I like the ghor-clans, really aggressive. Did you deliberately leave out knight of the Reliquary? Seems incredibly powerful, especially if you can bloodrush gcr and swing for huge life points.
Brainstorm Realist
I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner
Cheap mandrils fucks your goyfs, too. If You're not getting 4/4 trampellers for g, you have no reason to play them. I honestly think you would need to drop goyfs too and play more burn to support mandrils. I can't imagine that's better than knights though. Knight active for even 1-2 turns can become huge, like 8/8+ huge, and that's where your gcr's are going to win you games. All the while you're utilizing lands from kotr to disrupt your opponent. Having a critical mass of huge threats is probably better than swarming. You can meter out your big dudes in the face of removal/terminus.
Brainstorm Realist
I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner
Goyf can still retain P/T from opposing yards though. I mean I'm not saying you're wrong in what you're suggesting. This is just my initial thought on the deck. I feel like you'll be wanting to delve away lands fairly often so you can keep artifacts and other stuff in the yard for the Goof. And yes knight can make himself huge and that's a boon, but it also is a bit slow since it ratchets up over a few turns. Also I feel like at a certain point you just ask yourself why you're not just playing a dedicated Knight deck like Maverick
Can we make Nimble Mongoose work?
Something like 10 fetches, 4 Bauble 8 Bolt/Chain. Going along Nacatl, Narnam, Goyf and the usual cards.
Has the downside of not being Ghor-Clannable, but adds some removal insurance.
I don't think you need GCR and Knight, since Knight can just get you Kessig Wolf Run. Also, BBE into Domri is gassss. You definitely want Bolts, and maybe swords or path depending on if you also want to play punishing fire.
After a long break from Legacy, I've returned to this degenerate format. Been testing some shit list online, list has been running ok, nothing special.
Lands [20]
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Arid Mesa
3 Windswept Heath
2 Taiga
2 Plateau
2 Savannah
1 Mountain
1 Forest
1 Karakas
Creatures [30]
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Narnam Renegade
4 Wild Nacatl
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Qasali Pridemage
2 Renegade Rallier
4 Bloodbraid Elf
Spells [10]
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Chain Lightning
3 Domri Rade
1 Sylvan Library
Sideboard [15]
3 Path to Exile
2 Shapers' Sanctuary
2 Price of Progress
2 Containment Priest
1 Null Rod
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Destructive Revelry
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Tormod's Crypt
Shaper's Sanctuary is REALLY good in this format, you should all give it a try.
Let your Dredge 6 be: Narco, Narco, Narco, Bridge, Bridge, Dread Return
If I'm running Goyf I want other sources to help pump it, something like less lands and more copies of Land Grant to ensure our own Sorcery. The deck doesn't really sandbag secrets and the plan is almost as linear as they come, so it shouldn't be too much a downside.
Not sure if anyone saw this list: https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=24297&d=369651&f=LE
Hexdrinker replaces Nacatl, Reclaimer provides the land toolbox feature that KotR gave to previous big zoo decks, and planeswalkers help provide some resistances to sweepers. The deck remains rather low to the ground, though the splash of blue for Oko somehow seems a little off-brand.
Most people blindly suggest new cards for decks. True contributors also suggest what to remove. It's not about what's good, but rather what's better than the current selections.
I saw the deck as well, and I realized that Oko once again makes another card (more) obsolete with Wild Nacatl. Oko makes Wild Nacatls all by himself every other turn. This deck lives in the same space as Maverick, just a little more aggressive. I don't think it really has legs because I think the combo decks are going to come back fierce once the metagame goes further over the edge of grindy mid-range control matchups. However, if someone were determined, these are some cards that can really help with combo matchups:
Veil of Summer
Meddling Mage
Weather the Storm
Flusterstorm
Dovin's Veto
Add some number of those to the Bog/Karakas maindeck plan and it won't be favorable, but at least bring some of the combo matchups up to 50/50.
Brainstorm Realist
I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner
Just watched Samu_27 5-0 with this list from Ozymandias17:
Planeswalker (3)
3 Oko, Thief of Crowns
Creature (22)
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Elvish Reclaimer
2 Hexdrinker
4 Noble Hierarch
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Tarmogoyf
2 Klothys, God of Destiny
1 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Ramunap Excavator
1 Renegade Rallier
Sorcery (3)
3 Green Sun's Zenith
Instant (8)
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Swords to Plowshares
2 Once Upon a Time
Enchantment (2)
2 Sylvan Library
Land (22)
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Karakas
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Plateau
1 Savannah
1 Snow-Covered Forest
1 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Snow-Covered Plains
1 Taiga
1 Tropical Island
4 Wasteland
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
Sideboard
2 Deafening Silence
2 Pyroblast
2 Red Elemental Blast
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Blood Moon
1 Knight of Autumn
4 Leyline of the Void
Maybe Klothys and Oko were all we needed to make Zoo decent again?
"The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
—Kaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order
Totally forgot to add this here, but our zoo discord is active whereas many forums are not any more. Here's a link to our discord - we primarily discuss modern, but have legacy channel as well.
https://discord.gg/Va6JA7R
Looks awesome!
Someone just got third in the Saturday challenge with actual zoo. They were running 12 cantrip hate creatures which is a key innovation.
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Esper Sentinel
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
They were also running ending over plow, which ignores Thalia and helps against zoos historically bad chalice matchup.
https://magic.wizards.com/en/article...nge-2022-03-06
Love to see it.
I wouldn't say Zoo had much of an issue with Chalice historically. Pridemages were stock, and most of the Chalice decks had trouble beating a Tarmogoyf. Zoo struggled against numerous other decks, though. Some combo decks could be prepared for, but limited sideboard space meant gaping holes in other matchups. Sneak and Show was a beating, and Natural Order wasn't much better. Lands was also very unfavorable. Terminus and True-Name Nemesis were the other big problems.
I would be curious to know what Byvci faced over the course of the tournament. The Top 16 doesn't look favorable for the list, so I'm guessing Byvci beat up on Delver and the Control decks that aren't playing sweepers, then stole a couple matches with sideboard choices that lined up.
Ahh I don’t have any history with zoo. I just assumed it was difficult like other non-Fow decks with a million 1 drops. Painter pre saga/ANT/hogaak/elves pre shepherd all had a terrible chalice mu.
You were mostly right. From the data collection project (please support us if you value this stuff):
2-1 Grixis
1-2 Lands
2-0 UR delver
2-0 UR Delver
2-0 UWr
2-0 UR Delver
2-1 Ant
2-1 Ant
1-2 UR delver
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