The thought never crossed my mind and I have access to them could probably find room for three. I like it.
Oooo... Teysa looks interesting... must playtest.
So from what little I've played with this deck so far I'd say I'm most underwhelmed with Blood Artist. How have your experiences been with that card? I just keep wishing he was a Zombie or sac outlet. Any other options people have tried?
Teysa looks super sexy, can someone give an update on how she plays?
From the limited playtesting that I've done with her, she does so much for the deck. Late Carrion Feeders have evasion, Tidehollow Scullers can be sacced instantly for a spirit and the best of its effects, Teysa works as removal, Lingering Souls works as removal, Bitterblossom and a sac outlet becomes insane. The synergy that Teysa provides is almost unbeatable. I've been trying taking out the Blood Artists for Teysas and am not sure if I'll ever look back.
Tried this out tonight with 4 Mutavaults in the main over Carrion Feeders. Worked very nicely.
carrion feeder is an essential sac outlet that could never be replaced by a noncolor producing man land regardless of whether its a zombie or not. I'd only play mutavault in living dead girl variants with LftL and as a one of...
on that note tho the decks run similar engines to accomplish different goals using many of the same cards and I'm torn between the two if I play living dead girl, which is getting some love from ravinca, I can field dead guy ale as well but zombardment bastardizes both of them card wise, and cuts me out a contender locally.
Agree with tiggy. You definitely can't replace Carrion Feeder. He's an essential part to the deck's engine and does things that mutavault cannot. As for Teysa, I think Blood Artist does a much better job of breaking creature standoffs than she does. Artist also allows you to gain life against RUG and storm, which is relevant in both match-ups.
Caleb posted this list today:
Jund Zombies
3 Bayou
2 Bloodstained Mire
4 Marsh Flats
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Undiscovered Paradise
3 Swamp
3 Badlands
3 Blood Artist
4 Gravecrawler
4 Bloodghast
4 Lotleth Troll
4 Carrion Feeder
2 Squee, Goblin Nabob
4 Dark Confidant
1 Tragic Slip
2 Goblin Bombardment
1 Thoughtseize
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Faithless Looting
"This deck is good. I don’t mean the archetype, as Sam already proved that in GP Atlanta, but rather this version (which I’m considering for the Invitational). Lotleth adds a few turn-four kills to the deck and more reach in the form of trample. Regenerate: B is important, because opponents can’t Wasteland your Bayou to keep you off it. The more I play with this Troll, the more I realize how powerful it is. Don’t underestimate it!"
Currently playing Manipulate Fates. Learn about the Magic Card Market.
I've been thinking about putting this deck together after I got steamrolled by it at SCG St Louis this summer. I had no idea what was going on and then I was dead. There is one card that intrigues me to add.
What are your thoughts on Goblin Sharpshooter? It seems like it would be good. Can kill your dudes if there isn't a carrion feeder or goblin bombardment for some reason. Beats Elves straight up. Defense against empty the warrens. Do you think it has a place in the SB or maybe the MD?
goblin sharpshooter is an off color 3 drop that comes down too late to affect/effect(?) any match that value could be gained from it with no ramp and no way to tutor for it even one slot anywhere in the 75 will never hold value. No matter how you build it, red is a splash color for an enabler and a finisher not removal, mass or spot. The deck is fundamentally B/G or B/W with red holding 6-8 slots solely based on the sheer efficiency of those cards and not because they couldn't be duplicated without splashing. Barring sideboard options i do not believe red has much more to offer the deck for now.
which leads me to squee... I don't like him, have not tested him, or loltroll/slitherhead for that matter, so the jury is out on them but my original brew months ago was jund so it's full circle when I finish exploring teysa a bit more, going to up her count to two.
Anyone test with sorin in their list as a one of or in the board for control?
My list:
4x Gravecrawler
4x Bloodghast
4x Lingering Souls
4x Faithless Looting
4x Lightning Bolt
4x Tidehollow Sculler
3x Goblin Bombardment
4x Cabal Therapy
2x Zealous Persecution
1x Oblivion Ring
1x Umezawa's Jitte
2x Mox Diamond
4x Scrubland
4x Badlands
1x Plateau
4x Marsh Flats
3x Arid Mesa
4x Mutavault
1x Mountain
1x Swamp
1x Plains
Disagree on the Carrion Feeder. The deck still has sac outlets in the form of Goblin Bombardment and Cabal Therapy. Plus, oftentimes your line is to aggro out, and Carrion Feeder is strictly worse when it comes to that. I've found that you often don't want to waste turns recurring Gravecrawler just to pump it.
I do think Carrion Feeder is better if you're running Blood Artist, but I've playtested Blood Artist and it is not so good because it's kind of dead without a sac combo.
Mutavault helps you against EE, Jace, and sometimes Terminus (if they miracle it with the Mutavault unactivated)/board wipe effects. It protects you against aggro-control strategies and is better at building an aggressive board when you want to aggro out.
All I can say is - I've tested it and it's a strong - if you haven't then you should at least give it a shot.
I also give a nod to Lightning Bolt over Plow. This is because this deck is an aggro deck and not a combo deck (and I think the versions that try to be often lose to graveyard hate because of it). If you come out strong with a hand that's like "diamond, loot, pitch bloodghast, lingering souls, land drop, recur bloodghast" - you're on an aggro line of play. You can easily get 5-10 damage in with early gravecrawlers and bloodghasts before decks like stoneblade or miracles get online.
Faithless Looting is this deck's version of Brainstorm - you're never unhappy to see one.
Played Sam Black's 75 at a twelve man local event today.
Went 3-1 beating Miracles, Mono-Green Aggro, and Hypergenesis. Only loss was to Junk. Overall I'm very happy with his list and will continue to test the deck. Still no idea why this deck isn't getting the attention it deserves
So Sam Black got 9th at the invitational with basically the same list he used at the GP. That further cements in my mind that what he's doing is correct, so I'll stick to testing that list. Also, someone got 24th at the open with a Geralf's Messenger list. Still wondering why no one is testing/developing this deck in this thread. Also not satisfied with Teysa.
The deck does look pretty strong. Token decks in general, I think, have a lot to offer any format as swarming the board with critters has always been strong, especially when combined with some finisher like Bombardment.
I do feel that 20 lands is too few for the deck though. I always get mana screwed.
I've played a deck with 4 Zombie Infestation + 4 Squee Goblin Nabob and it has always been good. Now with Lotleth Troll Squee even becomes better.
Having two good (zombie-themed) 2-drops as discard outlet makes me think, if it makes sense to merge this deck with a Madness deck!?
Cards like the following, seem incredible valuable and synergistic:
Nightshade Assassin
Big Game Hunter
Tortured Existence
Vengevine
Gravecrawler
Goblin Bombardment
Bloodghast
Maybe even Grave Scrabbler is worth some consideration.
What do you think?
I've spent the last few days trying to work on a decklist. I really like the Squee's in Caleb's list. The concept looks very promising to me. I'm not sold on some of his choices, and I will definitely be making a crossbreed with my thread (meaning Vengevines), but I'm liking Caleb's direction. Looting + Squee is a nice draw engine and Squee has great synergy with Troll. I think Zombie Infestation makes perfect sense as another way to abuse Squee, while having great synergy with Gravecrawler. My list is currently running 4 Squees. I still have some other details I am hammering out; so I don't have a completed list to post just yet, but I will post it once I finish
I love the deck idea guys, so keep the ideas rolling... this thread has been very helpful.
Recent performances of this deck:
Sam Black (311 Players)
9th place at a StarCityGames.com Invitational tournament in Atlanta, Georgia, United States on 2012-September-23
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=49551
Ken Adams (351 Players)
27th place at a StarCityGames.com Legacy Open tournament in Atlanta, Georgia, United States on 2012-September-23
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=49686
Jaberwocki
8th place (353 players) 2012 Legacy MOCS 2012-August-17
http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/dec...1&iddeck=65182
Iván De Castro
2nd place (111 players) 8º Torneo Lliga Catalana Legacy Castelldefels 2012-August-11
http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/dec...6&iddeck=64926
Samuel Black
22nd place (223 players) at a StarCityGames.com Legacy Open tournament in St. Louis, Missouri, United States on 2012-July-15
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=47832
Primary legacy deck High Tide primer
I played Sam Black's list from the Invitational and had some amusing games against Omniscience. He beat me 2-1 but, but each time he dropped Emrakul the annihilator trigger was causing him problems because he was low on life and I had a Blood Artist and other creatures in play to sacrifice. It was quite hilarious and the last game ended with him at 1 life.
I feel Zombardment uses Cabal Therapy better than any other deck at the moment (including Nic Fit) and there are really lots of cool plays to pull off. It's really fun playing the deck and the surprise factor is also not to be underestimated.
One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die.
I think developing for this deck is hard due to balance of discard outlets and sacrifice outlets and which way you want to go, especially now with the troll. weighing and splitting these engines will be especially important, also the number of zombies you have to support gravecrawler.
From my limited time at looking at lists you are sort of an aggro/combo deck. with blood artist and bombardment you have a very powerful source of sac outlet damage that allows you to just kill people on the spot and turn into a permanent drain life effect
with troll you are kind of all your eggs in one basket, and him getting swords'd is no fun (discard does not protect from top decks) and regeneration is not that relevant these days considering the way things die. I think the way to go is to streamline for ultimate mana efficiency with either free or dudes who cost 2 or less and only things that are absolutely necessary at 3 or more(oring/ other effects).
This is all theory though, I have no time playtesting any of these lists. i personally think grinding out with a ton of little dudes that are more or less ready to die with sac outlets is better than making one giant guy who gets plowed or pathed.
If I get badlands, scrublands and bayous, I may investigate further but without the mana and having storm and rug as my primary decks this is on the backburner for me.
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