill MetalWorker
Me 3: Ancient Tomb, Trinisphere
Opponent 3: Land, Noble Hierarch, attacks for 2 infect
Me 4: Cloudpost, Wurm Coil
Opponent 4: Mana Ponder, Land, go
Me 5: Land, Ugin -1, opponent concedes
Sideboard: In: Staff of Nin, 2x Ratched Bomb. Out: Platinum Emperion, Sorcerous Spyglass, Coercive Portal
Game 2:
Opponent 1: Land, Noble Hierarch
Me 1: Cloudpost, go
Opponent 2: Land, Noble Hierarch, Noble Hierarch, Glistener Elf
Me 2: Ratchet Bomb
Opponent 3: Attacks for 4 Infect, plays blighted Agent, i tick up Ratched bomb
Me 3: Blow up Ratched bomb, play Staff of Nin ping blighted Agent, wipe his board.
Opponent 4: land, go
Me 4: Lodstone Golem
Opponent 5: Brainstorm, fetch, go
Me 5: draw, play stuff, opponent concedes
Match 2 Green Stompy (spicy brew)
Game 1:
Me 1: Post, go
Opponent 1: Land, Llanowar elf,
Me 2: Land, Grim Monolith, Metalworker
Opponent 2: Land, Elvish Mystic, Naturalize (MAIN DECK?!?) on Metalworker
Me 3: Land, Grim Monolith, Steel Hellkite
Opponent 3: Land, Natural Order for Cloudthresher
Me 4: Attack, pump Hellkite to trade with Cloudthresher, play something
Opponent Turn 4: Play Rhonas (?)
Me 5: Land,
Sideboard: In: 2xEnsnaring Bridge, Wurmcoil. Out: 2xSorcerous Spyglass, Sundering Titan,
Game 2:
Opponent 1: Land, go
Me 1: Land, go
Opponent 2: Land, Rofellos
Me 2: Land, Chalice on 1
Opponent 3: Land, tap Rofellos for 3, play Terra Stomper (8/8 Trample)
Me 3: Land, Trinisphere (nothing better in hand)
Opponent 4: Attack for 8, Natural Order (sac Rofellos) get Worldspine Wurm (15/15)
Me 4: No answer in hand, i concede
Game 3:
Me 1: Post, go
Opponent 1: Land, Llanowar Elf,
Me 2: Post, Chalice on 1
Opponent 2: Land, Rofellos
Me 3: Land, Thrandynamo, Trinisphere
Opponent 3: Rhonas, Natural Order for Woldspine Wurm (15/15)
Me 4: Land, Wurmcoil Engine
Opponent 4: Punts by playing Beast Within pre Combat, and i have 3 blockers, so it is not lethal, deathtouches kills Wurm, she gets 3 5/5 tokens
Me 5: I miss 1 mana for Ugin, because Trinisphere increases cost for Grim Monolith, i concede
I made some mistakes here, since Trinisphere is bad in this matchup and i should have sided it out for All is Dust and Spine.
This was my second legacy evening ever, so i only played elves combo and thought Trinisphere is more relevant. I could have played Walking Ballista in Game 2 early to kill the Elves, which could have helped
Match 3 Mill:
Game 1:
Opponent 1: Island, 1cmc mill me for 5
Me 1: Ancient Tomb, Chalice on 1
Opponent 2: Island, 1cmc and trys to bluff, I counter with chalice
Me 2: Land, Metal Worker
Opponent 3: Land, Sanity Grinder (UUU) mill me for 14
Me 3: Show some Artifacts, Play Kuldotha
Opponent 4: Mill me some more
Me 4: Land, Lightning Greaves, Use Koldotha for Blighsteel, equib Lightning Greaves, opponent dies
Sideboard: In: 1 Sorcerous Spyglass, 2 Thorn of Amethyst. Out: Steel Hellkite, Platinum Emperion, Sundering Titan
Game 2:
Opponent 1: Shelldock Isle tapped, go
Me 1: Ancient Tomb, Chalice on 1
Opponent 2: Shelldock Isle tapped, go
Me 2: Land, Metal Morker
Opponent 3: Land, Jace's Archivist
Me 3: Land, Grim Monolith, Thrandynamo
Opponent 4: Wheels the hand, plays something
Me 4: Land, Staff of Dominiation, draw 1, Combo out
Match 4 UBrea:
Game 1:
Me 1: Ancient Tomb, Sorcerous Spyglass. He has (Fetchland, Ponder, Dark Ritual, Unmask, 2 unrelevant spells)
I can choose Griselbrand or Polluted Delta, to keep him off mana. I choose Polluted Delta, hoping to get 2 turns
Opponent 1: Draws Lotus Petal, Plays Ponder
Me 2: Land, something
Opponent 2: Land, Dark Ritual, Entomb for Griselbrand, Shallow Grave, Reanimate Griselbrand, draw 14, play some spells, Entomb Emrakul, Shallow Grave, attack for lethal
Sideboard In: Sorcerous Spyglass, 2 Thorn of Amethyst, 2 Ensnaring Bridge, 3 Faerie Macabre. Out: Platinum Emperion, Steel Hellkite, 2xUgin, Sundering Titan, Walking Ballista, Wurmcoil, Coercive Portal
Game 2:
I mull to 6 and have a low mana hate hand (Wasteland, Faerie, Thorn Amethyst, Spyglass, Ensnaring Bridge, Metalworker)
Me 1: Play Wasteland
Opponent 1: Land, 2x Lotus Petal, Cabal Therapy for Chalice, no chalice in hand, Unmasks by Exiling Griselbrand to discard my Thorn. Nice 3 for 1
Me 2: Draw Ancient Tomb, Play Spyglass on Griselbrand
Opponent 2: Land, go (can't play much because of Faerie)
Me 3: Land, Ensnaring Bridge,
Opponent 3: Land, go
Me 4: Land, Baby Karn (+1, get some land)
next few turns i minus Karn for a token and start beating down with 5/5 construct, while opponents cant play much though more hatepieces
Game 3:
Opponent 1: Land, Cabal Therapy on Chalice, i have no chalice
Me 1: land, thorn
Opponent 2: pass
Me 2: land, pass
Opponent 3: land
Me 3: land, Lodstone
Opponent 4: land, pass
Me 4: land, attack with lodstone, play Wurmcoil
Opponent 5: brainstorm for 3
Me 5: attack with both for 11
Opponent concedes
------ I might have shortcutted some off the longer games, since i couldn't remember every step.
Super happy with my first day of the deck. Made a few minor misplays against the unknown green stompy deck, but she had crazy good draws. Just like i did most of the games. I am still unsure about a few cards in the the deck.
The Steel Hellkite feels a little bit off and i might exchange it for another Walking Ballista. Also one Kuldrotha might be exchanged for Citanul Flute for testing.
I was also thinking about Torpor Orb in the sideboard against Elves and DNT, which are also in our meta.
I am also asking myself, how useful the Wastelands are or if Buried Ruins, Karakas or other Utility Lands might be good alternatives. How useful do you find it? Is it a good tool in a Dark Depths matchup?
Last edited by kathor; 03-31-2019 at 05:11 PM.
First of all, welcome!
Your sideboarding decisions on the report were accurate, even though trini didn't work against mono green, it feels like something right to sideboard in against unknown fast mana decks so they can only cast 1 spell per turn. I believe you'll find the deck is very powerful and can be built in a lot of different ways, so the hardest decisions is whether to mulligan some hands or not.
Hellkite is useful against a lot of decks as a catch all removal, specially as we have greaves, it can steal games on its own, but depending on your meta it may be right to cut it.
Flute is one of the must answer noncreature artifacts, and since you can activate it for a ballista as soon as it enters, it will always be 2 for 1 at least.
Torpor orb is very strong against D&T and Elves, although they can remove it with council's and krosan grip, it usually gains you a few turns to develop your board. We tend to go bigger, so that is very useful for us.
BG Depths is a bad matchup, so the key cards are wasteland, karakas, staff of domination (tap the token), spyglass (thespian if it is not on the board yet because they will copy something, otherwise, Hexmage), thespian stage (they need to remove yours before trying to go off if you keep 2 mana up) and kuldotha for emperion. They have trophy and decay to remove our stuff, wasteland to deal with the lands, crop rotation to combo out of nowhere, etc I usually try to cast chalice on 1 and combo before them.
Lands on the other hand is significantly easier as they try to develop a board and lock you instead of just going for the combo. Spyglass on wasteland/ghost quarter and trinisphere go a long way.
War of the Spark spoilers are coming and we received this unconfirmed card:
Karn, the Great Creator (4)
Artifact abilities of artifacts your opponents control can't be activated.
+1 Until your next turn, up to one target noncreature artifact become an artifact with power and toughness equal to the amount of artifacts equal to their converted mana cost
-2 You may choose an artifact card you own from outside the game or in exile, reveal that card and add it to your hand
(5)
So with it we stop moxen, equipment, vial, engineered explosives, LED, lotus petal, ramp package from eldrazi and some other stuff.
Its +1 can unequip creatures, even tnn. They can't equip back. You can snipe their stuff, say that needle/spylgass with ballista.
-2 can give you access to sb hate in G1, Nevinyrral's Disk or Boompile or fetch for a Mycosynth Lattice so opponent can't tap lands for mana or activate any other abilities.
Last edited by Silverflame; 03-31-2019 at 07:39 PM.
The new Karn is insane! Do you think people will play it competitively in MUD or will it just get put into Eldrazi decks? Lol
This seems like it will have a home in the deck. Curving it into Mycosynth lattice seems extremely powerful and is a straight up lock.
It seems to me like a very nice card indeed! Problem is, if many people think the same and will play it in, we're doomed. It's still a Null Rod
Just been spoiled today !
Is it too expensive in mana cost for its effect or is it playable in MUD ?
I'm pretty sure ppl will use it against us too to kill chalices or lock our stuff. Probably Eldrazi and Tezzerator decks, maybe one or another combo. I don't think many other decks can rely on 4-mana answers in legacy, specially against a deck that increases cost of stuff.
It feels like it's made for MUD
If it was 4-5 mana without the damage clause it would be auto include. We can't get to 6 mana reliably before the opponent can do its thing, so it can hose opponents endgame, like Jace and Liliana. I think it need some setup like the stax shell, T1 chalice, T2 tangle wire/trini, T3 Lodestone T4 this. Also in matches where chalice isn't useful, I tend to replace them with voltaic keys, so this would be easier to cast. I'm really not sure, it might end up being better than I think.Originally Posted by grokh
Hello!
Im sort of returning (or well, trying)to legacy and I wonder how the MUD deck now looks like and works in todays legacy meta (ish since its so relative). I think i got most cards to work around with a shell. Last time i somewhat played legacy i got a playset of Karn, Scion of Urza.
It's very interesting to see which ways the card will lead us. Will we put a number of "main"board cards in the sideboard as a 1-of, or find a complete new list/decktype altogether. I'm not sure yet. And Ugin is coming as well, unconfirmed still but powerful as well if correct
6 mana 4 loyalty
Colourless spell you cast cost 2 less to cast
+1: create a 2/2 spirit. Exile top card of your library face down, you may look at it. When the spirit leaves the battlefield, put the exile card into your hand.
-3: destroy target permanent thats one or more colours
About the new Karn, except Eldrazi and steel stompy I don't really see any deck wanting to side this in. If they really hate artifacts they would have already sided in null rod.
I tried to brew a deck with the new Karn I ended up with this
MUD-KARNtech
I integrated the leyline package in prevision of the new mulligan, if this happens I will switch one vesuva for an urborg (still usefull when ancient tomb becomes painful).
Additionally I may replace the 2 voltaic keys by thorn of amethyst. Still have to figure this
Of cource Karn, silver golem is replaced with the new one. I will happily hear your returns :)
this is an artifact. Metalworker seems a good way to pay for the X cost of this. You don't have to sacrifice permanents like you do with Forgemaster
Report from the last event I attended: we were 69 players
Sorry I should have done it Friday but I didn't have time so details are a bit blur.
R1 : Nicfit special brew : curses
the brew was quite surprising with the kill being curses (overwhelming splendor, cruel reality, the curse that search another curse at the beginning of each upkeep (curse of misfortune) etc etc)
I lose the first game despite a wurmcoil, he found arena rector for curse of misfortune followed by an overwhelming splendor. I never found ugin.
G2: I keep a hand with witchbane orb (lucky me !) that got discarded by toughtseize T1. I try to prepare the board with various rocks and greaves.
The game was won thanks to lodestone golem with greaves killing the liliana of the veil that made me sacrifice metal worker the turn before. He never found mana to cast arena and I put an ugin on the board.
G3: Also close one, I am cursed but luckily I found the witchbane orb followed by ugin.
1-0
R2: infect
I lose the die roll, he starts with a noble.
I followed by a t1 chalice that doesn't encounter force/daze.
T2 He played blighted agent.
T2 I cast trinisphere and the game is pretty much over.
G2 : He leads again with a noble, I follow by a ratchet bomb. Game goes on and I take a few beats but I keep it in check with ratchet bomb on 2. It was quickly followed by a trinisphere and then a steel Hellkite that quickly ended the game.
2-0
R3 Grixis Control
I lose the die roll and mull to 6.
He starts with a toughseize for a lodestone golem.
I play cloudpost and pass.
T2 He follow by hymn that discards by second land and metalworker I just drew. Game is quickly out of hand and I loose.
G2 : I mull to 5 and led with cloudpost and go. He plays a fetch and pass.
I play glimmerpost and play grim monolith.
He again has the hymn that discard all my "cheap" spell. I then proceeded to draw irrelevant card quickly fate sealed by a jace.
2-1
R4 UR delver-pteramander
I lose the die roll and mull to 6.
He leads with a delver and pass.
I play T1 chalice on 1 and pass.
He flips delver, plays a young pyro and passes.
I play a metalworker and pass.
He plays TNN and the game is quickly lost.
G2 I mull to 5 again and never find solutions.
2-2
R5 Burn
G1 He does burn things and I loose.
G2 Chalice and 1 followed by trinisphere and lodestone golem finish the game
G3 Chalice, lodestone and wurmcoil rode me to victory
3-2
R6 Mono red prison
I fought through blood moon with metalworker and Ugin both games
4-2
R7 Tin fins
I lose the die roll and he got me T2. Luckily I just played an ancient tomb so he has noe clue of what I'm playing.
G2 : Taxes and wurmcoil for the win
G3 : same as G2 but he helped me by fizzling.
Globally the list felt pretty solid and Karn, scion of Urza quite usefull.
For now I don't plan any change in the list. Lost against UR delver that I find slightly favorable, grixis control is always rough with Kcommand but twice hymn T2 doesn't help :p
If you want my sideboard, just ask :) .
List :
// MAIN DECK (61)
// Arpenteurs (3)
2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
1 Karn, Scion of Urza
// Créatures (19)
1 Sundering Titan
1 Platinum Emperion
1 Steel Hellkite
3 Wurmcoil Engine
3 Kuldotha Forgemaster
4 Lodestone Golem
4 Metalworker
1 Walking Ballista
1 Blightsteel Colossus
// Sorts (15)
2 Thran Dynamo
1 Coercive Portal
1 Staff of Domination
2 Trinisphere
2 Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Lightning Greaves
2 Grim Monolith
4 Chalice of the Void
// Terrains (24)
2 Vesuva
4 Cloudpost
3 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Wasteland
4 Glimmerpost
3 Cavern of Souls
1 Inventor's Fair
1 Thespian's Stage
// SIDE DECK (15)
SB: 1 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
SB: 1 Wurmcoil Engine
SB: 3 Faerie Macabre
SB: 1 Spine of Ish Sah
SB: 1 Staff of Nin
SB: 1 Witchbane Orb
SB: 1 Sorcerous Spyglass
SB: 2 Thorn of Amethyst
SB: 2 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 2 Warping Wail
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