Now with Miracles gone other decks will have a lot more sideboard space, I am interested in seeing if BR reanimator will still hold its competitiveness, ,or even UB for that matter.
Without the Counterbalance I feel that E.Truth is a better catch-all, But uncounterability of A.Decay will always be relevant.
So what do we think the distribution of graveyard enemies will be in the coming months?
Thoughts?
- Deathrite Shaman/Scavenging Ooze I think will increase in prevalence as already strong BUG decks exploit the vacuum. Heard lots of talk about people dusting off Maverick lists.
- Rest in Peace will diminish as the format speeds up a bit. It was already on the decline with BR Reanimator being deemed too fast for RiP to be effective. This could go the total opposite of DRS decks are everywhere and people look for ways to shut that off entirely. But beyond D&T I'm not sure what mainstream decks would pick it as their hate of choice.
- Grafdigger's Cage/Colorless Hate could increase if decks unsplash for Abrupt Decay and find themselves in need of easy to include answers. Also heard lots of talk about Elves being a thing now, Cage offers good coverage against them as well.
- Surgical Extraction/Extirpate I'm not sure about. I feel like lists that had them already will keep them, but I'm just not sure where the trend is moving.
Originally Posted by GreatWhale
I have decided that with Counterbalance out, our need for Abrupt Decay isn't strong enough to splash green for, as I feel that Wasteland decks will be on the rise, we probably want a few more basics. By cutting Decay, we need to figure out answers to cards like Cage and Rest in Peace, as those are the only hate cards that don't get tagged by a Fatal Push but do get hit by Decay.
This is the list I have decided on trying at the next few events.
4 Polluted Delta
2 Bloodstained Mire
1 Flooded Strand
3 Swamp
1 Island
4 Underground Sea
4 Careful Study
4 Brainstorm
3 Ponder
4 Force of Will
3 Daze
1 Show and Tell
4 Thoughtseize
4 Entomb
4 Reanimate
4 Exhume
3 Lotus Petal
3 Griselbrand
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1 Tidespout Tyrant
1 Grave Titan
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
Sideboard
4 Fatal Push
1 Show and Tell
2 Pithing Needle
1 Echoing Truth
1 Spell Pierce
1 Massacre
1 Coffin Purge
2 Duress
1 Sire of Insanity
1 Blazing Archon
I've basically come to the same conclusion. My maindeck is very close to yours. For the SB I like having at least 2 truth to deal with chalice/rip/cage. 4 fatal is way too much, 2 should be sufficient. spell pierce is a much better MD card, SB cards need to be more impactful.
I like having a full set of S&T in the 75, with 2 cities to support them and fight taxing counters from delver, so something like this:
2 fatal push
2 echoing truth
2 needle
3 S&T
2 city of traitors (actually not terrible vs. d&t)
2 duress
1 massacre
1 flexslot - prob an extra fatty depending on the meta.
I'll be testing out this version in the coming weeks and tweak it appropriately.
If you have 2 cities then it's fine to have the full 4 of SnT. If not, then you definitely cannot go above 3.
Not sure if we can reliably use it but there is a new bounce spell that's interesting in amonkhet.
Winds of Rebuke:, instant, Bounce target nonland permanent then each player mills 2.
This is my updated list right now, a little bit of a different take than the last two posted:
2x Swamp
1x Island
4x Underground Sea
4x Polluted Delta
4x Verdant Catacombs
3x Griselbrand
1x Iona
1x Elesh Norn
1x Tidespout Tyrant
1x Grave Titan
4x Careful Study
4x Brainstorm
4x Ponder
4x Entomb
4x Reanimate
4x Exhume
2x Thoughtseize
2x Collective Brutality
3x Lotus Petal
4x Force of Will
3x Daze
Sideboard
2x Duress
2x Echoing Truth
2x Fatal Push
2x Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
2x Pithing Needle
2x Massacre
2x Show and Tell
1x Inkwell Leviathan
From nothing came teeth.
I like it, you can un-BS lock yourself, and put fatties back on top to be milled.Not sure if we can reliably use it but there is a new bounce spell that's interesting in amonkhet.
Winds of Rebuke:
Withbecoming less needed as a splash how viable does a
splash become? I know that some of you were/still are experimenting with it. Seems like the biggest gains are pyroclasm type board wipes, blast effects and izzet charm. Are these effects worth diluting the manabase again?
I was having par success with a BUrg build. Through my experience, the only times I got punished felt like it would have happened under a normal 3 color build. Examples like keeping a 1 land hand with Brainstorms and maybe combo pieces, losing your land to wasteland and the Brainstorm not showing you anything. Blood Moon was a pain, I guess with a clean UB build and Lotus Petals you're safer to that avenue of play from your opponent.With
How pronounced were the detriments to your diluted manabase?
Not sure if blasts are where we really want to be. With Miracles gone, are most U decks now running Wasteland? Sneak n Show (favoured) aside, we could easily just get Wasted off red mana. Plus we usually don't have a lot of extra mana open to start with to fight a counter war.
Izzet Charm is good against DRS but so is Collective Brutality. Izzet Charm offers different modes than CB though so it might be better. Worth a shot.
To be totally honest, the mode picked most often by a healthy margin is being pitched to Force of Will. Then it's looting 2 (instant speed is really nice), then burning a creature, and a distant last is casting to counter on its own.
I played in a 16 man local event on Sunday. I ran a very stock UB list. Came in 2nd due to Tie-breakers.
Spell 38
reanimate 4
exhume 4
entomb 4
CS 4
FOW 4
BS 4
petal 4
daze 3
TS 2
Ponder 4
SnT 1
Creature 7
Griselbrand 3
iona 1
elesh 1
grave titan 1
tidespout 1
land 15
Delta 4
mire 4
Usea 4
island 1
swamp 2
sideboard 15
pithing needle 3
show and tell 3
inkwell 1
massacre 1
fatal push 1
duress 3
flusterstorm 1
echoing truth 2
It performed extremely well. I was able to get a turn 1 or 2 reanimate almost every game, I attribute this to running 4 ponder and 4 lotus petal which I hadn't been doing with UBg.
Matches:
R1: Big Red - Loss 0-1
Game 1: He won die roll. He has chalice on 1 and turn 2 inferno titan. I scoop before he knows what I am playing.
Game 2: Turn 1 griselbrand, then draw 7 to counter his turn 1 attempt at something. He dies to grisel and elseh 2 turns later.
Game 3: I counter his turn 1 chalice on 1 with FOW. Then entomb on my turn. He plays a second chalice on 1 and I never draw exhume, echoing truth, or Snt. So I had 9 outs and got unlucky.
R2: Bug delver - Win 1-1
Game 1: I win die roll, and get a T1 griselbrand using FOW on his FOW.
Game 2: I FOW his T1 deathrite. I ponder to setup a turn 3 reanimate on grisel.
R3: food chain - Win 2-1
Game 1: Win die roll. I ponder turn one and setup for turn 2 reanimate using entomb, petal, exhume. He plays turn 1 DRS. I get a griselbrand turn 2. Turn 3 I draw 7 to counter a food chain, then reanimate an iona on green.
Game 2: This game was back and forth with counter magic the first few turns, but he doesn't draw any threats and that give me time to get a griselbrand + elesh on the feild.
R4: Aluren - Win 3-1
Game 1: Lose die roll. Hand of entomb, petal, 2 land, reanimate, daze, force, and draw BS. He ponders turn 1. I go for the turn 1 reanimate on grisel, which he tries to force and I daze. I counter a baleful strix next turn with FOW and kill him 2 turns later. Not sure what i was playing against.
Game 2: He plays a land and passes. I have ponder, reanimate, careful study, 2 land, BS, exhume, SnT(draw). I ponder on my turn to reveal iona, grisel, land. Turn 2 I try to reanimate grisel keeping Iona in hand. He uses surgical. Turn 3 I Snt in Iona and he puts in Aluren. I name black and he concedes.
R5: Omni-sneak – Win 4-1
Game 1: Win die roll. I turn 1 ponder to setup a turn 2 reanimate. He goes for a turn 1 Snt which I Daze. I BS on my turn to get a FOW + blue card. He tries to Snt again, I force. Turn 3 I get Grisel. Turn 5 he tries for sneak attack and I daze, then kill him.
Game 2: Turn 1 he ponders. I Thoughtsieze him taking his sneak attack, he had 2 Snt, Omniscience, Emrakul, Sneak, 2 Land. He plays lotus petal and tries for Snt which I daze. On my turn I reanimate Iona name blue. I attack for 2 turns, on his turn he tires for Sneak attack with 1 mana open, I daze which he pays(using his last red mana) for and I attack for the win.
The deck felt extremely strong and well positioned. I made a few mistakes during the event but the deck helped me out. Have the extra basics was really nice and not worrying about a 3rd color. Many people hadn’t seen UB reanimator in a while so the presence of Daze, FOW, and thoughtsieze threw them off which they told me later.
WotC needs to do something about $50+ Show-n-Tell on MODO. I understand (don't like, but understand) paper cards reaching high values, but digital objects is a whole other story.
Last edited by Zooligan; 05-02-2017 at 09:11 AM.
Did anyone try playing Mystical Tutor?
Often in games you sit on one combo piece.
It even can provide you with counters when you need protection to go off or show and tell, when gy hate is present.
They certainly did in 2010 before Mystical Tutor was banned.
People usually prefer cards that are tournament legal.
Some of my friends sell records,
some of my friends sell drugs.
sry, just wanted to delete the post, because I found out myself.
To late :)
If I recall correctly, Reanimator was why Mystical Tutor was banned :) And all we were reanimating was Akroma, Angel of Wrath and Spirit of the Night.
Reanimator
3 Griselbrand
1 Blazing Archon
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1 Inkwell Leviathan
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Sire of Insanity
1 Tidespout Tyrant
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
4 Daze
4 Careful Study
4 Exhume
4 Reanimate
4 Entomb
3 Lotus Petal
2 Ponder
2 Collective Brutality
2 Show and Tell
4 Polluted Delta
3 Underground Sea
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Verdant Catacombs
1 Bayou
1 Island
1 Swamp
1 Tropical Island
Sideboard:
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Massacre
2 Pithing Needle
2 Show and Tell
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Echoing Truth
1 Flusterstorm
1 Golgari Charm
1 Grave Titan
1 Keranos, God of Storms
I went 4:2 with this list at the weekend. Making rang 6 in a 34 player event in hamburg. In the Top 8 for the buy at mkm Hamburg I lost to Eldrazi.
Matches:
2:0 vs Patriot
2:1 vs Big Red
2:0 vs Burn
0:2 vs Deathblade
1:2 vs Patriot
2:0 vs Shardless
Top 8:
0:2 vs Eldrazi
Fun tournament. The deck did its thing. All sideboard cards were usefull.
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